What's bad and reasons for optimism.
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I just have one question - Was James Davis playing ? Wasnt he another rookie with a lot of potential ? If Harrison could not gain consistent yards and Hillis fumbled twice, shouldnt we atleast have a look at what james davis can do ? I dont think he was injured, right ?
I just have one question - Was James Davis playing ? Wasnt he another rookie with a lot of potential ? If Harrison could not gain consistent yards and Hillis fumbled twice, shouldnt we atleast have a look at what james davis can do ? I dont think he was injured, right ?
I don't think he was injured. I agree with you. Sit Hillis the rest of the game and bring in Harrison and Davis.
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Next game is against the Chiefs and they do have a good QB. We need to turn to smash mouth football.
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I was at the game tonight and I saw that Jake was taking a lot of chances. But I think he had to because our receivers could not break away or get separation. Mo Mass was wide open for his touchdown, but that was because of a blown coverage by the Bucs. No receiver had that break away speed. It seemed everyone was covered the whole game.
Jake made a huge mistake in throwing the ball we were up 14 - 3. He should have just taken the sack. With his age and experience, he should have known not to throw that ball. He looked great in preseason, but not so good today. I still believe he's better than what we had last year.
Hillis is appearing to be a fumbler. But he had 4.5 yards per carry at 9 att 41 yards, but fumbled twice. Once when inside the red zone! Harrison did well having 5.8 yards per carry. We should have used Harrison more effectively if he's producing like that.
Cribbs had one nice throw to Wallace while in the WildDawg. I thought we should have continued the formation and let him throw again.
Where were the screens or play actions? I could be wrong since I was experiencing heat stroke in the stadium, but was there much if any of those plays called? The play calling on offense definitely leveled out once we had 14 points on the board.
I believe it was the sloppy play and turn overs that caused us to lose. We lost and a loss is a Loss. BUT I believe we lost the game more than the Bucs won the game. If we don't make the turn overs, we should have won that. We have to stop losing the turn over battle.
Evan Moore continues to impress. He made a very acrobatic catch and appears to be the real deal. He may be our best receiver. He's a huge target, has great hands, and can break tackles. He took a big hit after he tipped himself the ball to catch it mid air. But he showed toughness.
TJ Ward is thus far, a great pick. 7 Tackles, 3 assists. Dude was all over the field and if he can keep it up, he could be defensive rookie of the year.
The defense overall played really well. They played well and I was happy overall.
Overall, I dont think we need to be calling for Coaches or Players heads. Let's just give it some time and hope Holmgren or Haskell can give Daboll some tips.
GO BROWNS!!!
I believe it was the sloppy play and turn overs that caused us to lose. We lost and a loss is a Loss. BUT I believe we lost the game more than the Bucs won the game. If we don't make the turn overs, we should have won that. We have to stop losing the turn over battle.
I agree. I was frustrated after we lost but now that I've thought about it, I'm looking at the glass half full for this game. If we don't make those mistakes we easily win that game.
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mikeyP72 said:
I disagree with the Harrison producing comment; he kills drives. Just because he broke one good run, should he be the every down back?Isn't this the essense of a run game? You slam the ball in there time after time and rip off a few big runs. This isn't high school, you aren't going to run the ball for 15 yards everytime you touch it. Harrison had the ball 9 times total, and ripped off 52 yards. Ya he had a big run and the rest were 2-3 yard GAINS. You run the ball on first down and get 3 yards and suddenly it's second and 7. Run it again on second down and get 2 yards and its 3rd and 5. It's a hell of alot easier to convert on 3rd and 5 rather than 3rd and 10. And that's worst case scenario. If Harrison catches a seam and gets some open field he is gone. He has that next gear that not alot of people have. And that's the reason he should be our feature back.
If you need more examples of feeding the running game, look at the stat sheets from yesterdays games....
Att Yds Avg Yds
Arian Foster HOU RB 33 231 7.0
Chris Johnson TEN RB 27 142 5.3
Rashard Mendenhall PIT RB 22 120 5.5
Maurice Jones-Drew JAC RB 23 98 4.3
Darren McFadden OAK RB 18 95 5.3
Adrian Peterson MIN RB 19 87 4.6
Steven Jackson STL RB 22 81 3.7
Ahmad Bradshaw NYG RB 20 76 3.8
Cadillac Williams TB RB 22 75 3.4
Pierre Thomas NO RB 19 71 3.7
Ronnie Brown MIA RB 13 65 5.0
Jerome Harrison CLE RB 9 52 5.8
Take a look at the average per carry number... Besides the great performace from Foster, (who got the ball 33 times...) nobody had a better average than Harrison. But I guess guys like Adrian Peterson, Steven Jackson and Ronnie Brown aren't starting backs either...
