Mccoy And Our System?
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I said this a while back: our system and McCoy do not mesh. There's a reason McCoy's stats are so drastically different during the 4th quarter when we're in catch-up situations. Once we start with our hurry-up offense and Colt starts calling his routes from the line, we look like a completely different team. McCoy has been in a Shotgun, fast tempo offense for most of his football career. He's used to that, and that's where he thrives.
It doesn't help that this WCO system we're running is also shite. Shurmur's playcalling is bland and unimaginative. It's all slants and 2 yard dives, interspersed with some 2 yard dives and slants. I understand that is what the WCO is built upon, but you have to change things up a little. The most successful coordinators and coaches have their own systems, hybrid bastardizations of different offenses. No successful coaches really just run one system, they make their own system with a blend of many different philosophies.
All Shurmur has done is photocopied a playbook from some random 1970's California state high school playoff team. His uncle was known as an innovator, too bad Pat didn't somehow inherit that gene.
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The new regime wants to install their system and that takes time. They dont care if it plays to the players strengths. Which is fine only if we are ready to stick with the coach and the ideology for 3+ years. Remember it takes time to find the right players and for the players to learn the system and excel in it.
The unknowns are if we have the right coach to lead us.
Well....Holmgren picked Mccoy, knowing the system he intended to run. Obviously, that isn't working out. San Francisco has a new coach with his new system. How are they doing? I thought Holmgren was a football genius....certainly more experienced and knowledgeable than Harbaugh.... I don't feel real encouraged, when the genius tells me that the qb he picked might not be the right guy, and we might have to pick a new qb every year until we get it right...WTF?...I could do that...and I wouldn't charge them 10 million a year to do it.
Well....Holmgren picked Mccoy, knowing the system he intended to run. Obviously, that isn't working out. San Francisco has a new coach with his new system. How are they doing? I thought Holmgren was a football genius....certainly more experienced and knowledgeable than Harbaugh.... I don't feel real encouraged, when the genius tells me that the qb he picked might not be the right guy, and we might have to pick a new qb every year until we get it right...WTF?...I could do that...and I wouldn't charge them 10 million a year to do it.
Holmgren didn't pick McCoy to be "the guy". He picked McCoy to be "the guy before the guy". Colt was picked because he was the lowest-risk QB in that draft. Colt's a smart, hard-working player. He makes good decisions, is decently mobile, has above par accuracy, and doesn't have a long arm. In short, he's the perfect guy to have when installing a new system, especially a system that's predicated on short passes and good decisions. He's not going to lose us any games himself. He'll probably win us a couple along the way, but for the most part all he's here to do is manage the game. The entire offense has to learn this system together, and having a long armed gunslinger back there would be counter-productive. Colt's a player-coach; he's going to learn the system and teach it to everyone else. That way, when we do make the move for a franchise QB, everyone will be on the same page.
And then our future franchise QB will have a great mentor.
I'm awesome, and I fuck dolphins. Ghoolie 12/2/2012: I have absolutely no skills, training or pride -
Omg this is a stupid. I almost wish we'd draft the Stanford turd. As highly "OVERRATED" as he is so that all the colt haters can make excuses for him that are not reasonable for mccoy. The o line is beat up, no running game, the head coach, the president, ect.
And then there are the front running bandwagon phags out there like girly or whom ever started this topic that will still be like" ohh what are they doing i didn't want Andy phuck and suck they shoulda listened to me." and one day when the browns do win they'll be like c i told ya so god about time they do it my way..
Lets just sit back and watch holmgen screw us up cause we were obviously one game one plyer or one season away from being a real football franchise anyway right?
