Delhomme the worst qb in the NFL
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but not more sacks.....and i wasnt talking about just sacks.....i was talking about pressures and hits too which is something that you just gave up on trying to prove wrong apparently. thats fine.....i didnt really expect a quality response
and despite throwing more passes, he also has completed 63% of his passes.........his INTs are a result of the coaching staff having enough confidence in him to make the tougher throws. seneca and colt manage the game and try not to make mistakes.......jake tries to win games and the coaching staff has no problem letting him do that
i just love it how you guys cry for a new QB every year........now you are crying for a new QB that you havent seen in almost 10 weeks
There's a difference between Delhomme feeling pressure and actual pressure. There's been quite a few plays this season where Jake has had a comfortable pocket and has still panicked and thrown a checkdown pass or tried to put a pass somewhere it should never go. He's feeling paranoid, almost.
He's also trying to make tougher throws that a 12 year veteran should know not to make with 1-2 year WR's with little to no experience. Frankly, I think everyone and their mother expected Jake to rely on Ben Watson every play, but that's not been the case. Kudos to Daboll for taking away a QB's comfort player.
This argument about one player trying not to make mistakes while the other is trying to win is nonsense. If playing to win the game means throwing errant passes into double coverage or waiting 6 seconds to throw to a checkdown factorback on a little dump off pass, I'll take the player trying "not to make mistakes". I'd take Colt's 76 yards, 0 TD's and 0 INT's in a win over your precious Aints rather than Jake's 227 yards, 1 TD and 2 INT's in a loss to the Yuckaneers any day of the week. We don't have a powerful enough offense to be giving the ball to the other team. That's not playing to win, that's making bad decisions.
Just shut your fuxking mouth already, you've proven not only to be a troll, but an uneducated one at that. You dig yourself in deeper holes every time you post, just go the fuxk away and root for the Saints. I never thought I'd see a fairweather Brown fan, but thanks for proving me wrong. I'll eat crow on that one. You're not garnering any respect by saying you were a Browns fan, or whatever nonsense you spout forth everytime you try and make a valid response. Your arguments are ridiculous, you quote "stats" that merely work against whatever assinine point you were trying to make, and then you try and make other people look dumb because they don't agree with you. It doesn't work, you're a dick.
You're a frak, and a fairweather Browns fan. That's a double whammy.
There's a difference between Delhomme feeling pressure and actual pressure. There's been quite a few plays this season where Jake has had a comfortable pocket and has still panicked and thrown a checkdown pass or tried to put a pass somewhere it should never go. He's feeling paranoid, almost.
He's also trying to make tougher throws that a 12 year veteran should know not to make with 1-2 year WR's with little to no experience. Frankly, I think everyone and their mother expected Jake to rely on Ben Watson every play, but that's not been the case. Kudos to Daboll for taking away a QB's comfort player.
This argument about one player trying not to make mistakes while the other is trying to win is nonsense. If playing to win the game means throwing errant passes into double coverage or waiting 6 seconds to throw to a checkdown factorback on a little dump off pass, I'll take the player trying "not to make mistakes". I'd take Colt's 76 yards, 0 TD's and 0 INT's in a win over your precious Aints rather than Jake's 227 yards, 1 TD and 2 INT's in a loss to the Yuckaneers any day of the week. We don't have a powerful enough offense to be giving the ball to the other team. That's not playing to win, that's making bad decisions.
the WRs suck.....how do you expect any QB for this team to play with them? but rather than put the blame where it should be, you're going to put it on the shoulders of your starting QB.....AGAIN
how many QBs have started for the browns over the past 15 years? eventually you are going to realize that its not the QB all the time.....but after that many years of making the same mistakes im not so sure anymore.......you guys will just keep blaming the QB......the coach will panick when his job is on the line and listen to the moronic fans and he'll flip flop QBs again
its inevitable unless you guys actually start supporting your team
Just shut your fuxking mouth already, you've proven not only to be a troll, but an uneducated one at that. You dig yourself in deeper holes every time you post, just go the fuxk away and root for the Saints. I never thought I'd see a fairweather Brown fan, but thanks for proving me wrong. I'll eat crow on that one. You're not garnering any respect by saying you were a Browns fan, or whatever nonsense you spout forth everytime you try and make a valid response. Your arguments are ridiculous, you quote "stats" that merely work against whatever assinine point you were trying to make, and then you try and make other people look dumb because they don't agree with you. It doesn't work, you're a dick.
You're a frak, and a fairweather Browns fan. That's a double whammy.
aww i was so close to actually respecting your responses. you were the only one coming back with reasonable posts.........and then this
im wondering what you have to say about the tougher pass defenses that jake has played against compared to seneca.
you guys are also super defensive when it comes to criticism unless it comes from a guy who has been here for millions of years. it just so happens that im not hating on the browns......im supporting them....but you're too ignorant to realize it
no wonder lebron left.....no wonder modell moved the team. cleveland is just big enough to carry a market for sports teams and just dumb enough to run them right out again
maybe they'll prove me wrong but this thread just proves my points further
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Hey cantonreject how can you account for him having more touchdowns and less picks?
And I'm still curious to know how many browns games have you actually watched this year from beginning to end?
Well that's exactly what you typed......his line doesn't like to hold blocks for him.........so they just pick and choose who they are gonna block for? Maybe you should think before you type instead of just rambling obvious nonsense...o wait then you would have to actually have a brain inside that 20 pound pumpkin on top ofyour shoulders
Hey cantonreject how can you account for him having more touchdowns and less picks?
weaker pass defenses......a few of jakes picks were tipped at the line of scrimmage or dropped by the WRs......not really his fault
And I'm still curious to know how many browns games have you actually watched this year from beginning to end?
almost all of them aside from the ones that i miss while im working
Well that's exactly what you typed......his line doesn't like to hold blocks for him
that is exactly what i typed......but your explanation and understanding of what i was actually saying is severly lacking
.........so they just pick and choose who they are gonna block for?
the linemen dont "pick and choose" who they block for
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You want quality? At least I added some sort of statistical proof to back up my claims. The reason you think Jake gets pressured so much is because he always feels heat even when it isn't there. This is part of his bad decision making process.
