Adam Schefter on DA

Yes, Randy Lerner wants Quinn.

I'll bet your life on it.

osusev

@osusev said:
I want the best for the Browns

Yet only post in threads about DA or Brady Quinn. Yeah, I buy that.

Guest

AdaM said:
Yes, Randy Lerner wants Quinn.
I'll bet your life on it.

Shhhhh.....It was just a kowinkie dink that Quinn was sent out in front of the press along with Joe Thomas after RAC and Savage were fired.

osusev

@osusev said:
Yea I know trade him for more PROSPECTIVE talent because that would be best for the TEAM. Genius logic.

Same logic Bill Belichick uses.

osusev

yea belichick another Fan favorite for the Browns, So what QB did he draft high for again? EVER? o no he is a prove it on the field kind of guy.never caring about fans perspective ala the Kosar decision.

Wait you must mean when he chose a 6th round draft pick in Brady over bledsoe or kept Cassel as the number one backup on the roster.... yea I know because I believe players should earn fan loyalty first by playing that makes me a DA only backer and not a True Browns fans because I have a differing opinion from the majority.

That just makes me an individual and yes from what I have seen between the two SO FAR DA is a better in my opinion. I do think he should start, however since we invested a number one in Quinn I think he should start this season so we know what he has. DA earned his place by winning and throwing tds against good defenses and teams. Do I think DA needs to improve ? YES. I became a DA fan AFTER he played and helped us win 10 games with a piss poor defense. I do like his back story of coming from nowhere better than BQ, however its what he did on the field that I liked. BQ IF he leads us to wins I will like him probably more but he has to actually earn it with ONFIELD PLAY.

osusev

@osusev said:
yea belichick another Fan favorite for the Browns, So what QB did he draft high for again? EVER? o no he is a prove it on the field kind of guy.never caring about fans perspective ala the Kosar decision.
Wait you must mean when he chose a 6th round draft pick in Brady over bledsoe or kept Cassel as the number one backup on the roster.... yea I know because I believe players should earn fan loyalty first by playing that makes me a DA only backer and not a True Browns fans because I have a differing opinion from the majority.

That just makes me an individual and yes from what I have seen between the two SO FAR DA is a better in my opinion. I do think he should start, however since we invested a number one in Quinn I think he should start this season so we know what he has. DA earned his place by winning and throwing tds against good defenses and teams. Do I think DA needs to improve ? YES. I became a DA fan AFTER he played and helped us win 10 games with a piss poor defense. I do like his back story of coming from nowhere better than BQ, however its what he did on the field that I liked. BQ IF he leads us to wins I will like him probably more but he has to actually earn it with ONFIELD PLAY.

Point on BB was trading players that could still play or start for picks. Traded Bledsoe with in his own division and risk having nothing behind Brady and Brady not being a half of a year wonder.

What good defense has DA shown up and played well against? He did it once against the G-men who played their worst game in over a year. That's it. Let's talk about what DA has done against bad D's since the week 9 marker of 2007. HOU 1 TD 1INT, ARZ 2TD 2 INT, BUF 0 and 0, CIN 2 TD 4 INT, SF 1 TD 1 INT. That was just in 2007 back half. I think beating the Gman last year was the first time he beat a team that finished with a winning record.

Look, it's admirable that you want to pull for DA. But this isn't Kosar here. It's a guy who had 9 good game until D-Coordinators around the league figured him out. Since then, he's Charlie Frye. A QB with a low 70's QBR. If we were talking over 4 or 5 games, that would be one thing. But we are talking about over his last 16 starts. DA is the same QB he was in his first starts in 2006. He has not improved a lick since HS and college.

GOOD DEFENSES AND TEAMS?

Get off the crack sev, seriously.

osusev

I am on crack....? OK I am not the guy who wants to bet the hundred + million dollar franchise on a 20 something kid with three subpar starts against poor defenses while I have at least a legitimate Backup and a 2nd option.

Yea I can see how me not wanting to trade DA and thinking that is extremely risky and completely uneccessary considering we have him under contract and have to pay him regardless along with my high draft pick who gets paid back up money ..... Wait in a league that is QB driven and starved to the point college kids blackmail franchises without ever playing an actual pro game. I can see the logic if injuries to QB's who wear HUGE targets for 240+ pound monsters to hit them game in game out.....

I see now how some of you rabid BQ backers might think that now..... or maybe I dont and cant until I use enough crack to make my risk/reward logic centers in my brain understand that like most of you seem to think... like I said before Genius logic. lmao

osusev

@osusev said:
I am on crack....? OK I am not the guy who wants to bet the hundred + million dollar franchise on a 20 something kid with three subpar starts against poor defenses while I have at least a legitimate Backup and a 2nd option.
Yea I can see how me not wanting to trade DA and thinking that is extremely risky and completely uneccessary considering we have him under contract and have to pay him regardless along with my high draft pick who gets paid back up money ..... Wait in a league that is QB driven and starved to the point college kids blackmail franchises without ever playing an actual pro game. I can see the logic if injuries to QB's who wear HUGE targets for 240+ pound monsters to hit them game in game out.....

