Combine
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Here is yet ANOTHER thing that will make me laugh, when somebodies pick does well at the combine, the ones for him will say "see I told you" and the ones against will say "it was just the combine, underwear olympics" and when THEIR guy doesn't do as well, it will be "Well it's just a workout, watch the TAPE or his highlights"
People will use anything for or against THEIR opinion, whether for or against. It ALL matters, and still not a guarantee.
Josh Allen had a good combine, while Rosen didn't. What happened today didn't make either one a better or worse player than what they were before. It may have changed their "stock", but they aren't a better or worse player than they were 24 hours ago.
Very true. The entire body of work still matters more than one single performance. I still thought Rosen threw the most consistent deep balls. He hit 3 beautiful ones in a row, right in stride. Judging from the game film, he throws guys open, where Allen and Mayfield tend to rifle it to open guys. I'll take the former any day. Really wish Darnold would've thrown, just to see him directly next to his peers.
Also- Rosen demonstrated he's highly underrated as an athlete. His 40, vertical, and broad jump were extremely solid.
Very true. The entire body of work still matters more than one single performance. I still thought Rosen threw the most consistent deep balls. He hit 3 beautiful ones in a row, right in stride. Judging from the game film, he throws guys open, where Allen and Mayfield tend to rifle it to open guys. I'll take the former any day. Really wish Darnold would've thrown, just to see him directly next to his peers.
Also- Rosen demonstrated he's highly underrated as an athlete. His 40, vertical, and broad jump were extremely solid.
I didn't really watch the combine, just going off the comments. Still doesn't change the player from yesterdsy
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Very true. The entire body of work still matters more than one single performance. I still thought Rosen threw the most consistent deep balls. He hit 3 beautiful ones in a row, right in stride. Judging from the game film, he throws guys open, where Allen and Mayfield tend to rifle it to open guys. I'll take the former any day. Really wish Darnold would've thrown, just to see him directly next to his peers.
Also- Rosen demonstrated he's highly underrated as an athlete. His 40, vertical, and broad jump were extremely solid.
I didn't really watch the combine, just going off the comments. Still doesn't change the player from yesterdsy
I didn't really watch the combine, just going off the comments. Still doesn't change the player from yesterdsy
If Terrell Davis was seen only for his yesterday - he would have never had the chance to be the HOF player he became. While the combine might not be a tell all per say - it can help a WR like Chark who didn't have an up to snuff QB at LSU.
The combines can show a body catcher vrs a hands catcher.
The combines can also show maybe JJ Watt isn't just limited to a 3-4 defense after all - especially considering Wade Phillips decided to use a 4-3 in 88% of his reps the first 2-3 years he played. Red hair and freckles was supposed to = no fast twitchies before the combines. The vertical, long jump and forty revealed otherwise.
NFL teams have to do their homework which includes includes breaking down film plus whatever fitness tests, medical evals and combine interviews compels them to do.
And in Rosen's case, it was a nice opportunity for him to show teams what he is capable of as well as clarifying some things that might have been taken out of context about him. Using stuff he said at 17 years of age against him when he didn't know if he was better at tennis or football to tell everyone he doesn't like football - needed updating. The only thing I would worry about with him is his concussion volume heading into the NFL.
I welcome the only Defensive Coordinator to earn a Superbowl Ring in New Orleans while understanding Revenge of the Nerds is a sequel. "Come get some!" -
I reached out for a NFL scout's opinion of how the top QBs performed today. Here is how he ranked the Combine workouts: 1) Mayfield "accurate and quick" 2) Allen "some consistency" t-3) Rosen and Jackson "underwhelming" Just one opinion, but interesting nonetheless...
If you can guarantee me Mayfield (or Darnold) will be there at #4, I can live with Barkley at #1.
If you can guarantee me Mayfield (or Darnold) will be there at #4, I can live with Barkley at #1.
