Vick is ready
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vick's image is tainted forever. no matter where he goes there will too many fans against him. what he did was disgusting and ridiculous. it doesn't matter if he becomes the president of PETA, his image is ruined forever. more fans of whatever team picks him up will be against for than for him.
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BTW 65% of the NFL players are black.
where's that stat from? i'm curious; thought it was much higher.
oldcow1945 said:
Serial killers normally have a history of cruelty to animals.that's an assumption built on an old model that's since been disproven. it was assumed to be correct at one time as part of a triad of experiences that led people to become serial killers with the other two being pyromania and bedwetting, with childhood abuse, either physical or sexual, being a common link as well. however, these behaviors are neither accurate indicators of becoming a serial killer nor are they exclusive to serial killing. there are far more factors that go into becoming a serial killer than three simple acts, and there's little to predict who will become a serial murderer because we understand so little of their psychology.
on a different tack, a person's color of his skin does nothing to determine the content of his character. someone's past experiences and upbringing determine what kind of person he will become. to say that someone will be a criminal because he is black, white, asian, native american or any other race, ethnicity or national origin is foolish, shortsighted and bigoted, and it makes the person who makes the assertion look ignorant and backwards, and i believe rightly so.
vick's crimes are indefensible, and there's no way i'd want him on my team. personally, as a dog lover, i want him tortured then brought back to health then tortured again and killed in the most horrible, painful ways possible, but i want that to happen to him solely because of what he's done, and would want anyone else who does the same to receive the same treatment.
i also think lenoard little should be kicked out of the league and am amazed that there's not more outrage about him also being a murderer.
where's that stat from? i'm curious; thought it was much higher.
Well I heard it on Espn's outside the lines a few months ago but this link says 67%
While 67 percent of all players in the NFL are black, there are no African-American owners and one general manager. Ozzie Newsome became the first Black General Manager of an NFL team in 2002. He works in the front office for the Baltimore Ravens.
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I can forgive people of a lot of things but not this. These types of people are absolute scumbags.
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@shepwrite said:
He didn't just fight dogs... he murdered them with his own hands. He's a sociopath. While it's his "right" to gain employment at any level he can find a suitor, I'm surely not pulling for him.Amen brother. Serial killers normally have a history of cruelty to animals. He is a true sociapath.
oldcow1945 said:
Amen brother. Serial killers normally have a history of cruelty to animals. He is a true sociapath.Great... But every Sunday we see guys on the field who smack around thier wives and/or girlfriends... I don't see you guys getting all offended over that. Twisted world we live in. Guys get dui and endanger the lives of everyone on the road.. no one is outraged that they may be killing HUMANS.. check out this link to the number of nfl arrests in ONE year.. This is an older list but there are a lot of assuaults, domestic violence, dwi's and drugs.. I counted about 41 arrests.. that is nearly 8% of the whole league being arrested. Vick will be right back on the field in no time. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/sport...t_12162006.html Sorry guys...while fighting dogs is sick.. offenses against humans is a bit more disturbing to me.. No one seems to be so shocked about that.. what's wrong with this picture?
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oldcow1945 said:
Amen brother. Serial killers normally have a history of cruelty to animals. He is a true sociapath.Great... But every Sunday we see guys on the field who smack around thier wives and/or girlfriends... I don't see you guys getting all offended over that. Twisted world we live in. Guys get dui and endanger the lives of everyone on the road.. no one is outraged that they may be killing HUMANS.. check out this link to the number of nfl arrests in ONE year.. This is an older list but there are a lot of assuaults, domestic violence, dwi's and drugs.. I counted about 41 arrests.. that is nearly 8% of the whole league being arrested. Vick will be right back on the field in no time. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/sport...t_12162006.html Sorry guys...while fighting dogs is sick.. offenses against humans is a bit more disturbing to me.. No one seems to be so shocked about that.. what's wrong with this picture?
