Jonathan Paul Manziel
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My name is Bill and I spent a year in hell for you watching a lot of people die. You should try to find out a little more about your new fan base instead of just mouthing off with uncalled for expletives concerning my supposed character, I have shown no disrespect for anyone on this board including yourself and I have spent a lot of time trying to learn what it means to be a real Browns fan. If you knew me you would be embarrassed to use terms like bitch and assmunch unless you had an extra beer in your hand and a smile on your face.
Bill,
I am an old (67) lifelong Browns Fan who has seen years ranging from great to extremely horrible, yet stuck with 'em through it all as have many on this board. It appears we just got kicked in the teeth again by a very stupid WR who was looking to become a superstar. Who knows what will come of that, but we DO know that one player will not win for us...it takes a TEAM (and yes, I am a HUGE JM Fan) to win & maintain excellence. We are Browns Fans rooting for the BROWNS. We've seen folks come & go that root for ONE player or a single good season. True Browns Fans have created a community here. We welcome new Browns Fans who are more than just Johnny Fans. If you guys can buy into & support the Browns TEAM, then welcome aboard. I consider myself somewhat of a newcomer to this board compared to many, but I like to think I've respected the more senior members & earned their respect as well.
We have amassed a good deal of talent, have an Owner who wants to win, & a FO & Coaching Staff that have been impressive thus far.
BTW, thanks for your service from this old 'Nam Vet (4th Infantry 1/1966-5/1967).
Mike
Bill,
I am an old (67) lifelong Browns Fan who has seen years ranging from great to extremely horrible, yet stuck with 'em through it all as have many on this board. It appears we just got kicked in the teeth again by a very stupid WR who was looking to become a superstar. Who knows what will come of that, but we DO know that one player will not win for us...it takes a TEAM (and yes, I am a HUGE JM Fan) to win & maintain excellence. We are Browns Fans rooting for the BROWNS. We've seen folks come & go that root for ONE player or a single good season. True Browns Fans have created a community here. We welcome new Browns Fans who are more than just Johnny Fans. If you guys can buy into & support the Browns TEAM, then welcome aboard. I consider myself somewhat of a newcomer to this board compared to many, but I like to think I've respected the more senior members & earned their respect as well.
We have amassed a good deal of talent, have an Owner who wants to win, & a FO & Coaching Staff that have been impressive thus far.
BTW, thanks for your service from this old 'Nam Vet (4th Infantry 1/1966-5/1967).
Mike
Thanks, Mike ... and Bill, I will take out my smart ass remarks to you, in honor of your service. I may have had a few too many of those beers last night. But I'm not backing down to that other assmunch. (see what I did there ... just a joke) ... some people don't know how to make an entrance. He came in all high and mighty, and we tested him .. and he failed.
No problem with you, you were just being friendly, I saw Texas and took a drunken swing.
So let's quit talking about us and talk about Johnny Manziel.
I think everyone knows he can play, the biggest concerns would be those play making efforts resulting in turnovers in the NFL where every defender is bigger, faster, smarter than what he saw on a weekly basis in college ... and the fact that he may not play 16 game seasons from getting his bell wrung.
I, for one, don't need to be sold on his passing skills or personality. And I think Shanny will do a good job with him.
Zombo
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Other than injury, the biggest concern I have with Manziel is him trying to do too much and/or getting too greedy. He has the skillset, I think he has the football intelligence....and most of last year showed patience. Too much patience at times IMO. Like he was determined to be a pocket passer. (Which I think he WAS trying to improve on, but at times last season he turned down an easy 10 yard run and slide or jump out of bounds for a chance at a big pass play. )
And, I suspect part of the time, it was "dammit, I'm going to throw it to X, no matter what". Not that he can't or won't do progressions, but I feel like there were a few times he didn't (not many). I don't know if it was ego "I'm going to burn this DB", perceived matchups, or just "I'm gonna get Mike the ball" (first part of the Duke game, for example - since I believe they both knew it was probably their last game together).
