Tale of the Tape - Browns vs Steelers
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I'm looking at these numbers and I'm trying to figure out how the Steelers are 6-3. They rank in the bottom 10 in every category.....except takeaways. So....I guess teams GIVE them wins.
With Watson out, Tomlin is going to think that we'll need to run the ball in order to win. So he will sell out to stop the run. And on passing downs he'll blitz the rookie QB and attack our backup Tackles. So, what do we do? Do we take the bait and try to beat them with the pass (when we don't actually have a passing game)? Or do we bite the bullet and try to impose our will in the running game?
Let's just say that we're not going to make the playoffs because of the loss of our QB (RT, LT, RB, etc.).....then there is no bigger game on the schedule than this one. The hated Steelers....at home! More need not be said.
BEING A BROWNS FAN IS A TEST TO SEE HOW MUCH YOU CAN TAKE -
It’s going to be hard for the browns to miss the playoffs especially with a win.
They will naturally bring the heat on DTR, and stack the box. What we’ve seen with stefanski though, he’s not going to be scared to call pass plays - a few completions and it’ll open things up. I’d hope not to see 30 attempts though.
One thing I thought about DTR the first game was that he looked quick and decisive with where he wanted to throw the ball, which will be necessary with the Steelers. Though his quick decision making doesn’t make up for bad decisions and inaccurate throws.
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I put this in the DTR thread earlier today, but this seems like a more appropriate place to put thoughts and potential concerns about the matchup this week.
At least DTR will have some practices to establish some degree of chemistry with the starting Receivers before the game this time.
The thing I'm most worried about is the strength of Pittsburgh's Defense is their Edge Rushers with the reality the Browns are counting on backup Tackles to stop them. 1st thought is gee, what could go wrong? Having said that, is it possible to play any worse than Wills did the last time Cleveland faced Pittsburgh? At the RT spot Jack Conklin was supposed to play this year - the Browns could be missing his backup Dawand Jones to give the 3rd man on the depth chart (James Hudson) his second consecutive start. As scary as that sounds, Jones' 1st NFL start was quite a learning experience on pass pro against TJ Watt. He's been pretty impressive since then; so it would be nice if the Browns could get him back out there.
As bad as all that sounds, one of the commentators in last week's game said the 1st place Ratbirds were leading the NFL in sacks. The good news is the 2 backup Tackles/running game, veteran QB and Cleveland Defense didn't allow all that to beat them. Unfortunately the Browns aren't going to have an experienced QB this week; but that doesn't change the reality that this is still a run 1st football team. As horrible as it was to lose Chubb in week 2 - the Browns have continued to do well running the ball with Hunt and Ford; while Pierre Strong has shown he can make valuable contributions as well. This time around for DTR, he'll have enough practices with the starters and plays within game plan to feel far more prepared than the 1st time.
I imagine the talk on all the sports media is going to be how much fun Pittsburgh's Defense is going to have with all the possibilities and opportunities that are seemingly lining up to favor them in the matchup. The 2 things that should not change are the Browns' ability to run the ball and perform like a top rated defense. The 1st time Cleveland played Pittsburgh, Pittsburgh's defense scored 2 TDs against the Browns' passing game. The team that stayed more patient with who they are on offense won the game. I get the feeling a lot of Pittsburgh's wins this year are because of this. Let's hope the Browns learned from that 1st matchup. If memory serves me right, they only lost by 4 points on the road there. Let's see what happens...
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Why DTR? I think I have an idea.
edit: @flugel per your request, buddy.
This is a look the Browns have been incredibly slow to build their offense around. We've dabbled, from my memory in the Ravens game last year a bit... and that's about it so far. But this past Sunday it was something we ran quite extensively, and to great effect when we weren't mis-identifying where Kyle Hamilton was and it role within the Baltimore defense.
A split zone look usually means you'll have a TE, FB, UB, Hback, from the play side cross the formation and kickout the backside edge. With the adjustment off that being either a chip or a fake to a route. The Browns added another wrinkle pre-snap with motion, something they've added extensively this past Sunday with Watson.
---------------------------------------------------------------
You'll have your front side zone steps, but in this one, instead of blocking Clowney backside, we're going to unblock him and read off of his play. If he stays flat, you give to Ford. If he crashes, then Watson pulls, from which point you get a sort of built in RPO.
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The wrinkle being, that Jordan Akins is the motion man, and on the snap, Njoku crosses the line as the TE that would be kicking out the backside edge. This accomplishes a couple things in the passing game.
- Forces LB's to flow with the extra receiver
- Forces either a safety to declare, spin down and pickup the receiver.
