America Has a Gun Problem
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The first documented mass shooting in the United States interestingly took place in 1949. I would like to see a timeline from that point on how many took place and the frequency.
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/story-first-mass-murder-us-history-180956927/
The first documented mass shooting in the United States interestingly took place in 1949. I would like to see a timeline from that point on how many took place and the frequency.
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/story-first-mass-murder-us-history-180956927/
I would wager that it correlates to the expansion of mass media and the explosion of social media.
/edit - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mass_shootings_in_the_United_States
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Any law that can help reduce gun violence, either in a school or in the inner city, is a positive. The "whataboutism" with gang violence being used to make sure no meaningful change actually happens is just petty and purposefully misleading. Like how you can't want climate change laws if you aren't also constantly angry about the rain forest. Or how you can't advocate for civil rights here if you aren't constantly angry about places in the middle east attacking civil rights.
Critiquing the opinion you've presented is not "whataboutism." The vast majority of gun violence is urban homicide and rural/suburban suicide. When you post graphs that show gun crime in the US compared to other nations in the context of a recent school shooting, and in reducing each of these individual problems into "the gun problem," you've invited yourself to the pushback you've received.
Again, adding barriers to entry will help. Background checks. Wait times. Etc.
Can you give specifics as to how that will be helpful?
I've made your argument in the parentheses many times. Posters here would have you believe that they could defend against the US Military because they have an AR. They'll cite Vietnam or Afghanistan and not even consider why those are irrelevant. Defending against an intruder is one thing, defending against a government military is gun lover fetishism.
If you're going to assert that those insurgencies are irrelevant, then I would like to hear your argument as to why. As well as the answer to these questions I asked earlier:
First, if you are for stricter regulations, then what segment of the American populace should have their 2nd amendment right revoked? Secondly, suppose that somehow those stricter regulations happen, what is your plan to keep these newly restricted people from getting their hands on one of the 500 million firearms circulating in the country?
Critiquing the opinion you've presented is not "whataboutism." The vast majority of gun violence is urban homicide and rural/suburban suicide. When you post graphs that show gun crime in the US compared to other nations in the context of a recent school shooting, and in reducing each of these individual problems into "the gun problem," you've invited yourself to the pushback you've received.
Can you give specifics as to how that will be helpful?
If you're going to assert that those insurgencies are irrelevant, then I would like to hear your argument as to why. As well as the answer to these questions I asked earlier:
First, if you are for stricter regulations, then what segment of the American populace should have their 2nd amendment right revoked? Secondly, suppose that somehow those stricter regulations happen, what is your plan to keep these newly restricted people from getting their hands on one of the 500 million firearms circulating in the country?
It seems to me, no matter what kind of regulation or law is passed, or actually enforced, people that want to get a gun will find a way to get one.
I don’t know how you can stop a criminal from getting their hands on a gun. The laws on the books sure are not stopping them. And any new law isn’t going to stop them either
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Critiquing the opinion you've presented is not "whataboutism." The vast majority of gun violence is urban homicide and rural/suburban suicide. When you post graphs that show gun crime in the US compared to other nations in the context of a recent school shooting, and in reducing each of these individual problems into "the gun problem," you've invited yourself to the pushback you've received.
Can you give specifics as to how that will be helpful?
If you're going to assert that those insurgencies are irrelevant, then I would like to hear your argument as to why. As well as the answer to these questions I asked earlier:
First, if you are for stricter regulations, then what segment of the American populace should have their 2nd amendment right revoked? Secondly, suppose that somehow those stricter regulations happen, what is your plan to keep these newly restricted people from getting their hands on one of the 500 million firearms circulating in the country?
It seems to me, no matter what kind of regulation or law is passed, or actually enforced, people that want to get a gun will find a way to get one.
I don’t know how you can stop a criminal from getting their hands on a gun. The laws on the books sure are not stopping them. And any new law isn’t going to stop them either
It seems to me, no matter what kind of regulation or law is passed, or actually enforced, people that want to get a gun will find a way to get one.
I don’t know how you can stop a criminal from getting their hands on a gun. The laws on the books sure are not stopping them. And any new law isn’t going to stop them either
When you have people willing to mass murder people with guns then willing to turn the gun on themselves, what law can you pass that would punish/deter the shooter? When you have someone that is willing to die, you literally have nothing to hang over their head.
