Betting Odds To Win AFC North
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Unbiased, I for one don't mind the Steelers. I know I should as a Browns fan but my best friend just finished up his career at Pitt and I've been up there twice. Last time I got to see your boys beat the piss out of the Colts. It was fun.
Unbiased, I for one don't mind the Steelers. I know I should as a Browns fan but my best friend just finished up his career at Pitt and I've been up there twice. Last time I got to see your boys beat the piss out of the Colts. It was fun.
From an organizational standpoint, I don't mind the Steelers. Go back and take a head count of all the ownerships that opposed the Browns being taken out of Cleveland by he-who-shall not be named. You'll find the Rooneys on that very short list. This was, for quite the longest time, one of - if not the best rivalry in the NFL. We knew that, they did as well and both our fanbases suffered when the Browns were gone. I believe the Rooney's even set up area's for Browns fans to visit Pittsburgh and attend games, if I"m correct?
Our two teams are companion pieces in time. While I do envy their success, I will always question the massive steroid rumors hanging over the heads of that team from the 70's and early 80's.
I do however despise their fans... Can't stand them. I look forward to the day Ben has that sharp decline in production and they return to the pit of mediocrity from whence they came.
Even better if a contender arose from Cleveland simultaneously.
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not all fans are created equal.
i really despise bandwagon fans from any team. half the people i know in NY are either steeler fans or cowboy fans. you talk to them, figure out their age and ask them "so how does a person, who's born and raised in NY become a cowboy fan?" their usual reply after fumbling around a bit: "well i like troy aikman" or "my dad bought me an emmit smith jersey" eyc. etc.
bullshit. you were a kid when they were winning super bowls and you attached yourself to them because they were winning, plain and simple. bandwagon bitches.
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The Steelers suck, congrats on earning the right to play one more game and lose.
BTW- Rapistburger is huge TOOL. My sister was his waitress once at a Applebee's or something and all this money he gets and he gave NO tip. What a asshole......
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not all fans are created equal.
i really despise bandwagon fans from any team. half the people i know in NY are either steeler fans or cowboy fans. you talk to them, figure out their age and ask them "so how does a person, who's born and raised in NY become a cowboy fan?" their usual reply after fumbling around a bit: "well i like troy aikman" or "my dad bought me an emmit smith jersey" eyc. etc.
bullshit. you were a kid when they were winning super bowls and you attached yourself to them because they were winning, plain and simple. bandwagon bitches.
not all fans are created equal.
i really despise bandwagon fans from any team. half the people i know in NY are either steeler fans or cowboy fans. you talk to them, figure out their age and ask them "so how does a person, who's born and raised in NY become a cowboy fan?" their usual reply after fumbling around a bit: "well i like troy aikman" or "my dad bought me an emmit smith jersey" eyc. etc.
bullshit. you were a kid when they were winning super bowls and you attached yourself to them because they were winning, plain and simple. bandwagon bitches.
I don't think you can blame a kid for being attracted to a winning team. Or anyone for that matter. Fandom means different things to different people. You obviously take a lot of pride in sticking with an organization that has given you almost nothing to be a fan about. You wear it as a badge of honor and you take your fandomness seriously. Others are more passive about it and don't get as deep emotionally. Sports isn't as important to them. Myself, I became a Steeler fan after my Browns fan uncle took me to a Browns training camp practice when I was a kid and then to a game later that season. I had fun at the practice and met Sam Rutigliano and some of the players. I thought it was cool. Then I went to the game and couldn't believe the fans. I forget who they were playing but the people (including my uncle) were beyond embarrassing. My uncle told me to hate the Steelers and whatever his reasons were they didn't make sense. The Steelers were in the middle of their dynasty and I remember rooting for them against the Rams in the Super Bowl even though I thought the Rams helmets were cool. That was right about the time I latched on. Been a fan ever since. My uncle is still a crazy Browns fan. Cheers every first down like it's their last. And they keep disappointing him.
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The Steelers suck, congrats on earning the right to play one more game and lose.
BTW- Rapistburger is huge TOOL. My sister was his waitress once at a Applebee's or something and all this money he gets and he gave NO tip. What a asshole......
The Steelers suck, congrats on earning the right to play one more game and lose.
BTW- Rapistburger is huge TOOL. My sister was his waitress once at a Applebee's or something and all this money he gets and he gave NO tip. What a asshole......
And good day to you too sir.
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The Steelers suck, congrats on earning the right to play one more game and lose.
BTW- Rapistburger is huge TOOL. My sister was his waitress once at a Applebee's or something and all this money he gets and he gave NO tip. What a asshole......
The Steelers suck, congrats on earning the right to play one more game and lose.
