Jimmy Garoppolo Speculation
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@boo-fagley said:
Did McGoo beg you to enter the fray for him?
He already cried to WSS and had him change my screen name. What powers to you posses here Hoorta? Please dont take away all my reputation.
I have absolutely nothing to do with any of that. Not within my powers nor my responsibilities and I wouldn't have considered doing it in the first place anyway.
To tell you the truth I have no idea why it happened, unless you are a Squeelers fan.
WSS
I have absolutely nothing to do with any of that. Not within my powers nor my responsibilities and I wouldn't have considered doing it in the first place anyway.
To tell you the truth I have no idea why it happened, unless you are a Squeelers fan.
WSS
Boo just keeps playing Fantasy Football with the Patriots. He keeps thinking that absolutely absurd things are going to happen.
He is a bit like PoG and his man crushes for the likes of Trent Richardson.
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It wasn't that long ago when NE was trying to fool teams into Vanilla Ice Jr (Mallett).
And all the former Patriot employees that brought Matt Cassell to KC got fired when he wasn't anything close to the 10 game winner he was 1 year under BB in NE. BB got the Cinderella story before midnight while KC got the toothless hag after midnight for 10x the cap hit.
It wasn't that long ago when NE was trying to fool teams into Vanilla Ice Jr (Mallett).
And all the former Patriot employees that brought Matt Cassell to KC got fired when he wasn't anything close to the 10 game winner he was 1 year under BB in NE. BB got the Cinderella story before midnight while KC got the toothless hag after midnight for 10x the cap hit.
Nice. A good fairy tale.
Just like the one about the Browns trading like #12 for JG. Fairy tale.
If Ryan Mallet is Vanilla Ice Jr., the Jimmy Garropolo is Joey Fatone Jr.
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@boo-fagley said:
You guys realize that this is not real life right?
Belichick did not send me to negotiate with the Fantasy GMs here. Some of you get downright upset like youre the ones handing over the draft pick.Nothing said or done here will have any effect on the outcome of this topic. Sorry fellas. The Browns and Patriots front offices are not following this thread debating on what to do next.
Not reality, at least for me anyway.
Come on! We are followers of Kellyanne Conway here! We have alternative facts!
Come on! We are followers of Kellyanne Conway here! We have alternative facts!
"We" means "you".
But great SNL bit.
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Top 5 AJ McCarron thread starters:
1) - Wife Katherine Webb is smoking hot. Google her and prepare to be fully Musbergered, you dirty old man.
2) - AJ's upper body is covered in hand drawn Jeebus tats and his head has a massive scar left over from a boating accident. So colorful. Discuss!
3) - Has the "it" factor. Can't be defined but you'll know it when you see it. (Massive head scar looks like a halo to some.)
4) - Doesn't require 25m commitment. 2017 salary less than 675k and won't be a RFA until 2018. Trade for and audition for 2 years at minimal real costs.
5) = Free Rustproofing. What do I have to do to put you in this QB today?
Well......if that happened, it would have to be one of the rarest events in the NFL: trading a QB intradivision.
I mean, as far as I know, the last time a trade intradivision was made involving the Browns it was when the Browns traded Dick Shiner to the Steelers for Bill Nelsen. (and the Browns got the far better end of that trade).
Does anyone know of it happening since?
Bottom line....if the Bengals do think about trading McCarron, the last place they would trade him is either Cleveland/Pitt. or Baltimore.
Fair to say?
Well......if that happened, it would have to be one of the rarest events in the NFL: trading a QB intradivision.
I mean, as far as I know, the last time a trade intradivision was made involving the Browns it was when the Browns traded Dick Shiner to the Steelers for Bill Nelsen. (and the Browns got the far better end of that trade).
Does anyone know of it happening since?
Bottom line....if the Bengals do think about trading McCarron, the last place they would trade him is either Cleveland/Pitt. or Baltimore.
Fair to say?
The Browns just traded Gilbert to Pittsburgh (for them to cut). I've been saying it for a while but the reason you've given is the reason I cannot see McCarron in Cleveland.
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@boo-fagley said:
I am bordering on trolling?
Dont you think that Garroplos agent would like a payday? Why would the Pats make Garrapolo sit for how many more years until Brady retires? Can you fathom that Garrapolo wants to play something he has likely dreamed about all his life - NFL football on Sunday? Its a QB weak NFL draft. Should the Pats hang on to Jimmy Garropolo until the next NFL draft thats loaded with QBs?