- Forces a sight adjust by the defense, where the corner stays flat to pickup Adkins, and turns Coop over to the safety.
In the running game
- Forces LBs to stay flat footed and read, because the mesh point is so cloudy, they also have to compensate for the fact Watson could pull this ball and Njoku could turn into a lead blocker on a QB read/keep.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Obviously, Clowney stayed flat and Watson handed the ball off.
That means you have + blockers on - defenders (including the RB) Allowing your QB to help you in the running game, of sorts, without actually running your traditional options. Now, later in the game we ran a power read look, similar to what the Ravens do with Lamar. Only difference there is that it wasn't an actual read. It was a designed give the whole way, but designed to freeze the Ravens edge pressure.
Because we know they LOVE to send those 3 deep, 3 under fire pressures. Especially using Kyle Hamilton off the edge as their de-facto 3rd LB or big nickel.
In that same screenshot above, you also get to structure quicker developing pass players where, the run action forces the defense to work horizontally, you can layer in routes that exploit both side to side but also downfield a bit behind LB's and underneath DB's.
It's an incredibly difficult look to defend with a lot of window dressing that can emphasize route diversity. And what sucks the most about Watson being hurt, is that even with our Oline injuries, we really got to start seeing glimpses of what both Deshaun AND this offensive philosophy look like in Cleveland. And that glimpse was putting the most points up on the Ravens that they've surrendered all season. More than Cincy, more than DET, more than future OROY C.J. Stroud and the Texans.
This is a link to a UCLA enthusiast about their version of split zone, called "midline". Basically the usual SZ, just how they differ in their halfback alignment from offset shotgun.
https://247sports.com/college/ucla/Article/UCLA-Playbook-Midline-Part-3-Split-Zone-163738858/
It's something I mentioned Jacoby had experience running in Miami... here.
Barring a terrible set-back of some kind, these are offensive concepts DTR has a great deal of experience running. Granted, that was at UCLA and the college level. His first outing was awful. But that was 8 weeks ago, he's had plenty of time to take snaps, watch film and begin adjusting to be a more prepared AND effective player. The coaching staff also clearly has signaled that this should be (again, barring something insane happening) a large part of the play calling features moving forward starting this Sunday. Which is exactly why DTR is getting the nod.
We've seen P.J. cling to reads, deep to short, and miss the open man directly in front of him. With DTR's legs, you can incorporate more of these reads and more short to intermediate throws while getting him (safely) on the run where he can pickup yards with his wheels while protecting himself. This just also coincides with the Steelers losing their top 2 ILB's. So this split zone looks that froze Quan and Queen should likely be every bit as important against a backup unit.
Still, it's CLE v PIT. The Steelers coaches will have their adjustments ready. But at least I have an idea as to what we should be expecting from our coaches. And I can say this - it isn't something rooted in fear. You can play conservatively, while also being a bit bold at the same time. Turning this over to the rookie and asking him to execute as he just saw last week is ballsy.
Eliminate the turnovers, and for the love of Christ, Delpit, don't surrender a 74 yard TD.... and this is a winnable game of field position and attrition.
-
Why DTR? I think I have an idea.
edit: @flugel per your request, buddy.
This is a look the Browns have been incredibly slow to build their offense around. We've dabbled, from my memory in the Ravens game last year a bit... and that's about it so far. But this past Sunday it was something we ran quite extensively, and to great effect when we weren't mis-identifying where Kyle Hamilton was and it role within the Baltimore defense.
A split zone look usually means you'll have a TE, FB, UB, Hback, from the play side cross the formation and kickout the backside edge. With the adjustment off that being either a chip or a fake to a route. The Browns added another wrinkle pre-snap with motion, something they've added extensively this past Sunday with Watson.
---------------------------------------------------------------
You'll have your front side zone steps, but in this one, instead of blocking Clowney backside, we're going to unblock him and read off of his play. If he stays flat, you give to Ford. If he crashes, then Watson pulls, from which point you get a sort of built in RPO.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The wrinkle being, that Jordan Akins is the motion man, and on the snap, Njoku crosses the line as the TE that would be kicking out the backside edge. This accomplishes a couple things in the passing game.
- Forces LB's to flow with the extra receiver
- Forces either a safety to declare, spin down and pickup the receiver.
- Forces a sight adjust by the defense, where the corner stays flat to pickup Adkins, and turns Coop over to the safety.
In the running game
- Forces LBs to stay flat footed and read, because the mesh point is so cloudy, they also have to compensate for the fact Watson could pull this ball and Njoku could turn into a lead blocker on a QB read/keep.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Obviously, Clowney stayed flat and Watson handed the ball off.
