Manning vs Manning vs Quinn
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Peyton Manning
9/06/98 vs MIA L 15-24
Comp: 21
Attmpt:37
Rating: 56.8
9/13/98 @ NE L 6-29
Comp: 21
Attmpt: 33
Rating: 63.6
9/20/98 @ NYJ L 6-44
Comp: 20
Attmpt: 44
Rating: 45.5
9/27/98 NO L 13-19
Comp: 19
Attmpt: 32
Rating: 59.4
Totals for first 4 games
10 points per game
40 total points in 4 games
4 losses
Rating: 56.3
Eli Manning
9/12/04 @ PHI L 17-31
Comp: 3
Attmpt: 9
Rating: 60.4
11/21/04 ATL L 10-14
Comp: 17
Attmp: 37
Rating: 45.1
11/28/04 PHI L 6-27
Comp: 6
Attmp: 21
Rating: 16.9
12/05/04 @ WAS L 7-31
Comp: 12
Attmpt: 25
Rating: 60.9
Totals for first 4 games
10 points per game
40 total points in 4 games
4 losses
Rating: 45.8
Brady Quinn
11/06/08 DEN L 30-34
Comp: 22
Attmpt: 35
Rating: 104.3
11/17/08 @ BUF W 29-27
Comp: 14
Attmpt: 36
Rating: 55.9
11/23/08 HOU L 6-16
Comp: 8
Attmpt: 18
Rating: 21.3
09/13/08 MIN L 20-34
Comp: 21
Attmpt: 35
Rating: 74.1
Totals for first 4 games
21.5 points per game
85 total points in 4 games
1 win and 3 losses
Rating: 63.8
Point of story, even Super Bowl QB's are given a chance to get comfortable. I'm still hoping for great things from Quinn. His reputation is better leadership and less turn overs than he displayed on Sunday. The only thing for this team to do at this point is get behind him 100%.
Chin up mates, let's see how this story unfolds.
N.B. Anybody else watch JaMarcus last night? With over a year's experience, "appropriately" drafted higher than Quinn according to draft experts, and a full off season of snaps, he lays an egg with a QB rating of 45 last night. I wonder what Raider nation is saying.
Peyton Manning
9/06/98 vs MIA L 15-24
Comp: 21
Attmpt:37
Rating: 56.8
9/13/98 @ NE L 6-29
Comp: 21
Attmpt: 33
Rating: 63.6
9/20/98 @ NYJ L 6-44
Comp: 20
Attmpt: 44
Rating: 45.5
9/27/98 NO L 13-19
Comp: 19
Attmpt: 32
Rating: 59.4
Totals for first 4 games
10 points per game
40 total points in 4 games
4 losses
Rating: 56.3
Eli Manning
9/12/04 @ PHI L 17-31
Comp: 3
Attmpt: 9
Rating: 60.4
11/21/04 ATL L 10-14
Comp: 17
Attmp: 37
Rating: 45.1
11/28/04 PHI L 6-27
Comp: 6
Attmp: 21
Rating: 16.9
12/05/04 @ WAS L 7-31
Comp: 12
Attmpt: 25
Rating: 60.9
Totals for first 4 games
10 points per game
40 total points in 4 games
4 losses
Rating: 45.8
Brady Quinn
11/06/08 DEN L 30-34
Comp: 22
Attmpt: 35
Rating: 104.3
11/17/08 @ BUF W 29-27
Comp: 14
Attmpt: 36
Rating: 55.9
11/23/08 HOU L 6-16
Comp: 8
Attmpt: 18
Rating: 21.3
09/13/08 MIN L 20-34
Comp: 21
Attmpt: 35
Rating: 74.1
Totals for first 4 games
21.5 points per game
85 total points in 4 games
1 win and 3 losses
Rating: 63.8
Point of story, even Super Bowl QB's are given a chance to get comfortable. I'm still hoping for great things from Quinn. His reputation is better leadership and less turn overs than he displayed on Sunday. The only thing for this team to do at this point is get behind him 100%.
Chin up mates, let's see how this story unfolds.
N.B. Anybody else watch JaMarcus last night? With over a year's experience, "appropriately" drafted higher than Quinn according to draft experts, and a full off season of snaps, he lays an egg with a QB rating of 45 last night. I wonder what Raider nation is saying.