Jesus, Chris Johnson got the ball 27 times and ripped off a 75 yard touchdown run on one play. So out of 142 yards, more than half came on one run.
TB feeds the ball to Williams 22 times and I wouldn't call his performance memorable... BUT running the ball opens up the pass AND wears down D's. (Especially in 105 degree weather)
The run game is like novacan. Give it time.... it will work.
At no point in this game were we ever to far behind that we HAD to abandon the run.
On another note, it was good to see Moore out there making some nice catches. I thought for a second there that he was going to have a big game. Ward was making some nice tackles and looked like he could actually wrap people up and keep them from going to the next level. Bernard was looking really good also. Hillis will be fine and looked strong. (Just hang on to it man)
I would have loved to see James Davis out there catching a screen or checkdown pass and making a few people miss.
Robo made a few nice grabs, but just needs to stay in bounds! His shoe fell off mid run, gets by the coverage on an obvious long pass down, makes a great grab and can't get the other foot down.... Almost!
Stuckey even made a few nice grabs in tight coverage.
I would have like to have seen Sheldon Brown make a few more plays. He really needed to pick off that pass that hit him right in the hands...
I still think we need to go out and get a legit #1 WR though. We don't have anyone that demands huge attention from a D so the other WR's can get open and make plays. I think leaning on MoMass to do that is stunting his development. We are going to have to face it, besides the likes of Andre Johnson the premier Wideouts in this league are nut jobs. (See what Randy Moss said after the Pats win over Cinny?) I guess I'm ok with a diva WR that snorts coke on the sidelines between plays if it opens up our passing game and lets the young guys get better. EM might just have to bite the bullet and bring in someone that doesn't fit his mold.
Next Sunday is another game day, so Go Browns!
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I was at the game tonight and I saw that Jake was taking a lot of chances. But I think he had to because our receivers could not break away or get separation. Mo Mass was wide open for his touchdown, but that was because of a blown coverage by the Bucs. No receiver had that break away speed. It seemed everyone was covered the whole game.
Jake made a huge mistake in throwing the ball we were up 14 - 3. He should have just taken the sack. With his age and experience, he should have known not to throw that ball. He looked great in preseason, but not so good today. I still believe he's better than what we had last year.
Hillis is appearing to be a fumbler. But he had 4.5 yards per carry at 9 att 41 yards, but fumbled twice. Once when inside the red zone! Harrison did well having 5.8 yards per carry. We should have used Harrison more effectively if he's producing like that.
Cribbs had one nice throw to Wallace while in the WildDawg. I thought we should have continued the formation and let him throw again.
Where were the screens or play actions? I could be wrong since I was experiencing heat stroke in the stadium, but was there much if any of those plays called? The play calling on offense definitely leveled out once we had 14 points on the board.
I believe it was the sloppy play and turn overs that caused us to lose. We lost and a loss is a Loss. BUT I believe we lost the game more than the Bucs won the game. If we don't make the turn overs, we should have won that. We have to stop losing the turn over battle.
Evan Moore continues to impress. He made a very acrobatic catch and appears to be the real deal. He may be our best receiver. He's a huge target, has great hands, and can break tackles. He took a big hit after he tipped himself the ball to catch it mid air. But he showed toughness.
TJ Ward is thus far, a great pick. 7 Tackles, 3 assists. Dude was all over the field and if he can keep it up, he could be defensive rookie of the year.
The defense overall played really well. They played well and I was happy overall.
Overall, I dont think we need to be calling for Coaches or Players heads. Let's just give it some time and hope Holmgren or Haskell can give Daboll some tips.
GO BROWNS!!!
I believe it was the sloppy play and turn overs that caused us to lose. We lost and a loss is a Loss. BUT I believe we lost the game more than the Bucs won the game. If we don't make the turn overs, we should have won that. We have to stop losing the turn over battle.
There's a real logic bomb for you.
So, Graham's fumble on the 2 or Freeman's pick don't count? How about when Freeman overthrew a wide open Mike Williams on the 6? How about on 4th and short our QB eats the ball with a wide open TE in the end zone?
