Confusion at #2
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Ya ok. Wait and see. Just don't get mad when the Browns draft a non qb at #2.Functioning eyeballs disagree with this assessment.
"One said:
Ya ok. Wait and see. Just don't get mad when the Browns draft a non qb at #2.
I won't be mad at all. But I know the two top QBs aren't Christian Ponder 2.0. If they take a top defensive player, I won't get my undies in a knot.
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Oh, I see Wentz as a kid very well worth a high pick.
Yeah, Goff is the best pure passer... but it seems like
he doesn't have a life or something.
Seriously, google these two guys ,,, the difference is amazing.
What rookie qb IS ready to start, except for going to a
team that is already a playoff team or near to it?
Getting a more value-worthy qb later in the first round one hasn't worked diddley
for the Browns - it's the hardest position on the team to fill. And the competition
is on to get one. Outside of starting experience, I'm trying to figure out what
Wentz doesn't have to be another star qb in the NFL.
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I'm not going to beat a dead horse. But I do offer a invitation.
Join me in the laughter at the Rams for giving the house up for a night on the town.
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I'm not going to beat a dead horse. But I do offer a invitation.
Join me in the laughter at the Rams for giving the house up for a night on the town.
One Post From the Truth said:
I'm not going to beat a dead horse. But I do offer a invitation.
Join me in the laughter at the Rams for giving the house up for a night on the town.
Oh that was a fucking stupid move for sure. You don't gamble with that many picks.
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One Post From the Truth said:
Ponder is a better NFL qb. Wentz and Goff have yet to take a snap. They are going to get killed.
Aikman got killed as a rookie but it never meant Steve Walsh was a better QB like some silly Dallas fans insinuated at the time right? The key is to understand inevitable growing pains early like Jimmy Johnson did up against all his critics thinking he was out of his mind for preferring Aikman to Steve Walsh.3 SB rings later - how did Jimmy do with that?
Ponder is such a terrific NFL QB- Minnesota chose to upgrade him with the 4th QB selected in the 2014 draft. That doesn't strike me as projecting a better NFL future than the first and/or second QB in the 2016 draft. You've had some good posts since you arrived here but I can't join your logic on this.
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One Post From the Truth said:
Ponder is a better NFL qb. Wentz and Goff have yet to take a snap. They are going to get killed.
Aikman got killed as a rookie but it never meant Steve Walsh was a better QB like some silly Dallas fans insinuated at the time right? The key is to understand inevitable growing pains early like Jimmy Johnson did up against all his critics thinking he was out of his mind for preferring Aikman to Steve Walsh.3 SB rings later - how did Jimmy do with that?
Ponder is such a terrific NFL QB- Minnesota chose to upgrade him with the 4th QB selected in the 2014 draft. That doesn't strike me as projecting a better NFL future than the first and/or second QB in the 2016 draft. You've had some good posts since you arrived here but I can't join your logic on this.
You caught me. I was trying to think of a qb that wasn't playing right now that's better than the two junkyard dogs. Ponder came to mind but a bad choice.Aikman got killed as a rookie but it never meant Steve Walsh was a better QB like some silly Dallas fans insinuated at the time right? The key is to understand inevitable growing pains early like Jimmy Johnson did up against all his critics thinking he was out of his mind for preferring Aikman to Steve Walsh.3 SB rings later - how did Jimmy do with that?
Ponder is such a terrific NFL QB- Minnesota chose to upgrade him with the 4th QB selected in the 2014 draft. That doesn't strike me as projecting a better NFL future than the first and/or second QB in the 2016 draft. You've had some good posts since you arrived here but I can't join your logic on this.
Nevertheless getting RG3 was a true sign of not getting a qb at 2. If we draft a qb at #2 he's going to start and I don't see it with RG3 on the roster.
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I seriously don't want to sound self absorbed but can't refrain from telling the board how it is.
I said Tunsil wouldn't go #1. Also I said that if RG3 was signed the Browns won't draft a qb in the first round. But no one listened and I feel like the new kid in the movie "Waiting".
One Post From the Truth said:
I seriously don't want to sound self absorbed but can't refrain from telling the board how it is.
I said Tunsil wouldn't go #1. Also I said that if RG3 was signed the Browns won't draft a qb in the first round. But no one listened and I feel like the new kid in the movie "Waiting".
Hey, I listened.
We're all going a little crazy over this, mainly because we're starving for a winner. It doesn't mean one guy is right or one guy is wrong here...we're all Browns fans wanting this team to turn it around.
