First, Second or Third round DTs?

SdBacker80

https://thedraftnetwork.com/articles/wyatt-hubert-2021-nfl-draft-prospect-interview

^^^wrestling mention with DL

Regarding the prospect Maybe a 3rd day flyer...he looks like he would be a great special teams player early on.

Tour2ma

@sdbacker80 said:

I love DL with wrestling backgrounds.

Lockstep with you on this...

My all-time fav Browns DT? Jerry Sherk... I've often posted that but for his knee injury(ies) back in the time of stone-knives and bearskins orthopedics, IMO, he'd be in the HOF.

As for the rest... all just opinion. You give yours... I give mine. It's the stuff of forums. That said...

I can't tell you how many articles I've read that the bench press is the least useful measurement The Combine produces. For example...

The former finds that for IDLs the broad jump most highly correlates with NFL success. The latter doesn't list "bench press" for any position.

The middle one? It's referenced in the first.

I mention these because they agree with my opinion... not because they disagree with yours...

As to the why of my opinion... simple... you can teach/build strength.

And while you can hone a standing broad or vertical jump, or a shuttle/3-cone time... you really can't instruct a prospect to a result that wows.

Personally, I use Combine results for two things...

a check on any evaluations I have done, i.e., do the numbers match what I saw "on tape";
a sign that I need to look at someone I have not yet evaluated.

tiamat63

A lot of IDL that are recruited that way from High school have wrestling backgrounds. Leverage, stamina, footwork and balance...

Plus the psychological component as well. Want to get the exhaustion of playing a full football game but in 1/3 of the time? Go 3 full periods on the mat and you'll be half dead.

The Gipper

@tiamat63 said:

A lot of IDL that are recruited that way from High school have wrestling backgrounds. Leverage, stamina, footwork and balance...

Plus the psychological component as well. Want to get the exhaustion of playing a full football game but in 1/3 of the time? Go 3 full periods on the mat and you'll be half dead.

Bob Golic was a HS wrestler.

I wonder what kind of a nose tackle Dan Gable or Cale Sanderson would have made.

Interesting article on the best college wrestlers of all time. Only NFL name I recognize is Carlton Haselpig.

https://intermatwrestle.com/articles/21790

The Gipper

More on wrestling and football. From National Wrestling HOF website.

Top 10 Wrestlers Who Played In NFL

1. Stephen Neal, New England Patriots OL** – 1999 World freestyle champion, 2x NCAA wrestling champion (Cal-Bakersfield) 4th 1996, 2nd 1997, 1st 1998, 1st 1999
2. Carlton Haselpig, Pittsburgh Steelers OL** – 3x NCAA Div. I champion, 3x NCAA Div. II champion (Pitt-Johnstown), Div. I champion (1987-1989), Div. II champion (1987-1989), 3rd 1986 Div. II
3. Bob Pickens, Chicago Bears, OL – 1964 U.S. Olympic Greco-Roman Team member
4. Jim Nance, New England Patriots, RB – 2x NCAA wrestling champion (Syracuse), 1963 and 1965 champion
5. Curley Culp, Kansas City Chiefs, DL – NCAA wrestling champion (Arizona State), 1967 champion
6. Art Baker, Buffalo Bills, RB – NCAA wrestling champion (Syracuse), 1959 champion
7. Bob Golic, Cleveland Browns, DL – 2x NCAA wrestling All-American (Notre Dame), 3rd 1978, 4th 1977
8. Charlie Getty, Kansas City Chiefs, OL – 2x NCAA wrestling All-American (Penn State), 3rd 1974, 5th 1973
9. Steve Sefter, Philadelphia Eagles, DL – 2x NCAA wrestling All-American (Penn State), 4th 1985, 6th 1981
10. John Ward, 3 NFL teams, OL – NCAA All-American wrestler (Oklahoma State), 3rd 1969
Honorable Mention (also NCAA All-Americans)
Ralph Cindrich, LB, Houston/Denver/New England– NCAA All-American wrestler (Pitt), 4th 1969
Antonio Garay, DT, San Diego/Chicago/Cleveland – NCAA All-American wrestler (Boston College), 4th 2000
Lorenzo Neal, 7 NFL teams, RB – NCAA All-American wrestler (Fresno State), 7th 1992
** Distinguished Member of the National Wrestling Hall of Fame

