Garrett and Hooker. Why not?
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This has Garrett the more athletic of the two based on 40, broad and vertical. 3 cone drill and shuttle will be a good comparison also.
While that article has some truths its also a blowjob piece to young myles. He's not the absolute best prospect to come out in a decade. He does some things the others couldnt but he by no means sheds tackles better than mack did let alone bosa. I know he's not the same type of DE that those two guys were but pls, the ability to shed huge tackles effortlessly is a "premium" in my eyes. I value that over pure edge rush. For my money mack and bosa were the two d to the o to the double g's we missed out on. And both "promptly" exhibited that skill set in the nfl. Bosa made a run tackle by shedding donald penn in his very first game as a pro, penn being arguably a very close 2nd to tyrone smith as the nfl's best left tackle. Both men are gargantuan. And wr know mack was DROY too and was recognized as a top 5 run stopper in the league as a rookie.
Point is garett has deficiencies the browns have to work on if they draft him. Allen is mire plug in right now but mayne doesnt have the same stupid ceiling garett has.
While that article has some truths its also a blowjob piece to young myles.
I don't care about the words they're using, just the numbers they're citing, that's what I was showing you.
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This has Garrett the more athletic of the two based on 40, broad and vertical. 3 cone drill and shuttle will be a good comparison also.
While that article has some truths its also a blowjob piece to young myles. He's not the absolute best prospect to come out in a decade. He does some things the others couldnt but he by no means sheds tackles better than mack did let alone bosa. I know he's not the same type of DE that those two guys were but pls, the ability to shed huge tackles effortlessly is a "premium" in my eyes. I value that over pure edge rush. For my money mack and bosa were the two d to the o to the double g's we missed out on. And both "promptly" exhibited that skill set in the nfl. Bosa made a run tackle by shedding donald penn in his very first game as a pro, penn being arguably a very close 2nd to tyrone smith as the nfl's best left tackle. Both men are gargantuan. And wr know mack was DROY too and was recognized as a top 5 run stopper in the league as a rookie.
Point is garett has deficiencies the browns have to work on if they draft him. Allen is mire plug in right now but mayne doesnt have the same stupid ceiling garett has.
the ability to shed huge tackles effortlessly is a "premium" in my eyes. I value that over pure edge rush.
First it was "clowney is more athletic than garrett" and now you come up with the "Someone's better because I see them as better even though there is no metric" BS?
Keep moving those goalposts.. eventually you'll come up with a point!
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the ability to shed huge tackles effortlessly is a "premium" in my eyes. I value that over pure edge rush.
First it was "clowney is more athletic than garrett" and now you come up with the "Someone's better because I see them as better even though there is no metric" BS?
Keep moving those goalposts.. eventually you'll come up with a point!
1) i dont think i ever said clowney was better or more athletic. I think i said he may do a thing or two better than garett and vive versa, at this stage in their respective careers.First it was "clowney is more athletic than garrett" and now you come up with the "Someone's better because I see them as better even though there is no metric" BS?
Keep moving those goalposts.. eventually you'll come up with a point!
2) so because theres not a shedding offensive lineman metric it shouldnt be discussed? Its not a valuable skill if theres no metric for it? Seriously? Ill hold out thats probably not what u were trying to say. My point about garett having trouble locking out OL is absolutely valid and im not the only one thats noticed it. I read a right up about him from two years ago that gave him a "garbage" rating against the run.
He's decent against the run now but alot of it is because he can pursue or dips underneath blocks. In the NFL they're gonna run right at him if some OC thinks he cant hold up at the edge. This will negate all his finesse stuff.
This is why you study the game for yourself, helps to have played obviously, instead of relying on PFF to tell you how the game is played
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Adding potentially the Next Von Miller and Ed Reed without having to trade up makes sense. Putting the QB on his ass and fucking up where he wants to throw in the pass-happy NFL is a must.
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Adding potentially the Next Von Miller and Ed Reed without having to trade up makes sense. Putting the QB on his ass and fucking up where he wants to throw in the pass-happy NFL is a must.
Adding potentially the Next Von Miller and Ed Reed without having to trade up makes sense. Putting the QB on his ass and fucking up where he wants to throw in the pass-happy NFL is a must.
Or the next Kam Wimbley and Justin Gilbert. Though, I think we already went over this. Browns fan pessimism and all that.
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Adding potentially the Next Von Miller and Ed Reed without having to trade up makes sense. Putting the QB on his ass and fucking up where he wants to throw in the pass-happy NFL is a must.
Or the next Kam Wimbley and Justin Gilbert. Though, I think we already went over this. Browns fan pessimism and all that.
Or the next Kam Wimbley and Justin Gilbert. Though, I think we already went over this.
Repeatedly......
We know we know.....why draft the next Courtney Brown, when we can have the next Ryan Leaf?
