I've been a big fan of the kid, he's looking like he's looked in the past when he was comfortable. Against Denver last year, Detroit and Chargers this year, as well as throughout all the preseasons. He has the tools, and can scramble. I'm so glad he got in there again. He got so screwed early in the season.

He gets reamed for his accuracy but much of the time, he's putting the ball where the receiver can make a play and the defense can't intercept. Not all the time, but sometimes it's intended to be behind the receiver. I can't say the same for DA.

I think BQ is more versatile and really seems smart and will keep improving. His intelligence showed in how well he handled himself throughout this mess. Look at how mature he was in interviews and always saying the right stuff.

@ballpeen said:

I am as frustrated as anyone, but pulling the plug at this point is premature.

No doubt the offense is in shambles, and that does need to be addressed this off season, but there is little that can be done at this point.

Switching coaches mid stream has never worked, and it won't here. Right now, how many games have we lost that might have been won had we kept with Romeo and crew?? I doubt we would have been sitting on 5 wins..or even 3.

Next year at this time is the time to consider dumping Mangini.

So we can ruin next year as well? and make a bunch of bad draft picks which ruin several seasons? Fire him NOW. He isn't liked by players and they wont produce for him. Not liked nationally either, and apparently by the refs, so he'll get the short end on close calls and things of that nature. He is a real world Charlie Brown.

hit it on the head!

FIRE Charlie Brown PLEASE!

He allowss the same thing over and over and lacks intelligence. No matter what Lucy says, you're not going to kick it Charlie Mangini.

@mopaji said:

This team is talentless. Thomas, Stienbach, Mack, Rogers, Cribbs. Outside of that, we not only have no talent, we don't have many NFL caliber players at all.

Outside of those 5 guys, not ONE player beat their guy on a single play yesterday. We are totally outmatched by every team in the league outside of Oakland and maybe KC. I don't know how Mangini is gonna do it this off-season but he is going to have to replace 30-40 players in a hurry. This team is a joke. Davis, Savage, RAC....F-YOU!!!

There is just no way you can scheme, coach, or gameplan with these players. You cannot ask them to do anything above fundamental football and expect any success. They are bad, really bad. It has got to be embarresing for the coaches knowing that each week another team is watching film on us getting prepared and seeing everything this team doesn't have.

We can't blame the coaches anymore. If you watch these players they are just getting beat on a down-by-down basis. Each and every one of them. Wimbley had Grant wrapped up with both arms and Grant just slipped out like he was coated in vaseline. How in the hell, at this level, do you let that happen? That is a microcosm of what this team doesn't do. Wright got punked again on TV. How many players do you think get punked every week like that guy does and have a job still? Is that coaching? Nope, is that scheme? Nope. Is that gameplan? Nope. That is what it looks like when you put bad players on the field in this league. Its a goddamned joke. I like DA but he looked like crap yesterday. He came out 5/5 and guys were catching it and then, he started forcing balls and leading defenders to his target before throwing it. That is not a coaching issue, they don't coach him to do that, thats not part of the gameplan, that is just a dumb QB.

My friend is a 10th grade English teacher and she said something once that applies here. She said that by the time students get to her they are way behind where they should be. So she has to go back and re-teach 7th grade material before she can even start the 10th grade material. I think that is where this team is right now. The difference is, this is the NFL and so you don't get time to coach up crappy players who are 2-5 years in the league, you just release them. And a lot of guys need to be gone.

BS. I totally blame Mangini for the way he's handled everything. He got rid of some good players. He's ultimately the one who's making the bad offense play calling by allowing Lewis to keep tip toeing up the gut and avg. 3 yds.

Watch how his players like Wright and Macdonald have given up on him. They weren't t his bad in prior years, Mangini is the reason. A coach needs to win over his players, and he never did that. He acts like a dictator with "my way or the highway" attitude. I'd guess players play bad on purpose so they can be traded or benched. He gets rid of good players in favor of mediocre subordinate players. All the really good players have attitudes these days, but it's no problem at all, WHEN YOURE WINNING!