The Patriots have always had QBs in development - Rohan Davey, Brian Hoyer, Michael Bishop, Ryan Mallet, Kliff Klingsbury. Matt Cassel.
The whole he cant be any good if Team X is letting him go argument is ridiculous, TJ Ward was let go. He looked OK winning the Super Bowl last year. Martellius Bennet is moving on from NE. He must not be any good. The Steelers let Legarret Blount walk. I sure am glad that he isnt any good 18 TDs this season and a Super Bowl ring later.
Rolling out those names is an excellent reason why Browns fans are sceptical! You already have said at least once "it's different this time with Jimmy." Proves you're arguing in circles, and repeating yourself. The track record of players released or traded by Bill is less than stellar. So sorry if I have trouble believing Jimmy can be a long term multiple pro bowl answer for the Browns.
Regarding Ward, it was just one of many horrible decisions by a clueless FO. Sheard, Schwartz, Gabriel- I could go on.
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Well......if that happened, it would have to be one of the rarest events in the NFL: trading a QB intradivision.
I mean, as far as I know, the last time a trade intradivision was made involving the Browns it was when the Browns traded Dick Shiner to the Steelers for Bill Nelsen. (and the Browns got the far better end of that trade).
Does anyone know of it happening since?
Bottom line....if the Bengals do think about trading McCarron, the last place they would trade him is either Cleveland/Pitt. or Baltimore.
Fair to say?
The Browns just traded Gilbert to Pittsburgh (for them to cut). I've been saying it for a while but the reason you've given is the reason I cannot see McCarron in Cleveland.
The Browns just traded Gilbert to Pittsburgh (for them to cut). I've been saying it for a while but the reason you've given is the reason I cannot see McCarron in Cleveland.
True. I think the only way McCarron would get here is via FA, which isn't in 2017.
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The Browns just traded Gilbert to Pittsburgh (for them to cut). I've been saying it for a while but the reason you've given is the reason I cannot see McCarron in Cleveland.
True. I think the only way McCarron would get here is via FA, which isn't in 2017.
True. I think the only way McCarron would get here is via FA, which isn't in 2017.
Interesting Flugs the other backup in the discussion McCarron gets around 5 comments- including a few by our pal Ummadog, and this thread is 14 pages and counting. It's getting me ill all of the attention on Garropolo. The flavor of the week- more attention than Watson or Kizer- combined. Here's some backup to my point- the latest media's nut hugging fascination over the guy. Is it getting fueled by Bill and his minions- or do they collectively have the cumulative insight of a groundhog about Jimmy? To their credit, at least some of the Browns media deservedly isn't wearing the rose colored glasses. http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000785403/article/charley-casserly-mock-draft-10-trades-shake-up-round-1
They're just not going to let this die. BARF! Seriously- why do New England's backup quarterbacks get all this media love and attention? It's not like plenty of them have flopped badly after they've left the cozy environment of Foxboro. From a Browns fans perspective the lines in the sand are pretty much drawn already.
1) Don't want him under any circumstance.
2) OK with a trade at the right price
3) Sure, ship the Patriots our #12 and something more to get him, he's gonna be the BOMB.
The simplistic media groupthink is well- the Browns are going to get Garrett with the #1, and they'll be happy to get their QBOTF in Jimmy with that extra pick in the first round. I have to hope Sashi, DePo, and Hue aren't that shallow. They're going to analyze every one of LOL Jimmy's 94 NFL passes- thoroughly. The ONLY way they're going to pull the trigger on a trade like that is if they're 100% certain Garropolo is the real deal, and he's a better option than one of the many top players available @ #12, and there isn't a 2017 qb prospect that might turn out better. It also flies in the face of our Front office's desire to add draft picks, not trade them away.
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I don't really remember anyone crying over Gabriel at the time of his release. Think a large majority of people were tired of the Smurfs. Considering how poor his second year was, followed by a poor camp, thought the move was fine.
So he blossomed whilst having a fqb and true #1 across from him. Think the real lesson is to ease up on expectations...Players are deemed all-pro or busts by this fanbase after their first few games, so maybe the way to look at this would be that's players often need time before the light goes on.
Not here tho...Produce from your first game on or you'll be replaced by another guy that'll be given 4 games to prove it.
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I don't really remember anyone crying over Gabriel at the time of his release. Think a large majority of people were tired of the Smurfs. Considering how poor his second year was, followed by a poor camp, thought the move was fine.