If he is chucking it down the field so often how do you explain his YPA being a full yard lower and his YPC being 1.6 yards less. Hmmmm......could it be that you are wrong and just spouting nonsense? I won't even get into the adjusted yards but will say that gets even worse for your argument.
a whole yard? no way....you're telling me that a whole yard means seneca is that much better of a QB?
no wonder you guys always think you need a new QB......because you actually believe all this nonsense that comes out of your mouth
a yard difference is nothing.....it means nothing.......it means that you are using ridiculous numbers to try and prove a point without takin reality and immeasurables into account
you are making up something about jake feeling pressure when there isnt any.....maybe because he gets hit so much? when his receivers suck and his line doesnt like to hold blocks for him, its easy to see how you would want to get rid of the ball a little quicker
getting rid of the ball quicker means several things......it means you are predictable, it means WRs cant get farther downfield.....and it means the WRs have less time to get open
something that can help explain the lower yards per attempt. it also means that teams respect jake as a passer. jake gets the tougher looks...the tighter coverage....and more pressure to try and force mistakes. seneca and colt are just there......they are on the field but they really dont do anything to help win games other than the occassional 3rd down pass
teams dont have to account for colt or seneca....but they do for jake
a whole yard? no way....you're telling me that a whole yard means seneca is that much better of a QB?
no wonder you guys always think you need a new QB......because you actually believe all this nonsense that comes out of your mouth
a yard difference is nothing.....it means nothing.......it means that you are using ridiculous numbers to try and prove a point without takin reality and immeasurables into account
you are making up something about jake feeling pressure when there isnt any.....maybe because he gets hit so much? when his receivers suck and his line doesnt like to hold blocks for him, its easy to see how you would want to get rid of the ball a little quicker
getting rid of the ball quicker means several things......it means you are predictable, it means WRs cant get farther downfield.....and it means the WRs have less time to get open
something that can help explain the lower yards per attempt. it also means that teams respect jake as a passer. jake gets the tougher looks...the tighter coverage....and more pressure to try and force mistakes. seneca and colt are just there......they are on the field but they really dont do anything to help win games other than the occassional 3rd down pass
teams dont have to account for colt or seneca....but they do for jake
Yes, a whole yard. Seeing as the leader of the NFL is 8.81, 1.0 is actually quite a huge differential. However, that isn't my only proof that Wallace >>>>>>>>>Delhomme as exhibited by the many other stats that you choose to ignore. I'll keep on dealing with facts and reality while you are working with fairy tales.
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mikeyP72 said:
Back to the D&D game in the basement.Didn't we beat your team?
D and D huh? man you sure are good at these comeback things.....its like you invented the next great part of speech
you spanked my team up and down......now back to the original topic of this thread eh?
you guys are really struggling to show anything worth pointing out and your using stats without looking at the bigger picture to show "proof"
your proof is only in your eyes because nobody else thinks seneca or colt for that matter is the best option for ur team.....ONLY BROWNS FANS
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There's a difference between Delhomme feeling pressure and actual pressure. There's been quite a few plays this season where Jake has had a comfortable pocket and has still panicked and thrown a checkdown pass or tried to put a pass somewhere it should never go. He's feeling paranoid, almost.
He's also trying to make tougher throws that a 12 year veteran should know not to make with 1-2 year WR's with little to no experience. Frankly, I think everyone and their mother expected Jake to rely on Ben Watson every play, but that's not been the case. Kudos to Daboll for taking away a QB's comfort player.
This argument about one player trying not to make mistakes while the other is trying to win is nonsense. If playing to win the game means throwing errant passes into double coverage or waiting 6 seconds to throw to a checkdown factorback on a little dump off pass, I'll take the player trying "not to make mistakes". I'd take Colt's 76 yards, 0 TD's and 0 INT's in a win over your precious Aints rather than Jake's 227 yards, 1 TD and 2 INT's in a loss to the Yuckaneers any day of the week. We don't have a powerful enough offense to be giving the ball to the other team. That's not playing to win, that's making bad decisions.
the WRs suck.....how do you expect any QB for this team to play with them? but rather than put the blame where it should be, you're going to put it on the shoulders of your starting QB.....AGAIN
how many QBs have started for the browns over the past 15 years? eventually you are going to realize that its not the QB all the time.....but after that many years of making the same mistakes im not so sure anymore.......you guys will just keep blaming the QB......the coach will panick when his job is on the line and listen to the moronic fans and he'll flip flop QBs again
its inevitable unless you guys actually start supporting your team
Just shut your fuxking mouth already, you've proven not only to be a troll, but an uneducated one at that. You dig yourself in deeper holes every time you post, just go the fuxk away and root for the Saints. I never thought I'd see a fairweather Brown fan, but thanks for proving me wrong. I'll eat crow on that one. You're not garnering any respect by saying you were a Browns fan, or whatever nonsense you spout forth everytime you try and make a valid response. Your arguments are ridiculous, you quote "stats" that merely work against whatever assinine point you were trying to make, and then you try and make other people look dumb because they don't agree with you. It doesn't work, you're a dick.
You're a frak, and a fairweather Browns fan. That's a double whammy.
aww i was so close to actually respecting your responses. you were the only one coming back with reasonable posts.........and then this
im wondering what you have to say about the tougher pass defenses that jake has played against compared to seneca.
you guys are also super defensive when it comes to criticism unless it comes from a guy who has been here for millions of years. it just so happens that im not hating on the browns......im supporting them....but you're too ignorant to realize it
no wonder lebron left.....no wonder modell moved the team. cleveland is just big enough to carry a market for sports teams and just dumb enough to run them right out again
maybe they'll prove me wrong but this thread just proves my points further
the WRs suck.....how do you expect any QB for this team to play with them? but rather than put the blame where it should be, you're going to put it on the shoulders of your starting QB.....AGAIN
how many QBs have started for the browns over the past 15 years? eventually you are going to realize that its not the QB all the time.....but after that many years of making the same mistakes im not so sure anymore.......you guys will just keep blaming the QB......the coach will panick when his job is on the line and listen to the moronic fans and he'll flip flop QBs again
its inevitable unless you guys actually start supporting your team
aww i was so close to actually respecting your responses. you were the only one coming back with reasonable posts.........and then this
im wondering what you have to say about the tougher pass defenses that jake has played against compared to seneca.
you guys are also super defensive when it comes to criticism unless it comes from a guy who has been here for millions of years. it just so happens that im not hating on the browns......im supporting them....but you're too ignorant to realize it
no wonder lebron left.....no wonder modell moved the team. cleveland is just big enough to carry a market for sports teams and just dumb enough to run them right out again
maybe they'll prove me wrong but this thread just proves my points further
You're right, Jake has competed against some tougher pass defenses. I guess just competing against tough pass defenses makes him the better QB, not his stats. How could I have been so blind?
Buffalo, Tampa Bay and Carolina have such "good" pass defenses because their rush defenses are terrible. It's easy to have a good pass defense when teams don't have to pass on you to beat you. Buffalo is ranked 32nd in rush defense. Tampa Bay is 27th in rush defense. Carolina is 25th in rush defense. Teams destroy them on the ground, therefore they don't have to pass on them.
On the other side, Kansas City is 15th in rush defense, Baltimore is 8th in rush defense, and Cincinnati is 24th. Outside of Cincinnati, those are solid rush defenses. And solid all around defenses.
And we'll completely just disregard the fact that Kansas City and Baltimore will both be playing in the postseason, whereas, of the teams Jake has faced, only Tampa Bay has a shot at playing in the postseason.
Look at Jake's performances against those "elite" defenses.