Good job front office president owner and coach and what ever players are still trying cause 3-4 is not good enough for anyone else.
so that all the colt haters can make excuses for him that are not reasonable for mccoy. The o line is beat up, no running game, the head coach, the president, ect.
theres a myriad of reasons we're struggling.....colt being one of them. hwile you wanna believe the "colt haters" just wanna bash the new QB, you "colt apologists" wanna blame everything under the sun but him. its more complicated than either, but colt is an easy target cause he, in fact, looks pretty bad. the WRs suck, the OL cant block, the FO didn't get him any help, etc......are not excuses for what he does on a play by play basis...they are excuses for the overall failure of the O to move the ball and score consistently.
these are no excuses for his poor arm strength, inability to see the field, read blitzes, call protections, shitty footwork, poor timing, poor accuracy, and bad pocket presence. while many of us recognize he is still young and learning, and some of these things should improve, it in no way negates the merit of the criticism. these are things he did well last year, and that are getting worse with every game in shurmurs system. i happen to think a large majority of the problem is inadequate coaching and not colt just sucking, but none of these deficiencies excuse this pop-warner offense. if he is indeed the QB many of you said he is, he should be able to persevere and do something...anything....
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Idk i can't really defend or bash the kid either way. And honestly any qb in Cleveland never gets a fair shake EVER!!!! But the amusing thing about mccoy with everyone's OPINION on here (honestly no one on this board knows dick about nfl football evaluations. Present company included. That's right i can admitt it can anyone else), he is actually better statistically better thru 7 gmes compared to 8. Tds are up, ints are down, qb rating is up. Fmbles are up but i don't really blame him completely for that. Footwork, field view or whatever sounds like mumble jumble to make people sound like they know more about shit than they really do. Cause i hear all the experts on tv say man his Footwork is all messed up. Remind u his numbers r better with a weaker supporting cast around him. He is at much fault as any other player or coach in my mind. No more responsible no less responsible. Team game last i checked
"We are Americans. We don't quit doing something because it's wrong. We just keep doing the wrong thing till it turns out right." Browns maybe the most American Football team ever. -
Well....Holmgren picked Mccoy, knowing the system he intended to run. Obviously, that isn't working out. San Francisco has a new coach with his new system. How are they doing? I thought Holmgren was a football genius....certainly more experienced and knowledgeable than Harbaugh.... I don't feel real encouraged, when the genius tells me that the qb he picked might not be the right guy, and we might have to pick a new qb every year until we get it right...WTF?...I could do that...and I wouldn't charge them 10 million a year to do it.
Holmgren didn't pick McCoy to be "the guy". He picked McCoy to be "the guy before the guy". Colt was picked because he was the lowest-risk QB in that draft. Colt's a smart, hard-working player. He makes good decisions, is decently mobile, has above par accuracy, and doesn't have a long arm. In short, he's the perfect guy to have when installing a new system, especially a system that's predicated on short passes and good decisions. He's not going to lose us any games himself. He'll probably win us a couple along the way, but for the most part all he's here to do is manage the game. The entire offense has to learn this system together, and having a long armed gunslinger back there would be counter-productive. Colt's a player-coach; he's going to learn the system and teach it to everyone else. That way, when we do make the move for a franchise QB, everyone will be on the same page.
And then our future franchise QB will have a great mentor.
very well putHolmgren didn't pick McCoy to be "the guy". He picked McCoy to be "the guy before the guy". Colt was picked because he was the lowest-risk QB in that draft. Colt's a smart, hard-working player. He makes good decisions, is decently mobile, has above par accuracy, and doesn't have a long arm. In short, he's the perfect guy to have when installing a new system, especially a system that's predicated on short passes and good decisions. He's not going to lose us any games himself. He'll probably win us a couple along the way, but for the most part all he's here to do is manage the game. The entire offense has to learn this system together, and having a long armed gunslinger back there would be counter-productive. Colt's a player-coach; he's going to learn the system and teach it to everyone else. That way, when we do make the move for a franchise QB, everyone will be on the same page.
And then our future franchise QB will have a great mentor.