So we can use comparisions to show how BQ stacks up and it is valid but when comparisons are used to show how DA stacks up with many top QBs after 27 starts those are not valid arguments?
Like many said on this board when looking at how DA compares to others, it is the smell test. And that game stunk. BQ did do a nice job in the pocket, but I can just imagine what people would have said if DA dropped the ball on a scramble throw. Things like what a Dumb Ass. He is losing us the game. He is so clumsy.
I mean BQ gets sacked 5 times and has two turnovers and I have seen some people say it was the offensive lines fault and that DA would have gotten sacked 12 times and thrown 3 interceptions. Get a grip, this is an improved OL I have seen many here say that. This is a top 5 OL I have seen that. And DA would have been sacked 12 times? When was the last time you saw DA sacked more than 3 times? He releases the ball too fast (Not always correct when doing so) to get sacked that many times.
I am not saying DA would have done better than BQ I am saying BQ did not play well that game and his rating would have been closer to 20 if the Vikings had not played prevent defense in that last possession. This is his first start this year, you can not make a huge deal about it. After 8 games you can make a judgement. But when BQ has a bad game you need to expect people to attack him. Remember the bar was set when DA was QB. There are NO excuses!!! Not the OL, Not the play calling, Not the receivers and Not this is his 4th start. Excuses were not good for DA and they are notr good for BQ.
In this game BQ sucked, that does not mean he sucks. Just means he had a bad game.
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Zombo said:
How bout he starts winning in September or it's Anderson's team in October.Zombo
I'd rather we give it to Cribbs. If Queen is that bad, we know Anderception is that bad - might as well give it to #16. Clearly Daboll wants to run, and throw short shitty shit. Josh can handle it for 2-3 months. Cribbs, Lewis & Davis/Harrison in the backfield. Vickers as 1 TE, and Heiden as the other. Have Furrey line up at WR, and spell him with MoMass.
F' the WildDawg, spread option this bitch and draft Tebow in April.
I mean, if we've already given up on the season... I'm giving up thinking before I type. Just whatever farts out of my brain is getting plastered to the interweb.
Sure, luck means a lot in football. Not having a good quarterback is bad luck. -Don Shula -
Ocon, THANK YOU for starting an intelligent thread on the QB play. Great posts all around in here, too.
Zombo: you have a good point about Quinn needing to improve but it's truly ridiculous to say "It's his third year, he has 4 games to show us he'll be great." It just doesn't work that way, and you know it.
I think it's more reasonable to say he gets 4 games to show us consistently positive results: good reads, accurate throws, no turnovers, smart audibles, etc. Those are things he supposedly excels at and those are the things we need to see him do.
And if he can do those things consistently, the results will come.
One thing we 100% agree on: it's on him. He's gotta find a way to produce, even amidst an offense seemingly in search of a gameplan.
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@danamal said:
Plus with the way bq's contract is structured they wouldn't want to pay him incentive money so he can stink up the joint,just like the Titans didn't want to pay young,or the Niners didn't want to pay Alex Smith. It's a business,first and foremost.Give me a contender and I'll pay you whatever it takes!
Thats the silliest argument ive ever heard.
:smiles indulgently:you think so?Go ask Lerner if he thinks it's silly..or Koko...what's silly is this excuse making for quinn...if you owned a small business and you hire a guy who is supposed to be a whiz kid,then he doesn't perform up to snuff,and costs your company money,plus has an incentive in his contract,that if he shows up for work 70%of the time you have to pay him a hefty bonus what would you do?Is that clear enough for ya?get it now?
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Zombo said:
How bout he starts winning in September or it's Anderson's team in October.Zombo
I'd rather we give it to Cribbs. If Queen is that bad, we know Anderception is that bad - might as well give it to #16. Clearly Daboll wants to run, and throw short shitty shit. Josh can handle it for 2-3 months. Cribbs, Lewis & Davis/Harrison in the backfield. Vickers as 1 TE, and Heiden as the other. Have Furrey line up at WR, and spell him with MoMass.
F' the WildDawg, spread option this bitch and draft Tebow in April.
I mean, if we've already given up on the season... I'm giving up thinking before I type. Just whatever farts out of my brain is getting plastered to the interweb.