Great... But every Sunday we see guys on the field who smack around thier wives and/or girlfriends... I don't see you guys getting all offended over that. Twisted world we live in. Guys get dui and endanger the lives of everyone on the road.. no one is outraged that they may be killing HUMANS.. check out this link to the number of nfl arrests in ONE year.. This is an older list but there are a lot of assuaults, domestic violence, dwi's and drugs.. I counted about 41 arrests.. that is nearly 8% of the whole league being arrested. Vick will be right back on the field in no time. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/sport...t_12162006.html Sorry guys...while fighting dogs is sick.. offenses against humans is a bit more disturbing to me.. No one seems to be so shocked about that.. what's wrong with this picture?
The problem is this...I think things such as DUI's are more of a crime of ignorance. Many people just don't see it as going out and endangering the masses. Is it wrong? yes, it's very wrong. But a person that drinks a bit too much (A beer or two and a .009 and you are a DUI stat) isn't the same as person who goes out and PURPOSELY hurts and kills animals. This is a sickness. It's criminal activity that should be held in the highest disdain. Should I then look at a couple of my firends who have DUI's in the same light that I look at Mike Vick with?
If a football player is arrested and convicted of spouse abuse, I think he should be held to the same penalties as any other violent criminal. Just because I view Vick as a disgusting excuse for a human being and have voiced that opinion, while I have not yet voiced my opionion of wife beaters, don't try and say I or we don't view those guys in the same disgusting light. None of them deserve to be working for the NFL. I am just as shocked over that too.
Are there recent examples of an NFL player beating his wife or girlfriend that we don't know about and have not had a chance to be disgusted over?
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I don't see how anyone can say vick was not a great player.. He is not a typical passing QB for sure. however.. he really only started full time for 4 seasons. He made the probowl three times and led his team to the playoffs 2x including going to a championship game. Every team who played him had to gameplan for HIM. That is the sign of a great player. Not to mention he signed the richest contract in nfl history at the time. Trust me there are teams that will pay him to play QB. What he did was sick. No, I am not his greatest fan, I enjoy watching him.. mostly watching him run.. but the guy is a force. Period. Ask anyone who ever had to play defense against him. Guy was a nightmare because of his running skills.
I guess I am the only one willing to stand up for the guy getting another chance ..sorry ...but get used to seeing him as he will only be 29 in June.
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EJ, I don't think anyone thinks he wasn't a good player...I liked to watch him but things have changed and could care less about him.
You say get use to seeing him, OK, Where? Honestly I have a hard time seeing it.
The Jets have already said they have no interest in him and they need a qb. And lets not forget that big pricetag that's going along with him. I think the only way you see him in a uniform is if he tears up his old contract and starts from scratch. Dont see that happening but it might be the only option for a broke dick qb.
Here is a good article to read http://sports.espn.go.com/espnmag/story?id=3726426
Gives you an idea how broke ole Ron Mexico is.
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I agree completely with Hiwaygal.
Some of his career numbers
Yards per game: 155
Career TD's to INT's 71 to 52
Career QB rating of 75
Certainly not good numbers.
His biggest asset was his ability to run. But what happens when he losses a step and has to depend on getting rid of the ball?
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@shepwrite said:
Well, he's a PR nightmare who probably has to play a different position to have any value (he's not at all bright and he's a horribly inaccurate passer). Think of him as Vince Young (backup), but far less polished as a passer.He almost certainly won't play in the NFL this year, as I've read repeatedly. In fact, the NFL might not even reinstate him for 2009, opting to force one more year out of the league so the Raiders or Cowboys don't do something stupid.
If he keeps his nose clean in Canada for a year and spend that time learning to play RB or WR, then he has a shot.
my exact response....PR nightmare!!!
