Sources: Browns eye Schottenheimer for 2009
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PLEASE! Please. Please. Please hire Marty!
MARTY '09!!!!!!!
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my take on marty is that, since he's likely to keep chud as our OC, the only thing that matters is if he'll bring in an aggressive or passive DC. if he brings in an aggressive guy, i'm all for it, especially if wade phillips gets fired in dallas. the two have worked together before and wade is an excellent DC.
if he brings in a two-gap, passive guy, though, i'm decidedly against it.
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Maybe we need an ass*$(@. Instead of this Mr "Warm and Fuzzy".. Someone who will put fire under asses if needed... If not Cowher. Schottenhiemer..
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i've been reading alot about Marty's first stint here. He truly was a psycho that put his interests ahead that of the team. i have not read about his time at KC, Wash or SD. If he is not a psycho, then i'm guessing he'd still be with one of those teams.
i'm guessing that the word is out that you would be crazy to hire Marty.
I roomed with Tim Manoa's cousin down at Kent. Manoa first of all hardy spoke, and when he did he didn't want to talk about football ... but if anything I can remember about his time with the Browns, it was that he thought Marty was an asshole for a coach.
We liked picking his brain more about playing for Joe pa at PSU.
I say 'no' to Marty ... do your homework Lerner and find a real leader that will live on the North Coast sideline for many moons to come. No more flash-in-the-pan band aid fixes that you think you can sell to the fans - just get the right guy.
I roomed with Tim Manoa's cousin down at Kent. Manoa first of all hardy spoke, and when he did he didn't want to talk about football ... but if anything I can remember about his time with the Browns, it was that he thought Marty was an asshole for a coach.
We liked picking his brain more about playing for Joe pa at PSU.
I say 'no' to Marty ... do your homework Lerner and find a real leader that will live on the North Coast sideline for many moons to come. No more flash-in-the-pan band aid fixes that you think you can sell to the fans - just get the right guy.
Boo-xxxxing-hoo.
AS HMFIC, Marty isn't there to be your buddy. He's there to win games, and he's damn good at doing it.
That's our problem - our players want a friend, not a coach. If Marty OR Cowher, about half of these guys will be gone. Good xxxxing riddance I say. Bunch of quitters and losers.
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Young, inspiring yet unproven coaches work MUCH better for teams that ALREADY HAVE a winning environment ESTABLISHED. That's the case with Tomlin in Pittsburgh and Harbaugh in Baltimore. Sean Payton made a turn around in New Orleans, but that had more to do with Drew Brees and Reggie Bush than anything else.
We need a winning enviroment here, and a proven guy with a system that works and who isn't just taking guesses on the fly will probably be our best bet. Marty may be the guy.
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Marty back in Cleveland similar to Gibbs in Washington, Parcells in Dallas. That said, new DC is Marvin Lewis, Chud stays on as OC, Kosar comes in as QB coach to mentor BQ and teach him to shrug off Chud when he sends in an off tackle run play when the Browns are 3rd down and 25.
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marvin lewis won't be marty's DC for two reasons: first, cinci isn't gonna fire him. second, marty runs a 3-4 and lewis runs a 4-3/cover 2. they're not compatible defenses.
it only works in pittsburgh because tomlin's the HC and he working with an experienced mastermind in lebeau who's willing to learn anything he can to stay ahead of the game.
but the DC has to know the ins and outs of whatever scheme he's going to run exceptionally well or you end up with an unimaginative D like we have this year.
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If Marty comes I feel that Savage will have to go or let go of his responsibilities.
does Savage have his Blackberry on speed dial to Chud during the game?
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marvin lewis won't be marty's DC for two reasons: first, cinci isn't gonna fire him. second, marty runs a 3-4 and lewis runs a 4-3/cover 2. they're not compatible defenses.
it only works in pittsburgh because tomlin's the HC and he working with an experienced mastermind in lebeau who's willing to learn anything he can to stay ahead of the game.
but the DC has to know the ins and outs of whatever scheme he's going to run exceptionally well or you end up with an unimaginative D like we have this year.
marvin lewis won't be marty's DC for two reasons: first, cinci isn't gonna fire him. second, marty runs a 3-4 and lewis runs a 4-3/cover 2. they're not compatible defenses.
it only works in pittsburgh because tomlin's the HC and he working with an experienced mastermind in lebeau who's willing to learn anything he can to stay ahead of the game.
but the DC has to know the ins and outs of whatever scheme he's going to run exceptionally well or you end up with an unimaginative D like we have this year.