The only thing I get bent out of shape about is the "trading down" thing some fans are hung up on. It hasn't worked out for us in the past, and that doesn't mean it will work out or not work out now. I just wouldn't do it. The draft is supposed to be designed to help the weaker teams get better, not to trade away the possibility of getting better that a crappy season gives you.
Karlis Missed -
I wonder how many times a huge trade up has been worth it for
a team that paid a high price....
don't know, but I did find this.
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You caught me. I was trying to think of a qb that wasn't playing right now that's better than the two junkyard dogs. Ponder came to mind but a bad choice.Aikman got killed as a rookie but it never meant Steve Walsh was a better QB like some silly Dallas fans insinuated at the time right? The key is to understand inevitable growing pains early like Jimmy Johnson did up against all his critics thinking he was out of his mind for preferring Aikman to Steve Walsh.3 SB rings later - how did Jimmy do with that?
Ponder is such a terrific NFL QB- Minnesota chose to upgrade him with the 4th QB selected in the 2014 draft. That doesn't strike me as projecting a better NFL future than the first and/or second QB in the 2016 draft. You've had some good posts since you arrived here but I can't join your logic on this.
Nevertheless getting RG3 was a true sign of not getting a qb at 2. If we draft a qb at #2 he's going to start and I don't see it with RG3 on the roster.
One Post From the Truth said:
You caught me. I was trying to think of a qb that wasn't playing right now that's better than the two junkyard dogs. Ponder came to mind but a bad choice.
Nevertheless getting RG3 was a true sign of not getting a qb at 2. If we draft a qb at #2 he's going to start and I don't see it with RG3 on the roster.
You might be right on the RG3 thing; but the lingering question yet to be answered is can RG3 escape injury? He's got 2 brutal injuries in the NFL following 1 brutal injury in college. I'm thinking the RG3 idea, marks a good reason not to race a QB in before he's ready. It wouldn't suck if RG3 gave us a lot more though. If both of the first 2 QBs are seen by our front office and Hue as equitable talent projecting ahead - why not take a pick of the litter at a very important position?
I'm wondering if they don't see Goff and Wentz as equal - how much differently do they view their #2 from their #3 QB? If not much, we could still see a trade-down for more picks. If they see a big drop off from their #1 choice to any of the QBs thereafter, we could see a trade down.
I'm trying not to lose sight of the reality there is a rookie salary cap which could limit our overall draft volume some if we also plan on competing for rookie free agents. That said, it could also open us up to telling a team like Philly - we'll take Wisniewski and your first round pick and a couple other picks. We're not even close to spending enough money up to the recent cba standard so this could help that along some IMO. Philly is just 1 example. Denver can't possibly be planning on Mark Saycheese at QB so there's another team that has vets we can tap via trade plus a a few draft picks. They had a 3rd string edge rusher(Barrett) who we couldn't block last year after Ray got hurt. That would show up here as a massive upgrade to anyone we've been counting on recently.
As I said, earlier on in one of these threads - Dallas seems like a team in despair at QB. Add in Philly's situation and now we have 2 teams from the same division worrying about each other taking their guy potentially. Even better if we're the ones benefitting most of that. It's going to be fun to watch this play out especially if we keep an open mind to it.
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The analytics thing says to me that there is no way that the Browns are going to rate need over value, and I just can't see them taking a QB at 2 that might not even be in the top 50 of all draft illegible players. In my mind, a QB at 2 has not been and is not now a possibility, especially once RG3 was signed.
I've been surprised before by this team that's for sure.......... The first 30min of the draft should be fun.
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So, you want the Browns to draft the OT ? A lot more goes into it,
than "top 50 players" rankings.
It's far easier to be a top 50 player on defense. I think qb is the hardest jump
to the NFL to make, and that doesn't seem to be part of the criteria for these rankings.
Probably should compare these rankings like "top 50" against how they did a year or two
after being in the NFL.
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So, you want the Browns to draft the OT ? A lot more goes into it,
than "top 50 players" rankings.
It's far easier to be a top 50 player on defense. I think qb is the hardest jump
to the NFL to make, and that doesn't seem to be part of the criteria for these rankings.
Probably should compare these rankings like "top 50" against how they did a year or two
after being in the NFL.
What do I want us to do?So, you want the Browns to draft the OT ? A lot more goes into it,
than "top 50 players" rankings.
