@king-ghoolie-lives said:

NO, actually, it's the BROWNS who better win some Titles. The Redskins are a more successful franchise than the Browns. They have given a lot for top picks before, AND it has broguth them success.

This is another thing people need to realize - it's not about having a shitload of high picks, otherwise your team would have won something this decade, and the 49ers would have won the 3rd of their 3 Super Bowls this year, instead of taking 5 years to break .500 in the shittiest division in football. It's about getting impact players, however you find them. Would people be talking shit about our big FA signings if they had worked out? Nope, don't think so. It's about picking the players correctly - which we did when we would trade first round picks for seemingly washed up guys like Marshall and Lachey, not about having 14 picks, which we did in 2008 drafting such stars as Devin Thomas and Justin Tryon.

Also

>texas

>civilization

haha thanks for the laugh

@harry-buffalo said:

If people think we could have made RGIII sucessfull by giving up all our picks to get his support staff for the next 3 season then you are delusional. RGIII is going to be lucky to go through the next two seasons with the Redskins without getting his knee blown out since they now can not support him through 1st round draft talent.

If your organization can only acquire talent in the first round then they should be run out of town.

Weren't you guys saying this crap when you drafted a tight end instead of Ben Roethlisberger?

It's funny, even Tim Couch got to the playoffs with a way shittier roster than the one you have, against an arguably stronger division that had Super Bowl caliber teams in the Titans and Ravens, and yet you give McCoy a pass for going 6-15 with way more around him than Couch could have dreamed of?

Tannehill sucks. I've watched a good number of his games. He's a scrub who was talked up by the people who hated the idea of giving up precious draft picks as an "alternative".

He's closer to Akili Smith than Jay Cutler.

Tannehill is shit, a mirage dredged up to make people feel better about NOT getting RGIII or Luck. He's not Big Ben. He's not even Cutler. He's not even Sanchez.

@dirty-hands said:

Couldn;t have said it better myself. rumor on espn is we didn;t want to add the 2nd rounder either way 3 1st rd. picks for hope is ridiculous... Any one who thinks that would be wise even if he does pan out has been playing too much madden...THANK YOU REDSKINS!

See you in 2018, that's how it took for the 49ers to get good with their NINE first round draft picks since 2005. "Build through the draft" - 57-62 (44-59 before this year) since 2005, while hitting on 6 of those 10 first rounders (Iupati, Smith, Davis, Willis, Crabtree, Staley), playing in the crappiest division in football. We were 10 games worse (about a game worse per season) over that same span, and we had a "GM" who couldn't draft his way out of a paper bag, playing in the NFC East. Context people. Having draft picks - hell, HITTING on those draft picks - doesn't guarantee shit.

Meanwhile, you're going to dumpster dive for a guy like Matt Flynn, or go with Colt "Barely Better Than Sexy Rexy" McCoy. Doesn't exactly inspire confidence does it?

So enjoy your draft picks, maybe you'll draft a real QB with them someday.

@kerrigan91 said:

Trust me, Grossman isn't that guy for you. You're better off with McCoy than Rex "Fuck it I'm going deep" Grossman.

Rex Grossman with Washington:

16 starts

4035 yards

23 TDs

24 INTs

57.4 CMP%

6.8 YPA

237.4 YPG

74.4 QBR

3 game winning drives

2 4QC

6-10 as starter (.375%)

Colt McCoy with Cleveland:

21 starts

4309 yards

20 TDs

20 INTs

58.4 CMP%

6.3 YPA

205.2 YPA

74.5 YPA

3 GWD

1 4QC

6-15 as starter (.286%)

So yeah, maybe the guy's right - if anything Grossman is an upgrade.

@jefftheskinsfan said:

As a competent Redskins fan, I feel that I have to apologize for intermediate proof or whatever his name is. The Browns have as many holes as the Redskins do, to trade both firsts would be crazy. I will elaborate later but I have to go to class.

Steelers suck.