That's the problem. There ARE no guarantees in waiting & I say take no chances. IF you really want a particular QB...Get him at #1!!......THAT'S a guarantee!!!!!
There will still be one hell of a player at 4. Think about it...IF we get Allen, Darnold, Mayfield, or Rosen at #1....then left at #4 are the other 3 top QBs , then Barkley, Chubb, Fitzpatrick, McGlinchey & more. That means AT LEAST 2 of those last 4 I mentioned will still be there at #4 & that's if NOBODY takes a QB at #2 or #3. IF a team selects ONE QB at either 2 or 3, we are then GUARANTEED that EITHER Chubb or Barkley are there at #4. That's a lot of quality & I'll take those odds.
Mike
IN DORSEY I TRUST -
Very true. The entire body of work still matters more than one single performance. I still thought Rosen threw the most consistent deep balls. He hit 3 beautiful ones in a row, right in stride. Judging from the game film, he throws guys open, where Allen and Mayfield tend to rifle it to open guys. I'll take the former any day. Really wish Darnold would've thrown, just to see him directly next to his peers.
Also- Rosen demonstrated he's highly underrated as an athlete. His 40, vertical, and broad jump were extremely solid.
I didn't really watch the combine, just going off the comments. Still doesn't change the player from yesterdsy
Still doesn't change the player from yesterday
I agree and listening to the GB GM who said the combine is to get in depth medicals and to validate what they already know on tapes while using the interview process to rule in or out some players. I already know from having watched Kirk for 3 years that he has exactly what you want in a slot receiver-- hands, speed and quickness. The added plus is his numerous punt returns for TDs and very decent KO returns. He's an "in space" kind of player and the Browns really need that kind of player to help the outside WRs be better weapons and assist the QB in getting rid of the ball quickly to someone who can snag it and get the 1st downs. He's a Brady kind of guy type receiver. Combine just reinforced that and he is a quality kid from a quality family and that will show in the interviews. I hope he is there in the 2nd, but after the combine I doubt it. I've read the Eagles have interviewed him and want him @ #32. GMs will figure out what not having a true passer meant for this year's stats for him.
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I didn't really watch the combine, just going off the comments. Still doesn't change the player from yesterdsy
If Terrell Davis was seen only for his yesterday - he would have never had the chance to be the HOF player he became. While the combine might not be a tell all per say - it can help a WR like Chark who didn't have an up to snuff QB at LSU.
The combines can show a body catcher vrs a hands catcher.
The combines can also show maybe JJ Watt isn't just limited to a 3-4 defense after all - especially considering Wade Phillips decided to use a 4-3 in 88% of his reps the first 2-3 years he played. Red hair and freckles was supposed to = no fast twitchies before the combines. The vertical, long jump and forty revealed otherwise.
NFL teams have to do their homework which includes includes breaking down film plus whatever fitness tests, medical evals and combine interviews compels them to do.
And in Rosen's case, it was a nice opportunity for him to show teams what he is capable of as well as clarifying some things that might have been taken out of context about him. Using stuff he said at 17 years of age against him when he didn't know if he was better at tennis or football to tell everyone he doesn't like football - needed updating. The only thing I would worry about with him is his concussion volume heading into the NFL.
If Terrell Davis was seen only for his yesterday - he would have never had the chance to be the HOF player he became. While the combine might not be a tell all per say - it can help a WR like Chark who didn't have an up to snuff QB at LSU.
The combines can show a body catcher vrs a hands catcher.
The combines can also show maybe JJ Watt isn't just limited to a 3-4 defense after all - especially considering Wade Phillips decided to use a 4-3 in 88% of his reps the first 2-3 years he played. Red hair and freckles was supposed to = no fast twitchies before the combines. The vertical, long jump and forty revealed otherwise.
NFL teams have to do their homework which includes includes breaking down film plus whatever fitness tests, medical evals and combine interviews compels them to do.