He's been a hyporcite saying he's going to stick with the decision on the QB. Then he gave BQ a super short leash and didn't even give him all the players, in practice or the game! Terrible.

Yes they are in need of talent, but since we have threat receivers, why isn't more focus on the run? Harrison WITH Cribbs in the backfield AND QUINN who can scramble. With the little they have, they can do much more than they are.

Mangini is horrible and it's a waste for another 3 years.

There goes another few years and then we're rebuilding again. It's not that they should've won today, but where was Cribbs WildDawg options, why on 3rd and short or at the goal line, the D stuffs the box, and Browns continue to try and run Lewis up the gut? Why don't they audible or call time out? Why does DA always look like a deer in the headlights when a team blitzes? Last week against the Stealers, they acted shocked like oh wow they're gonna blitz. Duh!!!!

sorry just venting. I'm depressed that it's going to waste several years and they'll be back to square one.

Anything would be better. This coach is a moron, not using the WildDawg today. They could draw a ton of plays/options with the players they have. Harrison and Cribbs, and Quinn can all run, and two of them can throw. I cannot believe we will have to be stuck with this horrible coach for a few years, and then start over again........

Awful. Quinn looked like a superstart compared to this chump.

@dabrowns41 said:

I just want to see why it's such a big deal that Quinn doesn't start. It's obvious this team can't win a game against an average opponent or better no matter who is QB, because we have no WR's, TE's, right side of the line, or running game.

So why do we want to keep butchering DA's value just to keep Quinn on the bench?

Because that'd be smart. That ain't the Browns.

You're right, Put BQ in. If he plays good, we keep or trade him and he'd be worth something. If he plays bad, we are still in the same situation. Everyone knows what DA is.

what's funny is when DA comes out and has a good game (or I should say drive, because he has never played good the whole game) every six or so games, that kind've hurts him, because he's so inconsistent. You can't even prep your offense for him. He stinks even when he manages to play decent!

@atenears said:

It would be very, very difficult for me to get that shit faced in such a short amount of time. I try at every tailgate party, then I attend the games like a gentleman.

Yeah sure! Anyone can catch a buzz right quick. He had hours to drink. And kickers aren't large, fat guys.

Anymore it's a pity party for the Browns. The rivalry was in the old days. Fans still care, but players come'n go so fast, they're friends with a lot of opposition. TA lot of them don't even remember the ass beating from last year. Most didn't live here their lives and it's no big deal like it it to the older fans. Now someone like Quinn, or Jurivicious (sp?) would've been different as they're locals and know. KII was an exception, he lit a fire under players asses. We had a pretty good team a few years back, imagine if we kept that team and just found a good coach and QB, and maybe a few D guys, we'd be a contender. But we had Mangini tear it all apart and then try to bring in a bunch of Jets guys to stink it up.

I don't know what KII did yesterday, but everytime I hear, his stats are very high. He ain't washed up. He's still a beast. And we don't get shi# for trades.

The way he handled the QB's showed a lot. He clearly doesn't know what he's doing there, and he lied about it, saying how he'd stick with the guy because of his great process. Preseason was a joke. The best looking QB, Bartel, was let go! They should've kept him and either DA or BQ for starter. But he was indecisive and neither got good reps, work and planning.

We will probably be rebuilding again in a few years. Why can't the Browns just get a proven coach where we know his methods have worked, and we can stick with him.

Yes there isn't a lot of talent here, but you know what, (this sickens me but it's true) you could probably put half these players on the Steelers and they'd shine. It's MORE than the players. Scouting, drafts, coaching....

@brownsfan4evr said:

Exactly! we're not going to trade BQ apparently, and DA surely sucks, we're not going anywhere this year, let's see what BQ can do.

What? Common sense? Here?! Outside of Kosar, the Browns rarely do anything that makes sense.

If they would design offense/plays around Quinn's skills, and allow him to work with all available players, he'd do much better than this shit we see every week.

