Draft Talk
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Watson and Kizer are both "pocket passers" in the same mold, then.
Just because you can run doesn't mean you're a dual threat QB.
Kizer is around 6'5" 235. He's a Ben/Bortles/Wentz who stays in the pocket and takes a beating, but has the ability to extend plays with his feet if need be.
they are both listed as a top duel threat QB in college right now... using your same logic just because you can throw doesn't mean your a pocket passer
they are both listed as a top duel threat QB in college right now... using your same logic just because you can throw doesn't mean your a pocket passer
And Russell Wilson was listed as a 3rd round pick. What does it matter what they are listed as? Are you not watching them play?
It just depends on where you choose to throw from and how you choose to utilize your talent. Personally, I'd say a guy who threw for 5 TD's in his first game isn't really considered a run-first kind of guy. Nor would I say a guy who currently is completing over 70% of his passes and has an 11 YPA is really a dink-and-dunk non-pocket passer.
Or maybe just take a read from the Zierlien's writeup on NFL.com, where his pro comparison is Steve McNair.
What really stands out to me is the mental makeup and toughness of Kizer in comparison to McNair. McNair was extremely difficult to rattle and Kizer appears to operate with that same confidence and calm. While McNair could beat teams with his legs, he looked to win from the pocket and I believe Kizer has that same trait.
As for Watson, he is more of a dual-threat guy, but he clearly possesses the ability to stand in the pocket and deliver throws to any part of the field. He stares down his receivers a little more, but I'd venture a guess that Watson/Kizer probably have pocket attempt percentages closer to that of Andrew Luck or Russell Wilson than they do of RG3 or Johnny Manziel.
Is Jameis Winston a running QB? What about Andrew Luck? Those guys can run, but they choose to operate from the pocket. Tuning out a guy solely because he can run is a pretty narrow minded view. But if you want to waste a pick on Brad Kaaya because some list somewhere has him as the top rated pocket passer, by all means.
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2016 cutdowns are already being posted.
http://draftbreakdown.com/players/?draft_class=2017&position=QB
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2016 cutdowns are already being posted.
http://draftbreakdown.com/players/?draft_class=2017&position=QB
2016 cutdowns are already being posted.
http://draftbreakdown.com/players/?draft_class=2017&position=QB
Saturday we get to see two of the nations best edge rushers together in Auburn's Lawson and A&M's Garrett. 7pm est on ESPN.
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Chad Kelly, Jim's nephew that played high school ball in Orchard Park (Buffalo), NY, has played a pretty good game vrs Alabama today outside of 1 mental breakdown where he coughed up the football for an Alabama TD. He's already beaten a National Champion Bama team in 2015 for anyone wondering what he's capable of against a well coached talented roster.
I remembered Tour bringing him up as an intriguing QB prospect last year to a pretty tough crowd of critics. I kind of liked the idea to be honest.
Anyone think he's somebody that might be able to help us?
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Chad Kelly, Jim's nephew that played high school ball in Orchard Park (Buffalo), NY, has played a pretty good game vrs Alabama today outside of 1 mental breakdown where he coughed up the football for an Alabama TD. He's already beaten a National Champion Bama team in 2015 for anyone wondering what he's capable of against a well coached talented roster.
I remembered Tour bringing him up as an intriguing QB prospect last year to a pretty tough crowd of critics. I kind of liked the idea to be honest.
Anyone think he's somebody that might be able to help us?
Chad Kelly, Jim's nephew that played high school ball in Orchard Park (Buffalo), NY, has played a pretty good game vrs Alabama today outside of 1 mental breakdown where he coughed up the football for an Alabama TD. He's already beaten a National Champion Bama team in 2015 for anyone wondering what he's capable of against a well coached talented roster.
I remembered Tour bringing him up as an intriguing QB prospect last year to a pretty tough crowd of critics. I kind of liked the idea to be honest.
Anyone think he's somebody that might be able to help us?
Watching the end of the game now... I forget in what game he caught my eye last year.
Chad is a roller coaster ride... that is for sure. That deep ball to the near sideline on their next to last TD drive was as pretty as can be. Other things, including putting his body at risk, are less desirable. The arm is there. The head???