I'd rather we give it to Cribbs. If Queen is that bad, we know Anderception is that bad - might as well give it to #16.
yeah, won't happen
If Quinn continues to play like shit, it'll be Anderson
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Not to hijack my own thread, but is anyone else surprised DA wasn't even mentioned regarding the Delhomme and McNabb situations? I guess Feeley is perceived to be better despite his lack of Pro Bowls and 10-win seasons.
hey Ocon, what you really want is for DA to be shipped outta town pronto, then your BF has less of a threat waiting on the bench to replace him..the Browns would be fools to get rid of DA now...you can make all the comparisons with other qb's ya want..it doesn't mean shit...all that means anything is the numbers in the win/lose column..Quinn reminded me a lot of Russel ,both have accuracy problems.
hey Ocon, what you really want is for DA to be shipped outta town pronto, then your BF has less of a threat waiting on the bench to replace him..the Browns would be fools to get rid of DA now...you can make all the comparisons with other qb's ya want..it doesn't mean shit...all that means anything is the numbers in the win/lose column..Quinn reminded me a lot of Russel ,both have accuracy problems.
It's true I don't want to go back to DA. I've made no secret about it.
I just find it interesting many of the same people who feel Quinn should produce now in a "what have you done for me lately" league want to site DA's '07 performance of yester-year as a reason to go back to him.
I do want to stick with Quinn as long as progress is seen, even it it isn't rapid progress. Not sure I have the patience for baby-steps. If he goes from two turnovers to 3-4-5 and starts that DA level of ball protection, I'm not for either, BFF or not.
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hey Ocon, what you really want is for DA to be shipped outta town pronto, then your BF has less of a threat waiting on the bench to replace him..the Browns would be fools to get rid of DA now...you can make all the comparisons with other qb's ya want..it doesn't mean shit...all that means anything is the numbers in the win/lose column..Quinn reminded me a lot of Russel ,both have accuracy problems.
It's true I don't want to go back to DA. I've made no secret about it.
I just find it interesting many of the same people who feel Quinn should produce now in a "what have you done for me lately" league want to site DA's '07 performance of yester-year as a reason to go back to him.
I do want to stick with Quinn as long as progress is seen, even it it isn't rapid progress. Not sure I have the patience for baby-steps. If he goes from two turnovers to 3-4-5 and starts that DA level of ball protection, I'm not for either, BFF or not.
It's true I don't want to go back to DA. I've made no secret about it.
I just find it interesting many of the same people who feel Quinn should produce now in a "what have you done for me lately" league want to site DA's '07 performance of yester-year as a reason to go back to him.
I do want to stick with Quinn as long as progress is seen, even it it isn't rapid progress. Not sure I have the patience for baby-steps. If he goes from two turnovers to 3-4-5 and starts that DA level of ball protection, I'm not for either, BFF or not.
DA averaged 1.25 turnovers a game (or 1.29 can't remember). Very similar to what all the other QBs in the league produce. He does not turn the ball over 2-4-5 times a game. He obviously has games where he did do that but not as many as people seem to think. BQ has averaged less than 1 turnover a game going into this season (I think around .7). He turned the ball over twice last week with a very conservative game plan. It is one game, lets see what he does for 8.
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cmac, it's not simply the amount of DA's TO's it's the TIMING of them. He repeatedly showed NO ability to understand game situations and adjust accordingly.
The guy simply only ever drives at one speed, so to speak, regardless of the traffic situation.
Sometimes he gets the team home safe and other times it's a car wreck.
That's the issue with DA.
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hey Ocon, what you really want is for DA to be shipped outta town pronto, then your BF has less of a threat waiting on the bench to replace him..the Browns would be fools to get rid of DA now...you can make all the comparisons with other qb's ya want..it doesn't mean shit...all that means anything is the numbers in the win/lose column..Quinn reminded me a lot of Russel ,both have accuracy problems.
It's true I don't want to go back to DA. I've made no secret about it.
I just find it interesting many of the same people who feel Quinn should produce now in a "what have you done for me lately" league want to site DA's '07 performance of yester-year as a reason to go back to him.
I do want to stick with Quinn as long as progress is seen, even it it isn't rapid progress. Not sure I have the patience for baby-steps. If he goes from two turnovers to 3-4-5 and starts that DA level of ball protection, I'm not for either, BFF or not.
It's true I don't want to go back to DA. I've made no secret about it.
Doesn't matter what you want. Anderson is the alternative.
