Draft And Free Agency
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^yup...amusing to say the least.
i think the "its not my money" approach is fundamentally flawed, and almost always results in a) grandiose projections, and
unrealistic expectations.try imagining what you'd do if you didn't have an unlimited budget....look at some actual numbers. cause the parameters we operate under with some of these ridiculous and utterly absurd predictions/plans are completely different than a GM with a budget and an actual job to do.
Honestly money wise it is doable. I can't find the exact figure but off the top of my head I remember us having between 25-30 mil under the cap. We have a ton of cap space signing Williams and Jackson could happen if they wanted it to. Adding a quality CB and quality WR additionally might be out of reach but it really depends on what people are willing to pay Meachum and Manningham of the world.
Honestly money wise it is doable. I can't find the exact figure but off the top of my head I remember us having between 25-30 mil under the cap. We have a ton of cap space signing Williams and Jackson could happen if they wanted it to. Adding a quality CB and quality WR additionally might be out of reach but it really depends on what people are willing to pay Meachum and Manningham of the world.
Gotta lower your expectations, kiddo. Here's some real world numbers. Williams will get an $80 million contract- take it to the bank- pun intended. We'll have to overpay like hell to persuade him to leave Super Bowl contender Houston, something Heckert is extremely unlikely to do. Franchise money for a wr receiver is $9.5 million so forget about Jackson, headcase problems aside. So you've already blown all the cap on two players.
Not only that, once you have those two guys on board- it creates a ripple effect on salary demands from guys you already have on the team. Exhibit "A" would be the Browns picking up FA Raymond Clayborn from the Patriots for big bucks way back when. And you can't blame them. So we bring in Williams- Sheard has as many sacks- he's gonna say- "Well I'm playing as good as Mario, so now I want Mario money too."
Another WR? Well Manningham is going to think he's worth Anquan Boldin money, which is around $8.5 million a year, not counting signing bonus. Adding a CB the caliber of Jonathan Joseph (5 year deal, $48.5 million) about $12 million up front = tilt. Your scenario might work if you're playing Madden, won't work for the Browns. Doubly, because with a 4-12 record, we're going to have to overpay anyone we get.
Look no farther than the current Super Bowl teams, maybe only a couple of superstars- but a bunch of solid players and great coaching.
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Zombo said:
Sheard is more comfortable at LE, but with Mathis at LE I think he would learn to excel at RE. Talent is talent, and he's got it.
Zombo
I agree Sheard could probably play either position he wanted to. But why move him to RE for a few seasons at most with Mathis? Once Mathis leaves the Sheard is going to want to move back. Sheard is the future, let him play where he is more comfortable.
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^yup...amusing to say the least.
i think the "its not my money" approach is fundamentally flawed, and almost always results in a) grandiose projections, and
unrealistic expectations.try imagining what you'd do if you didn't have an unlimited budget....look at some actual numbers. cause the parameters we operate under with some of these ridiculous and utterly absurd predictions/plans are completely different than a GM with a budget and an actual job to do.
Honestly money wise it is doable. I can't find the exact figure but off the top of my head I remember us having between 25-30 mil under the cap. We have a ton of cap space signing Williams and Jackson could happen if they wanted it to. Adding a quality CB and quality WR additionally might be out of reach but it really depends on what people are willing to pay Meachum and Manningham of the world.
Honestly money wise it is doable. I can't find the exact figure but off the top of my head I remember us having between 25-30 mil under the cap. We have a ton of cap space signing Williams and Jackson could happen if they wanted it to. Adding a quality CB and quality WR additionally might be out of reach but it really depends on what people are willing to pay Meachum and Manningham of the world.
about 18 mil as we sit now was last i heard after gocong got paid. sure we could do it, to the detriment of the rest of the squad.
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I'd rather pay big money to one player that would finish out a very good unit (defensive line) than pay the same amount of money to players like we have recently. Scott Fujita, Chris Gocong, Sheldon Brown, Evan Moore, etc. We could have the best defensive line in football with Williams. Then draft a DB that can hopefully upgrade over Brown or Adams or a linebacker that will upgrade Fujita.