Right, because Brandon Weeden or Ryan Tannehill are going to be anything more than average in the NFL. But people are going to talk themselves into shitty QB prospects because they're too afraid to take the shot with the star. Or they're going to say "Oh Barkley and Jones are just as good! Wait for them!" Except that Jones is terrible, he throws an NFL throw maybe once or twice a game, and Barkley last year played with about 8 guys who will be top 16 picks on offense.

What ever happened to quality > quantity? It may make you sleep better at night to have more draft picks but getting a few more average starters doesn't make up for not having a quarterback. Oh, it's possible to build a good team that way - but it takes 5 years of drafting and a shitload of lucky breaks. Do you really think the Niners will go 13-3 every year with Alex Smith at QB? And this was after they drafted about 7 first round picks in 5 years, and about 15-20 premium picks in that span. All of it means SHIT, utter fucking SHIT, if you don't have an elite QB.

London Fletcher? Barry Cofield? Stephen Bowen? Josh Wilson?

Also, we have to spend money, we're 50 million under the cap and we need to spend 90% of that. The problem isn't signing FAs, the problem is signing FAs that don't fit into a system.

I don't think Little is that great - he benefited from being the only NFL-caliber WR on your roster. He caught less than half the passes thrown at him. Gaffney caught about 57% of them. Hardesty sucks and Hillis is probably gone. You have no TE, even though Davis is a suspension away from being done for the year, he's a top 10 player at his position. OL is a push to me personally. Even so, those holes aren't enough to say "oh let's not trade for RGIII, let's draft another 8 mediocre to above-average players and hope we can find the next Matt Hasselbeck!". Of course, Matt Hasselbeck was shit once Shaun Alexander got run into the ground. He was average this year because teams put 8 in the box to stop CJ.

We had 12 picks last year and all 12 of them were good enough to get playing time as rookies, except the guys who got hurt. The only things we are lacking other than QB are a #1 WR, which will come in FA no matter what we do (all the top WRs in this class outside Blackmon are trash) and maybe a starting RG (we have to spend money so might as well sign Grubbs or Nicks).

@choco said:

banking on little like your banking on moss. are you really criticizing our personnel moves after mcnabb and haynesworth? what your saying is that trying and failing repeatedly is better than mitigating risk and taking value over flash?

im no more confident in snyders ability to gauge talent than i am in my neice's ability to fix my car.

All that "risk mitigation" has gotten you is one flash in the pan 10-6 season with a QB that was nothing once Braylon Edwards lost his hands.

I've already had this argument with people on my side - you can have all the "wonderful A+ drafts" you want, but if you don't have a stud QB then you'll be like the Bills or Jets - they get 2 to 3 starters every year through the draft, but they never have an elite QB so they never do anything.

Some other guy said a phrase that I like - "prevent drafting". It works just as well in the offseason as it does in the real games.

Btw, nobody you've drafted the last two years outside Haden and maybe Sheard is as good as Roy Helu (4th round pick) let alone Ryan Kerrigan.

Right, you're banking on a guy who was targeted 121 times and only caught 61 passes? Of course, it could be Colt McCoy dragging down his performance. Taylor is okay but he's not an impact player. Taylor is actually below-average against the run (or he was as of Week 10 according to PFF).

Again, while trading down makes you look smart in the eyes of draftniks, are you getting impact players with those picks you're picking up? The Falcons should never have traded up in the first place, but Matt Ryan DID have a career season just adding Jones.

It's also kind of funny (actually side-splittingly hilarious) how you're trying to argue that the Redskins are somehow worse than the Browns. We at least gamble in the hopes of winning - the Browns just limp from 4-6 win season to 4-6 win season, with an occasionaly 7-9 or 8-8 season that gives them "hope". You're the team that didn't draft Ben Roethlisberger because you had...Charlie Frye? We've actually won 2 playoff games while the Browns have existed in the current incarnation, so while we're not the Pats or Steelers, we're not the Cleveland Browns.

