My Ideas
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The fix. Raise taxes on the eltite. Create incentives to bring factories back to the US. Rich4nothin
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Oh, raise those taxes on the rich, Rich ! That's rich!!!! It's rich folk who own the factories. Tax them so high they will move THEMSELVES elsewhere !
Then raise taxes on those nasty corps so they will leave faster too !
But, then, create.......eh.... lower taxes so they will come right back again? Bass-ackwards pseudo-logic, Rich....
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Create funding for infrastructure projects. Increase the payments on SS and medicare to unlimited income.
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Oopsie, Richie ! LOL. Your iconic moronic failure ObaMAO spent us into near permanent debt now. We don't HAVE THE FREAKIN MONEY FOR those projects.
I mean, if we DID raise the money for those projects, it would have to go for paying off our INSANE NATIONAL FREAKIN DEBT.
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Cut defense spending in half by closing most of the overseas bases and eliminating the duplication among the services while increasing readiness and capablity
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I wouldn't mind closing some bases that are not really needed anymore. Which ones, oh generalizing generalizer? But the fighter that the Navy needs that can land
on an aircraft carrier is not necessarily the fighter that the Air Force needs for long distance raids But where possible, yeah.
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Tax all Churches like any other business that is what they are in essence.
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If you are going to go after churches, why not go after all
tax exempt orgs? Like the NEA and all the "ea's" in all the states? And AARP?
they are in the big business of supporting a certain....political ...party......
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Delete the vast majority of tax deductions including real estate and institute a graduated flat tax of 10% over 25K 15% over 50K 20% over 120K and 30% over 400K
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Oh, mindless grasshopper. The first thing that would do, is to kill off most all landowners, especially farmers. It would
hit the large farmers insanely, and it would cause food prices to skyrocket past anyone's scariest imagination.
Too much jaw flappy, and too little thought, oh, Richiewan.
The fix. Raise taxes on the eltite. Create incentives to bring factories back to the US. Rich4nothin
**********************************************
Oh, raise those taxes on the rich, Rich ! That's rich!!!! It's rich folk who own the factories. Tax them so high they will move THEMSELVES elsewhere !
Then raise taxes on those nasty corps so they will leave faster too !
But, then, create.......eh.... lower taxes so they will come right back again? Bass-ackwards pseudo-logic, Rich....
***********************************************
Create funding for infrastructure projects. Increase the payments on SS and medicare to unlimited income.
***********************************************
Oopsie, Richie ! LOL. Your iconic moronic failure ObaMAO spent us into near permanent debt now. We don't HAVE THE FREAKIN MONEY FOR those projects.
I mean, if we DID raise the money for those projects, it would have to go for paying off our INSANE NATIONAL FREAKIN DEBT.
***********************************************
Cut defense spending in half by closing most of the overseas bases and eliminating the duplication among the services while increasing readiness and capablity
**********************************************
I wouldn't mind closing some bases that are not really needed anymore. Which ones, oh generalizing generalizer? But the fighter that the Navy needs that can land
on an aircraft carrier is not necessarily the fighter that the Air Force needs for long distance raids But where possible, yeah.
*********************************************
Tax all Churches like any other business that is what they are in essence.
*****************************************************
If you are going to go after churches, why not go after all
tax exempt orgs? Like the NEA and all the "ea's" in all the states? And AARP?
they are in the big business of supporting a certain....political ...party......
*****************************************************
Delete the vast majority of tax deductions including real estate and institute a graduated flat tax of 10% over 25K 15% over 50K 20% over 120K and 30% over 400K
*****************************************************
Oh, mindless grasshopper. The first thing that would do, is to kill off most all landowners, especially farmers. It would
hit the large farmers insanely, and it would cause food prices to skyrocket past anyone's scariest imagination.
Too much jaw flappy, and too little thought, oh, Richiewan.
Rich people do not own corporations. That is why they are corporations because thousands of shareholders including indivduals, other corporations and nations and governments own them. Further, raising individual tax rates has nothing to do with factories and where they are. Corporate tax rates do however. What I proposed lowers corporate tax rates and eliminates the loopholes which now result in them allowing foreign profits to not be taxed penned in by the Bush Admin which is why corporations moved all the jobs overseas and use other loopholes to pay no taxes. I did suggest Obama create tax incentives to move factories back to the USA.
