Art Modell
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Having been born in Cleveland and having spent a few years living there for College, I can tell you one thing: Cleveland is Football.
So when you talk about Art Modell, even the average Browns fan gets a bad taste in their mouth. There's nothing good there for most folks and you certainly can't post a thread painting one of the city's most infamous villians in a positive light on this Browns forum, of all places, and expect people not to respond angrily or in a heated manner.
Cleveland takes sports personally, so when something like this happens, it wasn't just that the Browns were gone and that Cleveland didn't have a team. It was the fact that the fans were personally insulted, like someone had seduced their wives or sisters, and then laughed in their faces like it was no big deal. It might have even been worse than that, I don't know. I was just a kid when that all happened, but to the direhard fans, seeing the Ravens in the same division, and seeing them win the Superbowl in 2000, just adds even more insult to injury.
That was supposed to be OUR team. Ray Lewis was drafted in 1996. Jonathan Ogden was drafted in 1996. Two HoFers Cleveland was screwed out of. So instead Cleveland lost 5 years of football, and we've had to endure another 10 years of a pile of crap, which hopefully Holmgren and Mangini can turn around finally.
He's obviously done a lot of great things for the NFL, but what's he's done to Cleveland carries more weight than those things. I just can't see them being willing to endure the protests and vandalism that will occur if they try to induct him into Canton over the next 20 or 30 years.
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Mayor White is the villain in this story. Art was a business man, White was a politician. White said 'i can push you around all i want.' Art said 'Well, we'll just see about that.'
Anyone that thinks Art wanted to leave Cleveland is a total and complete idiot.
Mayor White is the villain in this story. Art was a business man, White was a politician. White said 'i can push you around all i want.' Art said 'Well, we'll just see about that.'
Anyone that thinks Art wanted to leave Cleveland is a total and complete idiot.
Bull, bull, bull.
White did what a prudent politician should have done: look out for the best interest of the city. He looked out for the city's priorities. And he made absolutely no promises that he broke.
Being totally objective, it was more important for Cleveland to have the 81 dates the Indians had on their schedule, and the 300 dates the Arena had on its schedule for the vitality and economic benefit of the city over the 10 dates the Browns have on their schedule. That is just a pure economic fact. White knew it. Art knew it. Art even accepted it. He wanted taken care of eventually, yes. And all that was in the works. After all, that was what the extension of the sin tax, voted on 1 day after Modell's announcement was all about.
Not only that, the entire Gateway project, and the football renovation project and the funding for both was far more a Cuyahoga County matter than a City of Cleveland matter. If you believe that politicians were to blame ( and I don't) then the primary culprits that you should have been angry at were the Commissioners who ran Gateway etc., not White.
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I agree. I hold nothing against Art at this point. What's done is done so no sense holding a grudge.
I wish the guy good health and hope he gets his HOF appointment soon.....he deserves the HOF as one of the strong contributors to the modern game.
Difference between holding a grudge, and justice. I'm with Gips on this one. Modell was in the process of getting what he wanted a renovated stadium. For those with a short attention span he was offered to get in on the Gateway deal- he declined. He held the Indians hostage for years, got all the revenue and parking had the first "luxury" boxes in the NFL, yet the guy got himself so totally overleveraged, it wasn't enough.
The Divine Justice part of it all is Artie moved (instead of selling out to Al Lerner and having the team remain in Cleveland as he should have) because he wanted to pass the franchise on to Little Davy. Well, turns out even a $50 million dollar bribe and a sickeningly sweet revenue stream from Baltimore and the State of Maryland wasn't enough to keep the booger afloat. So in the long run, Schmodell not only lost what he was trying to preserve, but he lost an immense amount of respect on the national level.
Now regarding the HOF. May he never get in. I'm of the opinion short of a few legendary owners (George Halas) owners don't belong. PERIOD. I'll puke the day Jerry Jones gets nominated. Modell is far from "legendary" unless you want to consider moving one of the most storied teams in the NFL out of town worthy of legend. One could argue since Al Davis is inducted the bar is set pretty low. But there is a morality angle. Unfortunately, you can't disinduct someone, but you think OJ would have gotten in if the Nicole thing had come up before he was eligible? And let's consider the PR angle. I can guarantee you this- with Canton being a mere hour drive from Cleveland, a potential Modell HOF induction would be ugly- REAL ugly. Check your rotten tomatoes at the gate, but if you thought those annoying vuvueletas at the World Cup were annoying, you haven't yet begun to imagine how loud the "Go to Hell, Modell" chants would be. They'd have to keep his bust behind 12" bulletproof glass like the Hope Diamond, and that still wouldn't stop a few folks from smearing boogers on the glass, or more foul stuff. (Use Your imagination DAWG Pounders)
Difference between holding a grudge, and justice. I'm with Gips on this one. Modell was in the process of getting what he wanted a renovated stadium. For those with a short attention span he was offered to get in on the Gateway deal- he declined. He held the Indians hostage for years, got all the revenue and parking had the first "luxury" boxes in the NFL, yet the guy got himself so totally overleveraged, it wasn't enough.
The Divine Justice part of it all is Artie moved (instead of selling out to Al Lerner and having the team remain in Cleveland as he should have) because he wanted to pass the franchise on to Little Davy. Well, turns out even a $50 million dollar bribe and a sickeningly sweet revenue stream from Baltimore and the State of Maryland wasn't enough to keep the booger afloat. So in the long run, Schmodell not only lost what he was trying to preserve, but he lost an immense amount of respect on the national level.