10 Best NFL Players/Coaches Who Wrestled
(Note: All are enshrined in National Football Hall of Fame, except Vinatieri)

1. Ray Lewis, LB, Baltimore Ravens, Pro Football Hall of Fame (2018)***
2. Ronnie Lott, DB, San Francisco 49ers, Pro Football Hall of Fame (2000)***
3. Bruce Smith, DE, Buffalo Bills, Washington Redskins, Pro Football Hall of Fame (2009)***
4. Jonathan Ogden, OT, Baltimore Ravens, Pro Football Hall of Fame (2013)***
5. John Hannah, OG New England Patriots, Pro Football Hall of Fame (1991)***
6. Mike Webster, C, Pittsburgh Steelers, Kansas City Chiefs, Pro Football Hall of Fame (1997)***
7. Randall McDaniel, OG, Minnesota Vikings, Pro Football Hall of Fame (2009)***
8. Jim Thorpe, RB, New York Giants, Canton, Cleveland, Oorang, Rock Island, Chicago, Pro Football Hall of Fame (1963)
9. Adam Vinatieri, K, Baltimore Colts, NE Patriots, (still active player)***
10. Chuck Noll, Coach, Pittsburgh Steelers, Pro Football Hall of Fame (1993)***
Honorable Mention, also enshrined in NFL Hall of Fame
Curley Culp, DT, Kansas City Chiefs –Pro Football Hall of Fame (2013), NCAA wrestling champion
Larry Csonka, RB, Miami Dolphins, Pro Football Hall of Fame (1987)
Dan Dierdorf, OT, St. Louis Cardinals, Pro Football Hall of Fame (1996)
Henry Jordan, DT, Green Bay Packers, Cleveland Browns, Pro Football Hall of Fame (1995)
Leo Nomellini, DT, San Francisco 49ers, Pro Football Hall of Fame (1969)

SdBacker80

@the-gipper said:

More on wrestling and football. From National Wrestling HOF website.

Top 10 Wrestlers Who Played In NFL

1. Stephen Neal, New England Patriots OL** – 1999 World freestyle champion, 2x NCAA wrestling champion (Cal-Bakersfield) 4th 1996, 2nd 1997, 1st 1998, 1st 1999
2. Carlton Haselpig, Pittsburgh Steelers OL** – 3x NCAA Div. I champion, 3x NCAA Div. II champion (Pitt-Johnstown), Div. I champion (1987-1989), Div. II champion (1987-1989), 3rd 1986 Div. II
3. Bob Pickens, Chicago Bears, OL – 1964 U.S. Olympic Greco-Roman Team member
4. Jim Nance, New England Patriots, RB – 2x NCAA wrestling champion (Syracuse), 1963 and 1965 champion
5. Curley Culp, Kansas City Chiefs, DL – NCAA wrestling champion (Arizona State), 1967 champion
6. Art Baker, Buffalo Bills, RB – NCAA wrestling champion (Syracuse), 1959 champion
7. Bob Golic, Cleveland Browns, DL – 2x NCAA wrestling All-American (Notre Dame), 3rd 1978, 4th 1977
8. Charlie Getty, Kansas City Chiefs, OL – 2x NCAA wrestling All-American (Penn State), 3rd 1974, 5th 1973
9. Steve Sefter, Philadelphia Eagles, DL – 2x NCAA wrestling All-American (Penn State), 4th 1985, 6th 1981
10. John Ward, 3 NFL teams, OL – NCAA All-American wrestler (Oklahoma State), 3rd 1969
Honorable Mention (also NCAA All-Americans)
Ralph Cindrich, LB, Houston/Denver/New England– NCAA All-American wrestler (Pitt), 4th 1969
Antonio Garay, DT, San Diego/Chicago/Cleveland – NCAA All-American wrestler (Boston College), 4th 2000
Lorenzo Neal, 7 NFL teams, RB – NCAA All-American wrestler (Fresno State), 7th 1992
** Distinguished Member of the National Wrestling Hall of Fame