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Idk i can't really defend or bash the kid either way. And honestly any qb in Cleveland never gets a fair shake EVER!!!! But the amusing thing about mccoy with everyone's OPINION on here (honestly no one on this board knows dick about nfl football evaluations. Present company included. That's right i can admitt it can anyone else), he is actually better statistically better thru 7 gmes compared to 8. Tds are up, ints are down, qb rating is up. Fmbles are up but i don't really blame him completely for that. Footwork, field view or whatever sounds like mumble jumble to make people sound like they know more about shit than they really do. Cause i hear all the experts on tv say man his Footwork is all messed up. Remind u his numbers r better with a weaker supporting cast around him. He is at much fault as any other player or coach in my mind. No more responsible no less responsible. Team game last i checked
Footwork, field view or whatever sounds like mumble jumble to make people sound like they know more about shit than they really do. Cause i hear all the experts on tv say man his Footwork is all messed up. Remind u his numbers r better with a weaker supporting cast around him.
ok....so you say alot in these couple sentences...
youre saying fundamentals dont matter. these are things experts look at, evaluate....so why would they even mention it? while i agree numbers are important, there's more to this game than just numbers. stats often lie....for instance, a good portion of colts numbers have come in garbage time when we are trailing. do his stats reflect how badly the offense plays thru the first 3 quarters? do they reflect the number of times receivers run bad routes, colt misses reads/an open receiver, or the number of checkdown completions for 2 yards? footwork is very important to a QB whether you realize it or not....it helps him line up, focus, and deliver the ball quickly an accurately. this directly leads to mccoys accuracy problems....he dances and hops around in the pocket instead of planting his feet and throwing. this the result of the OL? some of it at the very minimum....but unless he settles and learns to plant his feet, his velocity and accuracy will suffer (which is whats been observed). just because it seems like mumble jumble to you has no relevance to the ability of a trained eye to use those evaluations to judge a QB (im not that good, no, but colts problem with footwork is very easy to see.)
so while a talent evaluator goes by what they see on film, casual fans without that ability go by stats. its their tool to evaluate the game. so im sorry, but if you think colt is doing just fine cause his numbers are slightly improved with the same supporting cast, then you are seriously missing the true story of just what the hell is going wrong with this team.
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Same supporting cast watch the browns...boy! No hillis no vickers no steinbach no stuckey don't sit there and say the cast is the same when the only player of skill giving anything close to last year is mccoy. And that isn't saying much they were horrible last year son!
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Footwork, field view or whatever sounds like mumble jumble to make people sound like they know more about shit than they really do. Cause i hear all the experts on tv say man his Footwork is all messed up. Remind u his numbers r better with a weaker supporting cast around him.
ok....so you say alot in these couple sentences...
youre saying fundamentals dont matter. these are things experts look at, evaluate....so why would they even mention it? while i agree numbers are important, there's more to this game than just numbers. stats often lie....for instance, a good portion of colts numbers have come in garbage time when we are trailing. do his stats reflect how badly the offense plays thru the first 3 quarters? do they reflect the number of times receivers run bad routes, colt misses reads/an open receiver, or the number of checkdown completions for 2 yards? footwork is very important to a QB whether you realize it or not....it helps him line up, focus, and deliver the ball quickly an accurately. this directly leads to mccoys accuracy problems....he dances and hops around in the pocket instead of planting his feet and throwing. this the result of the OL? some of it at the very minimum....but unless he settles and learns to plant his feet, his velocity and accuracy will suffer (which is whats been observed). just because it seems like mumble jumble to you has no relevance to the ability of a trained eye to use those evaluations to judge a QB (im not that good, no, but colts problem with footwork is very easy to see.)
so while a talent evaluator goes by what they see on film, casual fans without that ability go by stats. its their tool to evaluate the game. so im sorry, but if you think colt is doing just fine cause his numbers are slightly improved with the same supporting cast, then you are seriously missing the true story of just what the hell is going wrong with this team.
i agree what your sayin but don't sit there and act like your in the film room with the dawgs. No one on this site knows what mccoys evaluation is with coaches if it is as bad as 90% of this boards members say then why is he playing and senneca notok....so you say alot in these couple sentences...