That means you have + blockers on - defenders (including the RB) Allowing your QB to help you in the running game, of sorts, without actually running your traditional options. Now, later in the game we ran a power read look, similar to what the Ravens do with Lamar. Only difference there is that it wasn't an actual read. It was a designed give the whole way, but designed to freeze the Ravens edge pressure.
Because we know they LOVE to send those 3 deep, 3 under fire pressures. Especially using Kyle Hamilton off the edge as their de-facto 3rd LB or big nickel.
In that same screenshot above, you also get to structure quicker developing pass players where, the run action forces the defense to work horizontally, you can layer in routes that exploit both side to side but also downfield a bit behind LB's and underneath DB's.
It's an incredibly difficult look to defend with a lot of window dressing that can emphasize route diversity. And what sucks the most about Watson being hurt, is that even with our Oline injuries, we really got to start seeing glimpses of what both Deshaun AND this offensive philosophy look like in Cleveland. And that glimpse was putting the most points up on the Ravens that they've surrendered all season. More than Cincy, more than DET, more than future OROY C.J. Stroud and the Texans.
This is a link to a UCLA enthusiast about their version of split zone, called "midline". Basically the usual SZ, just how they differ in their halfback alignment from offset shotgun.
https://247sports.com/college/ucla/Article/UCLA-Playbook-Midline-Part-3-Split-Zone-163738858/
It's something I mentioned Jacoby had experience running in Miami... here.
Barring a terrible set-back of some kind, these are offensive concepts DTR has a great deal of experience running. Granted, that was at UCLA and the college level. His first outing was awful. But that was 8 weeks ago, he's had plenty of time to take snaps, watch film and begin adjusting to be a more prepared AND effective player. The coaching staff also clearly has signaled that this should be (again, barring something insane happening) a large part of the play calling features moving forward starting this Sunday. Which is exactly why DTR is getting the nod.
We've seen P.J. cling to reads, deep to short, and miss the open man directly in front of him. With DTR's legs, you can incorporate more of these reads and more short to intermediate throws while getting him (safely) on the run where he can pickup yards with his wheels while protecting himself. This just also coincides with the Steelers losing their top 2 ILB's. So this split zone looks that froze Quan and Queen should likely be every bit as important against a backup unit.
Still, it's CLE v PIT. The Steelers coaches will have their adjustments ready. But at least I have an idea as to what we should be expecting from our coaches. And I can say this - it isn't something rooted in fear. You can play conservatively, while also being a bit bold at the same time. Turning this over to the rookie and asking him to execute as he just saw last week is ballsy.
Eliminate the turnovers, and for the love of Christ, Delpit, don't surrender a 74 yard TD.... and this is a winnable game of field position and attrition.
Why DTR? I think I have an idea.
edit: @flugel per your request, buddy.
This is a look the Browns have been incredibly slow to build their offense around. We've dabbled, from my memory in the Ravens game last year a bit... and that's about it so far. But this past Sunday it was something we ran quite extensively, and to great effect when we weren't mis-identifying where Kyle Hamilton was and it role within the Baltimore defense.
A split zone look usually means you'll have a TE, FB, UB, Hback, from the play side cross the formation and kickout the backside edge. With the adjustment off that being either a chip or a fake to a route. The Browns added another wrinkle pre-snap with motion, something they've added extensively this past Sunday with Watson.
---------------------------------------------------------------
You'll have your front side zone steps, but in this one, instead of blocking Clowney backside, we're going to unblock him and read off of his play. If he stays flat, you give to Ford. If he crashes, then Watson pulls, from which point you get a sort of built in RPO.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The wrinkle being, that Jordan Akins is the motion man, and on the snap, Njoku crosses the line as the TE that would be kicking out the backside edge. This accomplishes a couple things in the passing game.
- Forces LB's to flow with the extra receiver
- Forces either a safety to declare, spin down and pickup the receiver.
- Forces a sight adjust by the defense, where the corner stays flat to pickup Adkins, and turns Coop over to the safety.
In the running game
- Forces LBs to stay flat footed and read, because the mesh point is so cloudy, they also have to compensate for the fact Watson could pull this ball and Njoku could turn into a lead blocker on a QB read/keep.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Obviously, Clowney stayed flat and Watson handed the ball off.
That means you have + blockers on - defenders (including the RB) Allowing your QB to help you in the running game, of sorts, without actually running your traditional options. Now, later in the game we ran a power read look, similar to what the Ravens do with Lamar. Only difference there is that it wasn't an actual read. It was a designed give the whole way, but designed to freeze the Ravens edge pressure.
