Interesting Options Developing in Browns QB Situation
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Again, Hawkins was interviewed after the game, and he said
IT WASN'T ON HOYER like everybody figures. He said the wr's,
rest of the offense all have to eliminate mistakes.
eyeball that.
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wow. farmer F'd up drafting this kid (maybe on haslem).
as i have said in the past that 22nd pick was wasted.
WR? OL? LB?
last year's QB draft was thin enough but to say geno smith would have been drafted higher than bortles is an amazing statement by highly regarded NFL scouts.
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My crystal ball says Hoyer's good season (say 8-8 or better) translates into him leaving as a FA and the team being OK with that. If 7 wins or less, we may sign him for reasonable dollars and then let the competition begin (which would be stacked in JM's favor). Either way (and despite being a Hoyer fan), I'm accepting that the JM era will begin next year (or sooner if the post-season is out of reach). No way that I would pay $8 M/ yr for multiple years with guarantees for Hoyer. I can't rank him in the top 16 QB's in the league, no matter where the statistics put him. Don't get me wrong, he's talented and smart. But notions that he could be the next Brady are exaggerated. If I'm Hoyer, I take a LT deal with the Browns and see what happens. JM needs to make the transition to the NFL game and so there is a good chance that he will not succeed and then Hoyer will be the starter again.
My crystal ball says Hoyer's good season (say 8-8 or better) translates into him leaving as a FA and the team being OK with that. If 7 wins or less, we may sign him for reasonable dollars and then let the competition begin (which would be stacked in JM's favor). Either way (and despite being a Hoyer fan), I'm accepting that the JM era will begin next year (or sooner if the post-season is out of reach). No way that I would pay $8 M/ yr for multiple years with guarantees for Hoyer. I can't rank him in the top 16 QB's in the league, no matter where the statistics put him. Don't get me wrong, he's talented and smart. But notions that he could be the next Brady are exaggerated. If I'm Hoyer, I take a LT deal with the Browns and see what happens. JM needs to make the transition to the NFL game and so there is a good chance that he will not succeed and then Hoyer will be the starter again.
This is exactly my fear. If Hoyer continues on this pace some NFL team will pay him 4 years $32 million, $18 million guaranteed. That means he's gone and then we are stuck with Manziel who has played 4 snaps in his NFL career. If Cleveland does pony up the cash then the Manziel pick is a waste.
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You guys are fucking hilarious.
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My crystal ball says Hoyer's good season (say 8-8 or better) translates into him leaving as a FA and the team being OK with that. If 7 wins or less, we may sign him for reasonable dollars and then let the competition begin (which would be stacked in JM's favor). Either way (and despite being a Hoyer fan), I'm accepting that the JM era will begin next year (or sooner if the post-season is out of reach). No way that I would pay $8 M/ yr for multiple years with guarantees for Hoyer. I can't rank him in the top 16 QB's in the league, no matter where the statistics put him. Don't get me wrong, he's talented and smart. But notions that he could be the next Brady are exaggerated. If I'm Hoyer, I take a LT deal with the Browns and see what happens. JM needs to make the transition to the NFL game and so there is a good chance that he will not succeed and then Hoyer will be the starter again.
This is exactly my fear. If Hoyer continues on this pace some NFL team will pay him 4 years $32 million, $18 million guaranteed. That means he's gone and then we are stuck with Manziel who has played 4 snaps in his NFL career. If Cleveland does pony up the cash then the Manziel pick is a waste.
I don't see manziel being a backup for four years just because of the persona that surrounds him.This is exactly my fear. If Hoyer continues on this pace some NFL team will pay him 4 years $32 million, $18 million guaranteed. That means he's gone and then we are stuck with Manziel who has played 4 snaps in his NFL career. If Cleveland does pony up the cash then the Manziel pick is a waste.
You never know what can happen, all Im concerned about is we put ourselves in the best position possible to win, and right now Hoyer probably puts us in the best position to win.
But I'm not really concerned with signing Hoyer. Does signing him automatically mean Manziel has to go? I bet he'llhe'll stpick around for awhile, even as the #2
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Stockton: It IS the world of the mods.
The server is private property, dumbfuck.
Stockton, YOU are in fact the communist in this discussion.. only in communist society is there no such thing as private property.
Get over yourself, dumbass. The "first amendment" does not actually mean anyone has to agree with or listen to you.
Deal with reality, Retard.