Now regarding the HOF. May he never get in. I'm of the opinion short of a few legendary owners (George Halas) owners don't belong. PERIOD. I'll puke the day Jerry Jones gets nominated. Modell is far from "legendary" unless you want to consider moving one of the most storied teams in the NFL out of town worthy of legend. One could argue since Al Davis is inducted the bar is set pretty low. But there is a morality angle. Unfortunately, you can't disinduct someone, but you think OJ would have gotten in if the Nicole thing had come up before he was eligible? And let's consider the PR angle. I can guarantee you this- with Canton being a mere hour drive from Cleveland, a potential Modell HOF induction would be ugly- REAL ugly. Check your rotten tomatoes at the gate, but if you thought those annoying vuvueletas at the World Cup were annoying, you haven't yet begun to imagine how loud the "Go to Hell, Modell" chants would be. They'd have to keep his bust behind 12" bulletproof glass like the Hope Diamond, and that still wouldn't stop a few folks from smearing boogers on the glass, or more foul stuff. (Use Your imagination DAWG Pounders)
It was 75 million, but, whose counting. I agree about the owners though. Ralph Wilson is in. Lamar Hunt too, but that was more for their part in creating the NFL. Halas is in more as a coach than an owner. Davis is in more as a coach/GM/ than as an owner. (He wasn't even majority owner of the Raiders until after he was inducted into the HOF). You won't see Bud Adams get in, or Georgia Frontiere, or Bill Bidwill, or Robert Irsay. Modell belongs in with that bunch, not wit the Halas's or Maras.
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Art Modell panicked after loosing 30 million in a foreign film the previous summer and the Mayor White screwed him over after deciding to get the Cavs in the downtown area instead of renovating the stadium.
If some remember, Jacobs field could of been extended for football as well, and the design was much better than old Muni.
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The unmentionable piece of garbage refused to share a stadium with the Indians.
He was a bigarse bigshot, who wanted to call the shots.
And, he consistently made bad decisions about the Browns, because it was, to him, all about him.
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Having been born in Cleveland and having spent a few years living there for College, I can tell you one thing: Cleveland is Football.
So when you talk about Art Modell, even the average Browns fan gets a bad taste in their mouth. There's nothing good there for most folks and you certainly can't post a thread painting one of the city's most infamous villians in a positive light on this Browns forum, of all places, and expect people not to respond angrily or in a heated manner.
Cleveland takes sports personally, so when something like this happens, it wasn't just that the Browns were gone and that Cleveland didn't have a team. It was the fact that the fans were personally insulted, like someone had seduced their wives or sisters, and then laughed in their faces like it was no big deal. It might have even been worse than that, I don't know. I was just a kid when that all happened, but to the direhard fans, seeing the Ravens in the same division, and seeing them win the Superbowl in 2000, just adds even more insult to injury.
That was supposed to be OUR team. Ray Lewis was drafted in 1996. Jonathan Ogden was drafted in 1996. Two HoFers Cleveland was screwed out of. So instead Cleveland lost 5 years of football, and we've had to endure another 10 years of a pile of crap, which hopefully Holmgren and Mangini can turn around finally.
He's obviously done a lot of great things for the NFL, but what's he's done to Cleveland carries more weight than those things. I just can't see them being willing to endure the protests and vandalism that will occur if they try to induct him into Canton over the next 20 or 30 years.
@Browns57:
Having been born in Cleveland and having spent a few years living there for College, I can tell you one thing: Cleveland is Football.
So when you talk about Art Modell, even the average Browns fan gets a bad taste in their mouth. There's nothing good there for most folks and you certainly can't post a thread painting one of the city's most infamous villians in a positive light on this Browns forum, of all places, and expect people not to respond angrily or in a heated manner.
Cleveland takes sports personally, so when something like this happens, it wasn't just that the Browns were gone and that Cleveland didn't have a team. It was the fact that the fans were personally insulted, like someone had seduced their wives or sisters, and then laughed in their faces like it was no big deal. It might have even been worse than that, I don't know. I was just a kid when that all happened, but to the direhard fans, seeing the Ravens in the same division, and seeing them win the Superbowl in 2000, just adds even more insult to injury.
That was supposed to be OUR team. Ray Lewis was drafted in 1996. Jonathan Ogden was drafted in 1996. Two HoFers Cleveland was screwed out of. So instead Cleveland lost 5 years of football, and we've had to endure another 10 years of a pile of crap, which hopefully Holmgren and Mangini can turn around finally.
He's obviously done a lot of great things for the NFL, but what's he's done to Cleveland carries more weight than those things. I just can't see them being willing to endure the protests and vandalism that will occur if they try to induct him into Canton over the next 20 or 30 years.
Well I did post this on THIS forum so I guess that I can! And you all responded so I guess YOU can too. As for painting him in a positive light...I don't think I did that. I think I said that I have let the hate go, that football is a business, and that I am thankful and appreciate what he has done for the game. People hate Al Davis also but if anybody would let that hatred interfere with the respect for what he has done for the game of football I would call that foolish! Anybody who knows anything about the game should meet people like these and maybe say I don't particularly care for you in some respects but thank you VERY VERY much for taking the game that we all love and making it the BEST sport in the world that it is today! At least that is my opinion.