Tampa Bay 20-37 227 yards 1 TD 2 INT...LOSS
Carolina 24-35 245 yards 0 TD 2 INT...WIN (because of John Kasay choking)
Miami 24-34 217 yards 1 TD 0 INT...WIN (in the worst game I've ever seen)
Buffalo 12-20 86 yards 0 TD 1 INT... LOSS
Here's what Seneca did against those "inferior" teams
Kansas City- 16-31 229 yards 1 TD 1 INT...LOSS
Baltimore 18- 24 141 yards 1 TD 0 INT...LOSS
Cincinnati 18-30 184 yards 1 TD 1 INT...WIN
That's 2 touchdowns and 5 INT's for Jake against teams that have a combined record of 19-33, compared to Seneca's 3 TD's and 2 INT's against teams with a combined record of 18-20. I guess Jake really is playing to win, huh? Because if there's one thing I know, it's that winning QB's throw 2 times as many interceptions as they do touchdowns, especially against cupcake teams.
Seneca Wallace's worst game, by rating, is better than all of Jake's games, excluding the Miami game. Even then, it's only 11 rating points of a difference. Seneca Wallace's average QB rating of 88.5 is 24.9 points higher than that of Delhomme's. Seneca Wallace has yet to throw for multiple interceptions in a game. Jake Delhomme has as many pick sixes as Seneca has interceptions.
You are exactly right, Jake Delhomme is a huge game changer. Unfortunately, those changes normally end in a loss for us.
The two wins Jake has as a starter were the two worst games played this season, and should have very easily been losses. We were a missed field goal away in each game from losing. We didn't win because of Jake, we won in spite of him.
But these are all just subjective things, who's to say we would have won with Seneca in? It's too easy to say what could have been. If only there was a game that Seneca played in and Jake played in too. Man, that would be something for this argument. I'd go so far to say that would even be definitive evidence of who's better.
Oh, wait....
Jake Delhomme vs. ATL
13- 23 97 yards 0 TD 2 INT
Seneca Wallace vs ATL
11-15 139 yards 1 TD 0 INT
What's that? Seneca Wallace outperformed Jakeycakes? He threw for 42 more yards than Jake? On 8 less attempts? And got 1 more touchdown? And 2 less interceptions?
Yeah, but Jake at 2 more completions....so he's obviously better....
I support my team. I know my team. I know football. There's not one statline you can throw at me to prove Jake Delhomme gives the Cleveland Browns a better chance to win than Seneca Wallace. Seneca has outperformed Jake, flat out. That's it. You have a boner for Jake because he's a Ragin' Cajun, probably. And guess what, college allegiences don't get a team into the postseason.
What minimal, and I mean minimal, respect anybody might have had for you is now completely gone. You go onto a Browns forum and try to prove you know something when you clearly don't, and when everybody calls you on your bullshit you throw in a played-out Art Modell crack, and then call our fanbase and city ignorant and expect us to like you because you say you support the Browns? You're a joke, plain and simple.
Also, we take criticism well as a fanbase. We just don't take kindly to douchebags who think they know better about our team when they clearly don't. I'm all for genuine chalk talk with people who know what they're talking about. But you're a 16 week frak and that's it. After the Browns win a Super Bowl and the Saints go back to the cellar, are you going to say "Oh, I used to be a Saints fan, but I've been a secret Browns fan forever."?
Don't answer that question, it's already been answered.
Now fuxk off, you're done.
I'm awesome, and I fuck dolphins. Ghoolie 12/2/2012: I have absolutely no skills, training or pride -
Well cantonreject the point of this thread was to adress how we think he's a bum, its obvious you don't know what your talking about because you can't plainly see that he's a washed up "has been" who never really had it. The facts are he's a an unqualified defeated loser who can't convert unless he dumps the ball off to watson or hillis after 3yrds. You and mangini or who ever else is in charge of keeping him in the game are the only ones who can't see this. So its quite simple and plainly seen that you are use to being a loser because that's all the browns are gonna do is lose with that tool taking snaps.
So why don't you just go post on other topics and dish out free servings of your neverending superior "knowledge", or just leave this forum altogther since you aren't a browns fan anyhow. What other reason do you have to be a member of this forum if your not a fan? For drama and argument? Delhommo is a bum everyone agrees on that but you, he couldn't lead a team to victory if he had 4 clones of jerry rice as his WR's. So why don't you find out where he lives and go down to his house and get on your knees and take a money shot from him because your on his nuts big time.
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the WRs suck.....how do you expect any QB for this team to play with them? but rather than put the blame where it should be, you're going to put it on the shoulders of your starting QB.....AGAIN
how many QBs have started for the browns over the past 15 years? eventually you are going to realize that its not the QB all the time.....but after that many years of making the same mistakes im not so sure anymore.......you guys will just keep blaming the QB......the coach will panick when his job is on the line and listen to the moronic fans and he'll flip flop QBs again
its inevitable unless you guys actually start supporting your team
aww i was so close to actually respecting your responses. you were the only one coming back with reasonable posts.........and then this
im wondering what you have to say about the tougher pass defenses that jake has played against compared to seneca.
you guys are also super defensive when it comes to criticism unless it comes from a guy who has been here for millions of years. it just so happens that im not hating on the browns......im supporting them....but you're too ignorant to realize it
no wonder lebron left.....no wonder modell moved the team. cleveland is just big enough to carry a market for sports teams and just dumb enough to run them right out again
maybe they'll prove me wrong but this thread just proves my points further
You're right, Jake has competed against some tougher pass defenses. I guess just competing against tough pass defenses makes him the better QB, not his stats. How could I have been so blind?
Buffalo, Tampa Bay and Carolina have such "good" pass defenses because their rush defenses are terrible. It's easy to have a good pass defense when teams don't have to pass on you to beat you. Buffalo is ranked 32nd in rush defense. Tampa Bay is 27th in rush defense. Carolina is 25th in rush defense. Teams destroy them on the ground, therefore they don't have to pass on them.
On the other side, Kansas City is 15th in rush defense, Baltimore is 8th in rush defense, and Cincinnati is 24th. Outside of Cincinnati, those are solid rush defenses. And solid all around defenses.
And we'll completely just disregard the fact that Kansas City and Baltimore will both be playing in the postseason, whereas, of the teams Jake has faced, only Tampa Bay has a shot at playing in the postseason.
Look at Jake's performances against those "elite" defenses.
Tampa Bay 20-37 227 yards 1 TD 2 INT...LOSS
Carolina 24-35 245 yards 0 TD 2 INT...WIN (because of John Kasay choking)
Miami 24-34 217 yards 1 TD 0 INT...WIN (in the worst game I've ever seen)
Buffalo 12-20 86 yards 0 TD 1 INT... LOSS
Here's what Seneca did against those "inferior" teams
Kansas City- 16-31 229 yards 1 TD 1 INT...LOSS
Baltimore 18- 24 141 yards 1 TD 0 INT...LOSS
Cincinnati 18-30 184 yards 1 TD 1 INT...WIN
That's 2 touchdowns and 5 INT's for Jake against teams that have a combined record of 19-33, compared to Seneca's 3 TD's and 2 INT's against teams with a combined record of 18-20. I guess Jake really is playing to win, huh? Because if there's one thing I know, it's that winning QB's throw 2 times as many interceptions as they do touchdowns, especially against cupcake teams.