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@everlastingxxx said:
Stockton makes really good points. I think its all about perspective. Is being competitive and getting bounced in the first round of the playoffs your goal? Or building a Super Bowl Champion? Hoyer is a stop-gap QB. Nothing more, nothing less. The guy suffers from a noodle arm. Most of his passes are off target i think because he lacks a strong arm and weak legs. I also dont see him as a leader of men. I am bias of course, i think JM would bring an explosiveness to the offense that Brian cant.
I do admit, i am surprised the Browns keep winning and the lucky breaks they keep getting. That said, if they played the Cowboys tonight, they would get squashed.
I get that you're not a browns fan so don't watch many games, but everything you said is so wrong lol.
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Casual until JM sniffs some PT anyway...
And forget a hypothetical with us. You have a real life game against a rival led by a Browns' castoff QB to deal with tonite.
Stockton had his points, but ran out of fresh ones long ago. Now he only drones on and on about one topic...
... at least you have two.
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@everlastingxxx said:
Anyways, next weeks game against Arizona is the one i am really looking forward to.
More than ever now I'd guess...
How 'bout Dem Cowboys?
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inner division games are always tough. browns know.
i wanna see skip bayless's head explode tomorrow though.
i put my alarm on just to make sure i'm not dead by then, just to laugh at the 42" tv from a foot away.
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PS- Feel free to kick me out of the Tavern and delete my posts all because you don't like their message....It's not about "liking" the message. It's about you repeating over and over again. Like a broken fucking record. No one cares to hear your opinion 7 thousand times. It was lame the first time and now it's just old.
If you don't like the message just ignore it, don't pay attention to any facts it may present...It is void of any facts and is pure speculation on your part. We all have an opinion, but dont feel the need to jam it down everyone elses throat 40 thousand times. And we also dont need everyone else to agree just to feel validated. Maybe, someday, you will get to say "I told you so". Because we ALL know how important that is to you. Just imagine, someday you might actually feel what its like to be right. THAT will be a special day indeed. But, just be prepared, because no one will care except you.
History will be kind to these posts.....And history will also show that not one person cares but you......not one ...
PS- Feel free to kick me out of the Tavern and delete my posts all because you don't like their message....It's not about "liking" the message. It's about you repeating over and over again. Like a broken fucking record. No one cares to hear your opinion 7 thousand times. It was lame the first time and now it's just old.
If you don't like the message just ignore it, don't pay attention to any facts it may present...It is void of any facts and is pure speculation on your part. We all have an opinion, but dont feel the need to jam it down everyone elses throat 40 thousand times. And we also dont need everyone else to agree just to feel validated. Maybe, someday, you will get to say "I told you so". Because we ALL know how important that is to you. Just imagine, someday you might actually feel what its like to be right. THAT will be a special day indeed. But, just be prepared, because no one will care except you.
History will be kind to these posts.....And history will also show that not one person cares but you......not one ...
Stockton can't and never will get it- this is not another qb experiment year. As long as Hoyer is winning, Manziel sits. He's entitled to his opinion- and that's it. You think the Jets are really thrilled the way Geno Smith stunk the place out yesterday?
@everlastingxxx said:
Stockton makes really good points. I think its all about perspective. Is being competitive and getting bounced in the first round of the playoffs your goal? Or building a Super Bowl Champion? Hoyer is a stop-gap QB. Nothing more, nothing less. The guy suffers from a noodle arm. Most of his passes are off target i think because he lacks a strong arm and weak legs. I also dont see him as a leader of men. I am bias of course, i think JM would bring an explosiveness to the offense that Brian cant.
I do admit, i am surprised the Browns keep winning and the lucky breaks they keep getting. That said, if they played the Cowboys tonight, they would get squashed.
Here's my eyeball test- 23-13, 5-1 at home. Yeah- let's do an eyeball test on the Cowboys after tonight. Romo looked as crappy against the 'Skins as Hoyer did against the Jags. and the 'Skins didn't even have Orakpo. Every qb alive is going to look like crap when his o-line can't give him time to throw.
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The only interesting option in my opinion is that Johnny Football gets his first start sooner rather than later. I'm now, after seven games , in total agreement that Johnny Manziel should start by week ten. And I pray it comes to pass. Hell I hope he starts next week! With a different team. Think about how nice that would be. All the Manzielots would go away forever and the Browns should at least get a late first round or early second round pick. And maybe even a bag of footballs! I can dream can't I
GO BROWNS!
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I think Hoyer should be proud of himself and Browns fans should be thankful that he's allowing us to be competitive while Manziel gets "ready"... but let's be real. This is a guy with a bottom third arm who isn't a threat with his legs and has completed about 56% of his passes from MSU through now, the brink of 30.
