I called it before the season started that some of you wouldn't make it halfway through before..
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If we draft defense with the first pick next year it's hard for me to justify another front 7 pick. The exception being Peppers who could hybrid LB/safety. Otherwise defensively, good god we need secondary talent. I just can't justify Garrett or Allen over the secondary or for that matter if there's stud OL that are gonna go top 10 we need that. We have to start building up the O line and getting a RT that could take over for JT in a year or two would be my utmost preference. As bad as things are now, when JT leaves and shit is stil the same across the rest of the O line....omg our offense is going to be shit and we'll have to keep a 4 QB rotation. If after next year Ogbah and Nassib aren't showing much improvement than fine, they can play out their rookie contracts as depth and we can go get another front 4 guy.
If you don't see an elite DB, next best way to improve your secondary is pass rush.
If you don't see an elite DB, next best way to improve your secondary is pass rush.
I know, there's just so many glaring needs. Tough to convince me OL isn't one of our most pressing needs with JT's retirement looming. I love defense i want the next joey B, but i can't condone overlooking those other positions. Especially since we have a budding receiver corp, man just get our QB some time and even Kessler will look good. If teams have to pass more to keep up with us than that helps our pass rush
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... and certainly your optimism is only outsized compared to my skepticism which restricts me to 4-ish wins in 2018 2017.
OL: Getting Bito back certainly helps shore up the OL leaving only one widely accepted hole. Even on our existing roster there are two possible solutions that would allow his replacement with the thickest resume, Greco, to slide over permanently: Drango or Paz... with the latter requiring Shon Coleman to finally step up. Either of which still leaves Reiter as a fall back direct replacement.
Front 7: A Garett (4-3 DE) or Allen (3-4) opposite an extended Collins appeals. Add a returning Des Bryant, Ogbah and Stample, and a developed Nassib?
2ndary: A new safety to pair with the winner of a Poyer/Kindred/Campbell competition?
And then it's on the QB... agree there are signs of Kess possibilities, but the unresolved shadow of RG3 lingers as well. That resolution should indicate how deep the belief in Kess is.
... and certainly your optimism is only outsized compared to my skepticism which restricts me to 4-ish wins in 2018.
OL: Getting Bito back certainly helps shore up the OL leaving only one widely accepted hole. Even on our existing roster there are two possible solutions that would allow his replacement with the thickest resume, Greco, to slide over permanently: Drango or Paz... with the latter requiring Shon Coleman to finally step up. Either of which still leaves Reiter as a fall back direct replacement.
Front 7: A Garett (4-3 DE) or Allen (3-4) opposite an extended Collins appeals. Add a returning Des Bryant, Ogbah and Stample, and a developed Nassib?
2ndary: A new safety to pair with the winner of a Poyer/Kindred/Campbell competition?
And then it's on the QB... agree there are signs of Kess possibilities, but the unresolved shadow of RG3 lingers as well. That resolution should indicate how deep the belief in Kess is.
Please tell me you meant 2017.
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Prophetic Cleve comes through again.
Yeah you called it...you also predicted Pettine wasn't going anywhere, and that no way Trump would become president. So go ahead and use this rare opportunity to puff your chest out.(please no one turn this into a political discussion)
I believe Hue can turn it around.
Eventually.
But so could have Eric Mangini turned it around. Eventually. Problem is that browns fans want a winner now. Been waiting way too long, and wanting a winner now is understandable.
Coaches don't want to come here. The coaches that do know full well they are taking a risk, and have evaluated the risk/reward possibilities.
The reward is of epic proportions. If they are "the one" that has finally succeeded in Cleveland, the one that brings back the once rich tradition this team once enjoyed, then that coach becomes a God in this rabid football town...and highly respected throughout the league.
The risk is that if he fails, his head coaching opportunities go down the toilet...his future is relegated to some assistant or coordinator job.
Kinda like how Cleveland ruins quarterbacks.
If I'm not mistaken Romeo Crennel was the only fired browns coach to become a head coach elsewhere....but not immediately. He was a coordinator first and kind of fell into the position because he was already there.
If I'm not mistaken Romeo Crennel was the only fired browns coach to become a head coach elsewhere....but not immediately. He was a coordinator first and kind of fell into the position because he was already there.
Forrest Gregg & Marty Schottenheimer come to mind.
Two things that will define you: Your determination when you have nothing. Your attitude when you have everything. - Mike McCartney -
If you don't see an elite DB, next best way to improve your secondary is pass rush.