Seneca Wallace's worst game, by rating, is better than all of Jake's games, excluding the Miami game. Even then, it's only 11 rating points of a difference. Seneca Wallace's average QB rating of 88.5 is 24.9 points higher than that of Delhomme's. Seneca Wallace has yet to throw for multiple interceptions in a game. Jake Delhomme has as many pick sixes as Seneca has interceptions.
You are exactly right, Jake Delhomme is a huge game changer. Unfortunately, those changes normally end in a loss for us.
The two wins Jake has as a starter were the two worst games played this season, and should have very easily been losses. We were a missed field goal away in each game from losing. We didn't win because of Jake, we won in spite of him.
But these are all just subjective things, who's to say we would have won with Seneca in? It's too easy to say what could have been. If only there was a game that Seneca played in and Jake played in too. Man, that would be something for this argument. I'd go so far to say that would even be definitive evidence of who's better.
Oh, wait....
Jake Delhomme vs. ATL
13- 23 97 yards 0 TD 2 INT
Seneca Wallace vs ATL
11-15 139 yards 1 TD 0 INT
What's that? Seneca Wallace outperformed Jakeycakes? He threw for 42 more yards than Jake? On 8 less attempts? And got 1 more touchdown? And 2 less interceptions?
Yeah, but Jake at 2 more completions....so he's obviously better....
I support my team. I know my team. I know football. There's not one statline you can throw at me to prove Jake Delhomme gives the Cleveland Browns a better chance to win than Seneca Wallace. Seneca has outperformed Jake, flat out. That's it. You have a boner for Jake because he's a Ragin' Cajun, probably. And guess what, college allegiences don't get a team into the postseason.
What minimal, and I mean minimal, respect anybody might have had for you is now completely gone. You go onto a Browns forum and try to prove you know something when you clearly don't, and when everybody calls you on your bullshit you throw in a played-out Art Modell crack, and then call our fanbase and city ignorant and expect us to like you because you say you support the Browns? You're a joke, plain and simple.
Also, we take criticism well as a fanbase. We just don't take kindly to douchebags who think they know better about our team when they clearly don't. I'm all for genuine chalk talk with people who know what they're talking about. But you're a 16 week frak and that's it. After the Browns win a Super Bowl and the Saints go back to the cellar, are you going to say "Oh, I used to be a Saints fan, but I've been a secret Browns fan forever."?
Don't answer that question, it's already been answered.
Now fuxk off, you're done.
You're right, Jake has competed against some tougher pass defenses. I guess just competing against tough pass defenses makes him the better QB, not his stats. How could I have been so blind?
Buffalo, Tampa Bay and Carolina have such "good" pass defenses because their rush defenses are terrible. It's easy to have a good pass defense when teams don't have to pass on you to beat you. Buffalo is ranked 32nd in rush defense. Tampa Bay is 27th in rush defense. Carolina is 25th in rush defense. Teams destroy them on the ground, therefore they don't have to pass on them.
On the other side, Kansas City is 15th in rush defense, Baltimore is 8th in rush defense, and Cincinnati is 24th. Outside of Cincinnati, those are solid rush defenses. And solid all around defenses.
And we'll completely just disregard the fact that Kansas City and Baltimore will both be playing in the postseason, whereas, of the teams Jake has faced, only Tampa Bay has a shot at playing in the postseason.
actually their pass defenses are good because they have good secondaries.......tampa had one of the best secondaries in the league this year until all their injuries.......the bills have 2 of the best young corners in the league and their safeties are no joke either.......miami is the same way and carolina has an aging secondary with proven vets
baltimore is built up front....their secondary is garbage except ed reed......their starters are hurt and kansas city might as well not have a secondary
cincy has been beaten up badly all year by the pass......leon hall has had an eric wright type season and roy williams is probably the worst cover safety in the league
and no....i didnt say they were elite.....i just said they had good pass defenses. there is a reason for that because jake and seneca have nothing to do with the ground game. that is why i felt it was appropriate to use the pass defenses rather than the rush defenses seeing as how neither of them are running backs
That's 2 touchdowns and 5 INT's for Jake against teams that have a combined record of 19-33, compared to Seneca's 3 TD's and 2 INT's against teams with a combined record of 18-20. I guess Jake really is playing to win, huh? Because if there's one thing I know, it's that winning QB's throw 2 times as many interceptions as they do touchdowns, especially against cupcake teams.
his stats prove that he played against stiffer competition. their records dont reflect the talent on those teams or how the rest of the browns team performed during those games. in fact, i can use the browns as a perfect example.....the record doesnt reflect how good they actually are
Seneca Wallace's worst game, by rating, is better than all of Jake's games, excluding the Miami game. Even then, it's only 11 rating points of a difference. Seneca Wallace's average QB rating of 88.5 is 24.9 points higher than that of Delhomme's. Seneca Wallace has yet to throw for multiple interceptions in a game. Jake Delhomme has as many pick sixes as Seneca has interceptions.
if you can tell me the formula for coming up with a passer rating then i will start caring about what those numbers mean.....otherwise they are a made up stat
I support my team. I know my team. I know football. There's not one statline you can throw at me to prove Jake Delhomme gives the Cleveland Browns a better chance to win than Seneca Wallace. Seneca has outperformed Jake, flat out. That's it. You have a boner for Jake because he's a Ragin' Cajun, probably. And guess what, college allegiences don't get a team into the postseason.
i really dont care where jake when to school. i have no allegiance to any team or person from louisianna unless they play for the saints. ive grown up in ohio and i know football as well. i know the browns and the saints which is 2 more teams than most of you guys on here know anything about
the only stats that you are saying prove that jake is worse are the INTs.....other than that he has performed the exact same as seneca except he has more wins against stiffer pass defenses
What minimal, and I mean minimal, respect anybody might have had for you is now completely gone. You go onto a Browns forum and try to prove you know something when you clearly don't, and when everybody calls you on your bullshit you throw in a played-out Art Modell crack, and then call our fanbase and city ignorant and expect us to like you because you say you support the Browns? You're a joke, plain and simple.
Also, we take criticism well as a fanbase. We just don't take kindly to douchebags who think they know better about our team when they clearly don't. I'm all for genuine chalk talk with people who know what they're talking about. But you're a 16 week frak and that's it. After the Browns win a Super Bowl and the Saints go back to the cellar, are you going to say "Oh, I used to be a Saints fan, but I've been a secret Browns fan forever."?
i couldnt care less what you think of me or how much respect you have for me.....it has very little to do with browns football. the art modell crack? yea that was right up there with the D&D jokes or whatever you guys think i do in my spare time. pretty classy of you guys to bring shit up that has nothing to do with anything
the moderation here allows for a lot more pissing and moaning and a lot less football talk anyway. you guys keep on bitching and it makes the rest of ohio look bad. its starting to piss me off because my affiliation to the browns is very loose and its giving the normal fans a bad rep......so quit it
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There's a difference between Delhomme feeling pressure and actual pressure. There's been quite a few plays this season where Jake has had a comfortable pocket and has still panicked and thrown a checkdown pass or tried to put a pass somewhere it should never go. He's feeling paranoid, almost.