He ain't changing at this point. He's not surgically accurate, he isn't strong armed, and he isn't a threat to run. He's Brian Hoyer. He'll be Brian Hoyer next year and the year after that. He's a solid bridge starter and high-end backup in the Cassel-Moore-Fitzpatrick area. I struggle to believe anybody really expects a lot more than that.
I'd bet one of my three balls the Browns end up in the 8-8 to 9-7 area, middle of the league, and Hoyer ends up around 20th-25th in PR, somewhere in the area of 86. He hasn't seen the worst weather or best defenses he'll face.
I think that's a nice beginning for a rising team and an accurate representation of what/who Hoyer is... and that ain't good enough in this 65% completion, 100-ish PR league. The top 10-12 PR QBs are basically your playoff teams, year after year.
Manziel comes with no guarantees... but I feel pretty confident Hoyer is what he is and it ain't enough. Pettine is talking about Hoyer's contract status and the need to evaluate Manziel in the same breath, even as the Browns are alive for a playoff birth. It's a thing. It's an issue.
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I think Hoyer should be proud of himself and Browns fans should be thankful that he's allowing us to be competitive while Manziel gets "ready"... but let's be real. This is a guy with a bottom third arm who isn't a threat with his legs and has completed about 56% of his passes from MSU through now, the brink of 30.
He ain't changing at this point. He's not surgically accurate, he isn't strong armed, and he isn't a threat to run. He's Brian Hoyer. He'll be Brian Hoyer next year and the year after that. He's a solid bridge starter and high-end backup in the Cassel-Moore-Fitzpatrick area. I struggle to believe anybody really expects a lot more than that.
I'd bet one of my three balls the Browns end up in the 8-8 to 9-7 area, middle of the league, and Hoyer ends up around 20th-25th in PR, somewhere in the area of 86. He hasn't seen the worst weather or best defenses he'll face.
I think that's a nice beginning for a rising team and an accurate representation of what/who Hoyer is... and that ain't good enough in this 65% completion, 100-ish PR league. The top 10-12 PR QBs are basically your playoff teams, year after year.
Manziel comes with no guarantees... but I feel pretty confident Hoyer is what he is and it ain't enough. Pettine is talking about Hoyer's contract status and the need to evaluate Manziel in the same breath, even as the Browns are alive for a playoff birth. It's a thing. It's an issue.
I think Hoyer should be proud of himself and Browns fans should be thankful that he's allowing us to be competitive while Manziel gets "ready"... but let's be real. This is a guy with a bottom third arm who isn't a threat with his legs and has completed about 56% of his passes from MSU through now, the brink of 30.
He ain't changing at this point. He's not surgically accurate, he isn't strong armed, and he isn't a threat to run. He's Brian Hoyer. He'll be Brian Hoyer next year and the year after that. He's a solid bridge starter and high-end backup in the Cassel-Moore-Fitzpatrick area. I struggle to believe anybody really expects a lot more than that.
I'd bet one of my three balls the Browns end up in the 8-8 to 9-7 area, middle of the league, and Hoyer ends up around 20th-25th in PR, somewhere in the area of 86. He hasn't seen the worst weather or best defenses he'll face.
I think that's a nice beginning for a rising team and an accurate representation of what/who Hoyer is... and that ain't good enough in this 65% completion, 100-ish PR league. The top 10-12 PR QBs are basically your playoff teams, year after year.
Manziel comes with no guarantees... but I feel pretty confident Hoyer is what he is and it ain't enough. Pettine is talking about Hoyer's contract status and the need to evaluate Manziel in the same breath, even as the Browns are alive for a playoff birth. It's a thing. It's an issue.
Right on brother.
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I think Hoyer should be proud of himself and Browns fans should be thankful that he's allowing us to be competitive while Manziel gets "ready"... but let's be real. This is a guy with a bottom third arm who isn't a threat with his legs and has completed about 56% of his passes from MSU through now, the brink of 30.
He ain't changing at this point. He's not surgically accurate, he isn't strong armed, and he isn't a threat to run. He's Brian Hoyer. He'll be Brian Hoyer next year and the year after that. He's a solid bridge starter and high-end backup in the Cassel-Moore-Fitzpatrick area. I struggle to believe anybody really expects a lot more than that.