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Chad Kelly, Jim's nephew that played high school ball in Orchard Park (Buffalo), NY, has played a pretty good game vrs Alabama today outside of 1 mental breakdown where he coughed up the football for an Alabama TD. He's already beaten a National Champion Bama team in 2015 for anyone wondering what he's capable of against a well coached talented roster.
I remembered Tour bringing him up as an intriguing QB prospect last year to a pretty tough crowd of critics. I kind of liked the idea to be honest.
Anyone think he's somebody that might be able to help us?
Watching the end of the game now... I forget in what game he caught my eye last year.
Chad is a roller coaster ride... that is for sure. That deep ball to the near sideline on their next to last TD drive was as pretty as can be. Other things, including putting his body at risk, are less desirable. The arm is there. The head???
Chad is a roller coaster ride... that is for sure. Other things, including putting his body at risk, are less desirable. The arm is there. The head???
That's my whole problem with Kelly..Holding the ball to long & the head, thinking he can risk his body to NFL defenses?..Bama's D was a good test today for Chad. Gota see Round 2.
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Todd McShay calling A&M @ Auburn was saying he did not have a QB in his top 10 for the draft at this point, but that he was definitely moving Garrett higher up from his current #4 spot on his list. He referred to him several times as the best college football player in America. Understandable given 3 sacks, multiple hits as the ball left the QB's hand and much improved on run defense from a year ago. He indicated that the defense had to account for him on every play. Never took a down off while on the field.
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Chad Kelly is butt
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Kid from miami looked like you can mold him into a complete qb in the nfl. Louisville qb looked great. Will be a wr in the nfl or a crippled rg3. Watson was mediocre at best and the ND qb scratch him off the list. Mayfield? LMAO!
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Kid from miami looked like you can mold him into a complete qb in the nfl. Louisville qb looked great. Will be a wr in the nfl or a crippled rg3. Watson was mediocre at best and the ND qb scratch him off the list. Mayfield? LMAO!
Kid from miami looked like you can mold him into a complete qb in the nfl. Louisville qb looked great. Will be a wr in the nfl or a crippled rg3. Watson was mediocre at best and the ND qb scratch him off the list. Mayfield? LMAO!
I didn't see any NFL franchise QB yesterday. McShay is right. None in the top 10 of the draft.
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Kid from miami looked like you can mold him into a complete qb in the nfl. Louisville qb looked great. Will be a wr in the nfl or a crippled rg3. Watson was mediocre at best and the ND qb scratch him off the list. Mayfield? LMAO!
I didn't see any NFL franchise QB yesterday. McShay is right. None in the top 10 of the draft.
I didn't see any NFL franchise QB yesterday. McShay is right. None in the top 10 of the draft.
Perhaps. Need to see more of Watson, and then find out who the new Wentz/Bortles is that nobody's paying attention to right now.
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Kid from miami looked like you can mold him into a complete qb in the nfl. Louisville qb looked great. Will be a wr in the nfl or a crippled rg3. Watson was mediocre at best and the ND qb scratch him off the list. Mayfield? LMAO!
I didn't see any NFL franchise QB yesterday. McShay is right. None in the top 10 of the draft.
I didn't see any NFL franchise QB yesterday. McShay is right. None in the top 10 of the draft.
i totally agree. might be drafting D first.
god this sucks.
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I didn't see any NFL franchise QB yesterday. McShay is right. None in the top 10 of the draft.
i totally agree. might be drafting D first.
god this sucks.
i totally agree. might be drafting D first.
god this sucks.
They better draft D first.....second.....third.....and some OL for the 4th - 5th - 6th - etc....
If they go QB early(first/2nd/3rd) I will (again) be very upset, because that means we just burned a 3rd for no reason....
My theory on QB's is you take em in the 1st, if they are "your guy for the future".....OR......you take em late (4th-7th) if they are a long shot project....
But....NEVER.....take a flyer with a high pick(1st-2nd-3rd), unless you can afford to burn those valuable picks....and we cant....
Sooooo......IF the Browns "rebuild plan"(and I use that wording lightly) was to draft their future QB next year, then I wish we had used that #3 on someone who would help us in other areas....
Go get me some difference making LB's and CB's......we drafted Gilbert because of our deep need at CB and STILL haven't filled that role....
Anyone hear talk of us waiting for McCarron to be a FA?....ala the Hue connection.....thats 2 seasons away....possible?