It's far easier to be a top 50 player on defense. I think qb is the hardest jump
to the NFL to make, and that doesn't seem to be part of the criteria for these rankings.
Probably should compare these rankings like "top 50" against how they did a year or two
after being in the NFL.
Although I predict it does mean I'm right and it sure as heck doesn't mean I want it to happen. I hope I'm wrong.
If Goff is the guy then have the balls to get him. If RG3 put up with Cousins right behind him he can beat out Goff...this year. If Goff isn't the guy get Ramsey.
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Tunsil is seen by most as the best player in the draft. Tennessee also has a huge need at LT. It made sense.
Tunsil is seen by most as the best player in the draft. Tennessee also has a huge need at LT. It made sense.
Not sure if I'd say most.
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"One said:
Christian Ponder is a better qb than Wentz or Goff and he sucks.
Functioning eyeballs disagree with this assessment.
Functioning eyeballs disagree with this assessment.
Either that.....or it could be a correct assessment. (Goff being=to Christian Ponder that is)
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Not sure if I'd say most.
Seemed true for a very long time. Just recently began to hear of "off-field concerns" with Tunsil and he began to fall. But up came Ramsey who plays a position that the Titans also need.
All that said, an offer like the Rams made is a "QB offer" and TN doesn't need one.
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Our new FO with this Leverage is my concern. I don't trust Dallas, Jags nor Ravens with Zeke on board. Can you name their RB's? M. Jacks meniscus still not good medically (drop?). 49'ers confuse me still with Kap. Knowing Eagles want to jump but 49'ers could offer us more now. At this point of game I don't mind taking either QB at 2. (I like both even @2) Even if as "not their so called guy" In their opinion they could use "B" QB to move 49'er & Eagles, Bears, Jets into a deal.. (always screw Elway) Draft falls on my birthday & hope we sit @2 with no Surprise's!!
Our new FO with this Leverage is my concern. I don't trust Dallas, Jags nor Ravens with Zeke on board. Can you name their RB's? M. Jacks meniscus still not good medically (drop?). 49'ers confuse me still with Kap. Knowing Eagles want to jump but 49'ers could offer us more now. At this point of game I don't mind taking either QB at 2. (I like both even @2) Even if as "not their so called guy" In their opinion they could use "B" QB to move 49'er & Eagles, Bears, Jets into a deal.. (always screw Elway) Draft falls on my birthday & hope we sit @2 with no Surprise's!!
I've said it in other threads- the Eagles may want to move up, but minus their second round pick this year- their ammunition is limited. That is unless they want to give up multiple future picks, including their 2017 first rounder.
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Here's the truth.
There is no qb in this years draft worthy of a high first round pick. How many years can you count that the football talking heads have built up the playing level of a qb and they have turned out to be busts? Plenty. It's not a bad year to have the second pick overall but it's a bad year if you're reaching for a starting qb.
I'll admit the notion of a franchise qb tops everything from a good defense to building up the lines. But this isn't the year. Christian Ponder is a better qb than Wentz or Goff and he sucks.
One Post From the Truth said:
Here's the truth.
There is no qb in this years draft worthy of a high first round pick. How many years can you count that the football talking heads have built up the playing level of a qb and they have turned out to be busts? Plenty. It's not a bad year to have the second pick overall but it's a bad year if you're reaching for a starting qb.
I'll admit the notion of a franchise qb tops everything from a good defense to building up the lines. But this isn't the year. Christian Ponder is a better qb than Wentz or Goff and he sucks.
Um some of the pundits have Goff\ Wentz rated higher than any qb drafted last year.
Oh that was a fucking stupid move for sure. You don't gamble with that many picks.
Right- Wentz or Goff may be projected as good NFL quarterbacks, but the Rams obviously view them as Andrew Luck potential. LOL almost no one heard of Wentz before last December, unless you lived in North Dakota.
One Post From the Truth said:
You caught me. I was trying to think of a qb that wasn't playing right now that's better than the two junkyard dogs. Ponder came to mind but a bad choice.
Nevertheless getting RG3 was a true sign of not getting a qb at 2. If we draft a qb at #2 he's going to start and I don't see it with RG3 on the roster.
I disagree. Griffin can't be counted on to stay healthy, or suddenly figure out how to read a defense. Griffin is a stopgap until our QOTF is ready. That might be by game three, if Robert happens to get hurt. His next knee blowout will be his last. He's already had two ACL repairs on the knee.