I would wager that it correlates to the expansion of mass media and the explosion of social media.
/edit - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mass_shootings_in_the_United_States
Mass shootings started well before mass media and mass social media. Free will, guns, and social media do not mix well. But once the genie was let out of the bottle, I'm afraid there is no going back. Once Columbine happened, that's when things really started to go downhill. Like I said before, get yourself armed, be aware of your surroundings, and stay out of trouble.
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It seems to me, no matter what kind of regulation or law is passed, or actually enforced, people that want to get a gun will find a way to get one.
I don’t know how you can stop a criminal from getting their hands on a gun. The laws on the books sure are not stopping them. And any new law isn’t going to stop them either
When you have people willing to mass murder people with guns then willing to turn the gun on themselves, what law can you pass that would punish/deter the shooter? When you have someone that is willing to die, you literally have nothing to hang over their head.
I would wager that it correlates to the expansion of mass media and the explosion of social media.
/edit - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mass_shootings_in_the_United_States
Mass shootings started well before mass media and mass social media. Free will, guns, and social media do not mix well. But once the genie was let out of the bottle, I'm afraid there is no going back. Once Columbine happened, that's when things really started to go downhill. Like I said before, get yourself armed, be aware of your surroundings, and stay out of trouble.
When you have people willing to mass murder people with guns then willing to turn the gun on themselves, what law can you pass that would punish/deter the shooter? When you have someone that is willing to die, you literally have nothing to hang over their head.
Mass shootings started well before mass media and mass social media. Free will, guns, and social media do not mix well. But once the genie was let out of the bottle, I'm afraid there is no going back. Once Columbine happened, that's when things really started to go downhill. Like I said before, get yourself armed, be aware of your surroundings, and stay out of trouble.
I think that's true. Still I would urge a requirement for some kind of gun training for anyone wanting a concealed carry license. I have no problem with people carrying but I would rather they had some sort of knowledge about the weapon.
WSS
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When you have people willing to mass murder people with guns then willing to turn the gun on themselves, what law can you pass that would punish/deter the shooter? When you have someone that is willing to die, you literally have nothing to hang over their head.
Mass shootings started well before mass media and mass social media. Free will, guns, and social media do not mix well. But once the genie was let out of the bottle, I'm afraid there is no going back. Once Columbine happened, that's when things really started to go downhill. Like I said before, get yourself armed, be aware of your surroundings, and stay out of trouble.
I think that's true. Still I would urge a requirement for some kind of gun training for anyone wanting a concealed carry license. I have no problem with people carrying but I would rather they had some sort of knowledge about the weapon.
WSS
I think that's true. Still I would urge a requirement for some kind of gun training for anyone wanting a concealed carry license. I have no problem with people carrying but I would rather they had some sort of knowledge about the weapon.
WSS
I say throw out the concealed license and just make it a law to have 'gun license" You should not only have to take an overall gun safety class, but you should also have to be trained and certified for every class of weapon you wish to buy. If you buy an AR-15, you should be trained and certified in that class of weapon, and the same for shotguns. And maybe even have to re-certify after so long.
Once you have your gun license and it says that you are certified in the class of firearm you have then you should be allowed to carry it concealed.
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I think that's true. Still I would urge a requirement for some kind of gun training for anyone wanting a concealed carry license. I have no problem with people carrying but I would rather they had some sort of knowledge about the weapon.
WSS
I say throw out the concealed license and just make it a law to have 'gun license" You should not only have to take an overall gun safety class, but you should also have to be trained and certified for every class of weapon you wish to buy. If you buy an AR-15, you should be trained and certified in that class of weapon, and the same for shotguns. And maybe even have to re-certify after so long.
Once you have your gun license and it says that you are certified in the class of firearm you have then you should be allowed to carry it concealed.
I say throw out the concealed license and just make it a law to have 'gun license" You should not only have to take an overall gun safety class, but you should also have to be trained and certified for every class of weapon you wish to buy. If you buy an AR-15, you should be trained and certified in that class of weapon, and the same for shotguns. And maybe even have to re-certify after so long.
Once you have your gun license and it says that you are certified in the class of firearm you have then you should be allowed to carry it concealed.
I can live with that. The Specter of the slippery slope always exists but one has to start somewhere.
