Is This Racist? Didn't They Used To Call Bush A Chimp?
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To me, the worst thing about the e-mail is that it trivializes the tremendous harm Obama is doing to our democracy. We're going to look a lot like Libya by the time he's through with us.
Paxton
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Exactly. And Heck bickering about side issues.... also trivializes the damage that Obamao is doing...
in perfect liberal avoidance of reality form.
Liberalism is a dangerous cult. Dangerous to our country.
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Let's try that again: in this instance, where you have a woman who works for the Republican Party in California passing along a clearly racist email, what should be her sanction, if any? What would you do?
Here's what Scott Baugh, the County GOP leader, thinks: he considered it "dripping with racism and in very poor taste." He wants her to resign from her elected post on the county's central committee. (Must be one of those liberal race-baiters who uses race issues to divide us and buy votes.)
What would you do in this situation if you were her superior? Don't pretend that someone wants the woman burned at the stake. What would you do?
Let's try that again:
Meaning you got your butt smacked in the last series so lets refocus on something else."
Fine.
in this instance, where you have a woman who works for the Republican Party in California passing along a clearly racist email, what should be her sanction, if any? What would you do?
In a perfect world one would issue a statement along the lines of "Oh come on. It was a joke, but nobody here thinks Obama is actually a monkey and sorry if we offended any one."
In the real world of demegogues and cloying political correctness I suppose one might issue an over the top statement like the one below.
Here's what Scott Baugh, the County GOP leader, thinks: he considered it "dripping with racism and in very poor taste." He wants her to resign from her elected post on the county's central committee
(Must be one of those liberal race-baiters who uses race issues to divide us and buy votes.)
Close. No doubt he's playing the game for votes.
It sounded to me like a guy making an over the top statement to appease the chronically outraged groups with nothing better to do that stage a protest.
Hey, kind like you!
Seriously if some Democrat made a joke about a drunk Irishman and I demanded justice would you think I was being ridiculous or would you do the official bow and scrape?
What would you do in this situation if you were her superior? Don't pretend that someone wants the woman burned at the stake. What would you do?
I'd pretend I was outraged and make her issue a faux apology while you guys did the superior dance.
WSS
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Aye aye aye.
Yes, Steve, I'm reeling from your onslaught of winning arguments, like calling blacks monkeys and calling an Irishman a drunk are the same thing. (While you're at it, maybe you can explain how calling a Jew a "Jew!" is the same thing as calling a Presbyterian a "Presbyterian!") Suggesting that not liking someone because of their race and not like someone because they're an asshole are the same thing - that was another good one. Trotting out someone Fox News dug up from the NBPP and suggesting he is the same thing to Democratic Party as someone in the California Republican Party is for the Republican Party - another gem. He Who Can Not Distinguish Between Two Unlike Things, take yet another bow. Honestly, get over yourself. I'm getting side messages from people about how lost you are. I wouldn't be so quick to imagine yourself found. This is not the stuff of victory dances. It's to be laughed at in a logic class at a community college.
Funny, again, that you admitted that this email was racist. Just like you admitted that believing that interracial marriage should be illegal is racist. And the only problem you have with either situation? Anyone who might think being racist, or making racist jokes, is a bad thing, and says so. Not a single word in all of this for the actual racism, or the person involved. Just contempt for the people who mention it.
Nor did you ever ask what I would do in this situation. You just assumed I was "outraged." Just contempt for me for trying to explain why calling black monkeys and calling Bush a chimp are two very different things, and for explaining how, yes, this is a racist joke. That's all I've been arguing.
Also, "Oh come on. It was a joke." Doesn't really work here. The problem is that the joke is racist. At it's core, this email is the same thing as typing out the sentence, "You know why Obama doesn't have a birth certificate? Because he's from a family of monkeys." That's the joke. Just like that Seth MacFarlane "joke" on Family Guy was the same thing as typing out, "Isn't it funny that Sarah Palin has a Down Syndrome baby?" So, you can either apologize for not knowing it was racist, or for your lapse in judgment. But apologizing for thinking racism was funny and forwarding it on to your friends probably isn't going to get you anywhere.
"Sorry you can't take a racist joke and roll with it, people!"
