A look at the second round
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@.mz said:
Can we not wonder why one of our round two picks fails to DRESS as part of a shitty receiver group?He was supposedly "NFL-ready." Whoops.
This is a little perplexing. How is Hartline playing in Miami and Robiskie inactive? I'm a diehard Buckeye fan and I can't for the life of me explain this.
Either we are the suckiest bunch of sucks who ever sucked or Robiskie is a poser....or both. Damnit.
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The major flaw in your logic is that rookies can come in and make an immediate impact. Especially with OL and WRs. There is a reason that excellent stats and contributions are relative to a player's tenure in the league. "That's pretty good. For a rookie". Rookies' main jobs are to look, listen, and learn. They will develope. The fact that ANYBODY is pissed about our draft after 3 games is just baseless misdirected anger towards the team. He is obviously building for the future and so this thread should be post-poned until this time next year.
The major flaw in your logic is that rookies can come in and make an immediate impact. ha ha ha ha WOW.....Second rounders have to be impactful immediately....unless your as deep as the pats. 3 of ours don't start. it is fact. Man you drink the koolaid
The major flaw in your logic is that rookies can come in and make an immediate impact. ha ha ha ha WOW.....Second rounders have to be impactful immediately....unless your as deep as the pats. 3 of ours don't start. it is fact. Man you drink the koolaid
Why don't you give me one example of a single 2nd round pick that has EVER come in as a rookie and made and impact on a team that was considered the worst in the league at the time?
Second rounders have to be impactful immediately
Really? They have to? You are one of those guys that is in love with draft position and hype. That is fine if you're a fan but if you're actually building a team, that shit doesn't matter. And what in the hell is wrong with rookies sitting on the bench in the 3rd week of the season?!?!?!?! It's week 3!!! And the ONLY time you start rookies is when you are AS GOOD AS THE PATS. That's why they actually do it! You can say you would have done it differently but to start bashing an orginization because they made different decisions than you, the fan would have; is just not that mature.We have completely lost perspective on what is expected from rookies. They are nothing but prospects with varying degrees of potential. (which is why we need a rookie cap). With all of the hype around the draft and the occaional rookie sensation, you have a skewed view of the reality of an NFL football team. Re-read all of my rookie posts. I'm not gong to re-type another logical explanation of the details to an overly-emotional fan.
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Why don't you give me one example of a single 2nd round pick that has EVER come in as a rookie and made and impact on a team that was considered the worst in the league at the time? I'll compile a huge fkn list...but I do not have time right now! I'm talking about starting as a second round pick
And the ONLY time you start rookies is when you are AS GOOD AS THE PATS. That's why they actually do it! WRONG, that's the team that can afford to sit and develop....assbackwards as usual.
you have a skewed view of the reality of an NFL football team. Re-read all of my rookie posts. I'm not gong to re-type another logical explanation of the details to an overly-emotional fan. Re-read your ass backward posts...no thanks. Logical? Far from it!
You think I'm overly emotional...lol Call like I see it, you call it like you've taken too much acid.
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What makes me wonder is what do you expect out of a bunch of rookies playing on a terrible team? TO FKN PLAY!
I'm worried about you.....hurt there development....couldn't be farther from the truth!
What makes me wonder is what do you expect out of a bunch of rookies playing on a terrible team? TO FKN PLAY!
I'm worried about you.....hurt there development....couldn't be farther from the truth!
So coach should throw in these kids that are not ready to play or just not good enough yet so that Solon16 can see them play? You hear that coach?! Solon wants to see them play! Forget what you know! Solon wants to see them play! That's as good enough a reason as any. Hey, it worked for Brady Quah....errr......wait a minute?
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Why don't you give me one example of a single 2nd round pick that has EVER come in as a rookie and made and impact on a team that was considered the worst in the league at the time? I'll compile a huge fkn list...but I do not have time right now! I'm talking about starting as a second round pick
And the ONLY time you start rookies is when you are AS GOOD AS THE PATS. That's why they actually do it! WRONG, that's the team that can afford to sit and develop....assbackwards as usual.
you have a skewed view of the reality of an NFL football team. Re-read all of my rookie posts. I'm not gong to re-type another logical explanation of the details to an overly-emotional fan. Re-read your ass backward posts...no thanks. Logical? Far from it!
You think I'm overly emotional...lol Call like I see it, you call it like you've taken too much acid.
Why don't you give me one example of a single 2nd round pick that has EVER come in as a rookie and made and impact on a team that was considered the worst in the league at the time? I'll compile a huge fkn list...but I do not have time right now! I'm talking about starting as a second round pick
And the ONLY time you start rookies is when you are AS GOOD AS THE PATS. That's why they actually do it! WRONG, that's the team that can afford to sit and develop....assbackwards as usual.
you have a skewed view of the reality of an NFL football team. Re-read all of my rookie posts. I'm not gong to re-type another logical explanation of the details to an overly-emotional fan. Re-read your ass backward posts...no thanks. Logical? Far from it!