WSS
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Constitutional carry. MAGA!
"You planning on having a long relationship with that glass or are you going to drink it? Drink up, man. Maybe we can get another.” - Janis Joplin, 1970. -
I think that's true. Still I would urge a requirement for some kind of gun training for anyone wanting a concealed carry license. I have no problem with people carrying but I would rather they had some sort of knowledge about the weapon.
WSS
I say throw out the concealed license and just make it a law to have 'gun license" You should not only have to take an overall gun safety class, but you should also have to be trained and certified for every class of weapon you wish to buy. If you buy an AR-15, you should be trained and certified in that class of weapon, and the same for shotguns. And maybe even have to re-certify after so long.
Once you have your gun license and it says that you are certified in the class of firearm you have then you should be allowed to carry it concealed.
I say throw out the concealed license and just make it a law to have 'gun license" You should not only have to take an overall gun safety class, but you should also have to be trained and certified for every class of weapon you wish to buy. If you buy an AR-15, you should be trained and certified in that class of weapon, and the same for shotguns. And maybe even have to re-certify after so long.
Once you have your gun license and it says that you are certified in the class of firearm you have then you should be allowed to carry it concealed.
So basically a driver's license but for guns. Seems like a step in the right direction.
Do you think individuals have a legitimate case to actually own AR 15s though? And if so, what is that case?
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And vapor i know i still need to respond to you. That's on me
Ja.brill Peppers - Cleveland Brown OldBrownsFan, on 02 Jun 2017 - 5:09PM said: "No you are not the work of the devil but you are deceived by the devil." Who's got it better than us? Nooooobody! -
The problem with the second amendment is that it is so VAGUE. It say you have the right to keep and bear "Arms" , it says nothing about ammunition. You could in theory ban the mass production of ammo or ammo altogether? It even says it in the amendment "ARMS" , does not say anything about "Firearms" And technically, a gun can exist without the ammo. Ammo is not part of the gun itself but a consumable.
Also, it does not define "Infringe" So, technically gun laws don't infringe the 2nd amendment because in the end they still allow possession of a gun.?
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I say throw out the concealed license and just make it a law to have 'gun license" You should not only have to take an overall gun safety class, but you should also have to be trained and certified for every class of weapon you wish to buy. If you buy an AR-15, you should be trained and certified in that class of weapon, and the same for shotguns. And maybe even have to re-certify after so long.
Once you have your gun license and it says that you are certified in the class of firearm you have then you should be allowed to carry it concealed.
So basically a driver's license but for guns. Seems like a step in the right direction.
Do you think individuals have a legitimate case to actually own AR 15s though? And if so, what is that case?
So basically a driver's license but for guns. Seems like a step in the right direction.
Do you think individuals have a legitimate case to actually own AR 15s though? And if so, what is that case?
My idea was that if you want to own a particular gun, you get trained and certified in that class. Pistols, semi-automatic rifles like AR's and AK's, shotguns, long guns like bolt action rifles. You don't pass the course, you don't get it and it's illegal for you to own it. Passing a handgun course should not be that difficult for most 90% plus of people. And let's face it, if you can't pass a simple handgun course, you should not be handling AR-15's and shotguns. I do not believe my idea infringes the 2nd amendment because the end result is you get to carry a weapon. It's not a CURE ALL but it is a common sense step in the right direction.
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So basically a driver's license but for guns. Seems like a step in the right direction.
Do you think individuals have a legitimate case to actually own AR 15s though? And if so, what is that case?
My idea was that if you want to own a particular gun, you get trained and certified in that class. Pistols, semi-automatic rifles like AR's and AK's, shotguns, long guns like bolt action rifles. You don't pass the course, you don't get it and it's illegal for you to own it. Passing a handgun course should not be that difficult for most 90% plus of people. And let's face it, if you can't pass a simple handgun course, you should not be handling AR-15's and shotguns. I do not believe my idea infringes the 2nd amendment because the end result is you get to carry a weapon. It's not a CURE ALL but it is a common sense step in the right direction.