So he blossomed whilst having a fqb and true #1 across from him. Think the real lesson is to ease up on expectations...Players are deemed all-pro or busts by this fanbase after their first few games, so maybe the way to look at this would be that's players often need time before the light goes on.
Not here tho...Produce from your first game on or you'll be replaced by another guy that'll be given 4 games to prove it.
I don't really remember anyone crying over Gabriel at the time of his release. Think a large majority of people were tired of the Smurfs. Considering how poor his second year was, followed by a poor camp, thought the move was fine.
So he blossomed whilst having a fqb and true #1 across from him. Think the real lesson is to ease up on expectations...Players are deemed all-pro or busts by this fanbase after their first few games, so maybe the way to look at this would be that's players often need time before the light goes on.
Not here tho...Produce from your first game on or you'll be replaced by another guy that'll be given 4 games to prove it.
Well, they released Gabriel and kept every one of their rookie wr draft picks. I thought that was FO arrogance. Coleman produced little, and the rest of the crew virtually nothing. So keep Coleman and DeValve, and get rid of the rest of the crew.
There's a few of us who thought (notably Tour) who felt cutting Gabriel was a mistake.
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I don't really remember anyone crying over Gabriel at the time of his release. Think a large majority of people were tired of the Smurfs. Considering how poor his second year was, followed by a poor camp, thought the move was fine.
So he blossomed whilst having a fqb and true #1 across from him. Think the real lesson is to ease up on expectations...Players are deemed all-pro or busts by this fanbase after their first few games, so maybe the way to look at this would be that's players often need time before the light goes on.
Not here tho...Produce from your first game on or you'll be replaced by another guy that'll be given 4 games to prove it.
Well, they released Gabriel and kept every one of their rookie wr draft picks. I thought that was FO arrogance. Coleman produced little, and the rest of the crew virtually nothing. So keep Coleman and DeValve, and get rid of the rest of the crew.
There's a few of us who thought (notably Tour) who felt cutting Gabriel was a mistake.
Well, they released Gabriel and kept every one of their rookie wr draft picks. I thought that was FO arrogance. Coleman produced little, and the rest of the crew virtually nothing. So keep Coleman and DeValve, and get rid of the rest of the crew.
There's a few of us who thought (notably Tour) who felt cutting Gabriel was a mistake.
Everyone seems to forget that football is a team sport. Unless the Browns got their own version of Matt Ryan and Julio Jones, Gabriel was not going to flourish in Cleveland. Put another way, Gabriel had the season he did with Atlanta because he was with Atlanta. He would not have had that season in Cleveland.
"I said, 'I need someone who's going to want to get on the roller coaster with me knowing that it's not always going to be fun,'" -Paul DePodesta -
I don't really remember anyone crying over Gabriel at the time of his release. Think a large majority of people were tired of the Smurfs. Considering how poor his second year was, followed by a poor camp, thought the move was fine.
So he blossomed whilst having a fqb and true #1 across from him. Think the real lesson is to ease up on expectations...Players are deemed all-pro or busts by this fanbase after their first few games, so maybe the way to look at this would be that's players often need time before the light goes on.
Not here tho...Produce from your first game on or you'll be replaced by another guy that'll be given 4 games to prove it.
I don't really remember anyone crying over Gabriel at the time of his release. Think a large majority of people were tired of the Smurfs. Considering how poor his second year was, followed by a poor camp, thought the move was fine.
So he blossomed whilst having a fqb and true #1 across from him. Think the real lesson is to ease up on expectations...Players are deemed all-pro or busts by this fanbase after their first few games, so maybe the way to look at this would be that's players often need time before the light goes on.
Not here tho...Produce from your first game on or you'll be replaced by another guy that'll be given 4 games to prove it.
HA! Glad to see you back here Choco.
Colt McCoy has to be thinking "where was Choco when I had about 60,000 Hatfields ready to kill me during my 3rd start?"
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I don't really remember anyone crying over Gabriel at the time of his release. Think a large majority of people were tired of the Smurfs. Considering how poor his second year was, followed by a poor camp, thought the move was fine.
So he blossomed whilst having a fqb and true #1 across from him. Think the real lesson is to ease up on expectations...Players are deemed all-pro or busts by this fanbase after their first few games, so maybe the way to look at this would be that's players often need time before the light goes on.
Not here tho...Produce from your first game on or you'll be replaced by another guy that'll be given 4 games to prove it.