He's also trying to make tougher throws that a 12 year veteran should know not to make with 1-2 year WR's with little to no experience. Frankly, I think everyone and their mother expected Jake to rely on Ben Watson every play, but that's not been the case. Kudos to Daboll for taking away a QB's comfort player.
This argument about one player trying not to make mistakes while the other is trying to win is nonsense. If playing to win the game means throwing errant passes into double coverage or waiting 6 seconds to throw to a checkdown factorback on a little dump off pass, I'll take the player trying "not to make mistakes". I'd take Colt's 76 yards, 0 TD's and 0 INT's in a win over your precious Aints rather than Jake's 227 yards, 1 TD and 2 INT's in a loss to the Yuckaneers any day of the week. We don't have a powerful enough offense to be giving the ball to the other team. That's not playing to win, that's making bad decisions.
the WRs suck.....how do you expect any QB for this team to play with them? but rather than put the blame where it should be, you're going to put it on the shoulders of your starting QB.....AGAIN
how many QBs have started for the browns over the past 15 years? eventually you are going to realize that its not the QB all the time.....but after that many years of making the same mistakes im not so sure anymore.......you guys will just keep blaming the QB......the coach will panick when his job is on the line and listen to the moronic fans and he'll flip flop QBs again
its inevitable unless you guys actually start supporting your team
Just shut your fuxking mouth already, you've proven not only to be a troll, but an uneducated one at that. You dig yourself in deeper holes every time you post, just go the fuxk away and root for the Saints. I never thought I'd see a fairweather Brown fan, but thanks for proving me wrong. I'll eat crow on that one. You're not garnering any respect by saying you were a Browns fan, or whatever nonsense you spout forth everytime you try and make a valid response. Your arguments are ridiculous, you quote "stats" that merely work against whatever assinine point you were trying to make, and then you try and make other people look dumb because they don't agree with you. It doesn't work, you're a dick.
You're a frak, and a fairweather Browns fan. That's a double whammy.
aww i was so close to actually respecting your responses. you were the only one coming back with reasonable posts.........and then this
im wondering what you have to say about the tougher pass defenses that jake has played against compared to seneca.
you guys are also super defensive when it comes to criticism unless it comes from a guy who has been here for millions of years. it just so happens that im not hating on the browns......im supporting them....but you're too ignorant to realize it
no wonder lebron left.....no wonder modell moved the team. cleveland is just big enough to carry a market for sports teams and just dumb enough to run them right out again
maybe they'll prove me wrong but this thread just proves my points further
no wonder lebron left.....no wonder modell moved the team. cleveland is just big enough to carry a market for sports teams and just dumb enough to run them right out again
All bullsh*t aside you can have your own delusional opinion because every one knows what they say about opinions! But how can you say your a fan or "support" the browns and then make comments like that? Any self respecting browns fan despises art modell to the core, and then you call yourself a fan and justify art modell haha! Anybody that reads that comment can see thru your bullsh*t. Like delhomme or not you can't consider your self a fan and say stuff like that! So go ahead and try to justify your comments nobody respects your opinion anymore.
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Seeing as how Delhomme has twice as much experience as Mccoy and Wallace put together wouldn't you think is safe to say Jake should do just as good against teams ranked 5th and 6th on pass defense as Colt and Wallace would do against teams ranked 28th and 29th.
I mean he is the starter and all but he's being out played by a rookie 3rd round draft pick and a lifetime back up qb so that doesnt say much. Yes, he played tougher teams but to have a rookie 3rd round qb come in and run the offense better then he did says alot.
Just the fact that I hold my breath everytime Jake throws the ball and I get excited when Colt throws it tells me all I need to know.
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no wonder lebron left.....no wonder modell moved the team. cleveland is just big enough to carry a market for sports teams and just dumb enough to run them right out again
All bullsh*t aside you can have your own delusional opinion because every one knows what they say about opinions! But how can you say your a fan or "support" the browns and then make comments like that? Any self respecting browns fan despises art modell to the core, and then you call yourself a fan and justify art modell haha! Anybody that reads that comment can see thru your bullsh*t. Like delhomme or not you can't consider your self a fan and say stuff like that! So go ahead and try to justify your comments nobody respects your opinion anymore.
All bullsh*t aside you can have your own delusional opinion because every one knows what they say about opinions! But how can you say your a fan or "support" the browns and then make comments like that? Any self respecting browns fan despises art modell to the core, and then you call yourself a fan and justify art modell haha! Anybody that reads that comment can see thru your bullsh*t. Like delhomme or not you can't consider your self a fan and say stuff like that! So go ahead and try to justify your comments nobody respects your opinion anymore.
heres the deal.....you can take it or leave it and im willing to bet you'll leave it
ive lived almost my entire life rooting for 2 terrible teams......one of which is the saints.....they recently turned their entire franchise around and are now consistant contenders. it happened very quickly in only the span of 4 seasons
now......the browns are doing something very similar.....they brought in a free agent QB that nobody wanted. they brought in a few defensive leaders and a coach that was cast off his previous team......they bring in a president that wants to revitalize a city and help rebuild a team that is and has been one of the worst teams in the leagues history
now i understand the impatience coming from browns fans and i understand the constant pressure to push away anyone who comes in with a different mindset, but after watching the saints, a team that is known for failure, turn it around in such a short amount of time.....i want nothing more than to see the browns do the exact same thing
they are capable of doing it and the similarities are there. but one thing that i have noticed despite the progress of the team is that there is still a ton of negativity from browns fans. you guys constantly bash whatever scapegoat you can think of from week to week. lately its been jake. early on it was eric wright......for some reason you guys dont understand that one player isnt going to change the outcome of games.
you know when you're a teenager and your parents try and tell you all these things to help but you push them away and act like they have no idea what they are talking about only to grow up and realize they were right about everything..........well here i am.....telling you how its going to be
ive accepted that you dont want to hear what im saying, but in a few seasons the browns will be the cream of north crop and you will be looking back at these posts thinking.....maybe he did know something
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no wonder lebron left.....no wonder modell moved the team. cleveland is just big enough to carry a market for sports teams and just dumb enough to run them right out again
All bullsh*t aside you can have your own delusional opinion because every one knows what they say about opinions! But how can you say your a fan or "support" the browns and then make comments like that? Any self respecting browns fan despises art modell to the core, and then you call yourself a fan and justify art modell haha! Anybody that reads that comment can see thru your bullsh*t. Like delhomme or not you can't consider your self a fan and say stuff like that! So go ahead and try to justify your comments nobody respects your opinion anymore.