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Kid from miami looked like you can mold him into a complete qb in the nfl. Louisville qb looked great. Will be a wr in the nfl or a crippled rg3. Watson was mediocre at best and the ND qb scratch him off the list. Mayfield? LMAO!
Kid from miami looked like you can mold him into a complete qb in the nfl. Louisville qb looked great. Will be a wr in the nfl or a crippled rg3. Watson was mediocre at best and the ND qb scratch him off the list. Mayfield? LMAO!
I swear if you slapped a maroon #2 on Mayfield you'd think you were watching JFF...
The two best QBs I saw Sunday were Louisville's Lamar Jackson and UH's Greg Ward Jr. At 5'11 the latter has no QB-shot at the NFL, but the former is 6'3... and looks comfortable in the pocket.
JT Barrett probably leads the best of the rest list. Threw some really pretty balls...
Still... there's that "running QB" aversion of mine.
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i totally agree. might be drafting D first.
god this sucks.
They better draft D first.....second.....third.....and some OL for the 4th - 5th - 6th - etc....
If they go QB early(first/2nd/3rd) I will (again) be very upset, because that means we just burned a 3rd for no reason....
My theory on QB's is you take em in the 1st, if they are "your guy for the future".....OR......you take em late (4th-7th) if they are a long shot project....
But....NEVER.....take a flyer with a high pick(1st-2nd-3rd), unless you can afford to burn those valuable picks....and we cant....
Sooooo......IF the Browns "rebuild plan"(and I use that wording lightly) was to draft their future QB next year, then I wish we had used that #3 on someone who would help us in other areas....
Go get me some difference making LB's and CB's......we drafted Gilbert because of our deep need at CB and STILL haven't filled that role....
Anyone hear talk of us waiting for McCarron to be a FA?....ala the Hue connection.....thats 2 seasons away....possible?
They better draft D first.....second.....third.....and some OL for the 4th - 5th - 6th - etc....
If they go QB early(first/2nd/3rd) I will (again) be very upset, because that means we just burned a 3rd for no reason....
My theory on QB's is you take em in the 1st, if they are "your guy for the future".....OR......you take em late (4th-7th) if they are a long shot project....
But....NEVER.....take a flyer with a high pick(1st-2nd-3rd), unless you can afford to burn those valuable picks....and we cant....
Sooooo......IF the Browns "rebuild plan"(and I use that wording lightly) was to draft their future QB next year, then I wish we had used that #3 on someone who would help us in other areas....
Go get me some difference making LB's and CB's......we drafted Gilbert because of our deep need at CB and STILL haven't filled that role....
Anyone hear talk of us waiting for McCarron to be a FA?....ala the Hue connection.....thats 2 seasons away....possible?
i guess then, it's what we can get at the top spot we have and how they are ranked. after the run on wrs last year i'd hate to see another in the first....
offensively, IMO a rebuild of the OL is needed, a blue chip RB and of course a QB but like we've all said if there is noone that is a franchise guy of the future i would look at FA as you suggested to hold on for another year at least.
defensively, there are too many holes to mention. you guys that know and analyze the LBs and beyond maybe could enlighten us if there are any khalil macks coming out this year..?...maybe a monster DE...?...
i watched more college football yesterday than i have in a while and damn that ohio state d backfield is badass.
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i totally agree. might be drafting D first.
god this sucks.
They better draft D first.....second.....third.....and some OL for the 4th - 5th - 6th - etc....
If they go QB early(first/2nd/3rd) I will (again) be very upset, because that means we just burned a 3rd for no reason....
My theory on QB's is you take em in the 1st, if they are "your guy for the future".....OR......you take em late (4th-7th) if they are a long shot project....
But....NEVER.....take a flyer with a high pick(1st-2nd-3rd), unless you can afford to burn those valuable picks....and we cant....
Sooooo......IF the Browns "rebuild plan"(and I use that wording lightly) was to draft their future QB next year, then I wish we had used that #3 on someone who would help us in other areas....
Go get me some difference making LB's and CB's......we drafted Gilbert because of our deep need at CB and STILL haven't filled that role....
Anyone hear talk of us waiting for McCarron to be a FA?....ala the Hue connection.....thats 2 seasons away....possible?
They better draft D first.....second.....third.....and some OL for the 4th - 5th - 6th - etc....