My idea was that if you want to own a particular gun, you get trained and certified in that class. Pistols, semi-automatic rifles like AR's and AK's, shotguns, long guns like bolt action rifles. You don't pass the course, you don't get it and it's illegal for you to own it. Passing a handgun course should not be that difficult for most 90% plus of people. And let's face it, if you can't pass a simple handgun course, you should not be handling AR-15's and shotguns. I do not believe my idea infringes the 2nd amendment because the end result is you get to carry a weapon. It's not a CURE ALL but it is a common sense step in the right direction.
No I get it. What I'm asking is what would be your justification for why an average citizen would need to own an AR?
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My idea was that if you want to own a particular gun, you get trained and certified in that class. Pistols, semi-automatic rifles like AR's and AK's, shotguns, long guns like bolt action rifles. You don't pass the course, you don't get it and it's illegal for you to own it. Passing a handgun course should not be that difficult for most 90% plus of people. And let's face it, if you can't pass a simple handgun course, you should not be handling AR-15's and shotguns. I do not believe my idea infringes the 2nd amendment because the end result is you get to carry a weapon. It's not a CURE ALL but it is a common sense step in the right direction.
No I get it. What I'm asking is what would be your justification for why an average citizen would need to own an AR?
No I get it. What I'm asking is what would be your justification for why an average citizen would need to own an AR?
I don't know, personal choice? I have mine as a last line of defense if the world completely goes to shit. I really don't see the NEED for anyone to use it in a self defense manner, that's what pistols are for. If you live in a place that you NEED an Ar-15 for self defense then you need to move. I live in a pretty shit part of town and feel plenty safe with just my 45 and 9mm.
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No I get it. What I'm asking is what would be your justification for why an average citizen would need to own an AR?
I don't know, personal choice? I have mine as a last line of defense if the world completely goes to shit. I really don't see the NEED for anyone to use it in a self defense manner, that's what pistols are for. If you live in a place that you NEED an Ar-15 for self defense then you need to move. I live in a pretty shit part of town and feel plenty safe with just my 45 and 9mm.
I don't know, personal choice? I have mine as a last line of defense if the world completely goes to shit. I really don't see the NEED for anyone to use it in a self defense manner, that's what pistols are for. If you live in a place that you NEED an Ar-15 for self defense then you need to move. I live in a pretty shit part of town and feel plenty safe with just my 45 and 9mm.
That was kind of the point I was hoping to make. When looking at the 2nd amendment in regards to self defense.
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And vapor i know i still need to respond to you. That's on me
Take your time, brother. We all got irl commitments.
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I think that's true. Still I would urge a requirement for some kind of gun training for anyone wanting a concealed carry license. I have no problem with people carrying but I would rather they had some sort of knowledge about the weapon.
WSS
I say throw out the concealed license and just make it a law to have 'gun license" You should not only have to take an overall gun safety class, but you should also have to be trained and certified for every class of weapon you wish to buy. If you buy an AR-15, you should be trained and certified in that class of weapon, and the same for shotguns. And maybe even have to re-certify after so long.
Once you have your gun license and it says that you are certified in the class of firearm you have then you should be allowed to carry it concealed.
I say throw out the concealed license and just make it a law to have 'gun license" You should not only have to take an overall gun safety class, but you should also have to be trained and certified for every class of weapon you wish to buy. If you buy an AR-15, you should be trained and certified in that class of weapon, and the same for shotguns. And maybe even have to re-certify after so long.
Once you have your gun license and it says that you are certified in the class of firearm you have then you should be allowed to carry it concealed.
Nothing wrong with your idea, but I’m pretty sure if someone breaks into your home and steals your gun he/she wouldn’t give a fuck about any type of license.
Which puts the firearm in the wrong person’s possession, and that is the biggest issue of gun crime in America.
Two things that will define you: Your determination when you have nothing. Your attitude when you have everything. - Mike McCartney -
Constitutional carry. MAGA!
Constitutional carry. MAGA!
That’s what we have in WV
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I say throw out the concealed license and just make it a law to have 'gun license" You should not only have to take an overall gun safety class, but you should also have to be trained and certified for every class of weapon you wish to buy. If you buy an AR-15, you should be trained and certified in that class of weapon, and the same for shotguns. And maybe even have to re-certify after so long.
Once you have your gun license and it says that you are certified in the class of firearm you have then you should be allowed to carry it concealed.
Nothing wrong with your idea, but I’m pretty sure if someone breaks into your home and steals your gun he/she wouldn’t give a fuck about any type of license.