I have no doubt he'll be able to run, I hope he learns the QB slide or to Franco Harris it out of bounds for his durability sake. If he doesn't lock onto a certain receiver, for whatever reason, and goes for more singles than home runs, his passing should be fine.
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we don't talk enough about the oline rookie. Bitonio is a beast...
a powerful, mean playing, quick on his feet, very intelligent beast. Great pick.
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Zombo-my apologies. I'm afraid this is just always a bad time of the year for me made worse by leaving this coming Wed. to see an old Vietnam Vet friend in Atlanta who stroked out and can no longer speak other than yes or no and is wheelchair bound due to paralysis of his whole right side. He now resides in an assisted living center. Guess maybe I'm the one who is a little too touchy at the moment. This will be the first time I see him since the stoke and there is no guarantee he will even remember who I am. I'll take you up on the beer and a smile whenever I finally make it to a game there.
And thanks Mike for bringing back to my senses. I know you've had to have been in this kind of place. Some days you eat the bear and some days he just eats you.
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No need to bookmark, I don't think any of us will forget the 143rd Texas A&M fan to join the site and tell us how great our quarterback is going to be.
Well we need to come over and tell you. You have no idea what its like having a good football player for once. Your clueless to good football period. In fact im not sure you know the game of football. So glad to come over and help out.
No need to bookmark, I don't think any of us will forget the 143rd Texas A&M fan to join the site and tell us how great our quarterback is going to be.
Well we need to come over and tell you. You have no idea what its like having a good football player for once. Your clueless to good football period. In fact im not sure you know the game of football. So glad to come over and help out.
A good\great college player? I already listed the recent Heisman mega-bust quarterbacks, so I'm going to be too lazy to re-type it. If you'd like some embarrassment, I can dig it up. BTW, Vince Young stopped in Berea for a cup of coffee. Um yes we happen to have a damn good idea of what we're getting in Johnny Football.
@everlastingxxx said:
Why do you have to shit on everyone? We get it, your life sucks. Miserable people make others miserable. People are actually exiting about a player and you fucking hate that. My god, i have to stop posting here, i am not going to like the Browns being around these whiny crabby bitches. I like the Browns, i am learning about the team. I want to know about the team. I am reading every article and watching every video i can. I watch everything related to the Browns. I watched the Browns entire 2013 season in a few days. So again, go fuck yourself.
Sorry if your welcome hasn't been as nice as I'd prefer from some quarters. Some of us don't get easily excited anymore about "the next great thing". & Sorry if it bugs some of our members when you come in here and expect Johnny is going to do THIS: Part the waters and lead us to the Promised Super Bowl.
Here's the difference. You guys want to learn more about the Browns? Great. Sure, none of us here have seen every Manziel play like some of you A&M fans have- but that doesn't make us dumbasses about college football in general. Most of us have seen enough of Johnny Football- and his off field antics- to form some pretty strong opinions about him. That doesn't mean they cant change. BTW, I've seen every Browns game in totality since at least 1999, and probably way farther back than that- but my memory is going shot on me in my old age.
TyperWoods said:
They'll need at least that many press passes for the ESPN and media circus.
Zombo-my apologies. I'm afraid this is just always a bad time of the year for me made worse by leaving this coming Wed. to see an old Vietnam Vet friend in Atlanta who stroked out and can no longer speak other than yes or no and is wheelchair bound due to paralysis of his whole right side. He now resides in an assisted living center. Guess maybe I'm the one who is a little too touchy at the moment. This will be the first time I see him since the stoke and there is no guarantee he will even remember who I am. I'll take you up on the beer and a smile whenever I finally make it to a game there.
And thanks Mike for bringing back to my senses. I know you've had to have been in this kind of place. Some days you eat the bear and some days he just eats you.
Zombo will take you up on more than a few beers- trust me. Sorry to hear about your friend- and believe me, thanks for your service.
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Its too bad you guys dont talk football as much as you talk about how much better you are than Manziel fans.