I know, there's just so many glaring needs. Tough to convince me OL isn't one of our most pressing needs with JT's retirement looming. I love defense i want the next joey B, but i can't condone overlooking those other positions. Especially since we have a budding receiver corp, man just get our QB some time and even Kessler will look good. If teams have to pass more to keep up with us than that helps our pass rush
I know, there's just so many glaring needs. Tough to convince me OL isn't one of our most pressing needs with JT's retirement looming. I love defense i want the next joey B, but i can't condone overlooking those other positions. Especially since we have a budding receiver corp, man just get our QB some time and even Kessler will look good. If teams have to pass more to keep up with us than that helps our pass rush
Either way, Peppers isn't the player to help this secondary or front 7.
And if your belief is winning shoot outs, more often then not that bites you in the ass.
What we might do in free agency will affect our draft play. Like I've said (and Tour, apparently) taking a shot at Sheldon makes a lot of sense and immediately crosses a huge need off our board.
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If we draft defense with the first pick next year it's hard for me to justify another front 7 pick. The exception being Peppers who could hybrid LB/safety. Otherwise defensively, good god we need secondary talent. I just can't justify Garrett or Allen over the secondary or for that matter if there's stud OL that are gonna go top 10 we need that. We have to start building up the O line and getting a RT that could take over for JT in a year or two would be my utmost preference. As bad as things are now, when JT leaves and shit is stil the same across the rest of the O line....omg our offense is going to be shit and we'll have to keep a 4 QB rotation. If after next year Ogbah and Nassib aren't showing much improvement than fine, they can play out their rookie contracts as depth and we can go get another front 4 guy.
Get your Bosa today! Collect them all!
If we draft defense with the first pick next year it's hard for me to justify another front 7 pick. The exception being Peppers who could hybrid LB/safety. Otherwise defensively, good god we need secondary talent. I just can't justify Garrett or Allen over the secondary...
Sounds like a vote for trade-down.
We've had the debate forever about QBs, but which are easier to find throughout the draft: stud edge men or stud Safeties? Throw CBs in the mix if you like.
In our case both certainly rate high on the need scale. Any difference would stem from the "hoped for" improvement by current roster players.
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... and certainly your optimism is only outsized compared to my skepticism which restricts me to 4-ish wins in 2018.
OL: Getting Bito back certainly helps shore up the OL leaving only one widely accepted hole. Even on our existing roster there are two possible solutions that would allow his replacement with the thickest resume, Greco, to slide over permanently: Drango or Paz... with the latter requiring Shon Coleman to finally step up. Either of which still leaves Reiter as a fall back direct replacement.
Front 7: A Garett (4-3 DE) or Allen (3-4) opposite an extended Collins appeals. Add a returning Des Bryant, Ogbah and Stample, and a developed Nassib?
2ndary: A new safety to pair with the winner of a Poyer/Kindred/Campbell competition?
And then it's on the QB... agree there are signs of Kess possibilities, but the unresolved shadow of RG3 lingers as well. That resolution should indicate how deep the belief in Kess is.
Please tell me you meant 2017.
Please tell me you meant 2017.
2017... you're welcome...
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I know, there's just so many glaring needs. Tough to convince me OL isn't one of our most pressing needs with JT's retirement looming. I love defense i want the next joey B, but i can't condone overlooking those other positions. Especially since we have a budding receiver corp, man just get our QB some time and even Kessler will look good. If teams have to pass more to keep up with us than that helps our pass rush
Either way, Peppers isn't the player to help this secondary or front 7.
And if your belief is winning shoot outs, more often then not that bites you in the ass.
What we might do in free agency will affect our draft play. Like I've said (and Tour, apparently) taking a shot at Sheldon makes a lot of sense and immediately crosses a huge need off our board.
What we might do in free agency will affect our draft play. Like I've said (and Tour, apparently) taking a shot at Sheldon makes a lot of sense and immediately crosses a huge need off our board.
I was certainly surprised we were not in the reported trade conversations with the Jets for Richardson, so, yes, I'd expect us to be one of his FA suitors.
Bryant-Shelton-Richardson would be a helluva base 3 fronting a 3-4. And on passing downs trot off Danny and bookend Des and Sheldon with Collins and a Player to be named/emerge/drafted? Wow...
#Front2Back&InsideOut4ever
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
What we might do in free agency will affect our draft play. Like I've said (and Tour, apparently) taking a shot at Sheldon makes a lot of sense and immediately crosses a huge need off our board.