Which puts the firearm in the wrong person’s possession, and that is the biggest issue of gun crime in America.
someone breaks into your home and steals your gun
I've already said that is a problem in this thread. And I have also said that my idea was not a cure all. Gun theft is a major problem, but so is also people who have no business even touching a gun. What I am suggesting would at least slow down the ability of someone being able ti get their hands on a powerful weapon with ease. If you feel you deserve to have that weapon then prove it. Go get the training and go get certified.
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someone breaks into your home and steals your gun
I've already said that is a problem in this thread. And I have also said that my idea was not a cure all. Gun theft is a major problem, but so is also people who have no business even touching a gun. What I am suggesting would at least slow down the ability of someone being able ti get their hands on a powerful weapon with ease. If you feel you deserve to have that weapon then prove it. Go get the training and go get certified.
I've already said that is a problem in this thread. And I have also said that my idea was not a cure all. Gun theft is a major problem, but so is also people who have no business even touching a gun. What I am suggesting would at least slow down the ability of someone being able ti get their hands on a powerful weapon with ease. If you feel you deserve to have that weapon then prove it. Go get the training and go get certified.
Agreed. Some points in addition to your response:
1.Why NOT an AR ? It's a rifle. A semi-auto rifle. Very customizable - a primary factor in it's popularity.
2. We already HAVE a requirement for CCW. I'm fine with that. We have background checks. etc etc etc. But the left is their own worst enemy - they don't care about gun crimes and gun accidents - it's dirty political theater with them. NY had gun registration. First thing that happened? The local leftwing major newspaper PUBLISHED the names and addresses of all those registered. Including policemen, firemen, etc. Liberals CREATE problems because they are not sincere about what they do.
3. I've been wondering why noise reducers are fought by the left so diligenetly. Another ignorant attack point. Why not quiet
the sound of a gun going off? Right now- i't at least a couple hundred bucks and a year to wait to get one. I'd like to have one for my AR that I haven't bought yet....(need an upper) - but they are LOUD. Maybe the left opposes them because they want the loudness to annoy neighbors? or, they think the suppressors make gunshots silent like in the movies?
they do NOT. Ok, in the military they have them that do - but that class of suppressor is NOT sold to civilians. Ask any spec ops/Seal team guy - he'll tell you.
If I ever hunt boar, I want an AR. It would take more than a couple of frantic shots to kill one.
The left has made it impossible to add new risky laws - but they thrive on abusing laws in existence any way they can. Want to require a license to own? Just get one? An obaMao/biden gov would love to increase the cost of a license to about 500 bucks. or, how about a six month college stint? or a two year degree? They are already calling decent parents who object to crt being taught in their schools dangerous and have the corrupt fbi going after them.
4. All of us are sickened by school shootings. But using a car? no lefties car. Automobile deaths and injuries? They do NOT give a crap. Because attacking our 2nd Amendment is a political weapon they use to try to manipulate their anti-everthing support.
Motor Vehicle Crash Deaths | VitalSigns | CDC
However, more than 32,000 people are killed and 2 million are injured each year from motor vehicle crashes. In 2013, the US crash death rate was more than twice the average of other high-income countries. In the US, front seat belt use was lower than in most other comparison countries.5. There are lefties who fight against fishing. Anybody not know why they do that? It isn't about deaths or crime. It's about fighting against every aspect of American life they can think of to fight.
PETA Launches Attack on Sport Fishing | Fox News
PETA Launches Attack on Sport Fishing. LOS ANGELES - For many Americans, "fishing" conjures up images of a quiet lake or gentle stream with man and nature at peace. But not everybody sees it ... -
someone breaks into your home and steals your gun
I've already said that is a problem in this thread. And I have also said that my idea was not a cure all. Gun theft is a major problem, but so is also people who have no business even touching a gun. What I am suggesting would at least slow down the ability of someone being able ti get their hands on a powerful weapon with ease. If you feel you deserve to have that weapon then prove it. Go get the training and go get certified.
I've already said that is a problem in this thread. And I have also said that my idea was not a cure all. Gun theft is a major problem, but so is also people who have no business even touching a gun. What I am suggesting would at least slow down the ability of someone being able ti get their hands on a powerful weapon with ease. If you feel you deserve to have that weapon then prove it. Go get the training and go get certified.
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