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I'm a fan of the team. Not of a player. If he leaves, I wouldn't care about him or what he did. As long as he is a Brown, I will support him.
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No need to bookmark, I don't think any of us will forget the 143rd Texas A&M fan to join the site and tell us how great our quarterback is going to be.
Well we need to come over and tell you. You have no idea what its like having a good football player for once. Your clueless to good football period. In fact im not sure you know the game of football. So glad to come over and help out.
No need to bookmark, I don't think any of us will forget the 143rd Texas A&M fan to join the site and tell us how great our quarterback is going to be.
Well we need to come over and tell you. You have no idea what its like having a good football player for once. Your clueless to good football period. In fact im not sure you know the game of football. So glad to come over and help out.
Stupidest thing I have ever heard. Some of us watched Jim Brown play....and many other Hall of Famers.
And we have seen the likes of Braxton Miller play college ball. He was just as dynamic as JFF but without the hype.
I am happy that JFF is here....but lets not have to many DATs in here showing ignorance.
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Where is the rule that says that the face of the team has to play for the team? Paul Brown is dead, Jim Brown is like 72 years old.
The team bears their name.
The name of this forum is "The Browns Board", not the Manziel Board, the Hoyer Board, the Thomas Board the Haden Board.
They are the face of the team. Deal with it.
And yet, the team is named after neither of them.
Sheldon Brown also played for the Browns, I guess he's the face of the franchise. Morocco Brown is the VP of Player Personnel, I guess he's the face of the franchise too. There's a cartoon character named Cleveland Brown. I guess he's the face of the franchise too, since the team bears their names.
It's funny that the "faces of the franchise" have nothing to do with the franchise whatsoever anymore.
Jim Brown and Paul Brown are the faces of the franchise to fogeys who remember watching them, that's it.
And yet, the team is named after neither of them.
Actually, yes. The team is named after Paul Brown. Where the fuck have you been all these years? Yes, there is some controversy about it actually being name after Joe Louis....The "Brown" Bomber.....but if the league were to acknowledge that that is the basis of the name, then it would be acknowledging that the Browns are simply name the Cleveland Negroes in disguise.....and they don't want that. Paul Brown acquiesced to the team being named the Browns after him....he just didn't want to be so vain as to acknowledge it....ergo the Joe Louis story.
Sheldon Brown also played for the Browns, I guess he's the face of the franchise. Morocco Brown is the VP of Player Personnel, I guess he's the face of the franchise too. There's a cartoon character named Cleveland Brown. I guess he's the face of the franchise too, since the team bears their names.
It's funny that the "faces of the franchise" have nothing to do with the franchise whatsoever anymore.
Jim Brown and Paul Brown are the faces of the franchise to fogeys who remember watching them, that's it.
Actually, Jim Brown is now re-employed by the Browns if I am not mistaken. Why would they give a 74 year old guy a job? Because he is still the face of the franchise, that's why.
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Where is the rule that says that the face of the team has to play for the team? Paul Brown is dead, Jim Brown is like 72 years old.
The team bears their name.
The name of this forum is "The Browns Board", not the Manziel Board, the Hoyer Board, the Thomas Board the Haden Board.
They are the face of the team. Deal with it.
Riiiigggghhhhtttt. A dead guy and a 75 year old geezer are the face of the team and that symbolizes everything wrong with the Cleveland Browns
Riiiigggghhhhtttt. A dead guy and a 75 year old geezer are the face of the team and that symbolizes everything wrong with the Cleveland Browns
Sad but true. I can't help but think this when I'm at games and the play "greatest moments" of Browns and 99% of them are either from the 80's Kosar plays or then old B&W film of Jim Brown running it out. Would be nice to see something to remember from the current century. Here's to hoping that starts this year, and Manziel leads the way...
Zombo said:
We agree on the face.
Weedenesque.
Z
Hating the souless gingers! Lol.