There are many people out there who may be jerks but some of them have contributed to our culture, our way of life, our passions, our dreams, and our faith more then most of us could even dream of doing. So I say thank you to all of those motherf@@kers for making a big difference.
“The Wait Is Over, The Browns Will Be In The Playoffs This Year!" -
All said and done. Cleveland has a new Browns team and while we may not be what we once were, we are being guided by some one who can take us there. So how about we focus on what we have.
All said and done. Cleveland has a new Browns team and while we may not be what we once were, we are being guided by some one who can take us there. So how about we focus on what we have.
I agree, I believe I also mentioned something to this affect in one of my previous posts.
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I can guarantee you this- with Canton being a mere hour drive from Cleveland, a potential Modell HOF induction would be ugly- REAL ugly. Check your rotten tomatoes at the gate, but if you thought those annoying vuvueletas at the World Cup were annoying, you haven't yet begun to imagine how loud the "Go to Hell, Modell" chants would be. They'd have to keep his bust behind 12" bulletproof glass like the Hope Diamond, and that still wouldn't stop a few folks from smearing boogers on the glass, or more foul stuff. (Use Your imagination DAWG Pounders)
It would be my hope that my hometown folks would be able to show more class than that.
Really, does anyone teach their kids to do stuff like that??
It would be my hope that my hometown folks would be able to show more class than that.
Really, does anyone teach their kids to do stuff like that??
I would definately hope they would have much more class. Canton is my hometown too! I have seen so many HOF parades over the years. I saw drinking but I have never seen any disrepect towards those inducted. But with that being said I think there are a lot of idiots out there who WOULD raise their kids like that. Judging from some of this crazy hatred some might even be on this forum, but lets hope not.
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Hello Fellow Browns fans! I am new to the board, but have been reading the posts here for quite some time. This post here has compelled me to respond. I'll have you know that I am as big of a die hard Browns fan as anyone on here. Since the Browns return in 1999 my wife has grown to hate Sundays in our househould because more times than not I end up pissed off, and in a bad mood the rest of the evening, and she is a fan too! With that being said, I wanted to chime in. Bottomline... the move sucked! It should NEVER have happened! However; while Art Modell deserves the blame for not being able to capitalize on one of the most loyal fanbases in all of sports and practically running himself into bankruptcy, the city of Cleveland also must share some of the blame. For the past 50 years the people that have run this region, can't seem to get out of their own way when it comes to making decisions! We see it all of the time; letting the Flats die, bussing, scaring businesses out of here, and most recently the debacle on where to put the Medical Mart. Oh did I mention that we have the Rock N Roll Hall of Fame, yet for some reason we only get the induction ceremonies every other year or so! They chose to take care of the Indians, and the Cavs before the Browns who were much more (and still are more popular) than the other two (yes even with Lebron)! We must also blame the NFL as well for allowing this to happen. They allowed one of the most famous NFL franchises in history to move. Can you imagine what would have happened if it was the Steelers???? I certainly think our history is equally as great if not greater than that franchise considering they sucked for the first 40 some years of their existence. But I digress. The NFL also stuck it to us when they waited until last minute to announce Lerner as the owner, then they turn the knife a little more, by giving us next to nothing in the expansion draft. All of this, while Jacksonville, and Carolina got 2 years to get everything together in their front offices.
If you want a great perspective on the move to Baltimore, I ask every Browns fan to read "Fumble." It was written by a CPA who worked for Modell's Stadium Corp. His intention was not to lay blame on any of the parties in particular, but he had so many people asking him "why" and he was so upset about it, that he decided to write about it. It is a must read. It brought a lot of closure for me as far as the bitterness that I had felt toward Art Modell. Remember this Browns fans...up to that point in history we did what NO OTHER fanbase did when their teams relocated, and that was keep our name, history, and colors! Furthermore, we got our team back in 3 short years. Keep in mind Art was more than happy to shed the "Browns" name, as he wanted nothing to do with Paul Brown's name. The other teams like the Colts, Raiders, Rams and Cardinals did not leave their legacy behind. Hell, even the Oilers were the Tennessee Oilers initially until they retired the name. The Colts snuck out in the middle of the night! The misconception is that Baltimore fans gave us the middle finger when the Browns moved there, after what happened to them. In fact, just about every Ravens fan that I've talked to said that they were happy to get a team, but not at the expense of Cleveland losing the Browns, and they are happy to have their own identity, and building of their own legacy with the Ravens.
I don't really wish to see Modell in the HOF, and it will be very difficult for him to get inducted based on what happened in Cleveland. However; (and I realize a lot of fans are still angry) if he does get inducted while he is still alive, what would threatening his physical well-being solve? I mean really, people are that crazy that they would attempt to harm an 80+year old man, who is not in the best of health? Or vandalize the bust? Is it really worth the risk of going to prison? Like I said, I am as big of a Browns fan as the next person, but we have to move on! Perhaps the reason this town is so cursed, is because we can't let go of anything! We continue to dwell on the negatives! Yes there are a lot, but let's move on, and hope finally that this is a new and exciting era in Browns football! I feel that for the first time since they've been back, or since the 80s for that matter we are actually moving in the right direction.
Remember, this is just my 2 cents, my opinion, and how I've dealt with the move. I'm not here to start trouble. I'd rather fight with Steelers fans than my fellow Browns fans!
Peace, and GO BROWNS! -
@Browns57:
Having been born in Cleveland and having spent a few years living there for College, I can tell you one thing: Cleveland is Football.