DA chokes, is terrible in the two minute offense, not smart with the clock, innacurate. When he does manage to throw it accurately, the receivers are so shocked they drop it.

Yeah, I always thought they should come out with new colors, new team. At least call them the Cleveland Dawgs or something. Hell give them a logo at least! The "mojo" went to Baltimore everyone knows that. This team has none of that heritage. Hearing other players in the division, in bars and stuff outside of football, joke around and say that as well, it's how the Browns are viewed in the league.

I just couldn't believe how inaccurate some of BQ's passes were, even in garbage time. He was so off. Hitting the back of the defender one time! He might need to to quit being a gym rat. Those inflated biceps could be screwing up a lot..seriously. BQ also looks like he's playin' scared out there. Doesn't look at all like he's looked in the past. Something's up.

We all know DA stinks as a captain. No leadership. I'm so friggin' depressed, like most here I'm sure.

The D seems to look really good on 1st and 2nd down, then they keep getting burned on third downs though. As said, earlier, tired from all the 3n outs of the offense.

Get Cribbs outta there, and play the rookies, or just play him as a third receiver/WildDawg thing. He's getting spread thin and we'll just either get hurt, or he's too tired to do anything well.

@solon16 said:

It seems to me that BE and DA have something in the go deep department(pun intented), and that BQ was really matched well with K2. Looking back, if we knew the Qb, I think we should have traded BE instead of K2. Quinn was always k2's choice(imo), those two had synchonicity(sp). The draft would make a helluva lot more sense, if we kept k2.

Pat Mcmanhan, whom i don't like, wrote my exact thoughts on the viks game in regard to BQ:

" He threw short here, short there and short everywhere.

When he did throw downfield, it was a fade or a deep go down the sideline. There were very few over-the-middle 20-yard ins or slants or posts when the game was ''competitive.''

Quinn has his strengths, but taking chances down the field does not seem to be one of them at this point in his career. He'll do it occasionally, but more often than not, he'll take the checkdown.

Which led to him having 72 yards passing early in the fourth quarter."

Quinn will get better, but when i see him play, i don't see the long td pass and quick strike capability. I see a 5-15 yard qb and hope for a broken tackle and yac.

P.s. Does anyone else think he looks like bilbo baggins out there...i thought he was like 6'3?

I don't mind the dink and dunk style. With DA, he folds under blitz. Teams know that. You have to be able to do those little touch passes. With BQ, if he gets comfortable, he can handle the blitz with a quick dump or scramble as he has shown in the past. DA can't do either of those. BQ would be great for a west coast quick short passes offense. Sure I'd love to combine the talents of each, but we have to deal with it.

He has shown he can throw it too. So hopefully he will become more confident and add that to his game and then we'll have a great qb.

Masters said:

I'd say CLE traded one reliable/unreliable TE and replaced him with another reliabel/unreliable TE. Winslow was a reliable receiving option, but unreliable run blocking or pass blocking. Royal is just the opposite, in that he is reliable run blocking and pass blocking, but unreliable as a receiver. I like Winslow a lot, but I agree, CLE made the right move in getting value for him now. He wasn't in the long term plans.

Hanging on to JJ was not an option. There is a reason he is not playing for anyone else now either. I am pretty sure the staph infections he got ended his days of being able to play.

also K2 was Very reliable for a 15 yd penalty in the 4th.

Yes so far Brown's offense looks like college type plays. Where's the screens and short quick stuff Brady did well in preseason? They are playin' ultra conservative and afraid to make a mistake.

All I'm hearing is about stopping AP. That's a biggie fo' sure, but he's going to get his no matter. I don't want to see the Browns sit back and wait to stop AP or wait for the passes. Be aggressive! What I'm hoping for is they make Favre eat dirt a few times. Even if he gets off some nice completions it'd be great to see Rogers on top of Favre. It might cost a penalty (no cheap shots) but it'd be worth it to unleash Favre's interception machine we all see he has when he gets rattled or feels some PAIN!

Unbelieveable. It's the Browns and we should've expected this. This bad Kharma/weird funk happens to us all the time.