OK.....you don't have to get personal....I watched and saw them both, but I agree, that has nothing to do with today. Our last championship was 50 fucking years ago. You have to be a old man like me to have any real recall of the event. Fuck Paul Brown and Jim Brown.
Let's GO Johnny Football. Fuck the last 50 years of Browns Football.
Point well-made, ballpeen. Here is an attitude that defies those (like WW) who say this site is nothing but "old men who just want to hate" and are behind the times of today's NFL. Just stupid.
-"Can't we all just get along?" Go Browns!
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Jim Brown and Paul Brown are the faces of the franchise to fogeys who remember watching them, that's it.
OK.....you don't have to get personal....I watched and saw them both, but I agree, that has nothing to do with today. Our last championship was 50 fucking years ago. You have to be a old man like me to have any real recall of the event. Fuck Paul Brown and Jim Brown.
Let's GO Johnny Football. Fuck the last 50 years of Browns Football.
OK.....you don't have to get personal....I watched and saw them both, but I agree, that has nothing to do with today. Our last championship was 50 fucking years ago. You have to be a old man like me to have any real recall of the event. Fuck Paul Brown and Jim Brown.
I am not sure you want to go that far.
Let's GO Johnny Football. Fuck the last 50 years of Browns Football.
But, yes, let's be excited about the possibilities for the future....
(but for what its worth, I think any future success we have will be as much due to the team building an outstanding defense as much as to having a good QB. The guy that JFF somewhat reminds me of is Archie Manning....who was a very good QB.....but the rest of those Saints sucked so bad that no matter how good Archie was, he couldn't win the game for them. I don't want that happening here.).
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OK.....you don't have to get personal....I watched and saw them both, but I agree, that has nothing to do with today. Our last championship was 50 fucking years ago. You have to be a old man like me to have any real recall of the event. Fuck Paul Brown and Jim Brown.
I am not sure you want to go that far.
Let's GO Johnny Football. Fuck the last 50 years of Browns Football.
But, yes, let's be excited about the possibilities for the future....
(but for what its worth, I think any future success we have will be as much due to the team building an outstanding defense as much as to having a good QB. The guy that JFF somewhat reminds me of is Archie Manning....who was a very good QB.....but the rest of those Saints sucked so bad that no matter how good Archie was, he couldn't win the game for them. I don't want that happening here.).
OK.....you don't have to get personal....I watched and saw them both, but I agree, that has nothing to do with today. Our last championship was 50 fucking years ago. You have to be a old man like me to have any real recall of the event. Fuck Paul Brown and Jim Brown.
I am not sure you want to go that far.
Let's GO Johnny Football. Fuck the last 50 years of Browns Football.
But, yes, let's be excited about the possibilities for the future....
(but for what its worth, I think any future success we have will be as much due to the team building an outstanding defense as much as to having a good QB. The guy that JFF somewhat reminds me of is Archie Manning....who was a very good QB.....but the rest of those Saints sucked so bad that no matter how good Archie was, he couldn't win the game for them. I don't want that happening here.).
I took it as he was going extreme to make a point. Yes yes we all know the Browns are some of the best that ever was, but damnit let's see some good football TODAY.
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Where is the rule that says that the face of the team has to play for the team? Paul Brown is dead, Jim Brown is like 72 years old.
The team bears their name.
The name of this forum is "The Browns Board", not the Manziel Board, the Hoyer Board, the Thomas Board the Haden Board.
They are the face of the team. Deal with it.
Riiiigggghhhhtttt. A dead guy and a 75 year old geezer are the face of the team and that symbolizes everything wrong with the Cleveland Browns
Riiiigggghhhhtttt. A dead guy and a 75 year old geezer are the face of the team and that symbolizes everything wrong with the Cleveland Browns
No, those aren't the guys that symbolize what is wrong with the Browns. What kind of dumbassery is that?
It is the Randy Lerners/Mike Lombardi's/Romeo Crennels that symbolize what is wrong with the Browns.