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I'd rather pay big money to one player that would finish out a very good unit (defensive line) than pay the same amount of money to players like we have recently. Scott Fujita, Chris Gocong, Sheldon Brown, Evan Moore, etc. We could have the best defensive line in football with Williams. Then draft a DB that can hopefully upgrade over Brown or Adams or a linebacker that will upgrade Fujita.
I'd rather pay big money to one player that would finish out a very good unit (defensive line) than pay the same amount of money to players like we have recently. Scott Fujita, Chris Gocong, Sheldon Brown, Evan Moore, etc. We could have the best defensive line in football with Williams. Then draft a DB that can hopefully upgrade over Brown or Adams or a linebacker that will upgrade Fujita.
we won't sign williams but we will draft all three positions that you mentioned.
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Honestly money wise it is doable. I can't find the exact figure but off the top of my head I remember us having between 25-30 mil under the cap. We have a ton of cap space signing Williams and Jackson could happen if they wanted it to. Adding a quality CB and quality WR additionally might be out of reach but it really depends on what people are willing to pay Meachum and Manningham of the world.
Gotta lower your expectations, kiddo. Here's some real world numbers. Williams will get an $80 million contract- take it to the bank- pun intended. We'll have to overpay like hell to persuade him to leave Super Bowl contender Houston, something Heckert is extremely unlikely to do. Franchise money for a wr receiver is $9.5 million so forget about Jackson, headcase problems aside. So you've already blown all the cap on two players.
Not only that, once you have those two guys on board- it creates a ripple effect on salary demands from guys you already have on the team. Exhibit "A" would be the Browns picking up FA Raymond Clayborn from the Patriots for big bucks way back when. And you can't blame them. So we bring in Williams- Sheard has as many sacks- he's gonna say- "Well I'm playing as good as Mario, so now I want Mario money too."
Another WR? Well Manningham is going to think he's worth Anquan Boldin money, which is around $8.5 million a year, not counting signing bonus. Adding a CB the caliber of Jonathan Joseph (5 year deal, $48.5 million) about $12 million up front = tilt. Your scenario might work if you're playing Madden, won't work for the Browns. Doubly, because with a 4-12 record, we're going to have to overpay anyone we get.
Look no farther than the current Super Bowl teams, maybe only a couple of superstars- but a bunch of solid players and great coaching.
Gotta lower your expectations, kiddo. Here's some real world numbers. Williams will get an $80 million contract- take it to the bank- pun intended. We'll have to overpay like hell to persuade him to leave Super Bowl contender Houston, something Heckert is extremely unlikely to do. Franchise money for a wr receiver is $9.5 million so forget about Jackson, headcase problems aside. So you've already blown all the cap on two players.
Not only that, once you have those two guys on board- it creates a ripple effect on salary demands from guys you already have on the team. Exhibit "A" would be the Browns picking up FA Raymond Clayborn from the Patriots for big bucks way back when. And you can't blame them. So we bring in Williams- Sheard has as many sacks- he's gonna say- "Well I'm playing as good as Mario, so now I want Mario money too."
Another WR? Well Manningham is going to think he's worth Anquan Boldin money, which is around $8.5 million a year, not counting signing bonus. Adding a CB the caliber of Jonathan Joseph (5 year deal, $48.5 million) about $12 million up front = tilt. Your scenario might work if you're playing Madden, won't work for the Browns. Doubly, because with a 4-12 record, we're going to have to overpay anyone we get.
Look no farther than the current Super Bowl teams, maybe only a couple of superstars- but a bunch of solid players and great coaching.
Those are by no means my expectations. That is just what I would try and do. And I would get rid of as much dead weight I needed to to get it done.
Also there is way in hell Manningham commands Boldin money. He has never had a Boldin type of year. His best year probably isn't as good as Boldins worst year.
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I'd rather pay big money to one player that would finish out a very good unit (defensive line) than pay the same amount of money to players like we have recently. Scott Fujita, Chris Gocong, Sheldon Brown, Evan Moore, etc. We could have the best defensive line in football with Williams. Then draft a DB that can hopefully upgrade over Brown or Adams or a linebacker that will upgrade Fujita.
we won't sign williams but we will draft all three positions that you mentioned.