All bullsh*t aside you can have your own delusional opinion because every one knows what they say about opinions! But how can you say your a fan or "support" the browns and then make comments like that? Any self respecting browns fan despises art modell to the core, and then you call yourself a fan and justify art modell haha! Anybody that reads that comment can see thru your bullsh*t. Like delhomme or not you can't consider your self a fan and say stuff like that! So go ahead and try to justify your comments nobody respects your opinion anymore.
He's not a Browns fan. When he first joined his avatar was a picture of him wearing the Saints colors and he kept saying a bunch of crap about how we were going to lose to the Saints and all that.
Now that we beat them he's changed his tune and is now sporting a pic of a dog and claims to be a Browns fan.
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You're right, Jake has competed against some tougher pass defenses. I guess just competing against tough pass defenses makes him the better QB, not his stats. How could I have been so blind?
Buffalo, Tampa Bay and Carolina have such "good" pass defenses because their rush defenses are terrible. It's easy to have a good pass defense when teams don't have to pass on you to beat you. Buffalo is ranked 32nd in rush defense. Tampa Bay is 27th in rush defense. Carolina is 25th in rush defense. Teams destroy them on the ground, therefore they don't have to pass on them.
On the other side, Kansas City is 15th in rush defense, Baltimore is 8th in rush defense, and Cincinnati is 24th. Outside of Cincinnati, those are solid rush defenses. And solid all around defenses.
And we'll completely just disregard the fact that Kansas City and Baltimore will both be playing in the postseason, whereas, of the teams Jake has faced, only Tampa Bay has a shot at playing in the postseason.
actually their pass defenses are good because they have good secondaries.......tampa had one of the best secondaries in the league this year until all their injuries.......the bills have 2 of the best young corners in the league and their safeties are no joke either.......miami is the same way and carolina has an aging secondary with proven vets
baltimore is built up front....their secondary is garbage except ed reed......their starters are hurt and kansas city might as well not have a secondary
cincy has been beaten up badly all year by the pass......leon hall has had an eric wright type season and roy williams is probably the worst cover safety in the league
and no....i didnt say they were elite.....i just said they had good pass defenses. there is a reason for that because jake and seneca have nothing to do with the ground game. that is why i felt it was appropriate to use the pass defenses rather than the rush defenses seeing as how neither of them are running backs
That's 2 touchdowns and 5 INT's for Jake against teams that have a combined record of 19-33, compared to Seneca's 3 TD's and 2 INT's against teams with a combined record of 18-20. I guess Jake really is playing to win, huh? Because if there's one thing I know, it's that winning QB's throw 2 times as many interceptions as they do touchdowns, especially against cupcake teams.
his stats prove that he played against stiffer competition. their records dont reflect the talent on those teams or how the rest of the browns team performed during those games. in fact, i can use the browns as a perfect example.....the record doesnt reflect how good they actually are
Seneca Wallace's worst game, by rating, is better than all of Jake's games, excluding the Miami game. Even then, it's only 11 rating points of a difference. Seneca Wallace's average QB rating of 88.5 is 24.9 points higher than that of Delhomme's. Seneca Wallace has yet to throw for multiple interceptions in a game. Jake Delhomme has as many pick sixes as Seneca has interceptions.
if you can tell me the formula for coming up with a passer rating then i will start caring about what those numbers mean.....otherwise they are a made up stat
I support my team. I know my team. I know football. There's not one statline you can throw at me to prove Jake Delhomme gives the Cleveland Browns a better chance to win than Seneca Wallace. Seneca has outperformed Jake, flat out. That's it. You have a boner for Jake because he's a Ragin' Cajun, probably. And guess what, college allegiences don't get a team into the postseason.
i really dont care where jake when to school. i have no allegiance to any team or person from louisianna unless they play for the saints. ive grown up in ohio and i know football as well. i know the browns and the saints which is 2 more teams than most of you guys on here know anything about
the only stats that you are saying prove that jake is worse are the INTs.....other than that he has performed the exact same as seneca except he has more wins against stiffer pass defenses
What minimal, and I mean minimal, respect anybody might have had for you is now completely gone. You go onto a Browns forum and try to prove you know something when you clearly don't, and when everybody calls you on your bullshit you throw in a played-out Art Modell crack, and then call our fanbase and city ignorant and expect us to like you because you say you support the Browns? You're a joke, plain and simple.
Also, we take criticism well as a fanbase. We just don't take kindly to douchebags who think they know better about our team when they clearly don't. I'm all for genuine chalk talk with people who know what they're talking about. But you're a 16 week frak and that's it. After the Browns win a Super Bowl and the Saints go back to the cellar, are you going to say "Oh, I used to be a Saints fan, but I've been a secret Browns fan forever."?
i couldnt care less what you think of me or how much respect you have for me.....it has very little to do with browns football. the art modell crack? yea that was right up there with the D&D jokes or whatever you guys think i do in my spare time. pretty classy of you guys to bring shit up that has nothing to do with anything
the moderation here allows for a lot more pissing and moaning and a lot less football talk anyway. you guys keep on bitching and it makes the rest of ohio look bad. its starting to piss me off because my affiliation to the browns is very loose and its giving the normal fans a bad rep......so quit it
actually their pass defenses are good because they have good secondaries.......tampa had one of the best secondaries in the league this year until all their injuries.......the bills have 2 of the best young corners in the league and their safeties are no joke either.......miami is the same way and carolina has an aging secondary with proven vets
baltimore is built up front....their secondary is garbage except ed reed......their starters are hurt and kansas city might as well not have a secondary
cincy has been beaten up badly all year by the pass......leon hall has had an eric wright type season and roy williams is probably the worst cover safety in the league
and no....i didnt say they were elite.....i just said they had good pass defenses. there is a reason for that because jake and seneca have nothing to do with the ground game. that is why i felt it was appropriate to use the pass defenses rather than the rush defenses seeing as how neither of them are running backs
his stats prove that he played against stiffer competition. their records dont reflect the talent on those teams or how the rest of the browns team performed during those games. in fact, i can use the browns as a perfect example.....the record doesnt reflect how good they actually are
if you can tell me the formula for coming up with a passer rating then i will start caring about what those numbers mean.....otherwise they are a made up stat
i really dont care where jake when to school. i have no allegiance to any team or person from louisianna unless they play for the saints. ive grown up in ohio and i know football as well. i know the browns and the saints which is 2 more teams than most of you guys on here know anything about
the only stats that you are saying prove that jake is worse are the INTs.....other than that he has performed the exact same as seneca except he has more wins against stiffer pass defenses
i couldnt care less what you think of me or how much respect you have for me.....it has very little to do with browns football. the art modell crack? yea that was right up there with the D&D jokes or whatever you guys think i do in my spare time. pretty classy of you guys to bring shit up that has nothing to do with anything
the moderation here allows for a lot more pissing and moaning and a lot less football talk anyway. you guys keep on bitching and it makes the rest of ohio look bad. its starting to piss me off because my affiliation to the browns is very loose and its giving the normal fans a bad rep......so quit it
The ground game has nothing to do with the passing game? Someone tell all the coaches they're wrong! Apparently you don't run to set up the pass or vice versa! It turns out they are mutually exclusive and have no bearing on each other! You show the marks of someone who doesn't know anything about football other than the stats you get in fantasy every week. That doesn't mean you know football. I'm not getting into an internet pissing contest with you, but the shit I leave in the toilet every morning knows more football than you.