I will not answer your stupidity about Obama spending as Bush created the debt nigntmare and it was thrown over the fence to Obama in the face of an economy nearly in total collapse. I will say this though the eight Bush budget years added 6 trillion dollars to the national debt not counting the two trillion unfunded monies spent on two useless wars. Hmm 8 trillion dollars. So go ahead blame the 800 billion Obama spent on the stimulus to get us 14 trillion in hock
Your illogical defense of Air Force long range bombers was illogical. They are unecessary. The Air Force did not exist in WWII and that was the last war we won. Since we have tied one and lost going on three and the Air has not done any significant fighting since Korea. Obviously, you know jack about the need for long Range Air Bombers. We have 60 bases around the world. What purpose does a base in Germany serve or Japan each supporting 50,000 troops? What purpose does an aircraft development agency for each the Army, the Navy, and the Air Force serve when we are only developing one aircraft?
Further, the tax position I stated would make a fair tax for all rather than allowing crooked corporations and crooked farmers abuse the the tax code via loopholes. 40 % of US corporations pay no tax including many fortune 500 companies. Churches are for profit organizations, any for profit organization should be taxed. Non profits that can demonstrate NO profit will owe no tax, so your bs about that is bs, and makes no sense.
Cal, I learned long ago that your are illogical and in denial and do not use fact or data to reach the abysmal conclusions you believe So I will just let you shiitt yourself as usual in unsubstantiated factless bs as above. I say the following which you cannot defeat with data. Trickle down economics proved a dismal failure as a result of Reagan and Bush resuliting in destruction of America's middle class. Further millions of good blue collar jobs were destroyed during the Bush years more than any other period. Further the job growth rate overtime is usually arount 20%, it was negative for the whole Bush term. Further the average wealth of an American shrank during the Bush years. Further we had the lowest taxes on record during the Bush years. Further we added 8 trillion dollars of new debt during the Bush years. Further during the Bush years with lowest taxes in nearly a century we had a tremendous exodus of factories and jobs go overseas. Further American company profits are at record levels yet no jobs are being created, why because they already been sent overseas. So you want to keep doing this exercise of self destruction. Good Thinking Cal.
So Cal we are done discussing anything about the economy because your destructive political view is based on denial illogical totally factless bullshit to support an inane view forced on the people by a certain party. You drank the cool aid Have fun plowing yur garden You know jack about economics or our military and the excess deificit spending of your party and military spending explosiion of your party which is triple what it was when Clinton left office when we still had Two Towers in NY.
We just finished the worst decade since the depression and you want to continue the stupidity that created the worst decade since the depression Brilliant Cal, just brilliant.........bye bye this discussion is over. Talking to a box a rocks is a waste of time
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Well, I don't think that churches should be able to own hundred of acres of land tax-free. Limit it to 25 acres tax free per parish or whatever. And churches involved in politics need to be taxed.
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Well, I don't think that churches should be able to own hundred of acres of land tax-free. Limit it to 25 acres tax free per parish or whatever. And churches involved in politics need to be taxed.
Well, I don't think that churches should be able to own hundred of acres of land tax-free. Limit it to 25 acres tax free per parish or whatever. And churches involved in politics need to be taxed.
Why should they get anything tax free? You make a profit you pay taxes. I will concede that land a church is on up to five acres get a significant reduction in real estate tax. Everything over five get the same rate as other properties. On your other statement a lot of Church pastors speak out on politics regularly.
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The liberal loonies are always trying to control everyones freedom of speech.
Hell maybe some would be in favor of making Christians where a star on their shirt.
What do you guys want, a totalitarian take over by the US Government.
Maybe you would be in favor of a National religion so the US Government can control what is allowed to be preached from the pulpit. If the preacher speaks against a politician they can be sent to prison.
You better wake up before its to late.
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By being involved in politics I meant campaign contributions, etc.
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By being involved in politics I meant campaign contributions, etc.