If they go QB early(first/2nd/3rd) I will (again) be very upset, because that means we just burned a 3rd for no reason....
My theory on QB's is you take em in the 1st, if they are "your guy for the future".....OR......you take em late (4th-7th) if they are a long shot project....
But....NEVER.....take a flyer with a high pick(1st-2nd-3rd), unless you can afford to burn those valuable picks....and we cant....
Anyone hear talk of us waiting for McCarron to be a FA?....ala the Hue connection.....thats 2 seasons away....possible?
Why do my sleeper QBs' names keep coming up?
Jury is still out on our draft "needs"... except at one position... IMO. I do agree that early impact player(s) is(are) not evident at more than one position. DB? Depends on how you see the D being built: front to back or back to front.
Drafting is all about probability of success combined with impact of the position. I doubt there has ever been a 1st round card turned in where the org that wrote down the name did not think the player was a "sure thing"... at least in time. That includes even Wheezy... although I think there was a hefty dose of folks **cough Holmgren cough** talking themselves into that one. But even then the odds are lower for picks 24-32 than they were for 1-8. They just still have to be damn good.
Burning a 3rd on a prospect someone saw as having an outsized chance to be good doesn't bother me... although I confess I'd like to either share their view when they do it or have the wisdom of their way become evident PDQ...
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
They better draft D first.....second.....third.....and some OL for the 4th - 5th - 6th - etc....
If they go QB early(first/2nd/3rd) I will (again) be very upset, because that means we just burned a 3rd for no reason....
My theory on QB's is you take em in the 1st, if they are "your guy for the future".....OR......you take em late (4th-7th) if they are a long shot project....
But....NEVER.....take a flyer with a high pick(1st-2nd-3rd), unless you can afford to burn those valuable picks....and we cant....
Anyone hear talk of us waiting for McCarron to be a FA?....ala the Hue connection.....thats 2 seasons away....possible?
Why do my sleeper QBs' names keep coming up?
Jury is still out on our draft "needs"... except at one position... IMO. I do agree that early impact player(s) is(are) not evident at more than one position. DB? Depends on how you see the D being built: front to back or back to front.
Drafting is all about probability of success combined with impact of the position. I doubt there has ever been a 1st round card turned in where the org that wrote down the name did not think the player was a "sure thing"... at least in time. That includes even Wheezy... although I think there was a hefty dose of folks **cough Holmgren cough** talking themselves into that one. But even then the odds are lower for picks 24-32 than they were for 1-8. They just still have to be damn good.
Burning a 3rd on a prospect someone saw as having an outsized chance to be good doesn't bother me... although I confess I'd like to either share their view when they do it or have the wisdom of their way become evident PDQ...
Why do my sleeper QBs' names keep coming up?
Burning a 3rd on a prospect someone saw as having an outsized chance to be good doesn't bother me... although I confess I'd like to either share their view when they do it or have the wisdom of their way become evident PDQ...
Maybe you talk in your sleep?.....ha!
My issues with the burned picks grows deeper when I feel like that guy wouldnt even get drafted or could be had in the 6th or 7th....(that is Kessler)
I doubt ANY team shit their pants when that card came up in the 3rd.....(tho more than a few laughed and rolled their eyes)(trust me on this one).....
It still boils down to spending a 3rd round pick on a position that you already plan to fill thru other means....ie: FA or next years draft....and if you're just praying you get lucky and wont need to pick one high, then that is a bad plan....
And....taking it one further.....IF you truly believe this Kessler is your guy for the future.....AND you've already thrown in the whole season by cutting your starters, not signing any FA's and committing to rookies who "honestly" haven't earned the right to start....then why not play him too?.....the time is now to find out if he's got it or not.....
Then again....maybe it's not too early to already know......cause, clearly, this FO is committed to playing their guys early and often.....X cept at QB.....
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I had the same issue with Kessler. Why did the boys know what Hue didn't seem to know? Would they have taken Kessler? I don't think so. He was a later round flyer. I had the same reaction to DeValve in the 4th. WTF!!??
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Why do my sleeper QBs' names keep coming up?
Burning a 3rd on a prospect someone saw as having an outsized chance to be good doesn't bother me... although I confess I'd like to either share their view when they do it or have the wisdom of their way become evident PDQ...
Maybe you talk in your sleep?.....ha!