You think I'm overly emotional...lol Call like I see it, you call it like you've taken too much acid.
I didn't ask for a "huge fk'n list" I only wanted one example but whatever.
Homey, if you put raw rookies in on a bad team you'll get bad rookies. That's like having a bad dog and getting another one so he will behave. You know what you get? Two bad dogs. Good teams do it because they have a system in place with vets and continuity from top to bottom. I'm not really sure why you have such a huge problem with that? Oh wait, that's right. You just want to see them play. Okay nevermind I get it. The acid has worn off and I now realize that I make no sense. I concede.
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What makes me wonder is what do you expect out of a bunch of rookies playing on a terrible team? TO FKN PLAY!
I'm worried about you.....hurt there development....couldn't be farther from the truth!
So coach should throw in these kids that are not ready to play or just not good enough yet so that Solon16 can see them play? You hear that coach?! Solon wants to see them play! Forget what you know! Solon wants to see them play! That's as good enough a reason as any. Hey, it worked for Brady Quah....errr......wait a minute?
So coach should throw in these kids that are not ready to play or just not good enough yet so that Solon16 can see them play? You hear that coach?! Solon wants to see them play! Forget what you know! Solon wants to see them play! That's as good enough a reason as any. Hey, it worked for Brady Quah....errr......wait a minute?
not ready to play or just not good enough.... Boy you don't understand the point....but you just made mine. and BQ sat for three years because he isn't good enough...ie talent evaluation is the reason the Browns are where they are.
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Good teams sit there rookies...for the most part... because they are good. Bad teams play there rookies because they are bad thus second round picks SHOULD be able to displace the crap on the field on a 4-12 team...I really am confused as to why you even debate this fact...
We will just go off the top of my head on this years second rounders who play/start....Alonso Smith Denver CB, Evette Brown DE Carolina, rey maualuga LB Cincy, Lesean McCoy RB Phily,Paul Kruger DE Baltimore, Sean Smith CB Miami,Louis Delmas S Detroit, James Laurinitis LB Stl, Eben Britton RT Jax, Connor Barwin OLB Texans, Andy Levitre OT Buffalo, Phil Loadholt RT Minn......want more? three Pats see spot duty all second rounders Ron Brace NT, Darius Butler CB, Patrick Chung S.......OK?
All second rounders starting or playing alot of football with teams that had ONE second round pick...save NE, we have THREE sitting! These are JUST from this years draft....I guess I'm the only one on this board who thinks your wrong as hell. Has nothing to do with ME wanting to see them....has to do with the scary possibility that this Regime can't draft for shit.....which is exactly why this team has sucked for a decade....of the first 10 drafts we've missed on the first three picks in every draft... almost universally. 4 of 30 were any good....and I reluctantly put BE in there and Kam wimbley.
You are dilusional to think we should sit 3 second round picks on a 4-12 team. But you have your reasons....which make no sense to me.
P.S. you obviously don't follow the draft....I've watched gavel to gavel evr since it's been on air...you are dead wrong.
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Third Rounders playing/starting Jason Williams OLB Dallas, Glen Coffee RB SF, Antoine Caldwell OG Texans, Louis Vasquez OG San Diego, Kraig Urbik OT Steelers, Derrick Williams wr Detroit, Deandre Levy OLB Detroit, Mike Wallace wr Steelers, Jared Cook TE Titans, Jeraud Powers CB Indianapolis, Deon Butler wr seattle......................THIRD ROUNDERS in THIS years draft
We will NEVER be good without good talent evaluators....but like some dumasses on this board with the "a scouts a scout" mentality......JUNK.
GM's and scouting dept, have to hit atleast 60% in the first three rounds to be a consistently good team(PITT and NE)....we have been (7.5%)consistently HORRIFIC.
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I know you liked Glen Coffee, but you can't put him in that list. He is starting because of an injury. Through in that he couldn't move the chains when SF needed him to in order to kill the clock this past week against MIN, and I would be leary of trotting him out as some kind of great 3rd round pick at this point.
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I know you liked Glen Coffee, but you can't put him in that list. He is starting because of an injury. Through in that he couldn't move the chains when SF needed him to in order to kill the clock this past week against MIN, and I would be leary of trotting him out as some kind of great 3rd round pick at this point.