I'd bet one of my three balls the Browns end up in the 8-8 to 9-7 area, middle of the league, and Hoyer ends up around 20th-25th in PR, somewhere in the area of 86. He hasn't seen the worst weather or best defenses he'll face.
I think that's a nice beginning for a rising team and an accurate representation of what/who Hoyer is... and that ain't good enough in this 65% completion, 100-ish PR league. The top 10-12 PR QBs are basically your playoff teams, year after year.
Manziel comes with no guarantees... but I feel pretty confident Hoyer is what he is and it ain't enough. Pettine is talking about Hoyer's contract status and the need to evaluate Manziel in the same breath, even as the Browns are alive for a playoff birth. It's a thing. It's an issue.
I think Hoyer should be proud of himself and Browns fans should be thankful that he's allowing us to be competitive while Manziel gets "ready"... but let's be real. This is a guy with a bottom third arm who isn't a threat with his legs and has completed about 56% of his passes from MSU through now, the brink of 30.
He ain't changing at this point. He's not surgically accurate, he isn't strong armed, and he isn't a threat to run. He's Brian Hoyer. He'll be Brian Hoyer next year and the year after that. He's a solid bridge starter and high-end backup in the Cassel-Moore-Fitzpatrick area. I struggle to believe anybody really expects a lot more than that.
I'd bet one of my three balls the Browns end up in the 8-8 to 9-7 area, middle of the league, and Hoyer ends up around 20th-25th in PR, somewhere in the area of 86. He hasn't seen the worst weather or best defenses he'll face.
I think that's a nice beginning for a rising team and an accurate representation of what/who Hoyer is... and that ain't good enough in this 65% completion, 100-ish PR league. The top 10-12 PR QBs are basically your playoff teams, year after year.
Manziel comes with no guarantees... but I feel pretty confident Hoyer is what he is and it ain't enough. Pettine is talking about Hoyer's contract status and the need to evaluate Manziel in the same breath, even as the Browns are alive for a playoff birth. It's a thing. It's an issue.
Amen.
I feel like someone else around here has been saying the same thing since preseason.
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I think Hoyer should be proud of himself and Browns fans should be thankful that he's allowing us to be competitive while Manziel gets "ready"... but let's be real. This is a guy with a bottom third arm who isn't a threat with his legs and has completed about 56% of his passes from MSU through now, the brink of 30.
He ain't changing at this point. He's not surgically accurate, he isn't strong armed, and he isn't a threat to run. He's Brian Hoyer. He'll be Brian Hoyer next year and the year after that. He's a solid bridge starter and high-end backup in the Cassel-Moore-Fitzpatrick area. I struggle to believe anybody really expects a lot more than that.
I'd bet one of my three balls the Browns end up in the 8-8 to 9-7 area, middle of the league, and Hoyer ends up around 20th-25th in PR, somewhere in the area of 86. He hasn't seen the worst weather or best defenses he'll face.
I think that's a nice beginning for a rising team and an accurate representation of what/who Hoyer is... and that ain't good enough in this 65% completion, 100-ish PR league. The top 10-12 PR QBs are basically your playoff teams, year after year.
Manziel comes with no guarantees... but I feel pretty confident Hoyer is what he is and it ain't enough. Pettine is talking about Hoyer's contract status and the need to evaluate Manziel in the same breath, even as the Browns are alive for a playoff birth. It's a thing. It's an issue.
-
I think Hoyer should be proud of himself and Browns fans should be thankful that he's allowing us to be competitive while Manziel gets "ready"... but let's be real. This is a guy with a bottom third arm who isn't a threat with his legs and has completed about 56% of his passes from MSU through now, the brink of 30.
He ain't changing at this point. He's not surgically accurate, he isn't strong armed, and he isn't a threat to run. He's Brian Hoyer. He'll be Brian Hoyer next year and the year after that. He's a solid bridge starter and high-end backup in the Cassel-Moore-Fitzpatrick area. I struggle to believe anybody really expects a lot more than that.
I'd bet one of my three balls the Browns end up in the 8-8 to 9-7 area, middle of the league, and Hoyer ends up around 20th-25th in PR, somewhere in the area of 86. He hasn't seen the worst weather or best defenses he'll face.
I think that's a nice beginning for a rising team and an accurate representation of what/who Hoyer is... and that ain't good enough in this 65% completion, 100-ish PR league. The top 10-12 PR QBs are basically your playoff teams, year after year.
Manziel comes with no guarantees... but I feel pretty confident Hoyer is what he is and it ain't enough. Pettine is talking about Hoyer's contract status and the need to evaluate Manziel in the same breath, even as the Browns are alive for a playoff birth. It's a thing. It's an issue.