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Or the next Kam Wimbley and Justin Gilbert. Though, I think we already went over this.
Repeatedly......
We know we know.....why draft the next Courtney Brown, when we can have the next Ryan Leaf?
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Or the next Kam Wimbley and Justin Gilbert. Though, I think we already went over this.
Repeatedly......
We know we know.....why draft the next Courtney Brown, when we can have the next Ryan Leaf?
Repeatedly......
We know we know.....why draft the next Courtney Brown, when we can have the next Ryan Leaf?
LOL!
How many of these kinds of plays per game for the Browns would you need from MG to consider him a successful draft pick? Question is for all.
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Or the next Kam Wimbley and Justin Gilbert. Though, I think we already went over this.
Repeatedly......
We know we know.....why draft the next Courtney Brown, when we can have the next Ryan Leaf?
Repeatedly......
We know we know.....why draft the next Courtney Brown, when we can have the next Ryan Leaf?
I guess it is just a mentality that Browns fans have unfortuneatly developed after so many years of poor drafting:
Draft 4 QBs in the first round: all busts
Draft 3 DEs in the first round: all busts
Even when they hit on a Joe Thomas, they then take a Cam Erving.
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LOL!
How many of these kinds of plays per game for the Browns would you need from MG to consider him a successful draft pick? Question is for all.
We got all the same highlights from Brown, Mingo, Wimbley.
If and when he does those things in the NFL..perhaps for the Browns.....THEN we can consider him to be a successful draft pick.
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When I look at the criteria the new Browns coaches and FO use,
they would NEVER have drafted the busts.
So, things are really looking up, bigly.
My question is, given a selection criteria including work ethic, love for the game,
character, football IQ...
who would be a more dramatic impact player for the Browns - Garrett...or Jamal Adams?
Not even Garrett can get to a qb before he throws to a wide open TE in 1.5 seconds.
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When I look at the criteria the new Browns coaches and FO use,
they would NEVER have drafted the busts.
So, things are really looking up, bigly.
My question is, given a selection criteria including work ethic, love for the game,
character, football IQ...
who would be a more dramatic impact player for the Browns - Garrett...or Jamal Adams?
Not even Garrett can get to a qb before he throws to a wide open TE in 1.5 seconds.
who would be a more dramatic impact player for the Browns - Garrett...or Jamal Adams?Not even Garrett can get to a qb before he throws to a wide open TE in 1.5 seconds.
A reasonable question...
Personally I think it would be nice if it took 1.5-second passes to beat our pass rush as opposed to the 2.5+ QBs now have.
When you can reliably bring pressure faster, you reduce the opposing QB's route options and shrink the field your DBs must cover.
Front to back and inside out...
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
LOL!
How many of these kinds of plays per game for the Browns would you need from MG to consider him a successful draft pick? Question is for all.
We got all the same highlights from Brown, Mingo, Wimbley.
If and when he does those things in the NFL..perhaps for the Browns.....THEN we can consider him to be a successful draft pick.
We got all the same highlights from Brown, Mingo, Wimbley.
If and when he does those things in the NFL..perhaps for the Browns.....THEN we can consider him to be a successful draft pick.
That wasn't the question. The question was how many of those kinds of plays per game would make you think he was a good pick? Von Miller actually gets to QB's about 2-3 times a game and pressures 2 to 3 x's that number (just my guess). He's currently the best in the game. So what would you want from Garrett to say, "Yeah, great pick!"? What is your criteria?
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We got all the same highlights from Brown, Mingo, Wimbley.
If and when he does those things in the NFL..perhaps for the Browns.....THEN we can consider him to be a successful draft pick.
That wasn't the question. The question was how many of those kinds of plays per game would make you think he was a good pick? Von Miller actually gets to QB's about 2-3 times a game and pressures 2 to 3 x's that number (just my guess). He's currently the best in the game. So what would you want from Garrett to say, "Yeah, great pick!"? What is your criteria?
That wasn't the question. The question was how many of those kinds of plays per game would make you think he was a good pick? Von Miller actually gets to QB's about 2-3 times a game and pressures 2 to 3 x's that number (just my guess). He's currently the best in the game. So what would you want from Garrett to say, "Yeah, great pick!"? What is your criteria?
My criteria is that he prove it in the pros. Nothing he does in college will make me say "great pick". Or are you asking "how many of those kinds of plays that he makes per game in the pros would make you say "great pick". If so....sure, the numbers you give would be fine...if done in the pros.
But nothing he does in college will make me say he is "the best in the game"...if you are talking about the pros. If you are talking about college...it don't mean shit. Nate Orchard had more sacks/pressures while in college. That don't make him a great pass rusher.
No pick can be called a great pick until a couple of years into their pro career.
Cleveland has made great picks in the past: they are called LeBron James and Kyrie Irving...but that's a different sport.