And Quinn won't get endless games to try and have a good one some day.
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cmac, it's not simply the amount of DA's TO's it's the TIMING of them. He repeatedly showed NO ability to understand game situations and adjust accordingly.
The guy simply only ever drives at one speed, so to speak, regardless of the traffic situation.
Sometimes he gets the team home safe and other times it's a car wreck.
That's the issue with DA.
Sometimes he gets the team home safe and other times it's a car wreck.
I agree, with Anderson there is an opportunity to win every game, and you don't know what's gonna happen.
Quinn doesn't bring that kind of anxiety to games.
In his games the offense is simply so inept that the fans go home in the 3rd qtr.
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@jadbf said:
And two straight coaching staffs decided they had enough of Anderson's "excitement" and decided for all his "ineptitude" Quinn was the better guy to start.Harsh isn't it?
Yet both coaching staffs were fired, just last season.
Another harsh reality.
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i expect more out of a first rounder then.....like, much more than the 6th rounder. perhaps thats the reason for the short leash....for 2 years, we've been hearing how good quinn is, about how awesome his short throws and accuracy are.
ill be waiting to see it when if happens.
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I'd rather we give it to Cribbs. If Queen is that bad, we know Anderception is that bad - might as well give it to #16.
yeah, won't happen
If Quinn continues to play like shit, it'll be Anderson
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Zombo said:
Bull Phucken Shit.
He deserves ... we have to ...
No, no, no.
He needs to win and prove he deserves to be starting now.
Anderson put up 3,700 yards, 29 TDs and 10 wins his first year as a starter.
He was a sixth round pick, two training camps, four emergency starts, one year in the system, new offensive coordinator, taking over a team that was 4-13 and going 10-5 with them.
There is no good argument that Quinn needs to be babyfed or that we have to endure two more seasons of suckage because for some reason "we have to".
I thought Quinn won the job because the coaching staff decided he was better. Right here. Right now. That is what I fully expect. If you are telling me that Quinn is a two-year project that we must suffer with instead of having a better chance of winning games right now with Anderson ... then I am telling you that you are dead wrong.
I'm not giving up on Quinn. I'm saying I'm very disappointed and his window of opportunity just shrunk.
This was the guy that was the most "NFL-ready" QB prospect of his class. I'm sitting here three years later watching him dink around and play Keystone Kops while the only guy that has given me any hope at the position over the past decade dutifully backs him up.
Quinn needs to come out this week, win a football game, take command of the offense and put this shit to bed. It's in his hands.
Zombo
You can't even be right about your own team....
In case you haven't watched, or you don't get it (which is obvious), the problem with Anderson is he simply does not have the mental part of the game down. You love to focus on the 2007 season -- he had great stats. Whoop Dee Doo. The NFL has a long history of one year wonders who had great stats....and his were built up due to an incredibly easy schedule.
But when the rubber meets the road, when the pressure ever hit, he cannot rise to the occasion. In fact, he falters. He had the Steelers on the ropes in 07....and the whole second half he choked. He had the opportunity to reach the playoffs that year by beating a mediocre Cincy team....and he choked.
You have close to two years on the book of Derek Anderson and you know what you have. It's not going to work.
So you let a young guy go out and see what he has. Smart teams don't have quick hooks, they let players work out through difficult times and test what they have. Anderson got his opportunity and didn't make the most of it. If you had any clue, you would get that.
But as always, you are clueless.
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Zombo said:
Bull Phucken Shit.
He deserves ... we have to ...
No, no, no.
He needs to win and prove he deserves to be starting now.
Anderson put up 3,700 yards, 29 TDs and 10 wins his first year as a starter.
He was a sixth round pick, two training camps, four emergency starts, one year in the system, new offensive coordinator, taking over a team that was 4-13 and going 10-5 with them.
There is no good argument that Quinn needs to be babyfed or that we have to endure two more seasons of suckage because for some reason "we have to".
I thought Quinn won the job because the coaching staff decided he was better. Right here. Right now. That is what I fully expect. If you are telling me that Quinn is a two-year project that we must suffer with instead of having a better chance of winning games right now with Anderson ... then I am telling you that you are dead wrong.
I'm not giving up on Quinn. I'm saying I'm very disappointed and his window of opportunity just shrunk.