BTW- Rapistburger is huge TOOL. My sister was his waitress once at a Applebee's or something and all this money he gets and he gave NO tip. What a asshole......
Couldnt agree more CK.
Be happy Rapistberger didnt get her alone somewhere or he might have given her his tip whether she wanted it or not
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Unbiased, I for one don't mind the Steelers. I know I should as a Browns fan but my best friend just finished up his career at Pitt and I've been up there twice. Last time I got to see your boys beat the piss out of the Colts. It was fun.
From an organizational standpoint, I don't mind the Steelers. Go back and take a head count of all the ownerships that opposed the Browns being taken out of Cleveland by he-who-shall not be named. You'll find the Rooneys on that very short list. This was, for quite the longest time, one of - if not the best rivalry in the NFL. We knew that, they did as well and both our fanbases suffered when the Browns were gone. I believe the Rooney's even set up area's for Browns fans to visit Pittsburgh and attend games, if I"m correct?
Our two teams are companion pieces in time. While I do envy their success, I will always question the massive steroid rumors hanging over the heads of that team from the 70's and early 80's.
I do however despise their fans... Can't stand them. I look forward to the day Ben has that sharp decline in production and they return to the pit of mediocrity from whence they came.
Even better if a contender arose from Cleveland simultaneously.
From an organizational standpoint, I don't mind the Steelers. Go back and take a head count of all the ownerships that opposed the Browns being taken out of Cleveland by he-who-shall not be named. You'll find the Rooneys on that very short list. This was, for quite the longest time, one of - if not the best rivalry in the NFL. We knew that, they did as well and both our fanbases suffered when the Browns were gone. I believe the Rooney's even set up area's for Browns fans to visit Pittsburgh and attend games, if I"m correct?
Our two teams are companion pieces in time. While I do envy their success, I will always question the massive steroid rumors hanging over the heads of that team from the 70's and early 80's.
I do however despise their fans... Can't stand them. I look forward to the day Ben has that sharp decline in production and they return to the pit of mediocrity from whence they came.
Even better if a contender arose from Cleveland simultaneously.
I don't hate Browns fans. I pity some of them. Frankly I don't know how you stay so emotionally attached to an organization that doesn't seem to deserve it. From Andre Rison to what they did to Kosar in the end of his tenor. If I'm not mistaken, didn't they sign him to a huge contract and turn around and cut him shortly afterward? All the first round busts, all the misguided free agent signings, so on and so forth. Some of the moves were desperate and done to stay relevant to people who love to see the Browns name in the headlines, instead of actually making the team better. Who was the linebacker you guys drafted in the 90's who was a complete bust that you guys traded down in the first round for? The explanation was that there wasn't anybody worthy of the pick. Wasn't that the year you wanted that tight end out of Penn State and he was picked right before you and they didn't have a backup plan? How about the fact they turn over coaching staffs every couple years? Those things would cause me to lose interest. I used to be a Boston Celtic fan. I can't watch the NBA any more let alone the Celtics. I don't know how you guys do it. It's one thing to stick with a team through thick and thin, it's another to stick with a team that doesn't seem to return the favor to the fans who spend their hard earned money on them.
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The Steelers suck, congrats on earning the right to play one more game and lose.
BTW- Rapistburger is huge TOOL. My sister was his waitress once at a Applebee's or something and all this money he gets and he gave NO tip. What a asshole......
The Steelers suck, congrats on earning the right to play one more game and lose.
BTW- Rapistburger is huge TOOL. My sister was his waitress once at a Applebee's or something and all this money he gets and he gave NO tip. What a asshole......
Maybe your sister wasn't a very good waitress.
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From an organizational standpoint, I don't mind the Steelers. Go back and take a head count of all the ownerships that opposed the Browns being taken out of Cleveland by he-who-shall not be named. You'll find the Rooneys on that very short list. This was, for quite the longest time, one of - if not the best rivalry in the NFL. We knew that, they did as well and both our fanbases suffered when the Browns were gone. I believe the Rooney's even set up area's for Browns fans to visit Pittsburgh and attend games, if I"m correct?
Our two teams are companion pieces in time. While I do envy their success, I will always question the massive steroid rumors hanging over the heads of that team from the 70's and early 80's.
I do however despise their fans... Can't stand them. I look forward to the day Ben has that sharp decline in production and they return to the pit of mediocrity from whence they came.
Even better if a contender arose from Cleveland simultaneously.