More excuses from Brownsville.
Fact is, we got to Delhome, stopped a good rushing game in the 2nd half and had two very good touchdown catches. That's why you lost.
Deal with it.
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I believe it was the sloppy play and turn overs that caused us to lose. We lost and a loss is a Loss. BUT I believe we lost the game more than the Bucs won the game. If we don't make the turn overs, we should have won that. We have to stop losing the turn over battle.
There's a real logic bomb for you.
So, Graham's fumble on the 2 or Freeman's pick don't count? How about when Freeman overthrew a wide open Mike Williams on the 6? How about on 4th and short our QB eats the ball with a wide open TE in the end zone?
More excuses from Brownsville.
Fact is, we got to Delhome, stopped a good rushing game in the 2nd half and had two very good touchdown catches. That's why you lost.
Deal with it.
There's a real logic bomb for you.
So, Graham's fumble on the 2 or Freeman's pick don't count? How about when Freeman overthrew a wide open Mike Williams on the 6? How about on 4th and short our QB eats the ball with a wide open TE in the end zone?
More excuses from Brownsville.
Fact is, we got to Delhome, stopped a good rushing game in the 2nd half and had two very good touchdown catches. That's why you lost.
Deal with it.
The worst thing either team (or their fans) can do from this game is base the rest of the season on it.
The Browns could have seized control by pounding the run game down Tampa's throat when they had the 14-3 lead, but they didn't and Delhomme threw a stupid INT.
His second INT only came when he was throwing desperation passes to our VERY poor WRs. Bottom line is that week 1 is really the 5th week of pre-season and that is evident by looking at the mistakes made by Dallas (holding on the game winning TD - I would have slit my wrists if I were a Boys fan), Minnesota's playcalling was worse than Cleveland's in their loss to the Saints and pretty much EVERY other game.
It was an incredibly sloppy week around the league and it will get worse tonight.
Next week the Browns will be a little closer to game speed and HOPEFULLY they will learn how to run a solid offense because the defense is really trying to do it all by themself.
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The defense was the bright spot, they kept us in the game as best they could...but dabolls predictability and repetitive playcalling was gutwrenching to the point of almost making my liquor come up...
Optimism at this point has to be earned as im finding my way back onto the daboll hate wagon...no more maybe next game, maybe next year crap i need to see at least some improvement in progressive non play to lose offensive philosophy now...RAC is going to rip dabolls ass so far open that he could walk through it and our only chance is if ryan can make a fatter track through weis.
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I believe it was the sloppy play and turn overs that caused us to lose. We lost and a loss is a Loss. BUT I believe we lost the game more than the Bucs won the game. If we don't make the turn overs, we should have won that. We have to stop losing the turn over battle.
There's a real logic bomb for you.
So, Graham's fumble on the 2 or Freeman's pick don't count? How about when Freeman overthrew a wide open Mike Williams on the 6? How about on 4th and short our QB eats the ball with a wide open TE in the end zone?
More excuses from Brownsville.
Fact is, we got to Delhome, stopped a good rushing game in the 2nd half and had two very good touchdown catches. That's why you lost.
Deal with it.
There's a real logic bomb for you.
So, Graham's fumble on the 2 or Freeman's pick don't count? How about when Freeman overthrew a wide open Mike Williams on the 6? How about on 4th and short our QB eats the ball with a wide open TE in the end zone?
More excuses from Brownsville.
Fact is, we got to Delhome, stopped a good rushing game in the 2nd half and had two very good touchdown catches. That's why you lost.
Deal with it.
Thanks. I wasn't able to "deal with it" until you put it like that. I thought my life was over and everything was in the shitter. Now I have brighter days and I think i'll be able to go on with my life.
Please re-read where i said a loss is a loss. No excuses, we lost. I'm still sticking to what i said. If you don't like it, f*ck off. This the Browns board. No one values your opinion here.
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After "cooling off", I can see more clearly now & there is a great deal to look forward to:
Ward & Haden are studs..I was elated with those picks & nothing will change my mind.
I still like Hillis...The kid says he has to correct the fumbling, & I believe he will.
Moore is a SPECIAL receiver. He is FOCUS, FOCUS, FOCUS!
The other receivers will be fine, but the lack of experience, ie not coming back for the ball, etc hurts us now. They'll be ok.