I was certainly surprised we were not in the reported trade conversations with the Jets for Richardson, so, yes, I'd expect us to be one of his FA suitors.
Bryant-Shelton-Richardson would be a helluva base 3 fronting a 3-4. And on passing downs trot off Danny and bookend Des and Sheldon with Collins and a Player to be named/emerge/drafted? Wow...
#Front2Back&InsideOut4ever
I was certainly surprised we were not in the reported trade conversations with the Jets for Richardson, so, yes, I'd expect us to be one of his FA suitors.
Bryant-Shelton-Richardson would be a helluva base 3 fronting a 3-4. And on passing downs trot off Danny and bookend Des and Sheldon with Collins and a Player to be named/emerge/drafted? Wow...
#Front2Back&InsideOut4ever
Yeah, I agree. I think we're going to TRY to make SOME kind of big splash, I really do.
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I was certainly surprised we were not in the reported trade conversations with the Jets for Richardson, so, yes, I'd expect us to be one of his FA suitors.
Bryant-Shelton-Richardson would be a helluva base 3 fronting a 3-4. And on passing downs trot off Danny and bookend Des and Sheldon with Collins and a Player to be named/emerge/drafted? Wow...
#Front2Back&InsideOut4ever
Yeah, I agree. I think we're going to TRY to make SOME kind of big splash, I really do.
Yeah, I agree. I think we're going to TRY to make SOME kind of big splash, I really do.
What makes you think that? Because I am fully expecting us to go after tier 2/3 guys to supplement our home-grown talent. Maybe I'm wrong, and the Jamie Collins acquisition is a sign of things to come, but I saw it more as a shot in the arm of veteran leadership and quality that the D was sorely missing.
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What makes me think that is our front office keeps talking about "a plan". Surely the plan could involve building through the draft and inserting mid-tier veterans through free agency, but I just have a hunch we'll be going after somebody. I don't have anything to support this crazy theory, but I could see it happening...ESPECIALLY if we aren't able to keep Collins. If we are somehow able to sign Collins, then I don't think we'll sign a big name. Sashi didn't really comment on the contract situation of Collins, which made me sad. I sure was hoping to hear, "We're going to do everything we can to keep him here for a long time, and we don't care how much money it takes." LOL
I think we'll go after safety/corner back HARD in free agency.
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If I'm not mistaken Romeo Crennel was the only fired browns coach to become a head coach elsewhere....but not immediately. He was a coordinator first and kind of fell into the position because he was already there.
Forrest Gregg & Marty Schottenheimer come to mind.
Forrest Gregg & Marty Schottenheimer come to mind.
Good ole Forrest. I've often thought that we could use a hard nosed sob like him to get the culture changed.
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What makes me think that is our front office keeps talking about "a plan". Surely the plan could involve building through the draft and inserting mid-tier veterans through free agency, but I just have a hunch we'll be going after somebody. I don't have anything to support this crazy theory, but I could see it happening...ESPECIALLY if we aren't able to keep Collins. If we are somehow able to sign Collins, then I don't think we'll sign a big name. Sashi didn't really comment on the contract situation of Collins, which made me sad. I sure was hoping to hear, "We're going to do everything we can to keep him here for a long time, and we don't care how much money it takes." LOL
I think we'll go after safety/corner back HARD in free agency.
I sure was hoping to hear, "We're going to do everything we can to keep him here for a long time, and we don't care how much money it takes."
That would just give all of the leverage to Collins, as if he doesn't already have most of it.
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It's obvious they need to give coaches more time.
Hell, we might be 8-8 under Pettine if Jimmy Fucktard didn't hit the red button... again!Now we are stuck with a guy who has made some very questionable decisions and seems overwhelmed.
Injuries, mediocre play from the OL and secondary has hurt our cause this season. Teams exploit those weaknesses and we get decimated each week!
Next year needs to be a year in which the FO drafts a shit ton of lineman and defensive help.
They also need some impact veterans in FA. Because a team full of rookies will not do shit without solid vets showing them the way!
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What we might do in free agency will affect our draft play. Like I've said (and Tour, apparently) taking a shot at Sheldon makes a lot of sense and immediately crosses a huge need off our board.
I was certainly surprised we were not in the reported trade conversations with the Jets for Richardson, so, yes, I'd expect us to be one of his FA suitors.
Bryant-Shelton-Richardson would be a helluva base 3 fronting a 3-4. And on passing downs trot off Danny and bookend Des and Sheldon with Collins and a Player to be named/emerge/drafted? Wow...