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That wasn't the question. The question was how many of those kinds of plays per game would make you think he was a good pick? Von Miller actually gets to QB's about 2-3 times a game and pressures 2 to 3 x's that number (just my guess). He's currently the best in the game. So what would you want from Garrett to say, "Yeah, great pick!"? What is your criteria?
My criteria is that he prove it in the pros. Nothing he does in college will make me say "great pick". Or are you asking "how many of those kinds of plays that he makes per game in the pros would make you say "great pick". If so....sure, the numbers you give would be fine...if done in the pros.
But nothing he does in college will make me say he is "the best in the game"...if you are talking about the pros. If you are talking about college...it don't mean shit. Nate Orchard had more sacks/pressures while in college. That don't make him a great pass rusher.
No pick can be called a great pick until a couple of years into their pro career.
Cleveland has made great picks in the past: they are called LeBron James and Kyrie Irving...but that's a different sport.
My criteria is that he prove it in the pros. Nothing he does in college will make me say "great pick". Or are you asking "how many of those kinds of plays that he makes per game in the pros would make you say "great pick". If so....sure, the numbers you give would be fine...if done in the pros.
But nothing he does in college will make me say he is "the best in the game"...if you are talking about the pros. If you are talking about college...it don't mean shit. Nate Orchard had more sacks/pressures while in college. That don't make him a great pass rusher.
No pick can be called a great pick until a couple of years into their pro career.
Cleveland has made great picks in the past: they are called LeBron James and Kyrie Irving...but that's a different sport.
He's done with college so the question was strictly for the pros in terms of what makes you say at the end of a year or two, "Great pick". Those college highlights are very similar to Von's which did translate to the pros, so I only placed them there to show what I mean by great plays. I would want the same from him on the pro level very near to Von, though it would be foolish of me to expect it all the first year to match a guy with several years in now that is the best. Clowney is beginning to reach that level after a couple of injury plagued years.
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My criteria is that he prove it in the pros. Nothing he does in college will make me say "great pick". Or are you asking "how many of those kinds of plays that he makes per game in the pros would make you say "great pick". If so....sure, the numbers you give would be fine...if done in the pros.
But nothing he does in college will make me say he is "the best in the game"...if you are talking about the pros. If you are talking about college...it don't mean shit. Nate Orchard had more sacks/pressures while in college. That don't make him a great pass rusher.
No pick can be called a great pick until a couple of years into their pro career.
Cleveland has made great picks in the past: they are called LeBron James and Kyrie Irving...but that's a different sport.
He's done with college so the question was strictly for the pros in terms of what makes you say at the end of a year or two, "Great pick". Those college highlights are very similar to Von's which did translate to the pros, so I only placed them there to show what I mean by great plays. I would want the same from him on the pro level very near to Von, though it would be foolish of me to expect it all the first year to match a guy with several years in now that is the best. Clowney is beginning to reach that level after a couple of injury plagued years.
He's done with college so the question was strictly for the pros in terms of what makes you say at the end of a year or two, "Great pick". Those college highlights are very similar to Von's which did translate to the pros, so I only placed them there to show what I mean by great plays. I would want the same from him on the pro level very near to Von, though it would be foolish of me to expect it all the first year to match a guy with several years in now that is the best. Clowney is beginning to reach that level after a couple of injury plagued years.
Well, weren't you one of them on here telling us how JMZ's college performance was going to translate to the pros? We see how that turned out.
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In my eyes for garett to be a successful pick he also has to be decent against the run. If he's just a pass rushing specialist....meh. Teams just start running all over us so there negates his pass rush
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He's done with college so the question was strictly for the pros in terms of what makes you say at the end of a year or two, "Great pick". Those college highlights are very similar to Von's which did translate to the pros, so I only placed them there to show what I mean by great plays. I would want the same from him on the pro level very near to Von, though it would be foolish of me to expect it all the first year to match a guy with several years in now that is the best. Clowney is beginning to reach that level after a couple of injury plagued years.
Well, weren't you one of them on here telling us how JMZ's college performance was going to translate to the pros? We see how that turned out.
Well, weren't you one of them on here telling us how JMZ's college performance was going to translate to the pros? We see how that turned out.
No one here or elsewhere saw his alcohol problem playing out the way it did. And you already know that Garrett isn't even close to those off-field problems. Apples and oranges.
Manziel showed potential but he self destructed.
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Garrett claims he benches 485lbs., runs a 4.45 40 and has a 40" vertical. If he tests that at the Combine combined with his college production he seems like a solid pick.
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I really don't think Hooker will be there at 12 but they appear to have the potential to go at those picks. The big question is who else in this draft is worth the 1st and 12th pick that everyone would like instead. I really don't see a QB yet that jumps out enough to warrant either of those picks. I would like to upgrade at QB for sure; I am just not sure any of the QBs in this draft are a big enough upgrade to use our 1st or 12th pick on them.
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