So when you talk about Art Modell, even the average Browns fan gets a bad taste in their mouth. There's nothing good there for most folks and you certainly can't post a thread painting one of the city's most infamous villians in a positive light on this Browns forum, of all places, and expect people not to respond angrily or in a heated manner.
Cleveland takes sports personally, so when something like this happens, it wasn't just that the Browns were gone and that Cleveland didn't have a team. It was the fact that the fans were personally insulted, like someone had seduced their wives or sisters, and then laughed in their faces like it was no big deal. It might have even been worse than that, I don't know. I was just a kid when that all happened, but to the direhard fans, seeing the Ravens in the same division, and seeing them win the Superbowl in 2000, just adds even more insult to injury.
That was supposed to be OUR team. Ray Lewis was drafted in 1996. Jonathan Ogden was drafted in 1996. Two HoFers Cleveland was screwed out of. So instead Cleveland lost 5 years of football, and we've had to endure another 10 years of a pile of crap, which hopefully Holmgren and Mangini can turn around finally.
He's obviously done a lot of great things for the NFL, but what's he's done to Cleveland carries more weight than those things. I just can't see them being willing to endure the protests and vandalism that will occur if they try to induct him into Canton over the next 20 or 30 years.
Well I did post this on THIS forum so I guess that I can! And you all responded so I guess YOU can too. As for painting him in a positive light...I don't think I did that. I think I said that I have let the hate go, that football is a business, and that I am thankful and appreciate what he has done for the game. People hate Al Davis also but if anybody would let that hatred interfere with the respect for what he has done for the game of football I would call that foolish! Anybody who knows anything about the game should meet people like these and maybe say I don't particularly care for you in some respects but thank you VERY VERY much for taking the game that we all love and making it the BEST sport in the world that it is today! At least that is my opinion.
There are many people out there who may be jerks but some of them have contributed to our culture, our way of life, our passions, our dreams, and our faith more then most of us could even dream of doing. So I say thank you to all of those motherf@@kers for making a big difference.
Well I did post this on THIS forum so I guess that I can! And you all responded so I guess YOU can too. As for painting him in a positive light...I don't think I did that. I think I said that I have let the hate go, that football is a business, and that I am thankful and appreciate what he has done for the game. People hate Al Davis also but if anybody would let that hatred interfere with the respect for what he has done for the game of football I would call that foolish! Anybody who knows anything about the game should meet people like these and maybe say I don't particularly care for you in some respects but thank you VERY VERY much for taking the game that we all love and making it the BEST sport in the world that it is today! At least that is my opinion.
There are many people out there who may be jerks but some of them have contributed to our culture, our way of life, our passions, our dreams, and our faith more then most of us could even dream of doing. So I say thank you to all of those motherf@@kers for making a big difference.
I don't think there is one aspect of the development of football that would not have occurred had Art Modell not been around, with the possible exception of the Browns moving to the AFC. And he did that for cash. Monday Night Football, etc. all that other stuff the article mentions that he had a part of would have all occurred if Mickey McBride had still been the Browns owner, or if Robert Gries had been the Browns owner.
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The unmentionable piece of garbage refused to share a stadium with the Indians.
He was a bigarse bigshot, who wanted to call the shots.
And, he consistently made bad decisions about the Browns, because it was, to him, all about him.
The unmentionable piece of garbage refused to share a stadium with the Indians.
He was a bigarse bigshot, who wanted to call the shots.
And, he consistently made bad decisions about the Browns, because it was, to him, all about him.
He should have.....the fact is baseball stadiums and football stadiums have different requirements and design.
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I agree. I hold nothing against Art at this point. What's done is done so no sense holding a grudge.
I wish the guy good health and hope he gets his HOF appointment soon.....he deserves the HOF as one of the strong contributors to the modern game.
Difference between holding a grudge, and justice. I'm with Gips on this one. Modell was in the process of getting what he wanted a renovated stadium. For those with a short attention span he was offered to get in on the Gateway deal- he declined. He held the Indians hostage for years, got all the revenue and parking had the first "luxury" boxes in the NFL, yet the guy got himself so totally overleveraged, it wasn't enough.
The Divine Justice part of it all is Artie moved (instead of selling out to Al Lerner and having the team remain in Cleveland as he should have) because he wanted to pass the franchise on to Little Davy. Well, turns out even a $50 million dollar bribe and a sickeningly sweet revenue stream from Baltimore and the State of Maryland wasn't enough to keep the booger afloat. So in the long run, Schmodell not only lost what he was trying to preserve, but he lost an immense amount of respect on the national level.
Now regarding the HOF. May he never get in. I'm of the opinion short of a few legendary owners (George Halas) owners don't belong. PERIOD. I'll puke the day Jerry Jones gets nominated. Modell is far from "legendary" unless you want to consider moving one of the most storied teams in the NFL out of town worthy of legend. One could argue since Al Davis is inducted the bar is set pretty low. But there is a morality angle. Unfortunately, you can't disinduct someone, but you think OJ would have gotten in if the Nicole thing had come up before he was eligible? And let's consider the PR angle. I can guarantee you this- with Canton being a mere hour drive from Cleveland, a potential Modell HOF induction would be ugly- REAL ugly. Check your rotten tomatoes at the gate, but if you thought those annoying vuvueletas at the World Cup were annoying, you haven't yet begun to imagine how loud the "Go to Hell, Modell" chants would be. They'd have to keep his bust behind 12" bulletproof glass like the Hope Diamond, and that still wouldn't stop a few folks from smearing boogers on the glass, or more foul stuff. (Use Your imagination DAWG Pounders)
Difference between holding a grudge, and justice. I'm with Gips on this one. Modell was in the process of getting what he wanted a renovated stadium. For those with a short attention span he was offered to get in on the Gateway deal- he declined. He held the Indians hostage for years, got all the revenue and parking had the first "luxury" boxes in the NFL, yet the guy got himself so totally overleveraged, it wasn't enough.