This was the guy that was the most "NFL-ready" QB prospect of his class. I'm sitting here three years later watching him dink around and play Keystone Kops while the only guy that has given me any hope at the position over the past decade dutifully backs him up.
Quinn needs to come out this week, win a football game, take command of the offense and put this shit to bed. It's in his hands.
Zombo
You can't even be right about your own team....
In case you haven't watched, or you don't get it (which is obvious), the problem with Anderson is he simply does not have the mental part of the game down. You love to focus on the 2007 season -- he had great stats. Whoop Dee Doo. The NFL has a long history of one year wonders who had great stats....and his were built up due to an incredibly easy schedule.
But when the rubber meets the road, when the pressure ever hit, he cannot rise to the occasion. In fact, he falters. He had the Steelers on the ropes in 07....and the whole second half he choked. He had the opportunity to reach the playoffs that year by beating a mediocre Cincy team....and he choked.
You have close to two years on the book of Derek Anderson and you know what you have. It's not going to work.
So you let a young guy go out and see what he has. Smart teams don't have quick hooks, they let players work out through difficult times and test what they have. Anderson got his opportunity and didn't make the most of it. If you had any clue, you would get that.
But as always, you are clueless.
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Zombo said:
Mankock is not married to himProbably but I don't rule that out with Lerner and his history of pulling strings in the background.
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Zombo said:
Quinn has a very capable backup with a stronger arm and a 10-win Pro Bowl season on his resume.Zombo[/b][/color]
Not to hijack my own thread, but is anyone else surprised DA wasn't even mentioned regarding the Delhomme and McNabb situations? I guess Feeley is perceived to be better despite his lack of Pro Bowls and 10-win seasons.
Not to hijack my own thread, but is anyone else surprised DA wasn't even mentioned regarding the Delhomme and McNabb situations? I guess Feeley is perceived to be better despite his lack of Pro Bowls and 10-win seasons.
Or cheaper, or less cost.
Our last game makes DA more valuable to us...the better Brady plays, the more expendable DA becomes. The worse BQ plays, DA becomes more important to the team.
It isn't hard to understand.
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Zombo said:
Bull Phucken Shit.
He deserves ... we have to ...
No, no, no.
He needs to win and prove he deserves to be starting now.
Anderson put up 3,700 yards, 29 TDs and 10 wins his first year as a starter.
He was a sixth round pick, two training camps, four emergency starts, one year in the system, new offensive coordinator, taking over a team that was 4-13 and going 10-5 with them.
There is no good argument that Quinn needs to be babyfed or that we have to endure two more seasons of suckage because for some reason "we have to".
I thought Quinn won the job because the coaching staff decided he was better. Right here. Right now. That is what I fully expect. If you are telling me that Quinn is a two-year project that we must suffer with instead of having a better chance of winning games right now with Anderson ... then I am telling you that you are dead wrong.
I'm not giving up on Quinn. I'm saying I'm very disappointed and his window of opportunity just shrunk.
This was the guy that was the most "NFL-ready" QB prospect of his class. I'm sitting here three years later watching him dink around and play Keystone Kops while the only guy that has given me any hope at the position over the past decade dutifully backs him up.
Quinn needs to come out this week, win a football game, take command of the offense and put this shit to bed. It's in his hands.
Zombo
DAT'S WHA i'M TALKIN BOUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!...RIGHT ON THE BUTTON!!!!
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@danamal said:
Listen gimp,All you have ever talked about is your DA love crush,he's on the bench for the year get used to it.
Luv Crush???
All I'm reading this week on this board is the excuses thrown out there for BQ....and I think it's comical to read every reason as to why BQ didn't look any good on Sunday...OK I'll give him his shot....and I hiope he does win...very soon. but the argument is this...don't come out with this we need to invest years into a young guy....look at Ryan and Flacco., and even Sanchez for that matter... 1st and 2nd year guys with big arms and winning.....you want to say they have a defense...I'm on board with that...they get stops for their QB...this Browns D is pathetic...and the classic bitch slap from AP on that 64 yard run was ridiculous...do you think Palamalu would have gotten that?......So please just stop with the excuses for BQ...he's a grown dude, and should step up right now...if he lay's another egg this week...and I mean a big egg....he should gte a short leach from Mangini....
I'll give your boy his chance,...but I don't have to like seeing passes thrown backwards...???/a true Garo moment...
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