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read'em and weep.. the conversations have already started taking a serious tone. SF would be a good spot for Vick as it is a liberal venue. Singletary already says they have discussed it. It it's being discussed there.. it's being discussed all over. Someone will take the discussion to the next level. n Here is the article and I heard it on ESPN as well today. Oh.. and Hiway gal says he is not that good. I cannot think of anyone on our roster who is only 29 years olewith 3 probowls under his belt. (old man willie has 3 I think)
Michael Vick, QB, Atlanta Falcons Tuesday 2/17, 8:12 AM CT
The 49ers may be interested in Michael Vick, according to the Santa Rosa Press- Democrat. Head coach Mike Singletary said, "I am not going to say I am open or closed. I would say it has to be something GM Scot McCloughan and I talk about and feel good about one way or the other. But we have not talked about it at this point in great detail. We are trying to focus on what we have." Team President Jed York added, "If they felt it was right for the team, and convince me and my parents, it is up to them to show that somebody who has had issues in the past can be a part of this team."
Our View: The 49ers are currently the only known NFL club to express possible interest in Vick. If Vick did land in San Francisco, his primary competition at quarterback would be Shaun Hill.
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Great... But every Sunday we see guys on the field who smack around thier wives and/or girlfriends... I don't see you guys getting all offended over that. Twisted world we live in. Guys get dui and endanger the lives of everyone on the road.. no one is outraged that they may be killing HUMANS.. check out this link to the number of nfl arrests in ONE year.. This is an older list but there are a lot of assuaults, domestic violence, dwi's and drugs.. I counted about 41 arrests.. that is nearly 8% of the whole league being arrested. Vick will be right back on the field in no time. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/sport...t_12162006.html Sorry guys...while fighting dogs is sick.. offenses against humans is a bit more disturbing to me.. No one seems to be so shocked about that.. what's wrong with this picture?
The problem is this...I think things such as DUI's are more of a crime of ignorance. Many people just don't see it as going out and endangering the masses. Is it wrong? yes, it's very wrong. But a person that drinks a bit too much (A beer or two and a .009 and you are a DUI stat) isn't the same as person who goes out and PURPOSELY hurts and kills animals. This is a sickness. It's criminal activity that should be held in the highest disdain. Should I then look at a couple of my firends who have DUI's in the same light that I look at Mike Vick with?
If a football player is arrested and convicted of spouse abuse, I think he should be held to the same penalties as any other violent criminal. Just because I view Vick as a disgusting excuse for a human being and have voiced that opinion, while I have not yet voiced my opionion of wife beaters, don't try and say I or we don't view those guys in the same disgusting light. None of them deserve to be working for the NFL. I am just as shocked over that too.
Are there recent examples of an NFL player beating his wife or girlfriend that we don't know about and have not had a chance to be disgusted over?
oldcow1945 said:
The problem is this...I think things such as DUI's are more of a crime of ignorance. Many people just don't see it as going out and endangering the masses. Is it wrong? yes, it's very wrong. But a person that drinks a bit too much (A beer or two and a .009 and you are a DUI stat) isn't the same as person who goes out and PURPOSELY hurts and kills animals. This is a sickness. It's criminal activity that should be held in the highest disdain. Should I then look at a couple of my firends who have DUI's in the same light that I look at Mike Vick with?If a football player is arrested and convicted of spouse abuse, I think he should be held to the same penalties as any other violent criminal. Just because I view Vick as a disgusting excuse for a human being and have voiced that opinion, while I have not yet voiced my opionion of wife beaters, don't try and say I or we don't view those guys in the same disgusting light. None of them deserve to be working for the NFL. I am just as shocked over that too.
Are there recent examples of an NFL player beating his wife or girlfriend that we don't know about and have not had a chance to be disgusted over?
OLD COW: This is exactly the dismissive attitude I am talking about and I am pissed off about..... Sorry but I disagree.. it is WORSE than fighting dogs.... if you don't have a ride home BEFORE you go out.. you CHOSE to PURPOSELY endanger other peoples lives.. We have come to accept excuses for drinking and driving.. " Oh, i only had 3 or I only had 2" ... most of them in fact have had 5 or 6 drinks.... fact is before you have even ONE drink .... you need to check yourself. If you don't you are engangering HUMAN BEINGS.. People should not even drive after ONE beer. You can rationalize all you want on this.. but the fact is drinking and driving is a crime and puts others in danger... Think before you drink.. If you ask me people should lose the license to drive for 5 years first offense. period.. 2nd offense 10 years... then maybe people will wake up to the epidemic on our roadways.
