Worse than Wimbley
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In 2006, Mark Anderson had a phenomenal rookie season. Like Wimbley, he notched double-digit sacks primarily through an effective speed rush. And like Wimbley, the expectations for the young DE went through the roof, only for his production to rapidly decline.
In his second season, Anderson only notched 5 sacks. More importantly, he struggled holding the point of attack in the run game, leading to questions whether he could ever become an every down 4-3 DE.
This year, Anderson's been a complete non-factor. Not only is he still sack-less, but people have begun to wonder whether his rookie year was just a fluke. According to one team insider, Anderson's "a physical freak who appears to have benefited from what was an exceptionally good defensive line in his first season.” Local media have repeated that theme, suggesting that Anderson's success was simply a function of Tommie Harris being unstoppable in '06.
It'll be interesting to see if Anderson can turn it around. Unlike Wimbley, the team seems to be giving up the former fifth rounder, giving more of his playing time to Alex Brown. If the Bears end up giving up on him this offseason or next, I wouldn't mind having him try to turn his career around in Cleveland.
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\ said:
In 2006, Mark Anderson had a phenomenal rookie season. Like Wimbley, he notched double-digit sacks primarily through an effective speed rush. And like Wimbley, the expectations for the young DE went through the roof, only for his production to rapidly decline.In his second season, Anderson only notched 5 sacks. More importantly, he struggled holding the point of attack in the run game, leading to questions whether he could ever become an every down 4-3 DE.
This year, Anderson's been a complete non-factor. Not only is he still sack-less, but people have begun to wonder whether his rookie year was just a fluke. According to one team insider, Anderson's "a physical freak who appears to have benefited from what was an exceptionally good defensive line in his first season.” Local media have repeated that theme, suggesting that Anderson's success was simply a function of Tommie Harris being unstoppable in '06.
It'll be interesting to see if Anderson can turn it around. Unlike Wimbley, the team seems to be giving up the former fifth rounder, giving more of his playing time to Alex Brown. If the Bears end up giving up on him this offseason or next, I wouldn't mind having him try to turn his career around in Cleveland.
I don't know Al, I'm really getting concerned about Wimbley. He just doesn't seem to be very instinctual or athletic, to be honest. The guy is constantly off balance or stumbling, never seeming to be in control. He's terrible at open field tackling and not strong enough to take on blockers without his dip and under move. Occasionally he'll get through on a stunt, but most of the time he just seems to get devoured or stumble his way out of the play. This is a trend I noticed last year, and it only seems to be getting worse.
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I think we are failing to realize the impact of a couple of injuries.
We lost Robaire Smith and Shaun Smith has been out for all but a couple games with a hand injury and Williams is dealing with a shoulder injury for most of the season. Those were the projected starting DE's for our defense.
Shaun Rogers is busy dealing with 2 players (C and one G) on every play...but with our DE's basically a 2nd yr backup (Leonard), a FA 2nd yr player (Thomas) and then rotating in a rookie (Rubin)....it leaves at least one OT and a TE/RB free to pick up our OLB's.
From what I am seeing, they are putting the TE or RB on the side Wimbley plays...which in recent weeks with our DE's finally getting in step has left McGinnest and Hall free to get to the QB.
Wimbley is going to benefit from S.Smith coming back and demanding a few double teams himself...and I fully expect him to start getting sacks over the next couple of weeks.
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\ said:
I think we are failing to realize the impact of a couple of injuries.We lost Robaire Smith and Shaun Smith has been out for all but a couple games with a hand injury and Williams is dealing with a shoulder injury for most of the season. Those were the projected starting DE's for our defense.
Shaun Rogers is busy dealing with 2 players (C and one G) on every play...but with our DE's basically a 2nd yr backup (Leonard), a FA 2nd yr player (Thomas) and then rotating in a rookie (Rubin)....it leaves at least one OT and a TE/RB free to pick up our OLB's.