Well, they released Gabriel and kept every one of their rookie wr draft picks. I thought that was FO arrogance. Coleman produced little, and the rest of the crew virtually nothing. So keep Coleman and DeValve, and get rid of the rest of the crew.
There's a few of us who thought (notably Tour) who felt cutting Gabriel was a mistake.
There's a few of us who thought (notably Tour) who felt cutting Gabriel was a mistake.
Nice of you to "notab"....
I think I was making a case for his youth over Hawk, who you might also remember I wanted to trade after his "career" year with us. Just seemed the better fit with our youth movement and Hawk had a couple injury issues in 2015. However, the counter-case of keeping Hawk as a vet presence in the WR room had merit. Unfortunately now his concussed 2016 campaign has him considering retirement.
That said.... I do agree with Osiris that Gabe would not have had the kind of year here that he posted in ATL.
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I don't really remember anyone crying over Gabriel at the time of his release. Think a large majority of people were tired of the Smurfs. Considering how poor his second year was, followed by a poor camp, thought the move was fine.
So he blossomed whilst having a fqb and true #1 across from him. Think the real lesson is to ease up on expectations...Players are deemed all-pro or busts by this fanbase after their first few games, so maybe the way to look at this would be that's players often need time before the light goes on.
Not here tho...Produce from your first game on or you'll be replaced by another guy that'll be given 4 games to prove it.
Well, they released Gabriel and kept every one of their rookie wr draft picks. I thought that was FO arrogance. Coleman produced little, and the rest of the crew virtually nothing. So keep Coleman and DeValve, and get rid of the rest of the crew.
There's a few of us who thought (notably Tour) who felt cutting Gabriel was a mistake.
Well, they released Gabriel and kept every one of their rookie wr draft picks. I thought that was FO arrogance. Coleman produced little, and the rest of the crew virtually nothing. So keep Coleman and DeValve, and get rid of the rest of the crew.
There's a few of us who thought (notably Tour) who felt cutting Gabriel was a mistake.
I was there also...never thought they should have cut gabriel...we did not have a qb that could actually get him the ball in stride...i remember at least 2 or 3 occasions where he ran 50 yd post patterns and was open by 10 yds but had to wait for the ball and then got tackled and we end up with a fg instead of 6....that was when we had hoyer me thinks...again, we have a shitass front ofc. drafting players based on whatever anal itics they are looking at..
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Gabriel averaged 17.3 yards per catch for us in 2014 in Shanny's offense so that definitely made him intriguing for upside. Unfortunately, when Flip's Flop arrived in 2015 - he averaged only 8.8 yards per catch. He also got post traumatic stress in the bubble screen Flip designed with a very skinny Travis Benjamin on the apex as the lead blocker. Those Philly DBs were lighting up our little guys and Phil Simms was talking about what an advantage St Louis enjoyed. Shanny's scheme wouldn't have played into their favor nearly as much. Flip was advised in order for the zbs to work effectively, you can't part time it because certain running plays from specific formations set up the play action perks for the passing game.
Anyway, Gabriel returned to his most favorable scheme under the best OC for him (Shanny). As someone else said, he also had the luxury of an MVP QB like Matt Ryan while Julio Jones commanded so much attention it made life easier on other receivers.
In training camp in Cleveland, Gabriel was learning his 3rd different offense in 3 years so he wasn't about to look as good here as all the stuff that would make him a productive beneficiary in Atlanta. He was a hard working kid so I'm happy for him.
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@boo-fagley said:
Bingo
So many things have to come together to win no matter who the Browns get at QB.
Notably a defense that isn't #31 in the NFL, drafting Garrett will help Collins immensely.
@boo-fagley said:
No, I am not arguing in circles.
Of all the QBs that Belichick has developed Garrapolo looks the best IMO. NE took him in the 2nd round when they did not need a QB in that draft.
The horrid track record of players traded by Belichick is because many of those teams did not a good culture in place. Jamie Collins is not going to thrive if the Browns don't get their act together with a good system and group of players that fit that system.
It's not just culture- the player has to have the talent. Garropolo may have talent- BTW, my feeling is somewhere between the #1 and #2 on that scale I just posted. Not like I can do anything about it. Then again- it would just go back to rehashing things for the tenth time- the basic question- why would Bill be willing to trade him if he thinks he's Brady's heir apparent? He's a cheap insurance policy if Brady should get injured.