I don't hate Browns fans. I pity some of them. Frankly I don't know how you stay so emotionally attached to an organization that doesn't seem to deserve it. From Andre Rison to what they did to Kosar in the end of his tenor. If I'm not mistaken, didn't they sign him to a huge contract and turn around and cut him shortly afterward? All the first round busts, all the misguided free agent signings, so on and so forth. Some of the moves were desperate and done to stay relevant to people who love to see the Browns name in the headlines, instead of actually making the team better. Who was the linebacker you guys drafted in the 90's who was a complete bust that you guys traded down in the first round for? The explanation was that there wasn't anybody worthy of the pick. Wasn't that the year you wanted that tight end out of Penn State and he was picked right before you and they didn't have a backup plan? How about the fact they turn over coaching staffs every couple years? Those things would cause me to lose interest. I used to be a Boston Celtic fan. I can't watch the NBA any more let alone the Celtics. I don't know how you guys do it. It's one thing to stick with a team through thick and thin, it's another to stick with a team that doesn't seem to return the favor to the fans who spend their hard earned money on them.
unbiased said:
I used to be a Boston Celtic fan. I can't watch the NBA any more let alone the Celtics. I don't know how you guys do it. It's one thing to stick with a team through thick and thin, it's another to stick with a team that doesn't seem to return the favor to the fans who spend their hard earned money on them.
well you summed up your fandom right there.
when the going gets tough, you run the other way.
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My whole analysis was about NOW....when I talked about comparing each of the 22 positions, and the various units. At least it was about last year. This coming season will have to be reviewed when all the personell are known.
you are a fucking moron.
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My whole analysis was about NOW....when I talked about comparing each of the 22 positions, and the various units. At least it was about last year. This coming season will have to be reviewed when all the personell are known.
Your analysis was about now, I know. And it was written by a Browns fan who thinks his 7-9 team is more talented than an 11-5 team. So I have to take that into consideration when evaluating it. Pretty much everyone here thinks Alex Mack is better than Pouncey. I would expect nothing less. He's a good player and important to your offense as evidenced by their decline after his injury. My observation tells me Pouncey is better and no matter how I argue it you won't agree. So I'll let you have your opinion and I'll have mine. We both think highly of our centers. They're both good. Saying one is clearly better than the other is foolish and beyond our understanding because we don't know what their responsibilities are from play to play to know how to grade them. What we do know is their absences greatly affected the performance of the offenses they play on. Ours in 2013 and yours in 2014. I look forward to your 2015 evaluation and maybe I'll be around to critique it.
unbiased said:
Your analysis was about now, I know. And it was written by a Browns fan who thinks his 7-9 team is more talented than an 11-5 team. So I have to take that into consideration when evaluating it. Pretty much everyone here thinks Alex Mack is better than Pouncey. I would expect nothing less. He's a good player and important to your offense as evidenced by their decline after his injury. My observation tells me Pouncey is better and no matter how I argue it you won't agree. So I'll let you have your opinion and I'll have mine.
While I know they are close...it is Mack that has received the accolades from the neutral parties....the All Pro designations and the Pro Bowls more than Pouncey.....but, yes, they are both good.
We both think highly of our centers. They're both good. Saying one is clearly better than the other is foolish
I don't think I ever made that statement....I personally said that I think...and others think Mack is slightly better. Others may have said much better.
I said that the Browns OL as a whole I believe is much better. While Pouncey/Mack are close, and maybe Bito/DeCastro may be close....there is no one on the Steelers that does come close to Joe Thomas. Plus, I believe that although Greco and The Schwartz have been castigated some, they are better than what the Steelers have on their right side. (though Ravens Marshall Yanda is the big dog in the division over there)
and beyond our understanding because we don't know what their responsibilities are from play to play to know how to grade them. What we do know is their absences greatly affected the performance of the offenses they play on. Ours in 2013 and yours in 2014. I look forward to your 2015 evaluation and maybe I'll be around to critique it.
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not all fans are created equal.
i really despise bandwagon fans from any team. half the people i know in NY are either steeler fans or cowboy fans. you talk to them, figure out their age and ask them "so how does a person, who's born and raised in NY become a cowboy fan?" their usual reply after fumbling around a bit: "well i like troy aikman" or "my dad bought me an emmit smith jersey" eyc. etc.
bullshit. you were a kid when they were winning super bowls and you attached yourself to them because they were winning, plain and simple. bandwagon bitches.