From what I am seeing, they are putting the TE or RB on the side Wimbley plays...which in recent weeks with our DE's finally getting in step has left McGinnest and Hall free to get to the QB.
Wimbley is going to benefit from S.Smith coming back and demanding a few double teams himself...and I fully expect him to start getting sacks over the next couple of weeks.
We can keep making excuses for him all we want, but I'm going by what I see. I DVR these games and watch them at least twice more while rewinding and watching select guys on certain plays, and I have yet to see Kam make many plays at all.
Not trying to be a pessimist here, but a guy of his pedigree and draft status needs to show me more than he has, these worries are legit.
Note: I'm not attacking the guy or predicting he will suck, just going by what I've seen is all.
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Wimbley probably will always be a one-dimensional pass rusher, but I'm a little bit concerned about whether that means he'll end up failing like Mark Anderson apparently has.
One the one hand, Wimbley's definitely more athletic than Anderson. Anderson uses Wimbley's hip-bending move a lot, but he tends to fall down when he tries it.
On the other hand, I have some serious doubts about Wimbley's speed. He often looks like he's about to beat the LT off the edge, but he doesn't have the closing speed to get to the QB. Something similar happens in the run game; Kam just doesn't seem to have the second gear that would allow him to chase down an RB trying to bounce a run play back outside.
Maybe injuries to other players, opposing teams scheming for him, and bad coaching have played a role in Wimbley's decreased production. Perhaps it's notable that we have another LB in Leon Williams who has tremendous physical skills, yet the coaches haven't been able to coach him into becoming a significant contributor. Something similar could be happening with Wimbley.
Whatever the reason, I've definitely become less optimistic about Wimbley becoming an elite pass-rusher. Whereas I initially though that he could become a DeMarcus Ware-like force, I now wonder if he'll ever be as good as Shaun Phillips.
So although Alex Hall's shown some promise, I still feel like we'll be in the market for that #1 pass rusher type this offseason. He'll probably be selected before we're on the clock, but Brian Orakpo looks like he could play Merriman to Wimbley's Shaun Phillips. And if Hall continues to improve, Wimbley could end up fighting for his starting job.
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That's pretty spot on Al, I'm just not seeing anything special out of him like we thought we had his rookie year.
Sometimes he reminds me of Rahim Abdullah in the open field, like completely lost and out of control.
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Sometimes I wonder if we'd be better off using Wimbley as a roving pass-rusher: let him shut his brain off, pin his ears back, and get after the QB. If he still struggled while playing that role, we'd know for sure that he's not going to be the kind of elite rusher that makes a 3-4 D dominant.
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My opinion on being a rover type is you have to make plays and especially tackles, which I'm seeing as weaknesses right now.
It's almost just the opposite, where Tucker may be just conceding the guy needs to be more of a contain type than just removing himself from plays like he's been doing. He doesn't appear to have controlled speed, but more like a guy trying to be faster than what he is. Willie is not a good role model in this respect because he seems to be missing open field guys often and not wrapping up. The Browns spun Kam's performance last year by saying he was there often with pressure but there was no inside support. I saw it as him taking himself out of the play with his upfield speed rush and the QB simply stepping up like they're supposed to do. We're now in week 8 and his production continues to drop off even from last year.
Occasionally he'll catch a tackle overplaying his speed and giving him too much space when he cuts inside, but then he starts stumbling and is in no position to make the tackle. We have played some pretty mobile QB's thus far, which hurts a guy like Kam when he's not in position to finish the tackle.
Right now, I don't think he's a detriment per say given the way the defense is performing as a whole, but like you said, I think it's safe to assume the guy is nothing special like Ware or somebody. Not to second guess the pick, but imagine Ngata and Rogers up front and a guy like Peek (before injury obviously) or Hall playing Kam's spot. Who knows, maybe he's injured or something, but he just seems to lack the instincts. So far, Jackson is the better player out of that draft and becoming the leader of the defense. He seems to be the emotional support out there and the guy you can count on to play every down.