You have to admit- there's something weird about the National media's fascination with backup Patriot quarterbacks. Winning Super Bowl teams get all the attention? I suppose it will be nice- in a bad way- of all the speculation leading up to the draft- what will the Browns do?
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Part of Jimmy G's perceived "value" stems from the perception that NE has an enhanced ability to spot QB value in the draft. An article I posted yesterday(?) poked at that perception.
The point of the article's early focus on Bill B. and the Pats' org was that there is no track record of finding QB gems throughout the draft. Cassel is the only, former-Brady backups to lead his "new team" to a winning season after leaving NE... and he did it once. What Bill is good at is churning through QBs in the draft in hopes of finding cheap, serviceable backups that he believes, given time in his system, can win, if needed.
He hit Gold once with Brady. He hit Silver once with Cassell... which he turned into gold via trade. Bronze and Tin? They just fall through the sieve and leave... sometimes after unsuccessful tries to generate trade interest in them.
We are supposed to make something of the fact that Bill spent his highest, QB pick ever on Jimmy G. But if you look at the Pats trend since Cassell they have been fishing in higher-pick waters. And the one time in 17 years they struck Gold, they kept it.
Here's the list of rostered QBs not named Brady during Tom's career and the pick spent upon them, if any:
2016 Jimmy Garoppolo, Jacoby Brisett (R3 #91)
2015 Garoppolo
2014 Garoppolo (R2 #62), Garrett Gilbert
2013 Ryan Mallett, Tim Tebow
2012 Mallett
2011 Brian Hoyer, Mallett (R3 #74)
2010 Hoyer, Jonathan Compton (Zac Robinson R7 #250 was cut)
2009 Hoyer, Andrew Walter
2008 Matt Guitierrez, Kevin O'Connell (R3 #94)
2007 Matt Cassell, Guitierrez
2006 Cassell, Todd Mortensen
2005 Doug Flutie, Cassell (R7, #230)
2004 Rohan Davey (R4 #117), Jim Miller
2003 Damon Huard, Davey, Kliff Kingsbury (R6 #201)
2002 Huard, Davey
2001 Drew Bledsoe, Huard
Pretty much a "Who's Who" of Who Did They Draft?
http://www.patriots.com/team/historical-roster
http://boston.cbslocal.com/2016/05/04/adam-jones-patriots-quarterbacks-drafted-by-bill-belichick/
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Well, they released Gabriel and kept every one of their rookie wr draft picks. I thought that was FO arrogance. Coleman produced little, and the rest of the crew virtually nothing. So keep Coleman and DeValve, and get rid of the rest of the crew.
There's a few of us who thought (notably Tour) who felt cutting Gabriel was a mistake.
Everyone seems to forget that football is a team sport. Unless the Browns got their own version of Matt Ryan and Julio Jones, Gabriel was not going to flourish in Cleveland. Put another way, Gabriel had the season he did with Atlanta because he was with Atlanta. He would not have had that season in Cleveland.
Everyone seems to forget that football is a team sport. Unless the Browns got their own version of Matt Ryan and Julio Jones, Gabriel was not going to flourish in Cleveland. Put another way, Gabriel had the season he did with Atlanta because he was with Atlanta. He would not have had that season in Cleveland.
He had Jones as the #1 and Sanu as the #2.....plus outstanding pass catching RBs Freeman and Coleman. So, yes, Garbriel was going to get little attention from opposing defenses who probably had at best their #4 cornerback covering him.
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@boo-fagley said:
Youre arent used to not being the final word in everything.
Incessant taunting of the bull and you eventually get the horn up the keester.
Actually, in my case I end up with year's supply of steak/prime rib/sirloin etc. etc. in my freezer.
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@boo-fagley said:
Defense wins championships.
Look at Houston this year. The QB situation was a mess and still they gave NE a game in the wildcard.
No, great QBs and defense win Championships.
Other than like the 2000 Ravens, this has always been the case.
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I think the Browns trade their 33 for Garop, nobody is going to give
a first rounder. and the Browns still have their second pick in that round.
That means that the Browns might trade down with the Bears to 3. The Bears
need Trubisky, the Niners might draft a qb or pick Allen...
and the Browns would still get Garrett, assuming he's their guy. So, they draft
Garrett at 3, Howard at 12, a top cb at 3 in the second round, and an
OT with the second pick in the second round.
That would be genius. Then, who knows. maybe Foreman, rb in the third.... or
a fs....
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