Marty ran a 4-3 Cover 2 when he was in Cleveland and also when he was in Washington. SD was the first time he ran a 3-4 and that was because of Phillips, not Marty. He fits the system to the players and not the players to a system.
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i did not know that. i thought marty was a 3-4 guy. kinda makes me like him a little bit less.
however, he probably ran a straight 4-3 the first time in cleveland b/c the cover 2 as we know it is the brainchild of tony dungy and monte kiffin from their time together in tampa.
it would be interesting to see what system marty thinks are guys are best suited for, though.
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Lerner needs to bring someone in that knows the ropes in both a GM and HC positions.. at least until a strong foundation is formed and rebuilt and the upper management and coordinators alike learn how to play under a structured organization that only a few guys can bring to this failsauce club im all for marty or cowher no more 4 year failed training courses for clueless nitwits like crennel..
Some of you guys are amazing to think that the browns can bring in another coordinator project and fix this mess i dont care how brilliant they are no coordinator can become a great head coach in cleveland until it is all restructured because we have no structure we have no trademark anymore we have no owner or president to restore or make an identity we need real coaches and real management people to build this team right so great coordinators can rightfuly inherit the job when marty or cowher leave..we do not need another bunch of on the job training goofs it just doesnt work we need to rebuild upper management first and work on down...
10 years of these wretched experiments is enough..
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We ran a lot of Tampa 2 today, thats what had Collins confused. In the Tampa 2, the MLB drops into deep mid, which is how DQ had the 2, should have been 3 INT.
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Marty is (and was in his prime) a good .500+ coach. He was good at Cleveland I thought, developed a good repoire with Kosar and may do same with BQ. That helped the whole program immensely. In the 80's the Browns were always competitive and came up just shy of the Super Bowl more than once. I'd say he had potential, but from what I recall about his tenure at KC, it was nothing earth shaking when teams that built dynasties were up and coming. His time at SD was'nt bad, but I really believe he needs one or two very strong players to shine (ie.: LT), meaning he may not necessarily be the coach to whip this team into shape. If he has BQ doing well, a STRONG RB, solid receivers and a defense that plays like Dallas or Pittsburgh did last night, this team will definitely go places. Will have the latitude to get those key players and build that defense be there, I don't believe so.
Although no one here likes him (me included), Art Modell was football guy, much more than Lerner is and the Browns under Marty could'nt close. Will Marty do better with Lerner ? You're probably thinking, if he's given control, but is he the type of coach that can handle that control effectively ? Again, he's a good .500+ coach.
Cleveland's organization mimmicks the teams on Marty's resume' - competitive but unable to close. Maty has 8 division championships, no conference titles and no Super Bowls. I just can't believe this organization will be the one that he takes all the way. The '80's were SO frustrating because even though the team had so much going on, they never quite made it. It'd sure be nice to see them competitive and going deep into the playoffs, but I'd prefer to have a LONG term plan. How much worse can things get ?
Bellicheck, Cowher, Coughlin and a few others, can whip a team into shape and create a long term team. Is Marty in their category ? I don't believe so and that is the kind of guy the Browns need the absolute most right now.
I say Cowher is the man.
I'd be real curious to get Kosar's and Sam Rutigliano's take on Marty taking over the Browns.