And in Rosen's case, it was a nice opportunity for him to show teams what he is capable of as well as clarifying some things that might have been taken out of context about him. Using stuff he said at 17 years of age against him when he didn't know if he was better at tennis or football to tell everyone he doesn't like football - needed updating. The only thing I would worry about with him is his concussion volume heading into the NFL.
I think you missed the point. I didn't say it doesn't help or hurt, but it's just a part of it. I Even said it may change a players stock. It's just funny how if someone is for/against someone, they will either elevate the combine or dismiss it all together. Just so they can continue the "I'm right" thing
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Here is yet ANOTHER thing that will make me laugh, when somebodies pick does well at the combine, the ones for him will say "see I told you" and the ones against will say "it was just the combine, underwear olympics" and when THEIR guy doesn't do as well, it will be "Well it's just a workout, watch the TAPE or his highlights"
People will use anything for or against THEIR opinion, whether for or against. It ALL matters, and still not a guarantee.
Josh Allen had a good combine, while Rosen didn't. What happened today didn't make either one a better or worse player than what they were before. It may have changed their "stock", but they aren't a better or worse player than they were 24 hours ago.
Here is yet ANOTHER thing that will make me laugh, when somebodies pick does well at the combine, the ones for him will say "see I told you" and the ones against will say "it was just the combine, underwear olympics" and when THEIR guy doesn't do as well, it will be "Well it's just a workout, watch the TAPE or his highlights"
People will use anything for or against THEIR opinion, whether for or against. It ALL matters, and still not a guarantee.
Josh Allen had a good combine, while Rosen didn't. What happened today didn't make either one a better or worse player than what they were before. It may have changed their "stock", but they aren't a better or worse player than they were 24 hours ago.
The only player in my mind who saw his stock drop like a rock at the combine was Orlando Brown. Just terrible at everything. If that 40 and 10 yard split mean anything, he'll get eaten alive by speed edge rushers at the next level.
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If Terrell Davis was seen only for his yesterday - he would have never had the chance to be the HOF player he became. While the combine might not be a tell all per say - it can help a WR like Chark who didn't have an up to snuff QB at LSU.
The combines can show a body catcher vrs a hands catcher.
The combines can also show maybe JJ Watt isn't just limited to a 3-4 defense after all - especially considering Wade Phillips decided to use a 4-3 in 88% of his reps the first 2-3 years he played. Red hair and freckles was supposed to = no fast twitchies before the combines. The vertical, long jump and forty revealed otherwise.
NFL teams have to do their homework which includes includes breaking down film plus whatever fitness tests, medical evals and combine interviews compels them to do.
And in Rosen's case, it was a nice opportunity for him to show teams what he is capable of as well as clarifying some things that might have been taken out of context about him. Using stuff he said at 17 years of age against him when he didn't know if he was better at tennis or football to tell everyone he doesn't like football - needed updating. The only thing I would worry about with him is his concussion volume heading into the NFL.
I think you missed the point. I didn't say it doesn't help or hurt, but it's just a part of it. I Even said it may change a players stock. It's just funny how if someone is for/against someone, they will either elevate the combine or dismiss it all together. Just so they can continue the "I'm right" thing
It's just funny how if someone is for/against someone, they will either elevate the combine or dismiss it all together. Just so they can continue the "I'm right" thing
Funny? Maybe, but it does happen a lot in a forum that encourages opinions from passionate fans. Nature of the beast. If you think this is bad - look at politics. One side is always right while the other is only using fake news. Try reasoning with that. We're not quite there with the combines yet so it's still fun.