Congratulations, though, you have kept up with the latest blurbs on your fantasy football site about the young and rising talent on the worst franchises in the league. 95% of your last response was just a regurgitation of Michael Fabiano's "Start 'em or Sit 'em" throughout the year. Real football is bigger than fantasy. Apparently, though, from the amount of times you mention it, D&D was a big thing for you. It's no wonder you get fantasy and real life confused then.
a = \left ({COMP \over ATT} - .3 \right ) \times 5
b = \left ({YARDS \over ATT} - 3 \right ) \times .25
c = \left ({TD \over ATT} \right ) \times 20
d = 2.375 - \left ({INT \over ATT} \times 25 \right )
Then use the above calculations to complete the passer rating:
Passer Rating_{NFL} = \left ({mm(a) + mm(
+ mm
+ mm(d) \over 6} \right ) \times 100where mm(x) = max(0,min(x,2.375))
That is how a passer rating is figured. But since you don't like the numbers,it's not a real stat, right? That's okay, you don't have to use it; the NFL, ESPN, and the rest of the world will continue to use it. You just live in your bubble and pretend it's a made-up, fantastical statistic.
Jake has more INTs, less TDs, lower completion percentage, and lower yards per completion. He's a statue in the pocket. He doesn't stretch the field vertically. He takes 5 seconds to throw a checkdown pass. The offense hasn't been clicking with him in. He doesn't possess the ability to extend plays.
Your counterargument is weak and ineffective. Jake has not performed exactly the same as Seneca. And judging from your weak response, you've realized it.
But Jake should be our starter for the rest of the year, because he "spreads the field", right? Or is it because he's got more yards than Seneca? Because that's how you gauge a quality QB, his total yards thrown.
This isn't even fun, I feel bad for you.
heres the deal.....you can take it or leave it and im willing to bet you'll leave it
ive lived almost my entire life rooting for 2 terrible teams......one of which is the saints.....they recently turned their entire franchise around and are now consistant contenders. it happened very quickly in only the span of 4 seasons
now......the browns are doing something very similar.....they brought in a free agent QB that nobody wanted. they brought in a few defensive leaders and a coach that was cast off his previous team......they bring in a president that wants to revitalize a city and help rebuild a team that is and has been one of the worst teams in the leagues history
now i understand the impatience coming from browns fans and i understand the constant pressure to push away anyone who comes in with a different mindset, but after watching the saints, a team that is known for failure, turn it around in such a short amount of time.....i want nothing more than to see the browns do the exact same thing
they are capable of doing it and the similarities are there. but one thing that i have noticed despite the progress of the team is that there is still a ton of negativity from browns fans. you guys constantly bash whatever scapegoat you can think of from week to week. lately its been jake. early on it was eric wright......for some reason you guys dont understand that one player isnt going to change the outcome of games.
you know when you're a teenager and your parents try and tell you all these things to help but you push them away and act like they have no idea what they are talking about only to grow up and realize they were right about everything..........well here i am.....telling you how its going to be
ive accepted that you dont want to hear what im saying, but in a few seasons the browns will be the cream of north crop and you will be looking back at these posts thinking.....maybe he did know something
Stop trying to act like the wiser uncle who's seen it all. The Saints won a Super Bowl and now you think you're hot shit.
You're fuxking full of yourself, for no reason. You've yet to provide anything except a wet hole that my long dick of knowledge has fuxked over and over again.
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I feel bad for Mangini. First it was Favre and the Jets and now it's Delhomme and the Browns.
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All bullsh*t aside you can have your own delusional opinion because every one knows what they say about opinions! But how can you say your a fan or "support" the browns and then make comments like that? Any self respecting browns fan despises art modell to the core, and then you call yourself a fan and justify art modell haha! Anybody that reads that comment can see thru your bullsh*t. Like delhomme or not you can't consider your self a fan and say stuff like that! So go ahead and try to justify your comments nobody respects your opinion anymore.
heres the deal.....you can take it or leave it and im willing to bet you'll leave it
ive lived almost my entire life rooting for 2 terrible teams......one of which is the saints.....they recently turned their entire franchise around and are now consistant contenders. it happened very quickly in only the span of 4 seasons
now......the browns are doing something very similar.....they brought in a free agent QB that nobody wanted. they brought in a few defensive leaders and a coach that was cast off his previous team......they bring in a president that wants to revitalize a city and help rebuild a team that is and has been one of the worst teams in the leagues history
now i understand the impatience coming from browns fans and i understand the constant pressure to push away anyone who comes in with a different mindset, but after watching the saints, a team that is known for failure, turn it around in such a short amount of time.....i want nothing more than to see the browns do the exact same thing
they are capable of doing it and the similarities are there. but one thing that i have noticed despite the progress of the team is that there is still a ton of negativity from browns fans. you guys constantly bash whatever scapegoat you can think of from week to week. lately its been jake. early on it was eric wright......for some reason you guys dont understand that one player isnt going to change the outcome of games.
you know when you're a teenager and your parents try and tell you all these things to help but you push them away and act like they have no idea what they are talking about only to grow up and realize they were right about everything..........well here i am.....telling you how its going to be
ive accepted that you dont want to hear what im saying, but in a few seasons the browns will be the cream of north crop and you will be looking back at these posts thinking.....maybe he did know something
you know when you're a teenager and your parents try and tell you all these things to help but you push them away and act like they have no idea what they are talking about only to grow up and realize they were right about everything..........well here i am.....telling you how its going to be
The only thing your telling me is that you have no idea what the hell your talking about and everybody that's read your posts and this thread can pretty much agree your a moron who is a saints fan and should be on a saints forum giving all your great advice to those people..........jake delhomme is a complete bum he has no buisness getting the deal the browns gave him. The OP who started the thread did so to vent his frustrations with a 3rd rate QB, yet you felt the urge to sh*t on it to prove to all of us "negative browns fans who constantly bash whatever scape goat we can think of from week to week". So why don't you do us a favor uncle cantonreject and save your wonderful advice for someone who cares. And in a few seasons when we do turn it around I'm sure ill see your fair weather ass on here touting on the browns.
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At this point were screwed,Delhomme's lame duck QB performance has put the Browns in position with just enough wins of not being able to move up any draft position.Being out of the top 10 leaves less trade down possibilites.No need to play Colt McCoy now and risk further injury.Let Jake finish the season that way we have a target for snowballs.