By being involved in politics I meant campaign contributions, etc.
Its cool.
IMO: Their are some who despise the churches and would love to be able to control what comes from the pulpit. It is hard to control the masses when they dont control peoples thoughts or dont place our worldly leaders on a pedestal. For centuries many dictators have imposed one religion or faith so that it could be controled.
Before the American revolution many of the colonist were inspired by preachers and what they had to say from the pulpit.
How Preachers Incited Revolution
Angry colonists were rallied to declare independence and take up arms because of what they heard from the pulpit.
By Harry S. Stout
No turning back.
At the Battle of Bunker Hill (June 17, 1775) Americans suffered 441 casualties and the British 1,150. Though a strategic victory for the British, English nerve was shaken, the colonists were emboldened, and any hope for peaceful reconciliation was lost.
It's 1775. The year 1787, with its novel constitution and separation of church and state is a long 12 years away. At the moment, you and your friends are just a bunch of outlaws.
You've heard the debates in Parliament over taxation and representation; you've seen British troops enforce royal supremacy at the point of a bayonet. Your king, George III, and Parliament have issued a declaration asserting their sovereignty in "all cases whatsoever" in the colonies. You are, at least in New England, a people under siege with British troops quartered in Boston. You've dumped tea into Boston's harbor in a fit of rage and had your port closed.
Who will you turn to now for direction? There are no presidents or vice-presidents, no supreme court justices or public defenders to call on. There are a handful of young, radical lawyers, like the Adams cousins, John and Samuel, but they're largely concentrated in cities, while you and most of your friends live in the country. In many colonies, including Massachusetts, there are not even elected governors or councilorsthey have all been appointed by the British crown and are answerable to it.
Where you turn is where you have habitually turned for over a century: to the prophets of your society, your ministers.
The American Revolutionary era is known as the "Golden Age of Oratory." What school child has not heard or read Patrick Henry's immortal words, "Give me liberty or give me death"? Who has not seen reenactments or heard summaries of Ben Franklin's heroic appearance before a hostile British Parliament?
Yet often lost in this celebration of patriotic oratory is the key role preaching played in the Revolutionary movement.
Another good link Religion and the founding of the American Republic
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Rich,
Sorry, martian buddy, but you didn't give any data. You didn't give any information. Your president is a complete and total failure.
Obamao wants control over our judicial system, our farms, our guns, our electoral process, our corporations, our families, our educational system,
and he wants control over every penny we make, he wants control or abolishment of states' rights, parents' rights, born and unborn childrens' rights,
control over our culture, control over our private property ownership....
Obamao is a fascist, Rich. The sad truth is, you and Vaporized and MosquitoZits, Heck and Shep and all, remind me of the
German people cheering insanely for Hitler, then refusing to realize that they were cheering on a horror of horrors, until it was way too late.
If your Obamao was so perfect, and brilliant, why has he not fixed any freakin thing in two years, but instead is breaking or attempting to break everything
American over his last over two years? No wonder you want to end the debate before it really gets started Rich. Your side of the debate has lost all
credibility. Ramble on all you want, but Obamao is still a complete disaster, and the approval rating for the stark naked and butt ugly Obamao tree has
plummetted again, to a new low.
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Churches are not taxed because it's in the constitution, first amendment.
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof"
taxing churches would violate this amendment.
Churches are not taxed because it's in the constitution, first amendment.
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof"
taxing churches would violate this amendment.
Yeah, I'm with rich on this one. The reason churches aren't taxed isn't because of the First Amendment. By your logic, you could also make the argument that their tax exemption is unconstitutional.
I've been reading, but I'm not sure exactly where their tax exemption stems from. I don't think they have nonprofit 501
3 status. From some of the stuff I've read it's just based on the assumption that any profit they turned would be for charitable works, but I haven't found any really unbiased sources that say that. I'd like to know the exact legal reason that they're exempt. -
I kind of feel that taxing a Church's property would be prohibiting their free exercise of religion. What if the church cannot afford the taxes? would the government shut them down? take their property? Also keep in mind that The reason many settlers came to the new world was to escape the high taxes on their religion, which was England's way to weed out any religion other than the church of England.