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Our new FO with this Leverage is my concern. I don't trust Dallas, Jags nor Ravens with Zeke on board. Can you name their RB's? M. Jacks meniscus still not good medically (drop?). 49'ers confuse me still with Kap. Knowing Eagles want to jump but 49'ers could offer us more now. At this point of game I don't mind taking either QB at 2. (I like both even @2) Even if as "not their so called guy" In their opinion they could use "B" QB to move 49'er & Eagles, Bears, Jets into a deal.. (always screw Elway) Draft falls on my birthday & hope we sit @2 with no Surprise's!!
I've said it in other threads- the Eagles may want to move up, but minus their second round pick this year- their ammunition is limited. That is unless they want to give up multiple future picks, including their 2017 first rounder.
I've said it in other threads- the Eagles may want to move up, but minus their second round pick this year- their ammunition is limited. That is unless they want to give up multiple future picks, including their 2017 first rounder.
Future year picks are a total shot in the dark & IMHO a bad investment. ...Unknown production, injuries, character concerns, plus we don't know where the Eagles end up next year...do we get a 1st pick, 32nd pick or what? Too damn many variables. If the ammo is not a known quantity THIS year, I'm passing.
Mike
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One Post From the Truth said:
I seriously don't want to sound self absorbed but can't refrain from telling the board how it is.
I said Tunsil wouldn't go #1. Also I said that if RG3 was signed the Browns won't draft a qb in the first round. But no one listened and I feel like the new kid in the movie "Waiting".
Hey, I listened.
We're all going a little crazy over this, mainly because we're starving for a winner. It doesn't mean one guy is right or one guy is wrong here...we're all Browns fans wanting this team to turn it around.
The only thing I get bent out of shape about is the "trading down" thing some fans are hung up on. It hasn't worked out for us in the past, and that doesn't mean it will work out or not work out now. I just wouldn't do it. The draft is supposed to be designed to help the weaker teams get better, not to trade away the possibility of getting better that a crappy season gives you.
Hey, I listened.
We're all going a little crazy over this, mainly because we're starving for a winner. It doesn't mean one guy is right or one guy is wrong here...we're all Browns fans wanting this team to turn it around.
The only thing I get bent out of shape about is the "trading down" thing some fans are hung up on. It hasn't worked out for us in the past, and that doesn't mean it will work out or not work out now. I just wouldn't do it. The draft is supposed to be designed to help the weaker teams get better, not to trade away the possibility of getting better that a crappy season gives you.
I share your frustration Bob. That's why Ray Farmer is probably selling Lemonade today with the 6 scouts we fired.
I'd rather have guys committed to research in our FO than 1 cutting a corner such as asking Gilbert's college coaches if there's any red flags to be concerned with outside of an inability to see a DB that thinks you tackle people with your hands. This may not be a real word anywhere but our fan base "PHEW!"
I feel like we have a big upgrade in research and intelligence here today so I'm open to trading down under the influence of 2 highly intelligent guys that also played DI football at Harvard, Hue and Sashi. Sounds like a better Democracy in our War Room than the previous Dictator we had who's 2 brain cells weren't on speaking terms while he also had a War of the Roses going on with our Head Coach. The setting today seems so much more conducive to success unless I'm blinded by heart once again.
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Hey, I listened.
We're all going a little crazy over this, mainly because we're starving for a winner. It doesn't mean one guy is right or one guy is wrong here...we're all Browns fans wanting this team to turn it around.
The only thing I get bent out of shape about is the "trading down" thing some fans are hung up on. It hasn't worked out for us in the past, and that doesn't mean it will work out or not work out now. I just wouldn't do it. The draft is supposed to be designed to help the weaker teams get better, not to trade away the possibility of getting better that a crappy season gives you.
I share your frustration Bob. That's why Ray Farmer is probably selling Lemonade today with the 6 scouts we fired.
I'd rather have guys committed to research in our FO than 1 cutting a corner such as asking Gilbert's college coaches if there's any red flags to be concerned with outside of an inability to see a DB that thinks you tackle people with your hands. This may not be a real word anywhere but our fan base "PHEW!"
I feel like we have a big upgrade in research and intelligence here today so I'm open to trading down under the influence of 2 highly intelligent guys that also played DI football at Harvard, Hue and Sashi. Sounds like a better Democracy in our War Room than the previous Dictator we had who's 2 brain cells weren't on speaking terms while he also had a War of the Roses going on with our Head Coach. The setting today seems so much more conducive to success unless I'm blinded by heart once again.
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