The Divine Justice part of it all is Artie moved (instead of selling out to Al Lerner and having the team remain in Cleveland as he should have) because he wanted to pass the franchise on to Little Davy. Well, turns out even a $50 million dollar bribe and a sickeningly sweet revenue stream from Baltimore and the State of Maryland wasn't enough to keep the booger afloat. So in the long run, Schmodell not only lost what he was trying to preserve, but he lost an immense amount of respect on the national level.
Now regarding the HOF. May he never get in. I'm of the opinion short of a few legendary owners (George Halas) owners don't belong. PERIOD. I'll puke the day Jerry Jones gets nominated. Modell is far from "legendary" unless you want to consider moving one of the most storied teams in the NFL out of town worthy of legend. One could argue since Al Davis is inducted the bar is set pretty low. But there is a morality angle. Unfortunately, you can't disinduct someone, but you think OJ would have gotten in if the Nicole thing had come up before he was eligible? And let's consider the PR angle. I can guarantee you this- with Canton being a mere hour drive from Cleveland, a potential Modell HOF induction would be ugly- REAL ugly. Check your rotten tomatoes at the gate, but if you thought those annoying vuvueletas at the World Cup were annoying, you haven't yet begun to imagine how loud the "Go to Hell, Modell" chants would be. They'd have to keep his bust behind 12" bulletproof glass like the Hope Diamond, and that still wouldn't stop a few folks from smearing boogers on the glass, or more foul stuff. (Use Your imagination DAWG Pounders)
I hear a lot of what you say Larry and felt the same way exactly for a long long time. I look at the body of work and now understand he was broke and would had to sell the team instead he got a windfall of cash to do something he did not want to do. He made a lot of bad non football financial decisions which got him in a mess. Bmore was willing to bail him out.
Now after several years I remember all the great things Art Modell did for football and the Browns.......and there are many..........so he deserves hall of fame
in ten years all the hate for Modell gone but some great things he did will linger..........for one he understood Offense wins Championships.........which escapes most fans today......it would be good if he gets the HOF before he passes
Offense Wins.......Franchise QB's are the key.............Defense keeps you in the game.........Go Buckeyes -
Mayor White is the villain in this story. Art was a business man, White was a politician. White said 'i can push you around all i want.' Art said 'Well, we'll just see about that.'
Anyone that thinks Art wanted to leave Cleveland is a total and complete idiot.
Bull, bull, bull.
White did what a prudent politician should have done: look out for the best interest of the city. He looked out for the city's priorities. And he made absolutely no promises that he broke.
Being totally objective, it was more important for Cleveland to have the 81 dates the Indians had on their schedule, and the 300 dates the Arena had on its schedule for the vitality and economic benefit of the city over the 10 dates the Browns have on their schedule. That is just a pure economic fact. White knew it. Art knew it. Art even accepted it. He wanted taken care of eventually, yes. And all that was in the works. After all, that was what the extension of the sin tax, voted on 1 day after Modell's announcement was all about.
Not only that, the entire Gateway project, and the football renovation project and the funding for both was far more a Cuyahoga County matter than a City of Cleveland matter. If you believe that politicians were to blame ( and I don't) then the primary culprits that you should have been angry at were the Commissioners who ran Gateway etc., not White.
Bull, bull, bull.
White did what a prudent politician should have done: look out for the best interest of the city. He looked out for the city's priorities. And he made absolutely no promises that he broke.
Actually, White turned his bitchslapping of Modell into sport. White's asshole puckered only after he went one snub too far. i was mad at Modell until i learned the whole story.
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I haven't posted her in months but am a long time member. I am a lurker now and not much of a poster
but NOTHING gets my attention more than Art Modell trying to re-write history.
Art is an major league liar when it comes to the move. As others have mentioned, he moved
strictly for the almighty dollar. He can throw the blame on others as much as he wants
but it was HIS and ONLY HIS decision to move this team.Art keeps telling the same lies over
and over and over again and tries to win people over to his side. The more you tell a lie the
more people you get to believe you.
Art in the HOF?? He had a clear path in until the move. Now his election would be a huge black
eye for the NFL.Can you imagine the protestors and signs in Canton? Art wouldn't even have the
balls to show up. You wouldn't be able to see the sky for all the planes carrying the "Jump Art"
banners.
Go live your life out in peace Art and leave Cleveland alone. You did a lot of nice things for the city
and the Cleveland Clinic while you were here but the stain of the move is still on your hands.
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Difference between holding a grudge, and justice. I'm with Gips on this one. Modell was in the process of getting what he wanted a renovated stadium. For those with a short attention span he was offered to get in on the Gateway deal- he declined. He held the Indians hostage for years, got all the revenue and parking had the first "luxury" boxes in the NFL, yet the guy got himself so totally overleveraged, it wasn't enough.