Masters said:
I know you liked Glen Coffee, but you can't put him in that list. He is starting because of an injury. Through in that he couldn't move the chains when SF needed him to in order to kill the clock this past week against MIN, and I would be leary of trotting him out as some kind of great 3rd round pick at this point.He played before the injury...has nothing to do with my point...but thanks for your two cents...you need change
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Third Rounders playing/starting Jason Williams OLB Dallas, Glen Coffee RB SF, Antoine Caldwell OG Texans, Louis Vasquez OG San Diego, Kraig Urbik OT Steelers, Derrick Williams wr Detroit, Deandre Levy OLB Detroit, Mike Wallace wr Steelers, Jared Cook TE Titans, Jeraud Powers CB Indianapolis, Deon Butler wr seattle......................THIRD ROUNDERS in THIS years draft
We will NEVER be good without good talent evaluators....but like some dumasses on this board with the "a scouts a scout" mentality......JUNK.
GM's and scouting dept, have to hit atleast 60% in the first three rounds to be a consistently good team(PITT and NE)....we have been (7.5%)consistently HORRIFIC.
Third Rounders playing/starting Jason Williams OLB Dallas, Glen Coffee RB SF, Antoine Caldwell OG Texans, Louis Vasquez OG San Diego, Kraig Urbik OT Steelers, Derrick Williams wr Detroit, Deandre Levy OLB Detroit, Mike Wallace wr Steelers, Jared Cook TE Titans, Jeraud Powers CB Indianapolis, Deon Butler wr seattle......................THIRD ROUNDERS in THIS years draft
We will NEVER be good without good talent evaluators....but like some dumasses on this board with the "a scouts a scout" mentality......JUNK.
GM's and scouting dept, have to hit atleast 60% in the first three rounds to be a consistently good team(PITT and NE)....we have been (7.5%)consistently HORRIFIC.
Why do you have such a hard time understanding that each team is different? When was the last time the entire league finished 8-8, had the same level of talent in every position, the same type and number of injuries, ran the same sytstem on O and D, and drafted the exact same positions in every round? Here I'll help you, NEVER! Each team is different. Wrap your head around that if you can, I know it sometimes hurts but we have faith in you.
You keep complaining about the terrible GM and coach and you have NOTHING to base this on. Don't hang your hat on 0-3 because our QB sucked and this is the defenition of a rebuilding year so that just doesn't hold up. It seems that anyone who loves Brady and his bedroom eyes has turned on the coach and GM. You can no longer say Brady's the man and so now you are saying the regime needs to get canned, again, based on nothing. It is WAY too early to declare our draft a bust. Why you are so hung up on this issue I may never understand. Oh wait that's right, you just want to see them play. Nevermind. My bad, that is a great reason. Discard this message.
PS. How much should we wager that you concentrate on the "based on nothing" and try and insult me based on that and miss the point altogether?
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@.mz said:
Can we not wonder why one of our round two picks fails to DRESS as part of a shitty receiver group?He was supposedly "NFL-ready." Whoops.
He was drafted for his great hands and he dropped too many in training camp. That, and neither of the two rookies can block. You will not sniff the field if you cannot block. Notice MM comes in once the team is in a throw only situation only? And that goes for ALL positions. OL, TE, WR, RB all of them. College WRs don't do much blocking at all and so to throw a kid out there who is not ready to go against NFL CBs is bad enough but when they become a liability in the running game as well, there is just no way. This discussion should be over. But I'm sure I'll get a few "why does it matter, we suck anyway" replies and to that I would say. Right, it doesn't matter, tell the players, coaches, and 99% of the fans that.
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@.mz said:
Can we not wonder why one of our round two picks fails to DRESS as part of a shitty receiver group?He was supposedly "NFL-ready." Whoops.
He was drafted for his great hands and he dropped too many in training camp. That, and neither of the two rookies can block. You will not sniff the field if you cannot block. Notice MM comes in once the team is in a throw only situation only? And that goes for ALL positions. OL, TE, WR, RB all of them. College WRs don't do much blocking at all and so to throw a kid out there who is not ready to go against NFL CBs is bad enough but when they become a liability in the running game as well, there is just no way. This discussion should be over. But I'm sure I'll get a few "why does it matter, we suck anyway" replies and to that I would say. Right, it doesn't matter, tell the players, coaches, and 99% of the fans that.
He was drafted for his great hands and he dropped too many in training camp. That, and neither of the two rookies can block. You will not sniff the field if you cannot block. Notice MM comes in once the team is in a throw only situation only? And that goes for ALL positions. OL, TE, WR, RB all of them. College WRs don't do much blocking at all and so to throw a kid out there who is not ready to go against NFL CBs is bad enough but when they become a liability in the running game as well, there is just no way. This discussion should be over. But I'm sure I'll get a few "why does it matter, we suck anyway" replies and to that I would say. Right, it doesn't matter, tell the players, coaches, and 99% of the fans that.