Because we know they LOVE to send those 3 deep, 3 under fire pressures. Especially using Kyle Hamilton off the edge as their de-facto 3rd LB or big nickel.
In that same screenshot above, you also get to structure quicker developing pass players where, the run action forces the defense to work horizontally, you can layer in routes that exploit both side to side but also downfield a bit behind LB's and underneath DB's.
It's an incredibly difficult look to defend with a lot of window dressing that can emphasize route diversity. And what sucks the most about Watson being hurt, is that even with our Oline injuries, we really got to start seeing glimpses of what both Deshaun AND this offensive philosophy look like in Cleveland. And that glimpse was putting the most points up on the Ravens that they've surrendered all season. More than Cincy, more than DET, more than future OROY C.J. Stroud and the Texans.
This is a link to a UCLA enthusiast about their version of split zone, called "midline". Basically the usual SZ, just how they differ in their halfback alignment from offset shotgun.
https://247sports.com/college/ucla/Article/UCLA-Playbook-Midline-Part-3-Split-Zone-163738858/
It's something I mentioned Jacoby had experience running in Miami... here.
Barring a terrible set-back of some kind, these are offensive concepts DTR has a great deal of experience running. Granted, that was at UCLA and the college level. His first outing was awful. But that was 8 weeks ago, he's had plenty of time to take snaps, watch film and begin adjusting to be a more prepared AND effective player. The coaching staff also clearly has signaled that this should be (again, barring something insane happening) a large part of the play calling features moving forward starting this Sunday. Which is exactly why DTR is getting the nod.
We've seen P.J. cling to reads, deep to short, and miss the open man directly in front of him. With DTR's legs, you can incorporate more of these reads and more short to intermediate throws while getting him (safely) on the run where he can pickup yards with his wheels while protecting himself. This just also coincides with the Steelers losing their top 2 ILB's. So this split zone looks that froze Quan and Queen should likely be every bit as important against a backup unit.
Still, it's CLE v PIT. The Steelers coaches will have their adjustments ready. But at least I have an idea as to what we should be expecting from our coaches. And I can say this - it isn't something rooted in fear. You can play conservatively, while also being a bit bold at the same time. Turning this over to the rookie and asking him to execute as he just saw last week is ballsy.
Eliminate the turnovers, and for the love of Christ, Delpit, don't surrender a 74 yard TD.... and this is a winnable game of field position and attrition.
Great job of putting that together for us T! Thank you. Loved the new wrinkles you mentioned. From the wise use of the split zone formations to the long overdue and extremely welcomed motion. It was nice to see that made Patrick Queen and Roquan Smith have to think and question what may be coming this time around. Your 4th screen shot showing 6 blockers + 1 RB on 5 hats reminds/shows people the Browns can matchup even with a team that was leading the NFL in sacks.
One of my friends has a tendency to blame everything on the play calling; and sometimes that is correct. I can't tell you how many times I've asked him - have you ever considered a big reason the play calling looks bad is the design of the offense. In recent weeks he finally agreed the offensive design needed improvement. It's so refreshing to see the work this coaching staff put into the design of the offense with the pre-snap formations and wrinkles. After starting the game down by 14 points - there were was some complaining taking place about Watson on the game thread in here. Having said that, I don't remember reading a lot of complaints about the play calling throughout the game. JMO, I think the formations used for the matchup helped perpetuate very doable play calling throughout the game. The thread is still available.
In a week our fanbase is looking/hoping for chance to win this Sunday, it would be nice to see these formations creating favorable numbers again for the offense in areas of the defense/field the Browns want to attack. We shall see...
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Looks like we get the Browns v. Pittsburg game from sea to shining sea, as it should be.
https://506sports.com/nfl.php?yr=2023&wk=11
There are notable omissions in states where people ski a lot, states that grow a lotta citrus, that state where everything is bigger, and Tennessee.
Bad pick up line: hey baby, you must be from Memphis, cuz you’re the only ten I see…
Most of New Mexico gets to see the Browns game. New Mexicans love the Browns. Some of the old ones do too.
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Looks like we get the Browns v. Pittsburg game from sea to shining sea, as it should be.
https://506sports.com/nfl.php?yr=2023&wk=11
There are notable omissions in states where people ski a lot, states that grow a lotta citrus, that state where everything is bigger, and Tennessee.
Bad pick up line: hey baby, you must be from Memphis, cuz you’re the only ten I see…
Most of New Mexico gets to see the Browns game. New Mexicans love the Browns. Some of the old ones do too.