The Divine Justice part of it all is Artie moved (instead of selling out to Al Lerner and having the team remain in Cleveland as he should have) because he wanted to pass the franchise on to Little Davy. Well, turns out even a $50 million dollar bribe and a sickeningly sweet revenue stream from Baltimore and the State of Maryland wasn't enough to keep the booger afloat. So in the long run, Schmodell not only lost what he was trying to preserve, but he lost an immense amount of respect on the national level.
Now regarding the HOF. May he never get in. I'm of the opinion short of a few legendary owners (George Halas) owners don't belong. PERIOD. I'll puke the day Jerry Jones gets nominated. Modell is far from "legendary" unless you want to consider moving one of the most storied teams in the NFL out of town worthy of legend. One could argue since Al Davis is inducted the bar is set pretty low. But there is a morality angle. Unfortunately, you can't disinduct someone, but you think OJ would have gotten in if the Nicole thing had come up before he was eligible? And let's consider the PR angle. I can guarantee you this- with Canton being a mere hour drive from Cleveland, a potential Modell HOF induction would be ugly- REAL ugly. Check your rotten tomatoes at the gate, but if you thought those annoying vuvueletas at the World Cup were annoying, you haven't yet begun to imagine how loud the "Go to Hell, Modell" chants would be. They'd have to keep his bust behind 12" bulletproof glass like the Hope Diamond, and that still wouldn't stop a few folks from smearing boogers on the glass, or more foul stuff. (Use Your imagination DAWG Pounders)
I hear a lot of what you say Larry and felt the same way exactly for a long long time. I look at the body of work and now understand he was broke and would had to sell the team instead he got a windfall of cash to do something he did not want to do. He made a lot of bad non football financial decisions which got him in a mess. Bmore was willing to bail him out.
Now after several years I remember all the great things Art Modell did for football and the Browns.......and there are many..........so he deserves hall of fame
in ten years all the hate for Modell gone but some great things he did will linger..........for one he understood Offense wins Championships.........which escapes most fans today......it would be good if he gets the HOF before he passes
I hear a lot of what you say Larry and felt the same way exactly for a long long time. I look at the body of work and now understand he was broke and would had to sell the team instead he got a windfall of cash to do something he did not want to do. He made a lot of bad non football financial decisions which got him in a mess. Bmore was willing to bail him out.
Now after several years I remember all the great things Art Modell did for football and the Browns.......and there are many..........so he deserves hall of fame
in ten years all the hate for Modell gone but some great things he did will linger..........for one he understood Offense wins Championships.........which escapes most fans today......it would be good if he gets the HOF before he passes
Hate to dredge up history Rich- but you and I know the HONORABLE thing would have been for Modell to sell out to Al Lerner, and not move the team. Lord knows, Al sure had the money- he could have handed Artie a blank check. If you remember, he wrote out a check to the NFL to the tune of $400 million when he bought the Browns- not too many guys have that kind of spendable cash not tied up in investments.
Nope, it wasn't just all about money- Art wanted the whole enchilada- the money AND be able to pass the team down to his cigar smokin' kid. Well, he wound up with neither. Even with $75 million, he still couldn't cover the payments he owed the bank, and was about to get foreclosed on. The other owners were an inch away from stripping the Mighty Modell of his franchise until Biscotti bailed his sorry ass out, and temporarily made Cigar Chomper Vice President in charge of Nothing. Modell's assertion "I had no choice" is a flat out lie.
Yeah, Modell did some nice things for the Browns, and did some damn stupid things too- like firing Paul Brown for starters. Couldn't come to terms with Mary Schottenheimer, and dumped Bill Belichick prematurely on top of it, sheer genius there. If you throw out Paul Brown's coaching record with the crap Bengals teams he'd rank #2 in all time winning percentage- which he incidentally held when Artie canned him. BTW, Billy Boy is 25th, and Marty is #26 in that category. Hey, OJ did some nice things on the field for the Bills- and then went out and croaked his wife. Artie blew a lifetime of goodwill with one horrendous decision. Do I hate the guy anymore? Not really, but I sure as hell don't respect him. And as long as Grossi and some other Clevelanders have a say in the HOF voting, Art will never get in.
Offense wins championships?
Sure, that's why the Ravens won a Super Bowl with Trent Dilfer at quarterback, and one of the best DEFENSES of all time. -
I haven't posted her in months but am a long time member. I am a lurker now and not much of a poster
but NOTHING gets my attention more than Art Modell trying to re-write history.
Art is an major league liar when it comes to the move. As others have mentioned, he moved
strictly for the almighty dollar. He can throw the blame on others as much as he wants
but it was HIS and ONLY HIS decision to move this team.Art keeps telling the same lies over
and over and over again and tries to win people over to his side. The more you tell a lie the
more people you get to believe you.
Art in the HOF?? He had a clear path in until the move. Now his election would be a huge black
eye for the NFL.Can you imagine the protestors and signs in Canton? Art wouldn't even have the
balls to show up. You wouldn't be able to see the sky for all the planes carrying the "Jump Art"
banners.
Go live your life out in peace Art and leave Cleveland alone. You did a lot of nice things for the city
and the Cleveland Clinic while you were here but the stain of the move is still on your hands.
I haven't posted her in months but am a long time member. I am a lurker now and not much of a poster
but NOTHING gets my attention more than Art Modell trying to re-write history.
Art is an major league liar when it comes to the move. As others have mentioned, he moved
strictly for the almighty dollar. He can throw the blame on others as much as he wants
but it was HIS and ONLY HIS decision to move this team.Art keeps telling the same lies over
and over and over again and tries to win people over to his side. The more you tell a lie the
more people you get to believe you.