I don't think you can blame a kid for being attracted to a winning team. Or anyone for that matter. Fandom means different things to different people. You obviously take a lot of pride in sticking with an organization that has given you almost nothing to be a fan about. You wear it as a badge of honor and you take your fandomness seriously. Others are more passive about it and don't get as deep emotionally. Sports isn't as important to them. Myself, I became a Steeler fan after my Browns fan uncle took me to a Browns training camp practice when I was a kid and then to a game later that season. I had fun at the practice and met Sam Rutigliano and some of the players. I thought it was cool. Then I went to the game and couldn't believe the fans. I forget who they were playing but the people (including my uncle) were beyond embarrassing. My uncle told me to hate the Steelers and whatever his reasons were they didn't make sense. The Steelers were in the middle of their dynasty and I remember rooting for them against the Rams in the Super Bowl even though I thought the Rams helmets were cool. That was right about the time I latched on. Been a fan ever since. My uncle is still a crazy Browns fan. Cheers every first down like it's their last. And they keep disappointing him.
unbiased said:
I don't think you can blame a kid for being attracted to a winning team. Or anyone for that matter. Fandom means different things to different people. You obviously take a lot of pride in sticking with an organization that has given you almost nothing to be a fan about. You wear it as a badge of honor and you take your fandomness seriously. Others are more passive about it and don't get as deep emotionally. Sports isn't as important to them. Myself, I became a Steeler fan after my Browns fan uncle took me to a Browns training camp practice when I was a kid and then to a game later that season. I had fun at the practice and met Sam Rutigliano and some of the players. I thought it was cool. Then I went to the game and couldn't believe the fans. I forget who they were playing but the people (including my uncle) were beyond embarrassing. My uncle told me to hate the Steelers and whatever his reasons were they didn't make sense. The Steelers were in the middle of their dynasty and I remember rooting for them against the Rams in the Super Bowl even though I thought the Rams helmets were cool. That was right about the time I latched on. Been a fan ever since. My uncle is still a crazy Browns fan. Cheers every first down like it's their last. And they keep disappointing him.
Sorry, you are what we call a FRAK. A FrontRunnerAssKisser.
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My whole analysis was about NOW....when I talked about comparing each of the 22 positions, and the various units. At least it was about last year. This coming season will have to be reviewed when all the personell are known.
Your analysis was about now, I know. And it was written by a Browns fan who thinks his 7-9 team is more talented than an 11-5 team. So I have to take that into consideration when evaluating it. Pretty much everyone here thinks Alex Mack is better than Pouncey. I would expect nothing less. He's a good player and important to your offense as evidenced by their decline after his injury. My observation tells me Pouncey is better and no matter how I argue it you won't agree. So I'll let you have your opinion and I'll have mine. We both think highly of our centers. They're both good. Saying one is clearly better than the other is foolish and beyond our understanding because we don't know what their responsibilities are from play to play to know how to grade them. What we do know is their absences greatly affected the performance of the offenses they play on. Ours in 2013 and yours in 2014. I look forward to your 2015 evaluation and maybe I'll be around to critique it.
unbiased said:
Pretty much everyone here thinks Alex Mack is better than Pouncey. My observation tells me Pouncey is better and no matter how I argue it you won't agree.
Well, considering OL doesn't really have a nice set of stats to rely on, the most objective ratings would come from PFF....
And every single year since they have been in the league, Pff has Mack as the higher rated center.....He has gone from 11th to 9th to 4th to 1st in his 4 years.....
Pouncey, on the other hand, has scored much lower every year and has gone from 19th to 12th to 6th...
So, more than just Browns fans consider Mack to be the better center...........
FYI.....Macks 4 year cumulative score is 54 +........pounceys is 24 +......so there's that too.....
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From an organizational standpoint, I don't mind the Steelers. Go back and take a head count of all the ownerships that opposed the Browns being taken out of Cleveland by he-who-shall not be named. You'll find the Rooneys on that very short list. This was, for quite the longest time, one of - if not the best rivalry in the NFL. We knew that, they did as well and both our fanbases suffered when the Browns were gone. I believe the Rooney's even set up area's for Browns fans to visit Pittsburgh and attend games, if I"m correct?
Our two teams are companion pieces in time. While I do envy their success, I will always question the massive steroid rumors hanging over the heads of that team from the 70's and early 80's.
I do however despise their fans... Can't stand them. I look forward to the day Ben has that sharp decline in production and they return to the pit of mediocrity from whence they came.
Even better if a contender arose from Cleveland simultaneously.