This is where you don't seem to get it. Whether it's your past statements about "illiterate welfare criminals" or something like this, you don't seem to get the crux of it is that these are racist sentiments. Racism is, well, bad. When you issue an apology it should note that you understand this, and that you didn't think it through, and you're sorry for your lapse in judgment. Instead, you'd like you remind people that they should accept that, while you're making racist statements, or finding racist emails funny, that they should understand that you're not racist it all and blow it off. Once again, it's not accepting that there's anything wrong with racism.
Whether or not you believe Democrats overplay this hand is irrelevant here. That's your go-to speech every time, but you're missing the point.
For the record, I think the woman should want to - if not be made to - apologize for forwarding on that email. It should show that she understands what the problem with it is. (It's racist.) To this date, she's refused to do that. In the meantime, if I were her boss, I'd make sure there aren't more examples of this type of behavior. If she was an otherwise exemplary employee who is just an old lady who doesn't know any better, that would be the end of it. (Assuming she apologized.) If this was a larger pattern - if she really, really likes racist humor or made lots of these types of comments - clearly then you'd make sure she resigned as soon as possible, because you don't want your organization associated with racism, or be thought of as an organization that condones racism.
Perhaps this is an extreme, liberal position in your mind, but I really don't think it is. I also suspect it's pretty much what the Republican Party in Orange County thinks, too.
And no, Diehard doesn't have to resign.
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Aye aye aye.
Yes, Steve, I'm reeling from your onslaught of winning arguments, like calling blacks monkeys and calling an Irishman a drunk are the same thing. (While you're at it, maybe you can explain how calling a Jew a "Jew!" is the same thing as calling a Presbyterian a "Presbyterian!") Suggesting that not liking someone because of their race and not like someone because they're an asshole are the same thing - that was another good one. Trotting out someone Fox News dug up from the NBPP and suggesting he is the same thing to Democratic Party as someone in the California Republican Party is for the Republican Party - another gem. He Who Can Not Distinguish Between Two Unlike Things, take yet another bow. Honestly, get over yourself. I'm getting side messages from people about how lost you are. I wouldn't be so quick to imagine yourself found. This is not the stuff of victory dances. It's to be laughed at in a logic class at a community college.
Funny, again, that you admitted that this email was racist. Just like you admitted that believing that interracial marriage should be illegal is racist. And the only problem you have with either situation? Anyone who might think being racist, or making racist jokes, is a bad thing, and says so. Not a single word in all of this for the actual racism, or the person involved. Just contempt for the people who mention it.
Nor did you ever ask what I would do in this situation. You just assumed I was "outraged." Just contempt for me for trying to explain why calling black monkeys and calling Bush a chimp are two very different things, and for explaining how, yes, this is a racist joke. That's all I've been arguing.
Also, "Oh come on. It was a joke." Doesn't really work here. The problem is that the joke is racist. At it's core, this email is the same thing as typing out the sentence, "You know why Obama doesn't have a birth certificate? Because he's from a family of monkeys." That's the joke. Just like that Seth MacFarlane "joke" on Family Guy was the same thing as typing out, "Isn't it funny that Sarah Palin has a Down Syndrome baby?" So, you can either apologize for not knowing it was racist, or for your lapse in judgment. But apologizing for thinking racism was funny and forwarding it on to your friends probably isn't going to get you anywhere.
"Sorry you can't take a racist joke and roll with it, people!"
This is where you don't seem to get it. Whether it's your past statements about "illiterate welfare criminals" or something like this, you don't seem to get the crux of it is that these are racist sentiments. Racism is, well, bad. When you issue an apology it should note that you understand this, and that you didn't think it through, and you're sorry for your lapse in judgment. Instead, you'd like you remind people that they should accept that, while you're making racist statements, or finding racist emails funny, that they should understand that you're not racist it all and blow it off. Once again, it's not accepting that there's anything wrong with racism.
Whether or not you believe Democrats overplay this hand is irrelevant here. That's your go-to speech every time, but you're missing the point.