Art in the HOF?? He had a clear path in until the move. Now his election would be a huge black
eye for the NFL.Can you imagine the protestors and signs in Canton? Art wouldn't even have the
balls to show up. You wouldn't be able to see the sky for all the planes carrying the "Jump Art"
banners.
Go live your life out in peace Art and leave Cleveland alone. You did a lot of nice things for the city
and the Cleveland Clinic while you were here but the stain of the move is still on your hands.
I am not sure that even if he had never attempted to move the Browns that he would have been HOF worthy. Let's just assume for a second that he had just gone ahead and sold the Browns in 1995 to Al Lerner. I am not sure that he should have been considered for induction any more than a dozen other owners. Were his credentials better than McBride who founded the Browns and the AAFC? Or Clint Murchison who created the Cowboys? Or Bud Adams? or Joe Robbie? or Leon Hess? or William Clay Ford? or Bill Bidwill? or Carol Rosembloom? or Tom Benson, or Gerald Phipps, or Sonny Werblin, or Jack Kent Cooke, or Hugh Culverhouse, or Ralph Hay, or Rankin Smith, or William Shea, or many others?
-
Difference between holding a grudge, and justice. I'm with Gips on this one. Modell was in the process of getting what he wanted a renovated stadium. For those with a short attention span he was offered to get in on the Gateway deal- he declined. He held the Indians hostage for years, got all the revenue and parking had the first "luxury" boxes in the NFL, yet the guy got himself so totally overleveraged, it wasn't enough.
The Divine Justice part of it all is Artie moved (instead of selling out to Al Lerner and having the team remain in Cleveland as he should have) because he wanted to pass the franchise on to Little Davy. Well, turns out even a $50 million dollar bribe and a sickeningly sweet revenue stream from Baltimore and the State of Maryland wasn't enough to keep the booger afloat. So in the long run, Schmodell not only lost what he was trying to preserve, but he lost an immense amount of respect on the national level.
Now regarding the HOF. May he never get in. I'm of the opinion short of a few legendary owners (George Halas) owners don't belong. PERIOD. I'll puke the day Jerry Jones gets nominated. Modell is far from "legendary" unless you want to consider moving one of the most storied teams in the NFL out of town worthy of legend. One could argue since Al Davis is inducted the bar is set pretty low. But there is a morality angle. Unfortunately, you can't disinduct someone, but you think OJ would have gotten in if the Nicole thing had come up before he was eligible? And let's consider the PR angle. I can guarantee you this- with Canton being a mere hour drive from Cleveland, a potential Modell HOF induction would be ugly- REAL ugly. Check your rotten tomatoes at the gate, but if you thought those annoying vuvueletas at the World Cup were annoying, you haven't yet begun to imagine how loud the "Go to Hell, Modell" chants would be. They'd have to keep his bust behind 12" bulletproof glass like the Hope Diamond, and that still wouldn't stop a few folks from smearing boogers on the glass, or more foul stuff. (Use Your imagination DAWG Pounders)
I hear a lot of what you say Larry and felt the same way exactly for a long long time. I look at the body of work and now understand he was broke and would had to sell the team instead he got a windfall of cash to do something he did not want to do. He made a lot of bad non football financial decisions which got him in a mess. Bmore was willing to bail him out.
Now after several years I remember all the great things Art Modell did for football and the Browns.......and there are many..........so he deserves hall of fame
in ten years all the hate for Modell gone but some great things he did will linger..........for one he understood Offense wins Championships.........which escapes most fans today......it would be good if he gets the HOF before he passes
in ten years all the hate for Modell gone but some great things he did will linger..........for one he understood Offense wins Championships.........which escapes most fans today......
-
I hear a lot of what you say Larry and felt the same way exactly for a long long time. I look at the body of work and now understand he was broke and would had to sell the team instead he got a windfall of cash to do something he did not want to do. He made a lot of bad non football financial decisions which got him in a mess. Bmore was willing to bail him out.
Now after several years I remember all the great things Art Modell did for football and the Browns.......and there are many..........so he deserves hall of fame
in ten years all the hate for Modell gone but some great things he did will linger..........for one he understood Offense wins Championships.........which escapes most fans today......it would be good if he gets the HOF before he passes
Hate to dredge up history Rich- but you and I know the HONORABLE thing would have been for Modell to sell out to Al Lerner, and not move the team. Lord knows, Al sure had the money- he could have handed Artie a blank check. If you remember, he wrote out a check to the NFL to the tune of $400 million when he bought the Browns- not too many guys have that kind of spendable cash not tied up in investments.
Nope, it wasn't just all about money- Art wanted the whole enchilada- the money AND be able to pass the team down to his cigar smokin' kid. Well, he wound up with neither. Even with $75 million, he still couldn't cover the payments he owed the bank, and was about to get foreclosed on. The other owners were an inch away from stripping the Mighty Modell of his franchise until Biscotti bailed his sorry ass out, and temporarily made Cigar Chomper Vice President in charge of Nothing. Modell's assertion "I had no choice" is a flat out lie.