I don't hate Browns fans. I pity some of them. Frankly I don't know how you stay so emotionally attached to an organization that doesn't seem to deserve it. From Andre Rison to what they did to Kosar in the end of his tenor. If I'm not mistaken, didn't they sign him to a huge contract and turn around and cut him shortly afterward? All the first round busts, all the misguided free agent signings, so on and so forth. Some of the moves were desperate and done to stay relevant to people who love to see the Browns name in the headlines, instead of actually making the team better. Who was the linebacker you guys drafted in the 90's who was a complete bust that you guys traded down in the first round for? The explanation was that there wasn't anybody worthy of the pick. Wasn't that the year you wanted that tight end out of Penn State and he was picked right before you and they didn't have a backup plan? How about the fact they turn over coaching staffs every couple years? Those things would cause me to lose interest. I used to be a Boston Celtic fan. I can't watch the NBA any more let alone the Celtics. I don't know how you guys do it. It's one thing to stick with a team through thick and thin, it's another to stick with a team that doesn't seem to return the favor to the fans who spend their hard earned money on them.
unbiased said:
I don't hate Browns fans. I pity some of them. Frankly I don't know how you stay so emotionally attached to an organization that doesn't seem to deserve it.
Its called Loyalty. Sounds likely that you may not be the kind of fellow a guy would want to share a bunker with.
From Andre Rison to what they did to Kosar in the end of his tenor. If I'm not mistaken, didn't they sign him to a huge contract and turn around and cut him shortly afterward? All the first round busts, all the misguided free agent signings, so on and so forth. Some of the moves were desperate and done to stay relevant to people who love to see the Browns name in the headlines, instead of actually making the team better. Who was the linebacker you guys drafted in the 90's who was a complete bust that you guys traded down in the first round for? The explanation was that there wasn't anybody worthy of the pick. Wasn't that the year you wanted that tight end out of Penn State and he was picked right before you and they didn't have a backup plan? How about the fact they turn over coaching staffs every couple years? Those things would cause me to lose interest. I used to be a Boston Celtic fan. I can't watch the NBA any more let alone the Celtics. I don't know how you guys do it. It's one thing to stick with a team through thick and thin, it's another to stick with a team that doesn't seem to return the favor to the fans who spend their hard earned money on them.
You are digging your FRAK whole even deeper. I don't know, I think this has always been the difference between a Browns fan and many Steeler fans. Browns fans are with their team through thick and thin..... many Steeler fans are with their team through thick....but not so through thin.
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unbiased said:
Your analysis was about now, I know. And it was written by a Browns fan who thinks his 7-9 team is more talented than an 11-5 team. So I have to take that into consideration when evaluating it. Pretty much everyone here thinks Alex Mack is better than Pouncey. I would expect nothing less. He's a good player and important to your offense as evidenced by their decline after his injury. My observation tells me Pouncey is better and no matter how I argue it you won't agree. So I'll let you have your opinion and I'll have mine.
While I know they are close...it is Mack that has received the accolades from the neutral parties....the All Pro designations and the Pro Bowls more than Pouncey.....but, yes, they are both good.
We both think highly of our centers. They're both good. Saying one is clearly better than the other is foolish
I don't think I ever made that statement....I personally said that I think...and others think Mack is slightly better. Others may have said much better.
I said that the Browns OL as a whole I believe is much better. While Pouncey/Mack are close, and maybe Bito/DeCastro may be close....there is no one on the Steelers that does come close to Joe Thomas. Plus, I believe that although Greco and The Schwartz have been castigated some, they are better than what the Steelers have on their right side. (though Ravens Marshall Yanda is the big dog in the division over there)
and beyond our understanding because we don't know what their responsibilities are from play to play to know how to grade them. What we do know is their absences greatly affected the performance of the offenses they play on. Ours in 2013 and yours in 2014. I look forward to your 2015 evaluation and maybe I'll be around to critique it.
unbiased said:
Your analysis was about now, I know. And it was written by a Browns fan who thinks his 7-9 team is more talented than an 11-5 team. So I have to take that into consideration when evaluating it. Pretty much everyone here thinks Alex Mack is better than Pouncey. I would expect nothing less. He's a good player and important to your offense as evidenced by their decline after his injury. My observation tells me Pouncey is better and no matter how I argue it you won't agree. So I'll let you have your opinion and I'll have mine.
While I know they are close...it is Mack that has received the accolades from the neutral parties....the All Pro designations and the Pro Bowls more than Pouncey.....but, yes, they are both good.
We both think highly of our centers. They're both good. Saying one is clearly better than the other is foolish
I don't think I ever made that statement....I personally said that I think...and others think Mack is slightly better. Others may have said much better.
I said that the Browns OL as a whole I believe is much better. While Pouncey/Mack are close, and maybe Bito/DeCastro may be close....there is no one on the Steelers that does come close to Joe Thomas. Plus, I believe that although Greco and The Schwartz have been castigated some, they are better than what the Steelers have on their right side. (though Ravens Marshall Yanda is the big dog in the division over there)
and beyond our understanding because we don't know what their responsibilities are from play to play to know how to grade them. What we do know is their absences greatly affected the performance of the offenses they play on. Ours in 2013 and yours in 2014. I look forward to your 2015 evaluation and maybe I'll be around to critique it.