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All bullsh*t aside you can have your own delusional opinion because every one knows what they say about opinions! But how can you say your a fan or "support" the browns and then make comments like that? Any self respecting browns fan despises art modell to the core, and then you call yourself a fan and justify art modell haha! Anybody that reads that comment can see thru your bullsh*t. Like delhomme or not you can't consider your self a fan and say stuff like that! So go ahead and try to justify your comments nobody respects your opinion anymore.
He's not a Browns fan. When he first joined his avatar was a picture of him wearing the Saints colors and he kept saying a bunch of crap about how we were going to lose to the Saints and all that.
Now that we beat them he's changed his tune and is now sporting a pic of a dog and claims to be a Browns fan.
He's not a Browns fan. When he first joined his avatar was a picture of him wearing the Saints colors and he kept saying a bunch of crap about how we were going to lose to the Saints and all that.
Now that we beat them he's changed his tune and is now sporting a pic of a dog and claims to be a Browns fan.
actually i came here to talk about the browns and give you guys somethin to look forward to
heres a link to my original post
http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=15683
read that thread......its funny because even tho i came to wish you guys luck, you guys still jumped on my ass
same thing happened in the saints/browns thread......i started talking a little smack and you guys jumped on something that had nothing to do with football
its cool tho....after less than a season ive come to despise most browns fans and im completely content just tryin to piss you guys off more now.....its not that hard
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mikeyP72 said:
What proof do we need?Jake is not better than Seneca or Colt. Colt, after 4 starts, 2 of which defeating the Patriots and Saints, has been pegged by more experts than not as the QB of the future for the Browns.
Jake cannot out perform a career backup in Seneca Wallace. He single handedly lost 2 close games with untimely INT's earler in the season and almost handed the game to the Carolina Panthers (1-12).
The numbers and facts don't lie.
Come out of the basement and put down the magic cape fruit cake. There's a whole big world out here with people and opinions and facts, this isn't make believe land.
this is your problem
after 4 games you are ready to can your QB.....rather than giving him time and weapons you would rather crush him and watch him cry on the bench
the stats only show what you want them to show......colt didnt have anything to do with the victories against the saints or the pats
you guys keep blaming the QB when the real problem is WRs......if they get open....if they make plays on the ball instead of not getting open and running terrible routes and dropping balls, anybody could start for the browns
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mikeyP72 said:
What proof do we need?Jake is not better than Seneca or Colt. Colt, after 4 starts, 2 of which defeating the Patriots and Saints, has been pegged by more experts than not as the QB of the future for the Browns.
Jake cannot out perform a career backup in Seneca Wallace. He single handedly lost 2 close games with untimely INT's earler in the season and almost handed the game to the Carolina Panthers (1-12).
The numbers and facts don't lie.
Come out of the basement and put down the magic cape fruit cake. There's a whole big world out here with people and opinions and facts, this isn't make believe land.
this is your problem
after 4 games you are ready to can your QB.....rather than giving him time and weapons you would rather crush him and watch him cry on the bench
the stats only show what you want them to show......colt didnt have anything to do with the victories against the saints or the pats
you guys keep blaming the QB when the real problem is WRs......if they get open....if they make plays on the ball instead of not getting open and running terrible routes and dropping balls, anybody could start for the browns
you guys keep blaming the QB when the real problem is WRs......if they get open....if they make plays on the ball instead of not getting open and running terrible routes and dropping balls, anybody could start for the browns
Do you really think that we don't know that our WRs are below average? Is Steve Smith average? Delhomme had him last year, how did that work out for him?
Listen, the Browns have a good defense and can run the ball very well. There is no need for your "game changer" (lofl). They need an efficient QB not a risk taker that absolutely kills them and does indeed change the game.
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you guys keep blaming the QB when the real problem is WRs......if they get open....if they make plays on the ball instead of not getting open and running terrible routes and dropping balls, anybody could start for the browns
Do you really think that we don't know that our WRs are below average? Is Steve Smith average? Delhomme had him last year, how did that work out for him?
Listen, the Browns have a good defense and can run the ball very well. There is no need for your "game changer" (lofl). They need an efficient QB not a risk taker that absolutely kills them and does indeed change the game.
Do you really think that we don't know that our WRs are below average? Is Steve Smith average? Delhomme had him last year, how did that work out for him?
Listen, the Browns have a good defense and can run the ball very well. There is no need for your "game changer" (lofl). They need an efficient QB not a risk taker that absolutely kills them and does indeed change the game.
You need a great quarterback in today's NFL, period. You need a guy who can win games for you, not just be a caretaker. It's a quarterback league and a passing league. Nobody's winning Super Bowls with Orton or Fitzpatrick or Delhomme. It's Brady, Manning, Brees, and Roethlisberger, like it or not. Right behind them are Rivers, Ryan, and Rodgers. If he ever gets consistent, maybe Sanchez. Right now, he's as often the problem as the solution.
The idea of being awesome everywhere else and only decent at the most important position in team sports is old fashioned. Hey, the Vikings have everything else but a quarterback. How'd they look last night? Welcome back to .500, the pre-Favre Vikings. Or the Jets last year, when they should have been 7-9 if not for two teams resting all their starters.
As Holmgren says over and over, you have to be able to pass the ball really well, week after week, to win in this league for very long. As Gruden says, if you don't have your quarterback, nothing else really matter.
"North of 90" is the saying now: If you can't pass for a rating above 90 in today's NFL, go home. Preferably 100. You need to complete about 65% for over 7, maybe over 7.5, and throw twice as many TDs as INTs. It equates to winning, period.
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you guys keep blaming the QB when the real problem is WRs......if they get open....if they make plays on the ball instead of not getting open and running terrible routes and dropping balls, anybody could start for the browns
Do you really think that we don't know that our WRs are below average? Is Steve Smith average? Delhomme had him last year, how did that work out for him?
Listen, the Browns have a good defense and can run the ball very well. There is no need for your "game changer" (lofl). They need an efficient QB not a risk taker that absolutely kills them and does indeed change the game.
Do you really think that we don't know that our WRs are below average? Is Steve Smith average? Delhomme had him last year, how did that work out for him?
Listen, the Browns have a good defense and can run the ball very well. There is no need for your "game changer" (lofl). They need an efficient QB not a risk taker that absolutely kills them and does indeed change the game.
i am sure you guys understand the lack of talent at the WR position.....but i am not so sure you guys understand how detrimental they actually are to the team. the team got rid of its 2 best weapons in edwards and winslow......they replaced them with massaquoi and robiskie. are you kidding me? peyton manning and tom brady couldnt make those terrible receivers look good
steve smith is well past his prime and he is no longer the all pro caliber player that he was......not to mention the fact that they got rid of his other weapons and his tight ends were garbage
delhomme came to another team with no WRs and average TEs. it would be great to see him play with some talent at the WR position to see if he really is the problem or not
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