I see now how some of you rabid BQ backers might think that now..... or maybe I dont and cant until I use enough crack to make my risk/reward logic centers in my brain understand that like most of you seem to think... like I said before Genius logic. lmao

So best QBR rating for a 1st time start for a Browns player and 2 TDs is sub par? If that's the case, then you must think DA is really sub par. Quinn had two bad games, while having a broken index finger on his throwing hand, preventing him from being able to grip the ball.

Didn't GB, ATL, and BALT bet their 100+M franchise on 20 something kids? Two of those with guys that were true rookies. Do you actually watch or follow the NFL? You act like CLE handing the reigns over to Quinn would be unpresidented or no team has ever had success doing it. The success rate for that, when going with a 1st round QB is far greater that of a 6th rounder snatched off another teams practice squad.

Ah, and your closing just proves the point. You aren't a Browns fan, but a DA fan. Browns fans wanting to move forward with Quinn has zero to do with being a BQ backer. It's about seeing that DA is not the answer. If CLE was sitting on any other 1st round draft pick QB we'd be calling for the same thing.

Your last bit about risk/reward just again proves you really don't watch or follow the NFL, other than from sportscenter highlights and drinking beers with your buddies while the game is on.

rich4eagle

."

Jesus Rich! See my other note. Do the right thing.

rich4eagle

I did I presented a life winning formula for all to read........NO AGENDA.......it has now been deleted eight times.........

'

IS THAT WHAT YOU WHAT IN FREEDOM OF SPEECH?

too funny here

BTW your other note may have been deleted here in free of speech Stans heil salute town

osusev

masters you have me pegged..... and the season tickets/psl/ohio state nut that during football season entire weekends are devoted to traveling to columbus than to cleveland on sunday.... or the banning of blue and yellow clothing on my children along with black and yellow.... I know its just a passing fancy for me.... forced on me by some traveling gypsy friends lol. My wife and kids along with Business partners all know not to bother me during football weekends. I know I am a DA fan not a Browns fans because I rather have 2 qbs that can win versus one on the roster... I know the 3 games should be enough for me and since its not I am not a browns fan... I know I get it.

Funny the closest situation was San diego with Brees and rivers and yet they did exactly as the Browns did and only traded finally when brees was seen as injured seriously..... This is about having POTENTIALLY 2 qbs which I would rather have than one... call me greedy.... BUt ONE of them played 3 games..

All BQ fans have is the injury to explain the close bump and run coverage that took away his quick short hits and dump offs.... Film from Denver and all his passes under 10 yards probably had something to do with those games..... no I must have picked that up on sports center.

The bad reads probably was because of his finger....

I want BQ to be our starter so we know what we have, I dont assume like evidently you do what he may or may not be able to do until he actually proves it. Until than call me silly for wanting to have a backup plan.... Yea lets bet it all... like most qb starved franchises do when they DONT HAVE A YOUNG QB WHO SHOWS GLIMPSES of quality.... And the CRASH those franchises suffer is a awful long list that ahem... Couch we are a part of of.

I just gave you a thank you in the other thread. But thank you again.

Like I said, I don't agree with your thread being deleted. But as I have said before, this is a private message board. There is no real freedom of speech here. It's like assuming your freedom of speech would make it okay for you to be invited into someones house, then say anything you want. Their house, their rules.

osusev

caution and patience must mean I am not a TRUE Browns fan...lol

osusev

@osusev said:
Funny the closest situation was San diego with Brees and rivers and yet they did exactly as the Browns did and only traded finally when brees was seen as injured seriously..... This is about having POTENTIALLY 2 qbs which I would rather have than one... call me greedy.... BUt ONE of them played 3 games..

Wow, you just again reproved my assumption. SD never traded Drew Brees. They let him walk for nothing. Which they should have never done, because they could have gotten picks out of him.

And one played poorly over his last 16 starts. DA has put up back up QB stats over his last 16. CLE could get that same production out of one of them.

You bring up the coverage, so what was DA's excuse when the same D was used against him against HOU in the second half and against IND? It's also pretty hard to beat bump coverage when you can't grip the ball. Or BE makes no effort to get inside position (if you can use BE as a crutch/excuse for DA I can use it for Quinn).

osusev

your right they did not trade him they offered him a 5 year 50 million dollar contract after the franchise tag was used, your right that was the year the saints and dolphins wanted him but miami traded minnesota for Culpepper I believe that was 2006.

So I stand corrected I forgot about the franchise tag San Diego was forced to use.