You make some valid points in the last couple of posts (I'd argue Solon's dissatisfaction has nothing to do with Quinn being pulled). But if you really believe MoMoss and Robiskie are not playing because of blocking, I think you are in more wishful mode than reality. Cribbs and BE can't block for shat either. There are a ton of starting NFL WR who don't block for crap.
On top of that, a WR first and primary job is a receiver, not a blocker.
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Masters said:
I know you liked Glen Coffee, but you can't put him in that list. He is starting because of an injury. Through in that he couldn't move the chains when SF needed him to in order to kill the clock this past week against MIN, and I would be leary of trotting him out as some kind of great 3rd round pick at this point.He played before the injury...has nothing to do with my point...but thanks for your two cents...you need change
He played before the injury...has nothing to do with my point...but thanks for your two cents...you need change
He hasn't been a significant contributor to SF to date, so I wouldn't be touting him as any type of example. That was my point. That would be like me noting about MoMass seeing time as a 2nd rounder.
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Masters said:
I know you liked Glen Coffee, but you can't put him in that list. He is starting because of an injury. Through in that he couldn't move the chains when SF needed him to in order to kill the clock this past week against MIN, and I would be leary of trotting him out as some kind of great 3rd round pick at this point.He played before the injury...has nothing to do with my point...but thanks for your two cents...you need change
He played before the injury...has nothing to do with my point...but thanks for your two cents...you need change
He hasn't been a significant contributor to SF to date, so I wouldn't be touting him as any type of example. That was my point. That would be like me noting about MoMass seeing time as a 2nd rounder.
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WOW....do you even read the thread or just follow me around and point out 1 questionable mistake I made in mentioning a THIRD rounder who plays? I answered Mop's question and conclusively made my point. Should I go back in draft history and pull the same amount of second rounders who play/start/impact their teams while our 3 sit the bench? you son are a quibbler
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Third Rounders playing/starting Jason Williams OLB Dallas, Glen Coffee RB SF, Antoine Caldwell OG Texans, Louis Vasquez OG San Diego, Kraig Urbik OT Steelers, Derrick Williams wr Detroit, Deandre Levy OLB Detroit, Mike Wallace wr Steelers, Jared Cook TE Titans, Jeraud Powers CB Indianapolis, Deon Butler wr seattle......................THIRD ROUNDERS in THIS years draft
We will NEVER be good without good talent evaluators....but like some dumasses on this board with the "a scouts a scout" mentality......JUNK.
GM's and scouting dept, have to hit atleast 60% in the first three rounds to be a consistently good team(PITT and NE)....we have been (7.5%)consistently HORRIFIC.
Why do you have such a hard time understanding that each team is different? When was the last time the entire league finished 8-8, had the same level of talent in every position, the same type and number of injuries, ran the same sytstem on O and D, and drafted the exact same positions in every round? Here I'll help you, NEVER! Each team is different. Wrap your head around that if you can, I know it sometimes hurts but we have faith in you.
You keep complaining about the terrible GM and coach and you have NOTHING to base this on. Don't hang your hat on 0-3 because our QB sucked and this is the defenition of a rebuilding year so that just doesn't hold up. It seems that anyone who loves Brady and his bedroom eyes has turned on the coach and GM. You can no longer say Brady's the man and so now you are saying the regime needs to get canned, again, based on nothing. It is WAY too early to declare our draft a bust. Why you are so hung up on this issue I may never understand. Oh wait that's right, you just want to see them play. Nevermind. My bad, that is a great reason. Discard this message.
PS. How much should we wager that you concentrate on the "based on nothing" and try and insult me based on that and miss the point altogether?
Why do you have such a hard time understanding that each team is different? When was the last time the entire league finished 8-8, had the same level of talent in every position, the same type and number of injuries, ran the same sytstem on O and D, and drafted the exact same positions in every round? Here I'll help you, NEVER! Each team is different. Wrap your head around that if you can, I know it sometimes hurts but we have faith in you.
You keep complaining about the terrible GM and coach and you have NOTHING to base this on. Don't hang your hat on 0-3 because our QB sucked and this is the defenition of a rebuilding year so that just doesn't hold up. It seems that anyone who loves Brady and his bedroom eyes has turned on the coach and GM. You can no longer say Brady's the man and so now you are saying the regime needs to get canned, again, based on nothing. It is WAY too early to declare our draft a bust. Why you are so hung up on this issue I may never understand. Oh wait that's right, you just want to see them play. Nevermind. My bad, that is a great reason. Discard this message.
PS. How much should we wager that you concentrate on the "based on nothing" and try and insult me based on that and miss the point altogether?
Hey brickhead....I made this thread...the point is second round talent should start on a 4-12 team....man your thick
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