And FYI, even if the Browns were to win titles in the future, that would not mean that PB and JB would be forgotten. The Packers won titles with Brett Favre and Aaron Rodgers....but I doubt that anyone forgets Vince Lombardi, Bart Starr et al.
I am more than happy to have our Brett Favre and Aaron Rodgers if we can....but we won't forget the pioneers.
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Thats funny stuff. I came on here with good intentions. But then i get talked down to and then im the ahole? You dont like what i said? Then dont talk down to me.
Thats funny stuff. I came on here with good intentions. But then i get talked down to and then im the ahole? You dont like what i said? Then dont talk down to me.
Don't be stupid and you won't be talked down to. I can only assume that some of the stuff you have said has been tongue in cheek.
If not, then you deserved to be talked down to.
We don't suffer fools or ignoramusses. But we will all enjoy a little humor...even at our own expense.
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OK.....you don't have to get personal....I watched and saw them both, but I agree, that has nothing to do with today. Our last championship was 50 fucking years ago. You have to be a old man like me to have any real recall of the event. Fuck Paul Brown and Jim Brown.
I am not sure you want to go that far.
Let's GO Johnny Football. Fuck the last 50 years of Browns Football.
But, yes, let's be excited about the possibilities for the future....
(but for what its worth, I think any future success we have will be as much due to the team building an outstanding defense as much as to having a good QB. The guy that JFF somewhat reminds me of is Archie Manning....who was a very good QB.....but the rest of those Saints sucked so bad that no matter how good Archie was, he couldn't win the game for them. I don't want that happening here.).
I took it as he was going extreme to make a point. Yes yes we all know the Browns are some of the best that ever was, but damnit let's see some good football TODAY.
I took it as he was going extreme to make a point. Yes yes we all know the Browns are some of the best that ever was, but damnit let's see some good football TODAY.
Sure, of course. You know, Green Bay finally caught up with Cleveland a couple of years ago and finally matched up for the most pro football championships for a city/region......I would like to see us reclaim that top spot by ourselves.
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I took it as he was going extreme to make a point. Yes yes we all know the Browns are some of the best that ever was, but damnit let's see some good football TODAY.
Sure, of course. You know, Green Bay finally caught up with Cleveland a couple of years ago and finally matched up for the most pro football championships for a city/region......I would like to see us reclaim that top spot by ourselves.
Sure, of course. You know, Green Bay finally caught up with Cleveland a couple of years ago and finally matched up for the most pro football championships for a city/region......I would like to see us reclaim that top spot by ourselves.
As would I. 50 years is a long time.
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Its too bad you guys dont talk football as much as you talk about how much better you are than Manziel fans.
TyperWoods said:
Its too bad you guys dont talk football as much as you talk about how much better you are than Manziel fans.
If you want to talk football, we can talk football. It's a two way street. Sure, some A&M fans follow the NFL too- but I doubt they've followed the Browns as extensively as most of us here have. Let's just say the average Browns fan is as knowledgeable- perhaps moreso, about the Browns as A&M fans are about Manziel, OK? Better is a bad choice of words.
What irks us (and it's the reason WW got a timeout) is the extreme JF fans who can't stand any legitimate criticism or questioning of his talents, how they translate to the NFL, and go blasting other posters on top of it. If fired upon, some of us will return fire.
The point has already been made if Manziel had no flaws in his game, he would have been the consensus #1 overall pick, and certainly wouldn't have fallen out of the top 3.
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Mods could create a JM section of this forum. It might end up only marginally more confrontational than the Politics section.
Actual I think things have simmered down considerably since the WW time-out. The remaining JM fans either were not as obnoxious to begin with or have backed off a notch or two.
Disagree... actually by definition it's the publicity department (or Public Relations). Celebrity does not equal face of the franchise.
Now there's a comforting thought...
It would be the marketing department, not really public relations. PR is just a branch under marketing.
I'm a public relations executive for a digital marketing firm and I can tell you firsthand that the public relations department has exactly zero control.
Our job is all about spin and numbers.
We can decide who we want to push to be the face, sure. But that doesn't make him the face.