Yeah, Modell did some nice things for the Browns, and did some damn stupid things too- like firing Paul Brown for starters. Couldn't come to terms with Mary Schottenheimer, and dumped Bill Belichick prematurely on top of it, sheer genius there. If you throw out Paul Brown's coaching record with the crap Bengals teams he'd rank #2 in all time winning percentage- which he incidentally held when Artie canned him. BTW, Billy Boy is 25th, and Marty is #26 in that category. Hey, OJ did some nice things on the field for the Bills- and then went out and croaked his wife. Artie blew a lifetime of goodwill with one horrendous decision. Do I hate the guy anymore? Not really, but I sure as hell don't respect him. And as long as Grossi and some other Clevelanders have a say in the HOF voting, Art will never get in.
Offense wins championships?
Sure, that's why the Ravens won a Super Bowl with Trent Dilfer at quarterback, and one of the best DEFENSES of all time. Offense wins championships?
Sure, that's why the Ravens won a Super Bowl with Trent Dilfer at quarterback, and one of the best DEFENSES of all time. leave it to ol richcheerleading4steelers to say something like this. i never ever heard anyone but him make a statement like this. unbelievable!
-
Bull, bull, bull.
White did what a prudent politician should have done: look out for the best interest of the city. He looked out for the city's priorities. And he made absolutely no promises that he broke.
Actually, White turned his bitchslapping of Modell into sport. White's asshole puckered only after he went one snub too far. i was mad at Modell until i learned the whole story.
Actually, White turned his bitchslapping of Modell into sport. White's asshole puckered only after he went one snub too far. i was mad at Modell until i learned the whole story.
I agree. I am not saying Model didn't have his faults, but I don't think he jumped the gun. He took the opportunity while it existed after 10 years of being jerked around.
Muni was a POS stadium in the early 60's and I know talk about a new stadium for the team started in maybe that mid-late 70's....early 80's for sure.
I think Art finally got tied of all the talk and decided talk is cheap, it takes money to buy whiskey.
The city was a dollar short and a day late....the city bet black and damn if it didn't come up red.
While I will never be happy he moved the team, in the same position, I would have done the same thing.
Art worked behind the scenes for a decade to get a stadium deal. He didn't rant and rave and threaten this or threaten that in the media.....he worked the process in the proper way....and finally got tired of it.
I am sorry the PUBLIC feels he didn't give THEM enough notice, but I am sure the elected officials had plenty of notice and elected to choose he was bluffing.
Art deserves the HOF.....no question.
It's not his fault the team moved other than he made the only decision the city forced him to make.
If he hadn't moved we would probably still be playing in a stadium built in the early 20's pissing in metal troughs hip to hip and face to face. .
People need to face the facts.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. -
Actually, White turned his bitchslapping of Modell into sport. White's asshole puckered only after he went one snub too far. i was mad at Modell until i learned the whole story.
I agree. I am not saying Model didn't have his faults, but I don't think he jumped the gun. He took the opportunity while it existed after 10 years of being jerked around.
Muni was a POS stadium in the early 60's and I know talk about a new stadium for the team started in maybe that mid-late 70's....early 80's for sure.
I think Art finally got tied of all the talk and decided talk is cheap, it takes money to buy whiskey.
The city was a dollar short and a day late....the city bet black and damn if it didn't come up red.
While I will never be happy he moved the team, in the same position, I would have done the same thing.
Art worked behind the scenes for a decade to get a stadium deal. He didn't rant and rave and threaten this or threaten that in the media.....he worked the process in the proper way....and finally got tired of it.
I am sorry the PUBLIC feels he didn't give THEM enough notice, but I am sure the elected officials had plenty of notice and elected to choose he was bluffing.
Art deserves the HOF.....no question.
It's not his fault the team moved other than he made the only decision the city forced him to make.
If he hadn't moved we would probably still be playing in a stadium built in the early 20's pissing in metal troughs hip to hip and face to face. .
People need to face the facts.
I agree. I am not saying Model didn't have his faults, but I don't think he jumped the gun. He took the opportunity while it existed after 10 years of being jerked around.
Muni was a POS stadium in the early 60's and I know talk about a new stadium for the team started in maybe that mid-late 70's....early 80's for sure.
I think Art finally got tied of all the talk and decided talk is cheap, it takes money to buy whiskey.
The city was a dollar short and a day late....the city bet black and damn if it didn't come up red.
While I will never be happy he moved the team, in the same position, I would have done the same thing.
Art worked behind the scenes for a decade to get a stadium deal. He didn't rant and rave and threaten this or threaten that in the media.....he worked the process in the proper way....and finally got tired of it.
I am sorry the PUBLIC feels he didn't give THEM enough notice, but I am sure the elected officials had plenty of notice and elected to choose he was bluffing.
Art deserves the HOF.....no question.
It's not his fault the team moved other than he made the only decision the city forced him to make.
If he hadn't moved we would probably still be playing in a stadium built in the early 20's pissing in metal troughs hip to hip and face to face. .
People need to face the facts.
If I'm not mistaken Ballpeen, weren't they looking to build a stadium in Strongsville by 71 and the turnpike? Instead it ended up becoming a housing development. As I have stated, I feel the city must share some of the blame as well. This town trips over it's own feet when it comes to getting anything done around here. Modell however; did make some poor business decisions, and surrounded himself with people in the end that weren't good with his money. Like I said read "Fumble." It puts a lot into perspective, and I think it will ease a lot of the pain and the bitter feelings that people have regarding Modell and the mood. I mean, I'm no fan of the guy, but if he gets inducted into the HOF, I'm not going to lose sleep over it, nor am I going be an idiot and start a riot over it!
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