Marty's records:
Year Age Tm Lg G W L T W-L%
1984 41 Cleveland Browns NFL 8 4 4 0 .500
1985 42 Cleveland Browns NFL 16 8 8 0 .500
1986 43 Cleveland Browns NFL 16 12 4 0 .750
1987 44 Cleveland Browns NFL 15 10 5 0 .667
1988 45 Cleveland Browns NFL 16 10 6 0 .625
1989 46 Kansas City Chiefs NFL 16 8 7 1 .533
1990 47 Kansas City Chiefs NFL 16 11 5 0 .688
1991 48 Kansas City Chiefs NFL 16 10 6 0 .625
1992 49 Kansas City Chiefs NFL 16 10 6 0 .625
1993 50 Kansas City Chiefs NFL 16 11 5 0 .688
1994 51 Kansas City Chiefs NFL 16 9 7 0 .563
1995 52 Kansas City Chiefs NFL 16 13 3 0 .813
1996 53 Kansas City Chiefs NFL 16 9 7 0 .563
1997 54 Kansas City Chiefs NFL 16 13 3 0 .813
1998 55 Kansas City Chiefs NFL 16 7 9 0 .438
2001 58 Washington Redskins NFL 16 8 8 0 .500
2002 59 San Diego Chargers NFL 16 8 8 0 .500
2003 60 San Diego Chargers NFL 16 4 12 0 .250
2004 61 San Diego Chargers NFL 16 12 4 0 .750
2005 62 San Diego Chargers NFL 16 9 7 0 .563
2006 63 San Diego Chargers NFL 16 14 2 0 .875
Exp Games Wins Losses W/L %
21 yrs 327 200 126 .613
10 yrs KAN 160 101 58 .635
5 yrs CLE 71 44 27 .620
5 yrs SDG 80 47 33 .588
1 yr WAS 16 8 8 .500
Games over .500: 74
Super Bowl Wins: 0
Overall Championships: 0
Conference Championships: 0 Division Championships: 8
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We ran a lot of Tampa 2 today, thats what had Collins confused. In the Tampa 2, the MLB drops into deep mid, which is how DQ had the 2, should have been 3 INT.
We ran a lot of Tampa 2 today, thats what had Collins confused. In the Tampa 2, the MLB drops into deep mid, which is how DQ had the 2, should have been 3 INT.
We did not and do not run a 4-3! What you saw with 4 man fronts was a nickel 2-4-5 and 3-4 over. I don't get why people think we run a 4-3 because they see 4 down linemen? We haven't ran a 4-3 ever since Butch Davis was the HC.
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@inspecta said:
Sigh....Which do you think is quicker? Getting some other newbie coach to play learning curve for the next 4-5 seasons or a proven winner, that has turned around every franchise he's gotten a hold of.
Let marty coach for a couple years, and during that time let the team come together know what it's like to win, and then give it to an up and comer when a mentality of winning has already been established.
Exactly what I've been saying since BEFORE we hired Romeo.
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I find it funny that it was commented that Marty is an a-hole coach as if it was a BAD thing.
Do you want to know who else is considered an A-hole coach? Take a look at the SB Champs!!! Yup. A-hole coaches WIN!!!
I was looking at the record of Marty posted earlier. Did you notice there was ONLY 2 SEASONS BELOW .500???? That is simply an amazing stat.
65...wow. That is too old? Are you kidding me? Vermeil coached to 70. George Halas and Marv Levy both coached to 72.
Records after 65:
Vermeil 44-36
Halas 54-39-5 NFL Champions at 68
But Marv Levy is really the one to look at for post 65 records:
Year Age Tm Lg G W L T W-L% G plyf W plyf L plyf W-L% Rank Notes 1990 65 Buffalo Bills NFL 16 13 3 0 .813 3 2 1 .667 1 AFC Champions 1991 66 Buffalo Bills NFL 16 13 3 0 .813 3 2 1 .667 1 AFC Champions 1992 67 Buffalo Bills NFL 16 11 5 0 .688 4 3 1 .750 1 AFC Champions 1993 68 Buffalo Bills NFL 16 12 4 0 .750 3 2 1 .667 1 AFC Champions 1994 69 Buffalo Bills NFL 16 7 9 0 .438 4 1995 70 Buffalo Bills NFL 16 10 6 0 .625 2 1 1 .500 1 1996 71 Buffalo Bills NFL 16 10 6 0 .625 1 0 1 .000 2 1997 72 Buffalo Bills NFL 16 6 10 0 .375 4
That's right, 82-46 and 4 AFC Championships (i.e. SB appearances)
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