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I kind of feel that taxing a Church's property would be prohibiting their free exercise of religion. What if the church cannot afford the taxes? would the government shut them down? take their property? Also keep in mind that The reason many settlers came to the new world was to escape the high taxes on their religion, which was England's way to weed out any religion other than the church of England.
I kind of feel that taxing a Church's property would be prohibiting their free exercise of religion. What if the church cannot afford the taxes? would the government shut them down? take their property? Also keep in mind that The reason many settlers came to the new world was to escape the high taxes on their religion, which was England's way to weed out any religion other than the church of England.
Taxing a church's property isn't prohibiting their freedom to exercise religion. If they can't afford the taxes, then they can have a sermon in a park, and their land can and should be taken by the government. You don't need a huge, golden, glorified building to be a good religious person, not in my opinion.
We don't need to tax them unreasonable amounts (though if they opened their books, I'd argue that we should), but yes, they should be taxed.
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respectfully disagree Vape.
http://www.latimes.com/features/religion/la-oew-lynn-stanley23-2008sep23,0,2226105.story
SCOTUS takes my stance.
"In its 1970 opinion in Walz vs. Tax Commission of the City of New York, the high court stated that a tax exemption for churches "creates only a minimal and remote involvement between church and state and far less than taxation of churches. [An exemption] restricts the fiscal relationship between church and state, and tends to complement and reinforce the desired separation insulating each from the other." The Supreme Court also said that "the power to tax involves the power to destroy." Taxing churches breaks down the healthy separation of church and state and leads to the destruction of the free exercise of religion."
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respectfully disagree Vape.
http://www.latimes.com/features/religion/la-oew-lynn-stanley23-2008sep23,0,2226105.story
SCOTUS takes my stance.
"In its 1970 opinion in Walz vs. Tax Commission of the City of New York, the high court stated that a tax exemption for churches "creates only a minimal and remote involvement between church and state and far less than taxation of churches. [An exemption] restricts the fiscal relationship between church and state, and tends to complement and reinforce the desired separation insulating each from the other." The Supreme Court also said that "the power to tax involves the power to destroy." Taxing churches breaks down the healthy separation of church and state and leads to the destruction of the free exercise of religion."
respectfully disagree Vape.
http://www.latimes.com/features/religion/la-oew-lynn-stanley23-2008sep23,0,2226105.story
SCOTUS takes my stance.
"In its 1970 opinion in Walz vs. Tax Commission of the City of New York, the high court stated that a tax exemption for churches "creates only a minimal and remote involvement between church and state and far less than taxation of churches. [An exemption] restricts the fiscal relationship between church and state, and tends to complement and reinforce the desired separation insulating each from the other." The Supreme Court also said that "the power to tax involves the power to destroy." Taxing churches breaks down the healthy separation of church and state and leads to the destruction of the free exercise of religion."
Ah dammit, but nice article. I thought I typed up an earlier response, but failed to mention it. I agree with you on the fact that it's not unconstitutional to give churches tax-exempt status. I only argued that you could say the same thing about taxing them. And I would maintain that if they were to be taxed it wouldn't be breaking the first amendment, either.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walz_v._Tax_Commission
The supreme court doesn't touch the issue of actually taxing them in that decision, it only states that giving tax-exempt status is within the constitution; which I would agree with.
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Rich,
Sorry, martian buddy, but you didn't give any data. You didn't give any information. Your president is a complete and total failure.
Obamao wants control over our judicial system, our farms, our guns, our electoral process, our corporations, our families, our educational system,
and he wants control over every penny we make, he wants control or abolishment of states' rights, parents' rights, born and unborn childrens' rights,
control over our culture, control over our private property ownership....
Obamao is a fascist, Rich. The sad truth is, you and Vaporized and MosquitoZits, Heck and Shep and all, remind me of the
German people cheering insanely for Hitler, then refusing to realize that they were cheering on a horror of horrors, until it was way too late.