We could push Justin Gilbert all year, plaster his face all over ever bit of marketing materials we have, plug him in at every event and mention him in passing in every press release and pitch. But if the fans don't embrace it and the media doesn't cover him, it's all for naught.
It's brand recognition. You ask 1,000 people, in a fair distribution all over the country, the first person they think of when they hear "Cleveland Browns".
It won't be unanimous by any means, but I'm willing to bet that there will be a higher percentage (especially in the male 18-24, 25-31 and female 18-24 demographics) of people that say Manziel.
We can't control who ESPN chooses to cover, we can only push the ones we want to be covered. At the end of the day, they're about ratings and more people care about the Heisman trophy winning QB party boy who slid to #22 than they do some random CB.
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Our job is all about spin and numbers. We can decide who we want to push to be the face, sure. But that doesn't make him the face.
Agree... my original and only point was that it is premature. To push Manziel at this point when he is not even assured of being a starter, let alone a bona fide NFL "star", is ludicrous.
Well we need to come over and tell you. You have no idea what its like having a good football player for once. Your clueless to good football period. In fact im not sure you know the game of football. So glad to come over and help out.
Thank you, Capt. Humble...
And yet, the team is named after neither of them.
Knew that was coming...
FYI to our newbies... "Browns" is short for "Brown Bombers" which was the nickname of boxing great, Joe Lewis.
@everlastingxxx said:
Sucks because this is a Manziel thread and it gets shit on by the haters and insecure posters.
lol... have you read any other thread? It's not like folks automatically fall in line on any other topic.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Other than injury, the biggest concern I have with Manziel is him trying to do too much and/or getting too greedy. He has the skillset, I think he has the football intelligence....and most of last year showed patience. Too much patience at times IMO. Like he was determined to be a pocket passer. (Which I think he WAS trying to improve on, but at times last season he turned down an easy 10 yard run and slide or jump out of bounds for a chance at a big pass play. )
And, I suspect part of the time, it was "dammit, I'm going to throw it to X, no matter what". Not that he can't or won't do progressions, but I feel like there were a few times he didn't (not many). I don't know if it was ego "I'm going to burn this DB", perceived matchups, or just "I'm gonna get Mike the ball" (first part of the Duke game, for example - since I believe they both knew it was probably their last game together).
I have no doubt he'll be able to run, I hope he learns the QB slide or to Franco Harris it out of bounds for his durability sake. If he doesn't lock onto a certain receiver, for whatever reason, and goes for more singles than home runs, his passing should be fine.
TyperWoods said:
Other than injury, the biggest concern I have with Manziel is him trying to do too much and/or getting too greedy. He has the skillset, I think he has the football intelligence....and most of last year showed patience. Too much patience at times IMO. Like he was determined to be a pocket passer. (Which I think he WAS trying to improve on, but at times last season he turned down an easy 10 yard run and slide or jump out of bounds for a chance at a big pass play. )
And, I suspect part of the time, it was "dammit, I'm going to throw it to X, no matter what". Not that he can't or won't do progressions, but I feel like there were a few times he didn't (not many). I don't know if it was ego "I'm going to burn this DB", perceived matchups, or just "I'm gonna get Mike the ball" (first part of the Duke game, for example - since I believe they both knew it was probably their last game together).
I have no doubt he'll be able to run, I hope he learns the QB slide or to Franco Harris it out of bounds for his durability sake. If he doesn't lock onto a certain receiver, for whatever reason, and goes for more singles than home runs, his passing should be fine.
Good post... objective and analytical... combination of highest hopes and greatest fears. I could have written most of it. Seriously it's about as close as you being the half-full glass and me the half-empty.
Were I to summarize your post from my perspective, I'd simply write (as I have in past posts) that in the short-term...
JM's combination of fierce competitiveness and inexperience will lead to moments of exultation followed by bad decisions (many of which you have detailed) that will hurt the team, if not himself.
I other words... he's a rookie QB.
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