Just the messenger:

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-shutdown-corner/report--browns--so-done--with-manziel--so-what-s-next-for-him-013439391.html

and then there's this too:

https://twitter.com/BHOOLZ/status/683792389039763457

@miktoxic said:

i'd: keep pettine and have him take over D play calling. don't like flip's stuff this year but didn't like shanahan's either when he was here....maybe too much influence of the WCO or just playing to the strength of the players dealt them, dunno but something has to be done there as well.

farmer needs a kick in his ass, and he/they need to hold scouts accountable when their shit is no good.

half our OL might be gone. some D picks might pan out but are still in desperate need of LB help. AND we have no quality receivers over 6'. so even if the browns decide to keep manziel there are enough needs to take up 2 drafts IMO.

Thanks for the fill in mik,

Back on topic, watching Pettine, I just get the feeling that McCown is his ride-or-die chic and #1 choice. Seems like Johnny is the sloppy seconds because he knows, while hot and shiny, she already has herpes and won't bear his children.

@miktoxic said:

live in ny now. one good friend is a gints fan and one is a skins/steelers fan. (yeah, i know, how does one get away with such nonsense). i hate to see anyone in peril but to see kelly go down in flames is priceless. what he did to that team is beyond words. anyone that proclaimed him a genius should be spotlighted and held accountable. (we have a couple of idiots on here that wanted him in cleveland).

problem with pettine is the same with gruden. last year he pulled out one of the best records since the original team went to baltimore. now when you look back at everything (like you will next year) it was one of the weakest schedules in 2014. they were starting anew and then the whole manziel clusterfuck happened. not that i hate manziel, but the baggage that came with him could upset an apple cart on a level paved road. this year he gave away some power to his assistants and that was a mistake and our talent is lacking at certain positions that got hit with injuries. in other words 'we were not who we thought we were'.

still, i wouldn't blame our owner, who i think is a little more stable than snyder, to just flush everything down the toilet and do a yard sale considering the play on the field. most great football orgs have continuity and stay the course when the shit hits the fan, but in cleveland when that happens...........it's beyond bad. our GM likes to wheel and deal with top round picks like it's a chess game. sometimes just take your pick and pick it and get top talent instead of try to find those 4 players in the 6th round that one day might be good.

Totally agree about having an easy schedule, just happy to have a ticket to the dance. I guess my question is if you have to pick one to keep for the next 3 years is it Pettine, Farmer, or Johnny? Pettine could be a keeper but I feel like he might need a staff revamp. Don't know much about Farmers picks but I loved Shelton and Erving predraft, Duke is a stud but then to me Johnny and Gilbert are complete whiffs. I agree on owners too, Haslam has been patient and good - Snyder won't get a title till his hair's gone completely gray but at least he's gotten out of his own way the past 2 years.

Thanks mik,

The NFCLeast Almond Milk Belt is nice and gratifying mainly because of our rivals tears. That said Gruden I was 50/50 on but he went balls deep and hitched his wagon on KC early and was proven right - for that he gets my props. I always thought KC had the talent but what got him to where he is now is the intangibles...facing adversity and believing in himself etc. Honestly I'd still take Scot Mccloughan(the GM) over both of them if it came down to it - he is the #1 reason the skins are even relevant.

What's the consensus on Pettine? From afar he's a defensive guy but has that Browns D bought in? On the other end I think that there's been a ton of adversity for him that the public may not see and I think he's handled it well considering. You guys have sick talent in a lot of areas, maybe just need some of them to develop into core leaders.

This is my first post here and let me preface this by disclaiming that I'm a Redskin fan and lurker on this board since 2012 when both of our teams were linked to trying to trade for RGIII so I have no dog in this fight.

I've watched more recently in my peripheral because I was a big Kyle Shanahan fan and when you guys signed him I wanted to see how he would do here. I've also felt a kinship in the sense that both of our franchises have been management laughing stocks of the NFL and complete debacles overall yet our fanbases stay strong and both play in power divisions. All that said this is what I think from an outsider POV:

There is a difference between "staying the path" and "seeing what you have" with Johnny and realizing when a dud is a dud. I think the mobile 1-read QB's like Kaep, RGIII, and Johnny, while talented, are not worth investing your entire future around. RGIII is a great dude, hard worker, team player etc etc but homie cannot get to a 3rd read in a pressure situation to save his life and Johnny is the same exact way.

McCown is a decent QB when the ish is setup around him right and honestly if he was 5 years younger we wouldn't be having this conversation but just look at Fitz in NYJ. Bounced around from team to team but now hes on a precipice of a wildcard berth. You think they care that he is as old as joe dirt? You think that they think Geno is their future still after seeing what a professional QB can do?

Having injuries to Hartline and the WRs is one thing. Losing a potential stud like Gordon to stupidity is another travesty. But trust your eyes - 300 yard games don't grow on trees and McCown has had them. Barnidge and Jordan Reed are taking the TE championship belt from Gronk within 2 years. I think if healthy all year the Browns could of had a wildcard shot ala the Jets. Outside of Chip Kelly none of these 1-read QB's have a shot of progression unless they really dedicate themselves.

Yeah Johnny, throw your helmet in frustration and proclaim that you didn't come through in crunch-time - in reality dog "crunch-time" was your preparation on mon-tues-weds-thurs, it was you staying late watching film instead of drinking fourlokos.

Johnny has a winner's heart with a Vince Young mind.

Just an outsider and fellow underdog's 2 cents