FWIW, I went into the combines thinking I wasn't impressed with Rosen. The combines opened my eyes to the reality maybe I didn't have all the facts about him. Today, I was impressed with him. The only worry I have about him is the 2 concussions he had. I went into the combines thinking RB is deep and we needed to draft a QB first. BUT there's a bigger picture telling me why should I root for us to kick the BPA off our door step that fate is handing us? The reason I can ask such a thing after the combines is because 1) how much of a difference is there between the top 3 QBs?; 2) Don't we have the most $ to spend on a veteran FA QB to the extent we don't have to race a rookie QB out there before he's ready?; 3) Isn't it conceivable that there will still be an elite QB prospect on our doorstep at #4 overall if the first QB isn't drafted until #2 or #3?; 4) Does a deep draft at RB really offer another RB that is tailor made to play all 3 downs like Barkley? Before the combines I got a kick out of Poe - today I see what he's sayin, why he's sayin it and how he's sayin it. All I gotta do is take inventory of scoring threats to see that Josh Gordon hasn't been one since 2013...
While I can definitely be a stubborn old school goof ball with my opinions - a big reason I enjoy this message board is because of the differences of opinion that are educated and passionate enough to change my mind at times. Second opinions can be very underrated my man.
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Here is yet ANOTHER thing that will make me laugh, when somebodies pick does well at the combine, the ones for him will say "see I told you" and the ones against will say "it was just the combine, underwear olympics" and when THEIR guy doesn't do as well, it will be "Well it's just a workout, watch the TAPE or his highlights"
People will use anything for or against THEIR opinion, whether for or against. It ALL matters, and still not a guarantee.
Josh Allen had a good combine, while Rosen didn't. What happened today didn't make either one a better or worse player than what they were before. It may have changed their "stock", but they aren't a better or worse player than they were 24 hours ago.
The only player in my mind who saw his stock drop like a rock at the combine was Orlando Brown. Just terrible at everything. If that 40 and 10 yard split mean anything, he'll get eaten alive by speed edge rushers at the next level.
The only player in my mind who saw his stock drop like a rock at the combine was Orlando Brown. Just terrible at everything. If that 40 and 10 yard split mean anything, he'll get eaten alive by speed edge rushers at the next level.
He will be another Cam Erving grabbing at people as they go by and not having the arm strength to stone them upright if they bull rush him. Pancake city..
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Orlando showed himself to NOT be an OT in the NFL. But get him in shape, and he could develop
into a good OG. Maybe.
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The TE from Penn St is badass.
If there's a school that knows tight ends, it would be Penn State.
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If there's a school that knows tight ends, it would be Penn State.
Holy sh-it haha.
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If there's a school that knows tight ends, it would be Penn State.
Holy sh-it haha.
Holy sh-it haha.
I'll be here all week, make sure to tip your waitress and bartender!
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If there's a school that knows tight ends, it would be Penn State.
Yeah, evidently Sandusky didn't just teach his Linebackers how to fill the hole. Now karma has him in a real life version of the Longest Yard learning how to get the hole plugged from prisoners that like to gang tackle...
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My 2nd favorite player in this draft just ran a 4.66. Not bad for a 270lb edge player.
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If you can guarantee me Mayfield (or Darnold) will be there at #4, I can live with Barkley at #1.
That's the problem. There ARE no guarantees in waiting & I say take no chances. IF you really want a particular QB...Get him at #1!!......THAT'S a guarantee!!!!!
There will still be one hell of a player at 4. Think about it...IF we get Allen, Darnold, Mayfield, or Rosen at #1....then left at #4 are the other 3 top QBs , then Barkley, Chubb, Fitzpatrick, McGlinchey & more. That means AT LEAST 2 of those last 4 I mentioned will still be there at #4 & that's if NOBODY takes a QB at #2 or #3. IF a team selects ONE QB at either 2 or 3, we are then GUARANTEED that EITHER Chubb or Barkley are there at #4. That's a lot of quality & I'll take those odds.
Mike
That's the problem. There ARE no guarantees in waiting & I say take no chances. IF you really want a particular QB...Get him at #1!!......THAT'S a guarantee!!!!!