I think Hoyer should be proud of himself and Browns fans should be thankful that he's allowing us to be competitive while Manziel gets "ready"... but let's be real. This is a guy with a bottom third arm who isn't a threat with his legs and has completed about 56% of his passes from MSU through now, the brink of 30.
He ain't changing at this point. He's not surgically accurate, he isn't strong armed, and he isn't a threat to run. He's Brian Hoyer. He'll be Brian Hoyer next year and the year after that. He's a solid bridge starter and high-end backup in the Cassel-Moore-Fitzpatrick area. I struggle to believe anybody really expects a lot more than that.
I'd bet one of my three balls the Browns end up in the 8-8 to 9-7 area, middle of the league, and Hoyer ends up around 20th-25th in PR, somewhere in the area of 86. He hasn't seen the worst weather or best defenses he'll face.
I think that's a nice beginning for a rising team and an accurate representation of what/who Hoyer is... and that ain't good enough in this 65% completion, 100-ish PR league. The top 10-12 PR QBs are basically your playoff teams, year after year.
Manziel comes with no guarantees... but I feel pretty confident Hoyer is what he is and it ain't enough. Pettine is talking about Hoyer's contract status and the need to evaluate Manziel in the same breath, even as the Browns are alive for a playoff birth. It's a thing. It's an issue.
Shep, it's not so much an accuracy issue (except on deep balls 80% of the time) As it is just plain being erratic. His thread the needle passes are dead on. His arm is adequate, nothing special. And I totally disagree on the mobility issue, unless you're comparing him to Manziel, or a healthy RG III. Hoyer certainly has better wheels than the Mannings (either one), Brady, and probably Drew Brees. He's mobile enough- and the previously mentioned prove in spades you don't have to be a track star to be an upper echelon qb in the NFL.
Amen.
I feel like someone else around here has been saying the same thing since preseason.
Shep occasionally drops by- he used to be a regular over here- hangs out on the other place. I'd suggest you follow him over there- there's a lot more Manziel love on Barki**ing Hard.
Sound familiar? We hope to be so lucky.
Not really D, Kosar had one of the most accurate deep passes in the history of the NFL. Shep's comparisons are what I'm coming around to think- Fitzpatrick good, he's also being compared to Chad Pennington too. He might improve some, but 10 best in the league he's never going to be. I'll have to remind Shep guys like Trent Dilfer, Doug Williams, Jim McMahon, Mark Rypien, Jeff Hostetler, and Brad Johnson won Super Bowls. The QB doesn't have to be Peyton (choke) Manning- if the rest of the team is good enough.
Dynasty? F**k that- "Just ONE before I die."
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I think Hoyer should be proud of himself and Browns fans should be thankful that he's allowing us to be competitive while Manziel gets "ready"... but let's be real. This is a guy with a bottom third arm who isn't a threat with his legs and has completed about 56% of his passes from MSU through now, the brink of 30.
He ain't changing at this point. He's not surgically accurate, he isn't strong armed, and he isn't a threat to run. He's Brian Hoyer. He'll be Brian Hoyer next year and the year after that. He's a solid bridge starter and high-end backup in the Cassel-Moore-Fitzpatrick area. I struggle to believe anybody really expects a lot more than that.
I'd bet one of my three balls the Browns end up in the 8-8 to 9-7 area, middle of the league, and Hoyer ends up around 20th-25th in PR, somewhere in the area of 86. He hasn't seen the worst weather or best defenses he'll face.
I think that's a nice beginning for a rising team and an accurate representation of what/who Hoyer is... and that ain't good enough in this 65% completion, 100-ish PR league. The top 10-12 PR QBs are basically your playoff teams, year after year.
Manziel comes with no guarantees... but I feel pretty confident Hoyer is what he is and it ain't enough. Pettine is talking about Hoyer's contract status and the need to evaluate Manziel in the same breath, even as the Browns are alive for a playoff birth. It's a thing. It's an issue.
Amen.
I feel like someone else around here has been saying the same thing since preseason.
Amen.
I feel like someone else around here has been saying the same thing since preseason.
well it sure wasn't you.
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Kind of a modest goal.Hes Bernie Kosar
...Sound familiar? We hope to be so lucky.
Not exactly hitching your wagon to a star there bud.
WSS
www.westsidesteve.com www.myspace.com/westsidestevemusic www.cdbaby.com/artist/westsidestevesimmons
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