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and for the doubters who think I have lost my mind...this just in from kffl
NFL
49ers | Not ruling out Vick
Matt Maiocco, of the Santa Rosa Press Democrat, reports San Francisco 49ers head coach Mike Singletary did not rule out the possibility of the team trying to trade for Atlanta Falcons QB Michael Vick.
2009-02-16 23:02:43
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oldcow1945 said:
The problem is this...I think things such as DUI's are more of a crime of ignorance. Many people just don't see it as going out and endangering the masses. Is it wrong? yes, it's very wrong. But a person that drinks a bit too much (A beer or two and a .009 and you are a DUI stat) isn't the same as person who goes out and PURPOSELY hurts and kills animals. This is a sickness. It's criminal activity that should be held in the highest disdain. Should I then look at a couple of my firends who have DUI's in the same light that I look at Mike Vick with?If a football player is arrested and convicted of spouse abuse, I think he should be held to the same penalties as any other violent criminal. Just because I view Vick as a disgusting excuse for a human being and have voiced that opinion, while I have not yet voiced my opionion of wife beaters, don't try and say I or we don't view those guys in the same disgusting light. None of them deserve to be working for the NFL. I am just as shocked over that too.
Are there recent examples of an NFL player beating his wife or girlfriend that we don't know about and have not had a chance to be disgusted over?
OLD COW: This is exactly the dismissive attitude I am talking about and I am pissed off about..... Sorry but I disagree.. it is WORSE than fighting dogs.... if you don't have a ride home BEFORE you go out.. you CHOSE to PURPOSELY endanger other peoples lives.. We have come to accept excuses for drinking and driving.. " Oh, i only had 3 or I only had 2" ... most of them in fact have had 5 or 6 drinks.... fact is before you have even ONE drink .... you need to check yourself. If you don't you are engangering HUMAN BEINGS.. People should not even drive after ONE beer. You can rationalize all you want on this.. but the fact is drinking and driving is a crime and puts others in danger... Think before you drink.. If you ask me people should lose the license to drive for 5 years first offense. period.. 2nd offense 10 years... then maybe people will wake up to the epidemic on our roadways.
OLD COW: This is exactly the dismissive attitude I am talking about and I am pissed off about..... Sorry but I disagree.. it is WORSE than fighting dogs.... if you don't have a ride home BEFORE you go out.. you CHOSE to PURPOSELY endanger other peoples lives.. We have come to accept excuses for drinking and driving.. " Oh, i only had 3 or I only had 2" ... most of them in fact have had 5 or 6 drinks.... fact is before you have even ONE drink .... you need to check yourself. If you don't you are engangering HUMAN BEINGS.. People should not even drive after ONE beer. You can rationalize all you want on this.. but the fact is drinking and driving is a crime and puts others in danger... Think before you drink.. If you ask me people should lose the license to drive for 5 years first offense. period.. 2nd offense 10 years... then maybe people will wake up to the epidemic on our roadways.
We'll just have to agree to disagree.
Never would I agree that blowing a .009 is anywhere near killing dogs or wife beating or any other major criminal activity.
Sure, if you go out and knock down 6 or 8 or 20 and get behind the wheel then you should get thrown in jail and have the key thrown away. But even at that, the person is not the kind of mentally ill person that Mike Vick is....And that is what concerns me. The Narcissitic pathology that can be spread through culture.
This issue simply can't be black in white. There has to be a certain amount of reason and common sense involved when we talk about this. Again, a person that almost never drinks, works hard, is a good person, etc, but then one day decides to have a cocktail or two after dinner and gets nabbed for a .009 DUI is worse than Mike Vick? C'mon...That isn't being reasonable. It was a bad piece of judgment. Not a mental illness that Mike Vick suffers from.
I'll never agree with that.
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Wow ..I would root the Niners and Singletary on if they pulled this one out...Vick and Gore would do damage in that backfield..
Or is this a move a desperate perennially bad franchise makes that always backfires?