My issues with the burned picks grows deeper when I feel like that guy wouldnt even get drafted or could be had in the 6th or 7th....(that is Kessler)
I doubt ANY team shit their pants when that card came up in the 3rd.....(tho more than a few laughed and rolled their eyes)(trust me on this one).....
It still boils down to spending a 3rd round pick on a position that you already plan to fill thru other means....ie: FA or next years draft....and if you're just praying you get lucky and wont need to pick one high, then that is a bad plan....
And....taking it one further.....IF you truly believe this Kessler is your guy for the future.....AND you've already thrown in the whole season by cutting your starters, not signing any FA's and committing to rookies who "honestly" haven't earned the right to start....then why not play him too?.....the time is now to find out if he's got it or not.....
Then again....maybe it's not too early to already know......cause, clearly, this FO is committed to playing their guys early and often.....X cept at QB.....
Maybe you talk in your sleep?.....ha!
My issues with the burned picks grows deeper when I feel like that guy wouldnt even get drafted or could be had in the 6th or 7th....(that is Kessler)
I doubt ANY team shit their pants when that card came up in the 3rd.....(tho more than a few laughed and rolled their eyes)(trust me on this one).....
It still boils down to spending a 3rd round pick on a position that you already plan to fill thru other means....ie: FA or next years draft....and if you're just praying you get lucky and wont need to pick one high, then that is a bad plan....
And....taking it one further.....IF you truly believe this Kessler is your guy for the future.....AND you've already thrown in the whole season by cutting your starters, not signing any FA's and committing to rookies who "honestly" haven't earned the right to start....then why not play him too?.....the time is now to find out if he's got it or not.....
Then again....maybe it's not too early to already know......cause, clearly, this FO is committed to playing their guys early and often.....X cept at QB.....
First... agree on timing of the pick and share your doubt that one or more teams said, "Damn," when the pick was announced. But that's based on our view of Kessler. If our system determined he was high value late in the third, so be it. Even if they felt he could still be there a round later, if he had risen to the top of our board, then they should pull the trigger as they did. You have to trust your system until it's shown you should not. And then you tweak it and trust it again... and again... and again...
That said... it would be nice if their early judgement turned out to be sound. Even more so in light of their signing Hogan which is a bit of a head scratcher if Kessler was their sleeper.
The timing to start that discovery process? Still too early IMO... It's not just Kessler's readiness that is the issue, but the WR corps', the OL's and, to a lesser extent, the D's readiness. Let the surrounding cast develop some... get Gordon back in the mix... let everything settle in under McC. I don't think there is much risk of a winning streak breaking out, so there will be still be circumstances allowing us to check out Kessler (and probably Hogan) by year's end.
If you choose to start a rookie who is not ready while the team is still mathematically in "it", then you risk losing the team... especially if out of the other side of your mouth you are still talking about "fighting on" and "being close", etc.
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Why do my sleeper QBs' names keep coming up?
Burning a 3rd on a prospect someone saw as having an outsized chance to be good doesn't bother me... although I confess I'd like to either share their view when they do it or have the wisdom of their way become evident PDQ...
Maybe you talk in your sleep?.....ha!
My issues with the burned picks grows deeper when I feel like that guy wouldnt even get drafted or could be had in the 6th or 7th....(that is Kessler)
I doubt ANY team shit their pants when that card came up in the 3rd.....(tho more than a few laughed and rolled their eyes)(trust me on this one).....
It still boils down to spending a 3rd round pick on a position that you already plan to fill thru other means....ie: FA or next years draft....and if you're just praying you get lucky and wont need to pick one high, then that is a bad plan....
And....taking it one further.....IF you truly believe this Kessler is your guy for the future.....AND you've already thrown in the whole season by cutting your starters, not signing any FA's and committing to rookies who "honestly" haven't earned the right to start....then why not play him too?.....the time is now to find out if he's got it or not.....
Then again....maybe it's not too early to already know......cause, clearly, this FO is committed to playing their guys early and often.....X cept at QB.....
I doubt ANY team shit their pants when that card came up in the 3rd.....(tho more than a few laughed and rolled their eyes)(trust me on this one).....
If its "a feel better for a moment", Mud. TB took a Kicker at 59,(in 2nd?) leaving the door open for us to get Naz at 65..(small cave helmet light in a dark tunnel 🥷)
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