I am not going defend all of DA's weaknesses or our team skill players in general. I think DA as a young QB has work to do, but the NFL has shown that young qbs who throw for more than 25tds in their first year is rare in their first full starting season. BQ may or may not have the arm or mental capacity to throw 25-30 yd strikes in tight coverage in order to beat defensive schemes. We dont know yet and that is something he has to prove in order to be a qb in the NFL.

BernietheKid

Masters said:
Wow, you just again reproved my assumption. SD never traded Drew Brees. They let him walk for nothing. Which they should have never done, because they could have gotten picks out of him.
And one played poorly over his last 16 starts. DA has put up back up QB stats over his last 16. CLE could get that same production out of one of them.

You bring up the coverage, so what was DA's excuse when the same D was used against him against HOU in the second half and against IND? It's also pretty hard to beat bump coverage when you can't grip the ball. Or BE makes no effort to get inside position (if you can use BE as a crutch/excuse for DA I can use it for Quinn).

Good points Masters. The fact of the matter is DA has had 20 plus starts and you know what your gonna get from him. Mistakes at critical parts of the game or a bunch of three and outs. He has never really improved from college and probably never will. So you might as well trade him while you can and at least get a pick or two to help this team.

osusev

@osusev said:
your right they did not trade him they offered him a 5 year 50 million dollar contract after the franchise tag was used, your right that was the year the saints and dolphins wanted him but miami traded minnesota for Culpepper I believe that was 2006.
So I stand corrected I forgot about the franchise tag San Diego was forced to use.

I am not going defend all of DA's weaknesses or our team skill players in general. I think DA as a young QB has work to do, but the NFL has shown that young qbs who throw for more than 25tds in their first year is rare in their first full starting season. BQ may or may not have the arm or mental capacity to throw 25-30 yd strikes in tight coverage in order to beat defensive schemes. We dont know yet and that is something he has to prove in order to be a qb in the NFL.

They didn't franchise him either, because of his hurt arm. If franchised, SD would have gotten something out of it. They just decided to let him walk for nothing. I was shocked, because you should try and get value.

But here is the issue with the concept of DA being young and having work to do. He has had the same problems since HS. He has never learned to take off the heat on his throws in shorter range. Might not ever be able to. As to the deep ball, it isn't ever about mental capacity to throw it (and Quinn threw more than his fair share at ND). It's one of the easier throws because you don't have to be precise on it. JasonJ does a great explaination of the whole thing in this thread: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php...=2465&st=20

"Can a qb improve his accuracy? Sure. Experience is a great teacher. But here's the rub. I can learn to drive a golf ball long and straight. I can learn to hit a 5 iron 165 on the button. It's one basic stroke. I can learn it. But the only way for me to learn all the millions of nuances for the 100's of 1000's of shots around the green... is repetition, repetition, repetition.

If you told me you have a quarterback that is accurate, but has trouble dialing in his deep ball. I'd tell you, unless he's out-throwing his arm, I can fix that. On a 40-45 yard throw, you only have to throw the ball into about an 12-18 foot circle depending on the route. Most quarterbacks, with proper mechanics, can do that with their eyes closed.

And the flatter you can throw it, the bigger that circle gets, because you can throw the ball through the target area instead of landing it in the target area. So, if you've got an arm like DA's and can throw 45-50 yards about 12 feet off the ground you've got a pretty good sized margin for error.

But, when you have a kid with a cannon hanging from his right shoulder that can't hit a 12 yard target without leaving a 6-foot exit wound coming out the other side, I'm going to have my doubts as to how much I can teach him. Kids with that kind of problem spend most of their time taking too much off, or not enough, skipping balls, sailing them, suffering through spells where they can't hit a single living thing with a football up to and including the sedentary cow it was made from.

And, on the subject of not going deep enough... I always like challenging a defense, but, you've got to take your shots when you get them. If the qb gets to the top of his drop and the DB's are still looking him in the eye, he just can't launch that deep ball. The DB's have a better look at it than the receiver does. And suddenly that 12-18 foot circle becomes a 24 inch port hole moving 20 miles per hour.

Now, if he get's man coverage, or the safety has already had to clear his hips and run, take a shot. But, most teams have figured out that they have to keep the Browns receivers in front of them."

Obviously, this was part of the case for going with Quinn over Anderson, but that's not the point here. The point is, if a guy has "accuracy problems," he's going to have accuracy problems. "

BernietheKid

@berniethekid said:
Good points Masters. The fact of the matter is DA has had 20 plus starts and you know what your gonna get from him. Mistakes at critical parts of the game or a bunch of three and outs. He has never really improved from college and probably never will. So you might as well trade him while you can and at least get a pick or two to help this team.

That's pretty much it. I could go into how much more organized and properly lined up the O also got once DA went to the bench, but that's a whole different story.