For the record, I think the woman should want to - if not be made to - apologize for forwarding on that email. It should show that she understands what the problem with it is. (It's racist.) To this date, she's refused to do that. In the meantime, if I were her boss, I'd make sure there aren't more examples of this type of behavior. If she was an otherwise exemplary employee who is just an old lady who doesn't know any better, that would be the end of it. (Assuming she apologized.) If this was a larger pattern - if she really, really likes racist humor or made lots of these types of comments - clearly then you'd make sure she resigned as soon as possible, because you don't want your organization associated with racism, or be thought of as an organization that condones racism.
Perhaps this is an extreme, liberal position in your mind, but I really don't think it is. I also suspect it's pretty much what the Republican Party in Orange County thinks, too.
And no, Diehard doesn't have to resign.
Aye aye aye.
Careful Heck.
YOu're mocking the dialect of Hispanics.
You might get fired.
I'm getting side messages from people about how lost you are.
Then (and I have a guess) whoever that may be is free to speak on the record.
I'll read the rest later.
WSS
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I don't know what more there is to say anyway.
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Aye Aye Aye Heck
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What? Mocking all Hispanics AND all of our Navy military personnel?
That does it, I'm offended.
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Steve, the messages usually take the form of, "Why do you bother?" They're in no hurry to join our stupid discussion.
And I don't blame them.
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Steve, the messages usually take the form of, "Why do you bother?" They're in no hurry to join our stupid discussion.
And I don't blame them.
Steve, the messages usually take the form of, "Why do you bother?" They're in no hurry to join our stupid discussion.
And I don't blame them.
Well I can answer that Heck.
It's not from any liberal or love thy brother attitude that you have and I don't.
It's simply that you're a born demagogue.
I don't think you or any of your fanbase really believe that the way to heal the divide between any two groups is to make up a seperate set of social mores for each of them.
I don't believe for a second that anyone buys that the double standard you support, no, demand setsn the stage for assimilation. Without assimilation there will never be equality.
And I don't think anyone here will deny that it's about time to stop blaming someone else else for the shortcomings of an insulated society.
The allure of praise over wine and cheese is too much to give up I suppose.
WSS
www.westsidesteve.com www.myspace.com/westsidestevemusic www.cdbaby.com/artist/westsidestevesimmons -
Why do I bother indeed.
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Why do I bother indeed.
Why do I bother indeed.
No idea.
Training for the non response hyperbolic Olympics?
WSS
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Steve, the messages usually take the form of, "Why do you bother?" They're in no hurry to join our stupid discussion.
And I don't blame them.
Well I can answer that Heck.
It's not from any liberal or love thy brother attitude that you have and I don't.
It's simply that you're a born demagogue.
I don't think you or any of your fanbase really believe that the way to heal the divide between any two groups is to make up a seperate set of social mores for each of them.
I don't believe for a second that anyone buys that the double standard you support, no, demand setsn the stage for assimilation. Without assimilation there will never be equality.
And I don't think anyone here will deny that it's about time to stop blaming someone else else for the shortcomings of an insulated society.
The allure of praise over wine and cheese is too much to give up I suppose.
WSS
I don't think you or any of your fanbase really believe that the way to heal the divide between any two groups is to make up a seperate set of social mores for each of them.
I don't believe for a second that anyone buys that the double standard you support, no, demand setsn the stage for assimilation. Without assimilation there will never be equality.
And I don't think anyone here will deny that it's about time to stop blaming someone else else for the shortcomings of an insulated society.
WSS
And again to your "why bother" query I suspect you know what I wrote here is rational.
And though you'll never admit it you're fully aware that the double standard you promote stops assimilation and widens the gap.
But you've decided to make me your personal straw man.
It's OK to admit you were wrong.
WSS
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That's downright hysterical.
No, Steve. I don't find the worth in your speech there. (I was chuckling when I read it.) Nor, once again, does it speak to what we're talking about. The problem with "bothering" with you is that you always do this - break into a speech about something else, and then call me "non-responsive" for not following your change of direction, or address the straw man cartoon you've created for me, where you sub in your opinions about what I think for what I actually think. Honestly, after all of this time, all that I've written, you seem to have no conception of what I think, or what liberals believe. You only have your cartoon.
It gets old real fast. I have other things to do.
I don't agree with your contentions at all. They're uselessly broad. Honestly, you write this and think it's great, and that I could never take issue with it, and I'll just never admit it. It makes me laugh.