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Wow ..I would root the Niners and Singletary on if they pulled this one out...Vick and Gore would do damage in that backfield..
Or is this a move a desperate perennially bad franchise makes that always backfires?
Wow ..I would root the Niners and Singletary on if they pulled this one out...Vick and Gore would do damage in that backfield..
Or is this a move a desperate perennially bad franchise makes that always backfires?
From a PR standpoint this will backfire horribly. Can you imagine the media hype and the crowds?
Why would any team want that headache?
It won't be a matter of picking him up and having him slip quietly into the NFL. It'll be a major thing and a major headache. It would no longer be about the Niners. It would be about Mike Vick.
Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote! - "Ben Franklin" -
Wow ..I would root the Niners and Singletary on if they pulled this one out...Vick and Gore would do damage in that backfield..
Or is this a move a desperate perennially bad franchise makes that always backfires?
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mz. said:
I think these guys would have a bone to pick with you there.
The most successful franchise for the entire decade of 1980's!
RIP Bill.
I have a soft spot for this guy because of his skip off the field after a sam Wyche coaching blunder allowed him to beat the Bungals.
I laugh everytime I think of that.
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There are only two relevant questions here, IMO:
1) Can he help the team?
2) Would the outcry be enough to negatively affect the team's business--and I mean seriously affect it, which means costing a lot of money and doing it long-term?
Two case studies:
1) Jamal Lewis pled guilty to participating in a drug deal, served his time, and got back into the game. Nobody bats an eye at him now.
2) Christian Peter--much more of a sociopath than Vick--spent his time at Nebraska going to class, threatening to kill people, raping women, and having Tom Osborne look the other way. He got drafted by the Patriots, then was cut in the wake of a public outcry by people who thought that he should have been under the jail, what with the rapes and all. He ended up getting a couple of teams to sign him and ended up having a six-year NFL career (which still baffles me). We might throw in Lawrence Phillips as well.
Vick plead to his crimes, is serving his time, and if a team wants to pick him up, good for him.
Dennis
I probably didn't have to throw Tom Osborne in there, but anytime people can point out that he's a scumbag and a fraud, they should do so.
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read'em and weep.. the conversations have already started taking a serious tone. SF would be a good spot for Vick as it is a liberal venue. Singletary already says they have discussed it. It it's being discussed there.. it's being discussed all over. Someone will take the discussion to the next level. n Here is the article and I heard it on ESPN as well today. Oh.. and Hiway gal says he is not that good. I cannot think of anyone on our roster who is only 29 years olewith 3 probowls under his belt. (old man willie has 3 I think)
Michael Vick, QB, Atlanta Falcons Tuesday 2/17, 8:12 AM CT
The 49ers may be interested in Michael Vick, according to the Santa Rosa Press- Democrat. Head coach Mike Singletary said, "I am not going to say I am open or closed. I would say it has to be something GM Scot McCloughan and I talk about and feel good about one way or the other. But we have not talked about it at this point in great detail. We are trying to focus on what we have." Team President Jed York added, "If they felt it was right for the team, and convince me and my parents, it is up to them to show that somebody who has had issues in the past can be a part of this team."
Our View: The 49ers are currently the only known NFL club to express possible interest in Vick. If Vick did land in San Francisco, his primary competition at quarterback would be Shaun Hill.
read'em and weep.. the conversations have already started taking a serious tone. SF would be a good spot for Vick as it is a liberal venue.
This would be true, had his crimes 'only' been against humans, or, even more specifically, rich, old white guys (he would be a hero in that case). But he engaged in dog fighting, and the PETA crazies are thicker out there than anywhere else.
From a PR standpoint, I can't think of a much worse place than SF for Vick to land.
There's really no 'good' place for him to land. Just places that are 'less bad'.
Honestly, I can't see that he would be such a valuable addition that you MUST have him and the negative publicity would be offset by what he adds to the team. There will be better running backs with less baggage to be had, and pretty much better QBs just about anywhere.
I could see him landing in Canada, except I think the Canadians frown on his type of foolishness even more than most of us do.
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