There will still be one hell of a player at 4. Think about it...IF we get Allen, Darnold, Mayfield, or Rosen at #1....then left at #4 are the other 3 top QBs , then Barkley, Chubb, Fitzpatrick, McGlinchey & more. That means AT LEAST 2 of those last 4 I mentioned will still be there at #4 & that's if NOBODY takes a QB at #2 or #3. IF a team selects ONE QB at either 2 or 3, we are then GUARANTEED that EITHER Chubb or Barkley are there at #4. That's a lot of quality & I'll take those odds.
Mike
That's an interesting pov Mike. You did a great job explaining where you are coming from. I like our options here so I'm going to give you a devil's advocate that has some partial agreement with what your saying about the process of elimination of QBs somewhat.
We just drafted a DE #1 overall in place of a QB just 1 year after we drafted Ogbah #32 overall (1st pick of rd 2 after NE lost a pick in rd 1) who was drastically improved especially against the run in 2017 with PFF ranking him #1 in that category while he also led us in sacks at the time. While Nassib is still in question - he was also the 1st pick of rd 3 so we've given the edge rush a lot of attention IMO. Sooner or later we have to start accepting some of these scoring weapons that are showing up on our doorstep. Not just QBs but a RB like Zeke Elliott who was helped Dak Prescott become a Rookie of the Year when he played every game vrs what Prescott looked like in the absence of Zeke for a stretch in 2017. Or, what about what Marshall Faulk did for Kurt Warner in his first year starting for the Rams? Burying the blitz with his breakaway speed and ideal hands is a very similar element Barkley offers a veteran FA QB or rookie QB. Faulk had 1000 yards receiving to match his 1000+ yards rushing. Faulk filled 2 roles many teams are now looking to 2 different RBs for now. That's a perk that frees us up to only use 1 pick on a RB so we can address our massive needs at WR and DB as early as round 2 and as well as free agency.
I know we're just fans and stuff but a lot of scouts and draft experts/analysts seem to think the top 3-4 QBs are all so close in talent this isn't a year where only 1 QB offers us THE solution. Sticking with that thought, if took Barkley 1st (who has less perceived question marks than all 4 of the top QBs) we're going to get one of the best 3 QBs. This doesn't look like there's a consensus Andrew Luck emerging so along the lines of what you are saying - we may still get our pick of the litter QB at #4 but this is a year where our 1B QB or even 1C may be just as good as good as our 1st rated QB. If we get our FA QB of choice whether it's McCarron or even Bradford who went a long time since he last injured his leg (with a shoulder injury) - it gives us latitude here IMO. I keep hearing Rosen is the most ready to start right away from intelligence to mechanics. In that draft we traded out of #2 - the QB that had the best rookie year wasn't 1 of the first 2 QBs drafted just like the year we drafted Manziel in round 1 - didn't Jimmy G and Derek Carr get drafted in round 2? I'm not even talking waiting as long as those teams did in 2014 and 2016. I'm talking about only 2 picks between Barkley and #4 overall.
Tampa Bay is dying for a pass rush here on all the radio discussions so I wouldn't be surprised to see them trade up for Chubb at all. If the run hasn't started on QB at #1 overall - who knows what position someone will be trying to trade up for at #2 especially if someone gets wind of an interest in the top DE. They could wait until #3 if the Giants decided to take one of the QBs where the Colts rumored to need a DE badly as well can weigh the option of trade out or take Chubb. Very unpredictable in what will happen if we delay the run on QBs at #1 overall...
We're going to get some REALLY good football players regardless of what direction they go.
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Harrison Phillips. I told you guys he's a beast. 42 reps on bench.
Dj got it right with best of DL..Daron Payne-6'2" 311 4.95-40//Bench-27...H.Phillips-6'4" 307 5.21-40//bench-42...I was thrilled for BJ Hill, who I got a hand shake from at NC state spring game..Dude is a monster..BJ Hill- 6'4" 311 4.99-40//Bench-35....All did great on drills also
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