What's wrong with you? If you want to think that you've convinced me, or bested me in this or any discussion, go right ahead. I can't stop you. But trust me. Seriously. I'm not wowed by this. I'm not. I promise you.
Honestly, I haven't heard someone refer the need for blacks to "assimilate" in a very long time. That's usually a term reserved for immigrants. Far from being "rational" or "right", I think you're working on about a 25-year lag when it comes to these issues. And I'm not sure I care to bother discussing them with you anymore. I think I know where you stand. It's certainly not where I do.
Here's a question you could answer though, and it directly relates to what we were talking about: is it the same thing to make a joke about Obama being a chimp and Bush being a chimp? It's obvious to me that there's a double standard here, and that there should be. You poo-pooed the idea of double standards in general, but this was the one I was talking about, so like I said, I don't know how to follow you down these side trails.
So, do you not see the difference? Do you really think the two statements should be seen as equals?
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Heck translation:
"conservative is fine to be called a chimp...
anti-American progressive... it's really wrong to do the same thing"
got it.
A lot like the WH wanting to make corps disclose their political donations.
But of course, unions are exempt... and any org that gets Obama given grants... are also exempt.
The progressive marxists' rules flip opposite, as the benefit to them switches.
And they will never admit that THAT is hypocrisy, and corrupt.
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Well, Steve, there's a fine old man who doesn't see the difference. Do you?
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One uses race to deflect criticism of his failed politicies, because he came
from a church and pastor who hate America, and blame whites for all social ills.
"Obamao isn't screwing up our country, because he's black"...
You Obamao puppets put him up for Pres, despite his complete lack of experience and ability to lead...
because he was black - to buy black votes, and pull out the racist card when he would fail.
Most all of us don't CARE what color he is.
He's a lying, hateful, corrupt somebeech marxist.
WEST FOR PRESIDENT !
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That's downright hysterical.
No, Steve. I don't find the worth in your speech there. (I was chuckling when I read it.) Nor, once again, does it speak to what we're talking about. The problem with "bothering" with you is that you always do this - break into a speech about something else, and then call me "non-responsive" for not following your change of direction, or address the straw man cartoon you've created for me, where you sub in your opinions about what I think for what I actually think. Honestly, after all of this time, all that I've written, you seem to have no conception of what I think, or what liberals believe. You only have your cartoon.
It gets old real fast. I have other things to do.
I don't agree with your contentions at all. They're uselessly broad. Honestly, you write this and think it's great, and that I could never take issue with it, and I'll just never admit it. It makes me laugh.
What's wrong with you? If you want to think that you've convinced me, or bested me in this or any discussion, go right ahead. I can't stop you. But trust me. Seriously. I'm not wowed by this. I'm not. I promise you.
Honestly, I haven't heard someone refer the need for blacks to "assimilate" in a very long time. That's usually a term reserved for immigrants. Far from being "rational" or "right", I think you're working on about a 25-year lag when it comes to these issues. And I'm not sure I care to bother discussing them with you anymore. I think I know where you stand. It's certainly not where I do.
Here's a question you could answer though, and it directly relates to what we were talking about: is it the same thing to make a joke about Obama being a chimp and Bush being a chimp? It's obvious to me that there's a double standard here, and that there should be. You poo-pooed the idea of double standards in general, but this was the one I was talking about, so like I said, I don't know how to follow you down these side trails.
So, do you not see the difference? Do you really think the two statements should be seen as equals?
That's downright hysterical.
No, Steve. I don't find the worth in your speech there. (I was chuckling when I read it.) Nor, once again, does it speak to what we're talking about. The problem with "bothering" with you is that you always do this - break into a speech about something else, and then call me "non-responsive" for not following your change of direction, or address the straw man cartoon you've created for me, where you sub in your opinions about what I think for what I actually think. Honestly, after all of this time, all that I've written, you seem to have no conception of what I think, or what liberals believe. You only have your cartoon.
It gets old real fast. I have other things to do.
I don't agree with your contentions at all. They're uselessly broad. Honestly, you write this and think it's great, and that I could never take issue with it, and I'll just never admit it. It makes me laugh.