Looks like we get the Browns v. Pittsburg game from sea to shining sea, as it should be.
Apparently the Gulf Coast no longer includes the Country of Texas in sea to shining sea. Should I stop paying US Income taxes or at least find a way to devalue my property like some unknown persons have done? LOL!?
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Looks like we get the Browns v. Pittsburg game from sea to shining sea, as it should be.
Apparently the Gulf Coast no longer includes the Country of Texas in sea to shining sea. Should I stop paying US Income taxes or at least find a way to devalue my property like some unknown persons have done? LOL!?
Apparently the Gulf Coast no longer includes the Country of Texas in sea to shining sea. Should I stop paying US Income taxes or at least find a way to devalue my property like some unknown persons have done? LOL!?
Absolutely. Stick it to the man!
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Alaska will be watching. Lets win one for the Alaskan Browns fans!
Juneau that’s right!
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Juneau that’s right!
Is that Italian for the month of June??
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Juneau that’s right!
Is that Italian for the month of June??
Is that Italian for the month of June??
In Italian its "U know".. In Spanish its Juneau!
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Minkah Fitzpatrick
Charles LeClaire-USA TODAY SportsDid not practice (hamstring)
Game status: OUT
Minkah Fitzpatrick
Charles LeClaire-USA TODAY Sports
Did not practice (hamstring)
Game status: OUT
I have absolutely no idea why this happens, but every time l see this guy’s name, Minkah, l get a wild compulsion to do the name game song.
Minkah minkah bo binkah, banana fana fo finkah…
It’s not as fun as Chuck, but few names are.
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Minkah Fitzpatrick
Charles LeClaire-USA TODAY Sports
Did not practice (hamstring)
Game status: OUT
I have absolutely no idea why this happens, but every time l see this guy’s name, Minkah, l get a wild compulsion to do the name game song.
Minkah minkah bo binkah, banana fana fo finkah…
It’s not as fun as Chuck, but few names are.
I have absolutely no idea why this happens, but every time l see this guy’s name, Minkah, l get a wild compulsion to do the name game song.
Minkah minkah bo binkah, banana fana fo finkah…
It’s not as fun as Chuck, but few names are.
LOL. I have no fucking idea
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I have absolutely no idea why this happens, but every time l see this guy’s name, Minkah, l get a wild compulsion to do the name game song.
Minkah minkah bo binkah, banana fana fo finkah…
It’s not as fun as Chuck, but few names are.
LOL. I have no fucking idea
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Considering all the fouls Hudson commits, this improves our odds considerably:
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Ran into a guy who is a Steelers season ticket holder today and he mentioned that the Steelers have two linebackers and both safeties out for this game too.
Callahan/ Stef & Van Pelt, need a better plan of moving DTR than they did vs the Rats.
DT Montravius Adams whom replaced Cam Hayward is now out. We won't be lucky to miss Cam Hayward (groin) playing in this game. Wisconsin Rookie K. Benton played more snaps than Adams did in week 3
He's Correct..
No. 31 S Keanu Neal (Rib) - Out
No. 39 S Minkah Fitzpatrick (Hamstring) - Out
No. 57 DT Montravius Adams (Ankle) - Out
No. 88 TE Pat Freiermuth * (Hamstring) - QuestionableFree safety Minkah Fitzpatrick missed practice all week and has been ruled out, missing his third straight game with a hamstring injury.
That isn't the only injury the team is dealing with at safety, though.
Strong safety Keanu Neal, who has started eight games this season, has also been ruled out after missing practice all week with a rib injury.
In addition, nose tackle Montravius Adams will also miss Sunday's game, ruled out with an ankle injury and not playing for the second straight week.
With Adams out, look for rookie Keeanu Benton to step up again.
At the safety spot, Trenton Thompson was elevated last week from the practice squad for the game against the Packers.
The team will also be dealing with injuries at inside linebacker that have been mounting over the last few weeks, with both Kwon Alexander and Cole Holcomb on the Reserve/Injured List.
With just Elandon Roberts and Mark Robinson on the 53-man roster at the linebacker spot, there is the potential that veteran linebacker Mykal Walker could be called upon from the practice squad.
The Browns list Thornhill & Goodwin as Out.. Jones & M.Dunn as questionable
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I would rather see Watson, who is 0-3 against PIT.
Steelers are a bad team. They pull wins out of their ass and get help from the officials.
I expect CLE to win this one.
Consider the Ravens, They do not sow or reap, they have no storeroom or barn; yet God feeds them. And how much more valuable are you to God than the Ravens? Book of Luke, Chapter 12, Verse 24.
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