10 Best NFL Players/Coaches Who Wrestled
(Note: All are enshrined in National Football Hall of Fame, except Vinatieri)

1. Ray Lewis, LB, Baltimore Ravens, Pro Football Hall of Fame (2018)***
2. Ronnie Lott, DB, San Francisco 49ers, Pro Football Hall of Fame (2000)***
3. Bruce Smith, DE, Buffalo Bills, Washington Redskins, Pro Football Hall of Fame (2009)***
4. Jonathan Ogden, OT, Baltimore Ravens, Pro Football Hall of Fame (2013)***
5. John Hannah, OG New England Patriots, Pro Football Hall of Fame (1991)***
6. Mike Webster, C, Pittsburgh Steelers, Kansas City Chiefs, Pro Football Hall of Fame (1997)***
7. Randall McDaniel, OG, Minnesota Vikings, Pro Football Hall of Fame (2009)***
8. Jim Thorpe, RB, New York Giants, Canton, Cleveland, Oorang, Rock Island, Chicago, Pro Football Hall of Fame (1963)
9. Adam Vinatieri, K, Baltimore Colts, NE Patriots, (still active player)***
10. Chuck Noll, Coach, Pittsburgh Steelers, Pro Football Hall of Fame (1993)***
Honorable Mention, also enshrined in NFL Hall of Fame
Curley Culp, DT, Kansas City Chiefs –Pro Football Hall of Fame (2013), NCAA wrestling champion
Larry Csonka, RB, Miami Dolphins, Pro Football Hall of Fame (1987)
Dan Dierdorf, OT, St. Louis Cardinals, Pro Football Hall of Fame (1996)
Henry Jordan, DT, Green Bay Packers, Cleveland Browns, Pro Football Hall of Fame (1995)
Leo Nomellini, DT, San Francisco 49ers, Pro Football Hall of Fame (1969)

I remember Antonio Garay he was during my time- he made short work of a teammate/friend of mine. He was a chiseled 275 lb. he had to cut weight to make HWT.

Which is a big reason why some football coaches don’t like wrestling.

The Gipper

@sdbacker80 said:

I remember Antonio Garay he was during my time- he made short work of a teammate/friend of mine. He was a chiseled 275 lb. he had to cut weight to make the HWT.

Which is a big reason why some football coaches don’t like wrestling.

Why would a Heavyweight have to cut weight? Or, is there actually a 275 pound weight class, and a heavyweight class above that?

Tour2ma

@tiamat63 said:

Go 3 1 full periods on the mat and you'll be half dead.

FIFY...

... and little guys love wrestling...

Cool little Jerry Sherk article that I just stumbled across... https://www.brownsnation.com/jerry-sherk/

SdBacker80

@the-gipper said:

Why would a Heavyweight have to cut weight? Or, is there actually a 275 pound weight class, and a heavyweight class above that?

There is a weight limit to even Heavyweight. I think it was 285 in college. I know HS is 275.

Way way back In the day it was unlimited.

DieHardBrownsFan

@tiamat63 said:

A lot of IDL that are recruited that way from High school have wrestling backgrounds. Leverage, stamina, footwork and balance...

Plus the psychological component as well. Want to get the exhaustion of playing a full football game but in 1/3 of the time? Go 3 full periods on the mat and you'll be half dead.

Wrestling practice was a bitch.

Tour2ma

@sdbacker80 said:

There is a weight limit to even Heavyweight. I think it was 285 in college. I know HS is 275.

Way way back In the day it was unlimited.

Didn't they add a Super-Heavyweight class?

Aside I still remember a Romanian lifting our Super, Chris Taylor, at an Olympics. IIRC Chris weighed over 400#.