youre saying fundamentals dont matter. these are things experts look at, evaluate....so why would they even mention it? while i agree numbers are important, there's more to this game than just numbers. stats often lie....for instance, a good portion of colts numbers have come in garbage time when we are trailing. do his stats reflect how badly the offense plays thru the first 3 quarters? do they reflect the number of times receivers run bad routes, colt misses reads/an open receiver, or the number of checkdown completions for 2 yards? footwork is very important to a QB whether you realize it or not....it helps him line up, focus, and deliver the ball quickly an accurately. this directly leads to mccoys accuracy problems....he dances and hops around in the pocket instead of planting his feet and throwing. this the result of the OL? some of it at the very minimum....but unless he settles and learns to plant his feet, his velocity and accuracy will suffer (which is whats been observed). just because it seems like mumble jumble to you has no relevance to the ability of a trained eye to use those evaluations to judge a QB (im not that good, no, but colts problem with footwork is very easy to see.)
so while a talent evaluator goes by what they see on film, casual fans without that ability go by stats. its their tool to evaluate the game. so im sorry, but if you think colt is doing just fine cause his numbers are slightly improved with the same supporting cast, then you are seriously missing the true story of just what the hell is going wrong with this team.
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Yea i guess your time really ain't worth that much anyway. Keep blaming colt he has as many if not more weapons and protection as last year. So i guess his stats mean dick they been in every game but tenn game and u call it garbage time. Bet u a skip bayless fan too lmfao
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Outside of the Tennessee game, none of McCoy's stats were really recorded in "garbage time". We haven't been blown out this season, and our losses have never been by more than 10 points (excluding the Tennessee game).
The reason his stats are so inflated in the fourth quarter is because by that time he's no longer running the "WCO" that Shurmur is trying to install. Once we hit the "hurry-up" offense, Colt is calling his own plays from the line and is more often than not in Shotgun. In all actuality, his fourth quarter stats are probably more his "true" stats than the other 3 quarters.
I'm awesome, and I fuck dolphins. Ghoolie 12/2/2012: I have absolutely no skills, training or pride -
and against a prevent D....hence garbage time. theyre giving him the only stuff he can complete...the underneath routes. he has yet to beat a base defense.
and against a prevent D....hence garbage time. theyre giving him the only stuff he can complete...the underneath routes. he has yet to beat a base defense.
Lmfao gotta love those blitzing prevent defenses. I've seen worse qbs in better offenses for the browns. You can complain till the browns get it right then u can emerge as if ur the one all along that had the blueprints. But for now the whole offense sucks so bash whomever you want ghoolie oh i mean chocco chicken
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Outside of the Tennessee game, none of McCoy's stats were really recorded in "garbage time". We haven't been blown out this season, and our losses have never been by more than 10 points (excluding the Tennessee game).
The reason his stats are so inflated in the fourth quarter is because by that time he's no longer running the "WCO" that Shurmur is trying to install. Once we hit the "hurry-up" offense, Colt is calling his own plays from the line and is more often than not in Shotgun. In all actuality, his fourth quarter stats are probably more his "true" stats than the other 3 quarters.
Outside of the Tennessee game, none of McCoy's stats were really recorded in "garbage time". We haven't been blown out this season, and our losses have never been by more than 10 points (excluding the Tennessee game).
The reason his stats are so inflated in the fourth quarter is because by that time he's no longer running the "WCO" that Shurmur is trying to install. Once we hit the "hurry-up" offense, Colt is calling his own plays from the line and is more often than not in Shotgun. In all actuality, his fourth quarter stats are probably more his "true" stats than the other 3 quarters.
Ya know i wish they'd go to a hurry up more often than they do. He'll start the game out that way
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Go back and rewatch the games. They're not running prevent defenses. At least, not until the very last minute.
You're just trying to hate against Colt instead of looking at it objectively. Sure, he's no Peyton Newton-Brady. But he's not Chad Henne, either.
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