Ok, I get what you're saying. You believe your team's line is "much" better. But when I look at the production of the offenses it doesn't back that up. I know, the Steelers have an advantage at qb, but if you were to sit down and watch a few Steeler games (I certainly don't expect you to) you'd see, blocking for Roethlisberger isn't easy. I would venture to say the the majority of the sacks he takes are his own fault. Now, our right tackle for some reason forgets how to play football when they play the Ravens. He stiffens up, bends at the waste, is slow out of his stance and just in general sucks. But for the rest of the season he played well...at least average. He's a great run blocker, violent and aggressive. As for the rest of them, I've seen Pouncey and DeCastro get credited for sacks after Ben held the ball for 6 to 8 seconds and then runs run up their back to get killed when they (Pouncey and DeCatro) don't even know he's there. I watch the Steelers line. Their left tackle, center and right guard are very good. Their left guard is a speed bump and a tremendous liability against anyone with anything more than a bull rush. I'd love the kid from Iowa to fall to them but my worst fear is you guys draft him. Now that would be a badass line for either team.
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unbiased said:
Your analysis was about now, I know. And it was written by a Browns fan who thinks his 7-9 team is more talented than an 11-5 team. So I have to take that into consideration when evaluating it. Pretty much everyone here thinks Alex Mack is better than Pouncey. I would expect nothing less. He's a good player and important to your offense as evidenced by their decline after his injury. My observation tells me Pouncey is better and no matter how I argue it you won't agree. So I'll let you have your opinion and I'll have mine.
While I know they are close...it is Mack that has received the accolades from the neutral parties....the All Pro designations and the Pro Bowls more than Pouncey.....but, yes, they are both good.
We both think highly of our centers. They're both good. Saying one is clearly better than the other is foolish
I don't think I ever made that statement....I personally said that I think...and others think Mack is slightly better. Others may have said much better.
I said that the Browns OL as a whole I believe is much better. While Pouncey/Mack are close, and maybe Bito/DeCastro may be close....there is no one on the Steelers that does come close to Joe Thomas. Plus, I believe that although Greco and The Schwartz have been castigated some, they are better than what the Steelers have on their right side. (though Ravens Marshall Yanda is the big dog in the division over there)
and beyond our understanding because we don't know what their responsibilities are from play to play to know how to grade them. What we do know is their absences greatly affected the performance of the offenses they play on. Ours in 2013 and yours in 2014. I look forward to your 2015 evaluation and maybe I'll be around to critique it.
Ok, I get what you're saying. You believe your team's line is "much" better. But when I look at the production of the offenses it doesn't back that up. I know, the Steelers have an advantage at qb, but if you were to sit down and watch a few Steeler games (I certainly don't expect you to) you'd see, blocking for Roethlisberger isn't easy. I would venture to say the the majority of the sacks he takes are his own fault. Now, our right tackle for some reason forgets how to play football when they play the Ravens. He stiffens up, bends at the waste, is slow out of his stance and just in general sucks. But for the rest of the season he played well...at least average. He's a great run blocker, violent and aggressive. As for the rest of them, I've seen Pouncey and DeCastro get credited for sacks after Ben held the ball for 6 to 8 seconds and then runs run up their back to get killed when they (Pouncey and DeCatro) don't even know he's there. I watch the Steelers line. Their left tackle, center and right guard are very good. Their left guard is a speed bump and a tremendous liability against anyone with anything more than a bull rush. I'd love the kid from Iowa to fall to them but my worst fear is you guys draft him. Now that would be a badass line for either team.
unbiased said:
Ok, I get what you're saying. You believe your team's line is "much" better. But when I look at the production of the offenses it doesn't back that up. I know, the Steelers have an advantage at qb....and RB and WR and maybe TE.
but if you were to sit down and watch a few Steeler games (I certainly don't expect you to) you'd see, blocking for Roethlisberger isn't easy. I would venture to say the the majority of the sacks he takes are his own fault. Now, our right tackle for some reason forgets how to play football when they play the Ravens. He stiffens up, bends at the waste, is slow out of his stance and just in general sucks. But for the rest of the season he played well...at least average. He's a great run blocker, violent and aggressive. As for the rest of them, I've seen Pouncey and DeCastro get credited for sacks after Ben held the ball for 6 to 8 seconds and then runs run up their back to get killed when they (Pouncey and DeCatro) don't even know he's there. I watch the Steelers line. Their left tackle, center and right guard are very good. Their left guard is a speed bump and a tremendous liability against anyone with anything more than a bull rush. I'd love the kid from Iowa to fall to them but my worst fear is you guys draft him. Now that would be a badass line for either team.