If your Obamao was so perfect, and brilliant, why has he not fixed any freakin thing in two years, but instead is breaking or attempting to break everything
American over his last over two years? No wonder you want to end the debate before it really gets started Rich. Your side of the debate has lost all
credibility. Ramble on all you want, but Obamao is still a complete disaster, and the approval rating for the stark naked and butt ugly Obamao tree has
plummetted again, to a new low.
Rich,
Sorry, martian buddy, but you didn't give any data. You didn't give any information. Your president is a complete and total failure.
Obamao wants control over our judicial system, our farms, our guns, our electoral process, our corporations, our families, our educational system,
and he wants control over every penny we make, he wants control or abolishment of states' rights, parents' rights, born and unborn childrens' rights,
control over our culture, control over our private property ownership....
Obamao is a fascist, Rich. The sad truth is, you and Vaporized and MosquitoZits, Heck and Shep and all, remind me of the
German people cheering insanely for Hitler, then refusing to realize that they were cheering on a horror of horrors, until it was way too late.
If your Obamao was so perfect, and brilliant, why has he not fixed any freakin thing in two years, but instead is breaking or attempting to break everything
American over his last over two years? No wonder you want to end the debate before it really gets started Rich. Your side of the debate has lost all
credibility. Ramble on all you want, but Obamao is still a complete disaster, and the approval rating for the stark naked and butt ugly Obamao tree has
plummetted again, to a new low.
I gave a load of facts and substantiation to your lies.........counter them or keep fawkinbg lying as you now are accustomed to
starting with 8 trillion in Bush debt and two wars to nowhere.........start by countering either.........or just be what you are an in denial ahole
you just spewed eight or ten lines of numberless bullshoot .........and that makes you what you are a lying assholoe
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respectfully disagree Vape.
http://www.latimes.com/features/religion/la-oew-lynn-stanley23-2008sep23,0,2226105.story
SCOTUS takes my stance.
"In its 1970 opinion in Walz vs. Tax Commission of the City of New York, the high court stated that a tax exemption for churches "creates only a minimal and remote involvement between church and state and far less than taxation of churches. [An exemption] restricts the fiscal relationship between church and state, and tends to complement and reinforce the desired separation insulating each from the other." The Supreme Court also said that "the power to tax involves the power to destroy." Taxing churches breaks down the healthy separation of church and state and leads to the destruction of the free exercise of religion."
Ah dammit, but nice article. I thought I typed up an earlier response, but failed to mention it. I agree with you on the fact that it's not unconstitutional to give churches tax-exempt status. I only argued that you could say the same thing about taxing them. And I would maintain that if they were to be taxed it wouldn't be breaking the first amendment, either.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walz_v._Tax_Commission
The supreme court doesn't touch the issue of actually taxing them in that decision, it only states that giving tax-exempt status is within the constitution; which I would agree with.
Ah dammit, but nice article. I thought I typed up an earlier response, but failed to mention it. I agree with you on the fact that it's not unconstitutional to give churches tax-exempt status. I only argued that you could say the same thing about taxing them. And I would maintain that if they were to be taxed it wouldn't be breaking the first amendment, either.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walz_v._Tax_Commission
The supreme court doesn't touch the issue of actually taxing them in that decision, it only states that giving tax-exempt status is within the constitution; which I would agree with.
So I don't think it's unreasonable to allow them a standard amount of property or donations per parrishoner tax free.
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Ah dammit, but nice article. I thought I typed up an earlier response, but failed to mention it. I agree with you on the fact that it's not unconstitutional to give churches tax-exempt status. I only argued that you could say the same thing about taxing them. And I would maintain that if they were to be taxed it wouldn't be breaking the first amendment, either.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walz_v._Tax_Commission
The supreme court doesn't touch the issue of actually taxing them in that decision, it only states that giving tax-exempt status is within the constitution; which I would agree with.
So I don't think it's unreasonable to allow them a standard amount of property or donations per parrishoner tax free.
So I don't think it's unreasonable to allow them a standard amount of property or donations per parrishoner tax free.
Right, that's where we disagree. I think they should have to pay a property tax (they really don't have to pay this?). This is unfair because, as far as I know, there's no secular service organization that gets the same recognition without being a 501
3. I think their donations, however, should be tax free.
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