Being in a pro system has almost nothing to do with NFL success. Matt Leinart, Jimmy Clausen and Mark Sanchez were in pro systems, Drew Brees, Aaron Rodgers and Cam Newton were in spread systems.

It's funny how you guys are getting so mad because you want to pretend you're smart by punting yet again on impact talent. The ironic thing is that you could have taken Julio Jones last year, and still had enough ammo to trade for RGIII this year. But no, having 5 or 6 mediocre starters is better than having 2 impact talents.

I guess when Joe Average QB leads you to 8-8 you'll all feel vindicated.

If you really believed in your FO you'd think they could find quality starters in the 4th round or later like the good franchises do.

Actually, the Eagles beat us not because they had sooo many precious draft picks but because they had a franchise QB (even a fringe guy) in McNabb and we had Jason Campbell and Patrick Ramsey and Mark Brunell.

People harp on our lack of draft picks, but had we drafted Big Ben over Sean Taylor nobody would be singing this tune.

You know who had solid drafts? The Jaguars. They have solid drafts every year. Yet they have no QB. Where are they? About to be moved.

Maybe examine what Holmgren has done at every other stop he's been at, and then examine the buzz coming out of your own organization.

Holmgren doesn't trade up, he trades down. He doesn't draft QBs high, he thinks he can find a "system" quarterback and win with him.

Most likely, he'll trade both firsts, but that's as far as he'll go. After that he'll pray RGIII is there at #4, which he won't be.

RGIII would be the best QB in this draft if he ran a 5.0 flat. He throws deep better, he's more accurate short, he's cool under pressure (Luck barely even SEES pressure), and I think he has a stronger arm.

Luck gets overrated because he ran a pro style offense. So? Jimmy Clausen and Mark Sanchez did too.

That you AND your front office are fucking delusional if you think that playing it safe and drafting more defense as opposed to matching and exceeding any offer we make for RGIII is in your team's best interest (If you don't think this, then disregard this part!)

You guys are trying to talk yourselves out of RGIII and trading the picks needed to get him by saying "Oh, we have Colt McCoy! Oh we can sign Matt Flynn! We need to draft more running backs and wide receivers!"

Really? REALLY?!

As a Redskins fan, I've seen this movie with Jason Campbell. We gave him a top 10 OL, solid but not elite TEs and WRs, and a top 10 RB in Portis. And yet he still threw deep balls out of bounds, still collapsed whenever there was any pressure, and still threw checkdowns every other play. And yet our fanbase made excuses for him until the bitter end. We hired Zorn SOLELY to fix his shitty mechanics, but all that did was make him even more of a robot than he already was. There's a reason the first thing we did when Shanahan came to town was get rid of him. Colt is marginally better than JC, and yet not only do you want to stick with him, or sign a one-hit wonder like Flynn, you want to bring in JC to compete with him! Madness.

Draft picks are nice, but you know what's nice? Having a franchise QB. Look at the Steelers. Bounced between 11-5 and 5-11 every year until they drafted Big Ben. Ravens? Same deal until they got Flacco. And yet you're still here making excuses for your mid-round QB and thinking a few picks is too much to get a legit franchise QB, one that could be the best in your division.

But well, if you and your front office don't get your heads out of your asses, we'll make the deal, take RGIII, and laugh while we stomp all over the declining NFC East, while you continue to dwell in the basement of the AFC North because you're trotting out some combination of Flynn/JC/Colt. When by rights, the situation should be reversed. You should be the perennial basement-dwellers getting the stud QB and reversing 20 years of suck (Ray Lewis and Ed Reed aren't getting any younger, and the Bengals are a flash in the pan as always), but Holmgren's too much of a pussy and thinks stockpiling picks makes him look smart. But then, Shanny was always the real genius of the Walsh coaching tree. Holmgren didn't even want Favre, and he probably would have kept Steve Young in the pocket and made him throw 5 yard slants all day.

Anyway, that's just what I think.