Bottom line.....NO NFL GM in my opinion would trade the players on the Browns line for those on your line straight up as a whole unit.
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unbiased said:
Your analysis was about now, I know. And it was written by a Browns fan who thinks his 7-9 team is more talented than an 11-5 team. So I have to take that into consideration when evaluating it. Pretty much everyone here thinks Alex Mack is better than Pouncey. I would expect nothing less. He's a good player and important to your offense as evidenced by their decline after his injury. My observation tells me Pouncey is better and no matter how I argue it you won't agree. So I'll let you have your opinion and I'll have mine.
While I know they are close...it is Mack that has received the accolades from the neutral parties....the All Pro designations and the Pro Bowls more than Pouncey.....but, yes, they are both good.
We both think highly of our centers. They're both good. Saying one is clearly better than the other is foolish
I don't think I ever made that statement....I personally said that I think...and others think Mack is slightly better. Others may have said much better.
I said that the Browns OL as a whole I believe is much better. While Pouncey/Mack are close, and maybe Bito/DeCastro may be close....there is no one on the Steelers that does come close to Joe Thomas. Plus, I believe that although Greco and The Schwartz have been castigated some, they are better than what the Steelers have on their right side. (though Ravens Marshall Yanda is the big dog in the division over there)
and beyond our understanding because we don't know what their responsibilities are from play to play to know how to grade them. What we do know is their absences greatly affected the performance of the offenses they play on. Ours in 2013 and yours in 2014. I look forward to your 2015 evaluation and maybe I'll be around to critique it.
unbiased said:
Your analysis was about now, I know. And it was written by a Browns fan who thinks his 7-9 team is more talented than an 11-5 team. So I have to take that into consideration when evaluating it. Pretty much everyone here thinks Alex Mack is better than Pouncey. I would expect nothing less. He's a good player and important to your offense as evidenced by their decline after his injury. My observation tells me Pouncey is better and no matter how I argue it you won't agree. So I'll let you have your opinion and I'll have mine.
While I know they are close...it is Mack that has received the accolades from the neutral parties....the All Pro designations and the Pro Bowls more than Pouncey.....but, yes, they are both good.
Pouncey has been All Pro 4 times. Mack was second team All Pro once and that was in 2013 when Pouncey was hurt. Mack has also been to the Pro Bowl twice. Just saying.
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unbiased said:
I don't think you can blame a kid for being attracted to a winning team. Or anyone for that matter. Fandom means different things to different people. You obviously take a lot of pride in sticking with an organization that has given you almost nothing to be a fan about. You wear it as a badge of honor and you take your fandomness seriously. Others are more passive about it and don't get as deep emotionally. Sports isn't as important to them. Myself, I became a Steeler fan after my Browns fan uncle took me to a Browns training camp practice when I was a kid and then to a game later that season. I had fun at the practice and met Sam Rutigliano and some of the players. I thought it was cool. Then I went to the game and couldn't believe the fans. I forget who they were playing but the people (including my uncle) were beyond embarrassing. My uncle told me to hate the Steelers and whatever his reasons were they didn't make sense. The Steelers were in the middle of their dynasty and I remember rooting for them against the Rams in the Super Bowl even though I thought the Rams helmets were cool. That was right about the time I latched on. Been a fan ever since. My uncle is still a crazy Browns fan. Cheers every first down like it's their last. And they keep disappointing him.
Sorry, you are what we call a FRAK. A FrontRunnerAssKisser.
Sorry, you are what we call a FRAK. A FrontRunnerAssKisser.
Uh, I just explained, I've been a fan of the Steelers since I was a child. This is another example of you guys measuring dicks. I don't know why you do it or why you care. I've seen every Steeler game since I was a teenager and been to about 40 of them. I don't classify myself in any way. It simply doesn't matter. We all have the right to root for whomever we wish. It's simply a state of mind. You think yourself better because you root for a bad team for some reason. Good for you. How you classify me in your silly way matters not. I've been born and raised in a Steeler town and I've spent my share of money on them as well. I hope you feel better. Can we get on with something more interesting to talk about?
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unbiased said:
Ok, I get what you're saying. You believe your team's line is "much" better. But when I look at the production of the offenses it doesn't back that up. I know, the Steelers have an advantage at qb....and RB and WR and maybe TE.
but if you were to sit down and watch a few Steeler games (I certainly don't expect you to) you'd see, blocking for Roethlisberger isn't easy. I would venture to say the the majority of the sacks he takes are his own fault. Now, our right tackle for some reason forgets how to play football when they play the Ravens. He stiffens up, bends at the waste, is slow out of his stance and just in general sucks. But for the rest of the season he played well...at least average. He's a great run blocker, violent and aggressive. As for the rest of them, I've seen Pouncey and DeCastro get credited for sacks after Ben held the ball for 6 to 8 seconds and then runs run up their back to get killed when they (Pouncey and DeCatro) don't even know he's there. I watch the Steelers line. Their left tackle, center and right guard are very good. Their left guard is a speed bump and a tremendous liability against anyone with anything more than a bull rush. I'd love the kid from Iowa to fall to them but my worst fear is you guys draft him. Now that would be a badass line for either team.