We made plenty of mistakes, the 2 most glaring were Jake's AWFUL decision to throw that ball late in the 1st half, & Barton's not even ATTEMPTING to advance that fumble recovery.
Bottom line is that I have repeatedly said that, win or lose, I wanted to see improvement over last year & we DID see that.
Mike
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I believe it was the sloppy play and turn overs that caused us to lose. We lost and a loss is a Loss. BUT I believe we lost the game more than the Bucs won the game. If we don't make the turn overs, we should have won that. We have to stop losing the turn over battle.
There's a real logic bomb for you.
So, Graham's fumble on the 2 or Freeman's pick don't count? How about when Freeman overthrew a wide open Mike Williams on the 6? How about on 4th and short our QB eats the ball with a wide open TE in the end zone?
More excuses from Brownsville.
Fact is, we got to Delhome, stopped a good rushing game in the 2nd half and had two very good touchdown catches. That's why you lost.
Deal with it.
Fact is, we got to Delhome, stopped a good rushing game in the 2nd half and had two very good touchdown catches. That's why you lost.
Deal with it.
I'll give you one real good td pass and catch on the one that won the game...ball was perfectly thrown because the coverage wasn't that bad. The first TD pass though was very fortunate for Tampa since the ball went right through Sheldon Browns hands and more often than not that ball gets picked off butit worked out for you guys this time.
You are correct though...our running game was stopped in the 2nd half and we couldn't adjust to that and that is why we lost. We didn't score in the 2nd half and you aren't going to win many games that way.
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I still believe, if we scored at least 3 on that drive that delhomme throws the int, we would have won. The Bucs and their 100 fans in the stadium were deflated until that int. It totally changed the momentum.
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I believe it was the sloppy play and turn overs that caused us to lose. We lost and a loss is a Loss. BUT I believe we lost the game more than the Bucs won the game. If we don't make the turn overs, we should have won that. We have to stop losing the turn over battle.
There's a real logic bomb for you.
So, Graham's fumble on the 2 or Freeman's pick don't count? How about when Freeman overthrew a wide open Mike Williams on the 6? How about on 4th and short our QB eats the ball with a wide open TE in the end zone?
More excuses from Brownsville.
Fact is, we got to Delhome, stopped a good rushing game in the 2nd half and had two very good touchdown catches. That's why you lost.
Deal with it.
There's a real logic bomb for you.
So, Graham's fumble on the 2 or Freeman's pick don't count? How about when Freeman overthrew a wide open Mike Williams on the 6? How about on 4th and short our QB eats the ball with a wide open TE in the end zone?
More excuses from Brownsville.
Fact is, we got to Delhome, stopped a good rushing game in the 2nd half and had two very good touchdown catches. That's why you lost.
Deal with it.
i didn't check to see if anyone else covered this but:
1) our defense caused the pick(TJ Ward delivers blow)
2) Yeah he overthrew him, but you guys scored on the next play.
3) Fumble on 2 would've been a gift if we had a pee-wee caliber linebacker pick the ball up and run to get us out of there.
4) He didnt want to risk throwing that, or obviously he would have because we all know he saw the TE.
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Yes, we can credit the Bucs and/or blame the players for their mistakes, but I'm more upset at the coaches for this one. First, Jake shouldn't have been passing at all with a 14-3 lead, in scoring position and two minutes on the clock before half-time in an away-game. Smash mouth football and then take the field goal for a 17-3 half time lead. Second, the playcalling was awful after the second-half fumble. No play action, no outside run, no screens, no creativity. Result: Predicable plays and a shut-down by the Bucs. If our team is not moving downfield with an limping QB - take him the @#$* out and give the back-up Wallace a series. See what happens. And playing Hillis instead of Harrison is just stupid game-planning. Harrision should have had more carries - he can break one for a TD on any play.
The only disagreement I have with the board is with the Buc's fumble and the lineman just falling on it. The linemen players are trained to go down and secure the ball on a scrimmage fumble like that. It's not like the QB was sacked in the backfield and fumbled. Furthermore, two Browns went down to cover it up. Yes, if a DB is in that position, it could have been different and gone for a touchdown.
We have some big issues. Specialty teams (I thought that was our strength), the passing game, the lack of a pass rush even with a blitz. And let's not forget the winning drive had two 3rd and long plays that the Browns could not stop.
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