#Front2Back&InsideOut4ever
I was certainly surprised we were not in the reported trade conversations with the Jets for Richardson, so, yes, I'd expect us to be one of his FA suitors.
Bryant-Shelton-Richardson would be a helluva base 3 fronting a 3-4. And on passing downs trot off Danny and bookend Des and Sheldon with Collins and a Player to be named/emerge/drafted? Wow...
#Front2Back&InsideOut4ever
Omg why the 3-4 with those guys plus og,orch and nas? I want any combination of those 6 guys on the field at all times
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Not convinced on Richardson based on supposed character issues.
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Yeah, I agree. I think we're going to TRY to make SOME kind of big splash, I really do.
What makes you think that? Because I am fully expecting us to go after tier 2/3 guys to supplement our home-grown talent. Maybe I'm wrong, and the Jamie Collins acquisition is a sign of things to come, but I saw it more as a shot in the arm of veteran leadership and quality that the D was sorely missing.
What makes you think that? Because I am fully expecting us to go after tier 2/3 guys to supplement our home-grown talent. Maybe I'm wrong, and the Jamie Collins acquisition is a sign of things to come, but I saw it more as a shot in the arm of veteran leadership and quality that the D was sorely missing.
First.. a "big splash" can come in the form of a single UFA signing. Richardson would qualify. So would resigning Collins. That's 2. Just as you can't toss enough pebbles into a pond to match the splash made by a couple bricks or a single cinder block, it's the size/quality of the talent signed that counts in FA.
Second, "2/3 guys" is certainly a reasonable estimate as would be 4. But certainly the bulk of the roster will still be comprised of draftees and UDFAs. I see nothing inconsistent with your take and "the plan".
I think we'll go after safety/corner back HARD in free agency.
Certainly are some names in the 2017 UFA class...
At Safety I think you can forget top tier players going for a second big deal, like Eric Berry and Barry Church, but there are some interesting choices coming off of rookie contracts. My eyes fell to AZ's situation of having both Tony Jefferson and D.J. Swearinger hitting UFA at the same time. Hard to see one of them not getting squeezed out of the desert by cap considerations.
http://overthecap.com/free-agency/
At corner? The pickens look a lot slimmer to me. Mostly a bunch of pebbles... The Pats' Butler jumps out, but he's an RFA so depends on the Pats' tender. I'm sure I missed a couple in my quick scan, but otherwise HOU's AJ Bouye is about the only one that jumps out and he's having a good, not great year.
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I wasn't saying two or three guys, but that we would go after second or third tier players - so not Richardson or weddle for example. Demario Davis type players that fill in holes to complement our big draft and develop players.
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Forrest Gregg & Marty Schottenheimer come to mind.
Good ole Forrest. I've often thought that we could use a hard nosed sob like him to get the culture changed.
Good ole Forrest. I've often thought that we could use a hard nosed sob like him to get the culture changed.
Not seeing a hard-ass who couldn't make it with us in the 70's doing well today...
Not convinced on Richardson based on supposed character issues.
Came out of Mizzou with "character concerns and 'maturity, leadership and consistency issues'". That said, people grow up...
What has he done off-field during his NYJ time? One arrest for racing (reportedly hit 143 mph) in 2015. Also charged with resisting arrest, but who knows the circumstances there. Apologized to his team for the distraction Otherwise seems like he overslept and was late for a team meeting this year and may have missed a walkthru (can't verify). Both could be a reaction to NYJ openly shopping him Curbed his Enthusiam...
Not a poster child, but hardly a hardened criminal. Many reports of teammates supporting him. Certainly deserves an interview.
Even if the edges are a bit rough, there comes a point when if you surround a "problem child" with good teammates, they change him rather than him changing your team. Moss with the Pats may be the best example I can think of.
Maybe his edges are still too rough... maybe our team is not ready to be enough of a positive influence... but you don't know unless you interview the man. And I'd include "team leaders" in the interview process. Kirksey or Davis and Haden on the D-side... Greco and Joe T for the O-side.
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I wasn't saying two or three guys, but that we would go after second or third tier players - so not Richardson or weddle for example. Demario Davis type players that fill in holes to complement our big draft and develop players.
I wasn't saying two or three guys, but that we would go after second or third tier players - so not Richardson or weddle for example. Demario Davis type players that fill in holes to complement our big draft and develop players.
Ah... that's what "tier" means... that's different then isn't it?
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Gregg was 18-23. Not great then but by today's standards...lol. I saw him as a good type to build with then get the players coach.
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