Bottom line.....NO NFL GM in my opinion would trade the players on the Browns line for those on your line straight up as a whole unit.
Bottom line.....NO NFL GM in my opinion would trade the players on the Browns line for those on your line straight up as a whole unit.
Your opinion is noted.
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unbiased said:
I don't hate Browns fans. I pity some of them. Frankly I don't know how you stay so emotionally attached to an organization that doesn't seem to deserve it.
Its called Loyalty. Sounds likely that you may not be the kind of fellow a guy would want to share a bunker with.
From Andre Rison to what they did to Kosar in the end of his tenor. If I'm not mistaken, didn't they sign him to a huge contract and turn around and cut him shortly afterward? All the first round busts, all the misguided free agent signings, so on and so forth. Some of the moves were desperate and done to stay relevant to people who love to see the Browns name in the headlines, instead of actually making the team better. Who was the linebacker you guys drafted in the 90's who was a complete bust that you guys traded down in the first round for? The explanation was that there wasn't anybody worthy of the pick. Wasn't that the year you wanted that tight end out of Penn State and he was picked right before you and they didn't have a backup plan? How about the fact they turn over coaching staffs every couple years? Those things would cause me to lose interest. I used to be a Boston Celtic fan. I can't watch the NBA any more let alone the Celtics. I don't know how you guys do it. It's one thing to stick with a team through thick and thin, it's another to stick with a team that doesn't seem to return the favor to the fans who spend their hard earned money on them.
You are digging your FRAK whole even deeper. I don't know, I think this has always been the difference between a Browns fan and many Steeler fans. Browns fans are with their team through thick and thin..... many Steeler fans are with their team through thick....but not so through thin.
unbiased said:
I don't hate Browns fans. I pity some of them. Frankly I don't know how you stay so emotionally attached to an organization that doesn't seem to deserve it.
Its called Loyalty. Sounds likely that you may not be the kind of fellow a guy would want to share a bunker with.
From Andre Rison to what they did to Kosar in the end of his tenor. If I'm not mistaken, didn't they sign him to a huge contract and turn around and cut him shortly afterward? All the first round busts, all the misguided free agent signings, so on and so forth. Some of the moves were desperate and done to stay relevant to people who love to see the Browns name in the headlines, instead of actually making the team better. Who was the linebacker you guys drafted in the 90's who was a complete bust that you guys traded down in the first round for? The explanation was that there wasn't anybody worthy of the pick. Wasn't that the year you wanted that tight end out of Penn State and he was picked right before you and they didn't have a backup plan? How about the fact they turn over coaching staffs every couple years? Those things would cause me to lose interest. I used to be a Boston Celtic fan. I can't watch the NBA any more let alone the Celtics. I don't know how you guys do it. It's one thing to stick with a team through thick and thin, it's another to stick with a team that doesn't seem to return the favor to the fans who spend their hard earned money on them.
You are digging your FRAK whole even deeper. I don't know, I think this has always been the difference between a Browns fan and many Steeler fans. Browns fans are with their team through thick and thin..... many Steeler fans are with their team through thick....but not so through thin.
It's not a Browns-Steelers thing. You've gone so long with such lousy team that you're afraid to let go because you're afraid your friends will view you in some stupid way when you come back to them if they ever do get good. You've experienced consistent losing for so long that you cling to every little morsel that gives you hope that they're turning it around. You view every touchdown as a great achievement because they simply don't happen as often as some other teams. I know, I remember feeling the same way in the 80's. I remember the 51-0 game. I remember jumping out of my chair every time Bubby Brister threw a touchdown. It's because it didn't happen very often. Trust me, your perspective will change if they win a Super Bowl. It will take the edge off. The arrogance you show sometimes on this board is born from the fact you were living back when the Browns were dominant. Most people weren't. That's why you always respond to Steeler fans the way you do and are so quick to categorize them in your condescending way. You need to know not every Steeler fan is out to prove they're better than you. I just came here to have to interesting discussion and I hoped it wouldn't deteriorate. There's still hope i guess, but I'm beginning to think you guys don't tolerate anyone outside of your own. Nor do you have to. It's your board and it says "Browns" on it.
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