What's wrong with you? If you want to think that you've convinced me, or bested me in this or any discussion, go right ahead. I can't stop you. But trust me. Seriously. I'm not wowed by this. I'm not. I promise you.
Honestly, I haven't heard someone refer the need for blacks to "assimilate" in a very long time. That's usually a term reserved for immigrants. Far from being "rational" or "right", I think you're working on about a 25-year lag when it comes to these issues. And I'm not sure I care to bother discussing them with you anymore. I think I know where you stand. It's certainly not where I do.
Here's a question you could answer though, and it directly relates to what we were talking about: is it the same thing to make a joke about Obama being a chimp and Bush being a chimp? It's obvious to me that there's a double standard here, and that there should be. You poo-pooed the idea of double standards in general, but this was the one I was talking about, so like I said, I don't know how to follow you down these side trails.
So, do you not see the difference? Do you really think the two statements should be seen as equals?
This is a good example of why you're called non responsive.
Your trademarks are:
1 Pretend you're laughing.
(but you're the most humorless guy here_)
2 Personal insults
(I'm lost stupid idiotic submental blah blah)
3 Bitch that I repeat points.
(Yep. They're still true)
4 After refusing to answer you ask another question.
(a part and parcel of political propaganda. Never state an opinion lest you give something to be attacked. Stay on offense and speak in generalities)
Here you complain that assimilation (becoming equal part of American culture and society) is outdated and we need a seperate set of rules.
So now that your required preamble is taken care of I'll answer you in the next post while remindiong you that you refuse to do the same.
WSS
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Well, Steve, there's a fine old man who doesn't see the difference. Do you?
Well, Steve, there's a fine old man who doesn't see the difference. Do you?
Ah forgot one.
6 Attack Cal.
" So, do you not see the difference?"
But to your questions:
Fair enough.
Yes I see a difference.
However it's come to pass that the "sticks and stones" rule applies to eveyone except black people.
That because there have been hard times in past centuries that this group deserves special protection from any perceived jest or slight.
Jests that in any other situation would elicit a "get over it" response from you.
"Do you really think the two statements should be seen as equals?"
Yes Heck. I do.
The president is not a monkey.
Anyone who actually believes so is an idiot.
President Bush was not a monkey or a Retard.
Same caveat applies.
Furthermore almost no differences among races are due to race itself.
(meaning societal differences so I don't have to hear a word game on that distinction)
WSS
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"Here you complain that assimilation (becoming equal part of American culture and society) is outdated and we need a seperate set of rules."
That's not what I said at all. See, once again, you're making things up. I'm saying assimilation is usually a term used for immigrants, not people who have been here for generations. So why don't you explain to me what you mean by black Americans becoming "equal part of American culture and society," I kind of thought they already were.
PS - And I'm not pretending I'm laughing. You can trust me on that one, too.
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As for the other part, you said you see a difference between the two "chimp" statements because of the history of racism and discrimination and slavery applies to one and not the other. Great. That's what I've been getting at all along. It's the same reason why calling a "Jew" a "Jew" (pejoratively, not descriptively) is different from calling a Presbyterian a "Presbyterian" - because of the history of what the statements mean. Because we're adults, we understand why this double standard exists.
And then you lose me again when you say you believe that a statement that's racist - which you agreed is racist - should be seen as no different or worse than a statement that isn't. You said you see a difference, but when asked if those statements should be seen as equals, you say, "Yes Heck. I do." I don't agree with that, and I'm even surprised that you're making that case.
And then, once again, you make up what you think I believe:"That because there have been hard times in past centuries that this group deserves special protection from any perceived jest or slight.
No, not at all. I don't believe that they deserve special protection from any perceived jest or slight. I think racism is bad. And unfortunate. I also think public officials who are tasked with representing all Americans should not have racist beliefs, or condone racism, or prejudice. Those two things are different, as difficult as it might be for you to distinguish between the two.
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http://www.aquilaarts.com/bushmonkey.html
But this is great to libs.
do the same to Obamao, and it's offensive...
funny how that works. It's racist since Obamao is part black....
it's offensive to women if it was about Hillary,
but it's never racist if a black person were to create a pic of Bush as a monkey.
Liberal/progressive/marxists always use "offense" to their political advantage.
Totally corrupt thinking
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