The Browns still lack good break down skills on tackling individually. A good example was Jones last week on the fourth down conversion in the red zone: He had Drew stopped deep in the backfield but rather than making a play on the ball got swallowed (by a hold....but still) and Drew ended up getting just enough by running 15 yards to get two.
I feel like I'm nitpicking the defense, but I think they have the potential to be damn good by tackling better and with another playmaker at DE. Wimbley is on his way to being an average player in this league unless he steps it up a lot. We've got Rogers just dominating the front and getting more pressure in one game than Wimbley has at a designated spot all year. This is also forcing them to blitz more, which is good in a way, but I just wonder.........
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Wimbly is the best pass rusher in the league who never gets to the qb.
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Ugh. As I read that, I pictured seeing Wimbley stumbling as he tries to change directions. Something all of us have seen a lot, but maybe not noticed how often.\ said:
Occasionally he'll catch a tackle overplaying his speed and giving him too much space when he cuts inside, but then he starts stumbling and is in no position to make the tackle. We have played some pretty mobile QB's thus far, which hurts a guy like Kam when he's not in position to finish the tackle.So far, Jackson is the better player out of that draft and becoming the leader of the defense. He seems to be the emotional support out there and the guy you can count on to play every down.
Agreed. Jackson's really grown into a leader in the past few years. IIRC, Jackson got a little negative pub his rookie year when he stopped hanging around the team after being placed on IR (w/ turf toe). Not only that, but Leon Williams seemed to outplay DQ when he took over his spot.Now, no one's questioning that DQ's the better player, as well as the young leader of our defense.
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no worries--he's just been getting double-teamed and/or chipped all season.
albeit hard to swallow, the writings all over the wall.........in 10' letters.
i foresee them experimenting w/ alex on the right in the very near future.
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Welcome to the new board, sisky.
Hall did play some ROLB in the preseason. However, I think he'll stick on the left side for the rest of the season. With Willie being older & Wimbley struggling, it's probably not the best time to start playing musical chairs with our LB core.\ said:
i foresee them experimenting w/ alex on the right in the very near future.That said, things could be much different next year. If we end up bringing in someone to play LOLB, I could see Hall & Wimbley splitting time on the other side.
Hopefully, Wimbley will turn things around & make this whole discussion moot.
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I've read that Cushing hasn't looked good playing inside. He's struggled shedding blockers, which is a big concern if you're projecting him to 3-4 ILB.\ said:
Wimbley isn't going any where. We need a rey M or even brian Cushing in the middle. -
Perhaps this isn't the best time to bring this up, but...
Let me first state that, the current state of our D-Line makes this point moot, but with the personnel we have/had, the fact that we are running the 3-4 is ludicrous. Yes, I understand NE (could) and PIT (can, always) pull it off, but with the crap we have/had at LB, I just don't get it. At all.
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I've read that Cushing hasn't looked good playing inside. He's struggled shedding blockers, which is a big concern if you're projecting him to 3-4 ILB.\ said:
Wimbley isn't going any where. We need a rey M or even brian Cushing in the middle.Whom do you like at mlb/ilb in april???
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Not sure yet. I still haven't watched Curry play, and I didn't really like what I saw when I watched Brandon Spikes, but these are a few guys to look at:\ said:
Whom do you like at mlb/ilb in april???[*] Rey Maualuga, USC[/*
1f2yug5x][*] Brandon Spikes, Florida*[/*
1f2yug5x][*] Eric Norwood, SC *[/*
1f2yug5x]* = Juniors
It doesn't look like there's a lot of depth to this class, so you could be right that we need to go ILB in Round 1. Norwood may be available in Round 2 or 3, but most people think he's a marginal talent compared to those other guys (I disagree).
There are also a few late-round guys I like (Worrell Williams, Jasper Brinkley), but they're not going to come in and make a significant impact.
.jpg.a1a2b9a0c33008fdaf4097d8fe2cfd64.jpg "Riffer X"){kind=avatar}
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