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Gotta lower your expectations, kiddo. Here's some real world numbers. Williams will get an $80 million contract- take it to the bank- pun intended. We'll have to overpay like hell to persuade him to leave Super Bowl contender Houston, something Heckert is extremely unlikely to do. Franchise money for a wr receiver is $9.5 million so forget about Jackson, headcase problems aside. So you've already blown all the cap on two players.
Not only that, once you have those two guys on board- it creates a ripple effect on salary demands from guys you already have on the team. Exhibit "A" would be the Browns picking up FA Raymond Clayborn from the Patriots for big bucks way back when. And you can't blame them. So we bring in Williams- Sheard has as many sacks- he's gonna say- "Well I'm playing as good as Mario, so now I want Mario money too."
Another WR? Well Manningham is going to think he's worth Anquan Boldin money, which is around $8.5 million a year, not counting signing bonus. Adding a CB the caliber of Jonathan Joseph (5 year deal, $48.5 million) about $12 million up front = tilt. Your scenario might work if you're playing Madden, won't work for the Browns. Doubly, because with a 4-12 record, we're going to have to overpay anyone we get.
Look no farther than the current Super Bowl teams, maybe only a couple of superstars- but a bunch of solid players and great coaching.
Those are by no means my expectations. That is just what I would try and do. And I would get rid of as much dead weight I needed to to get it done.
Also there is way in hell Manningham commands Boldin money. He has never had a Boldin type of year. His best year probably isn't as good as Boldins worst year.
Those are by no means my expectations. That is just what I would try and do. And I would get rid of as much dead weight I needed to to get it done.
Also there is way in hell Manningham commands Boldin money. He has never had a Boldin type of year. His best year probably isn't as good as Boldins worst year.
If you try and do that, you're going to have to unload 1\2 the the team in the process. BTW, Manningham has had a couple years as good as Boldin- but hasn't had the super stud years, so whoop-te-do, he'll only get $6 million a year. About $3 million more than he's worth- not a significant upgrade over Little.
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Those are by no means my expectations. That is just what I would try and do. And I would get rid of as much dead weight I needed to to get it done.
Also there is way in hell Manningham commands Boldin money. He has never had a Boldin type of year. His best year probably isn't as good as Boldins worst year.
If you try and do that, you're going to have to unload 1\2 the the team in the process. BTW, Manningham has had a couple years as good as Boldin- but hasn't had the super stud years, so whoop-te-do, he'll only get $6 million a year. About $3 million more than he's worth- not a significant upgrade over Little.
If you try and do that, you're going to have to unload 1\2 the the team in the process. BTW, Manningham has had a couple years as good as Boldin- but hasn't had the super stud years, so whoop-te-do, he'll only get $6 million a year. About $3 million more than he's worth- not a significant upgrade over Little.
Our records for the last 3 years as you know are 5-11. 5-11 and 4-12. I am just fine with getting rid of half the crap on this team if we can bring in guys like DJax, Mario Williams, another good WR, and a good CB. We can fill the holes with rookies and lesser known free agents.
As far as Boldin and Manningham. Boldins last 2 seasons have been un Boldin like in comparison to what he has done in the past. Those are the 2 years though that yuou can compare to Manninghams better years statistically. Boldin however got his money after the big years not after the Manningham like years. I also don't think Manningham will get overpaid because of the abundance of good WRs available this year in free agency. If Manningham gets paid according to what he has actually produced he could be good value because he does have some upside. My interest in Manningham would realy depend on his asking price.
I agree about Manningham not being a significant upgrade over Litte. I wasn't looking to replace Little though. I was looking to add a good legit third option to go along with a guy like a Desean Jackson (or a big name WR) and Little.
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If you try and do that, you're going to have to unload 1\2 the the team in the process. BTW, Manningham has had a couple years as good as Boldin- but hasn't had the super stud years, so whoop-te-do, he'll only get $6 million a year. About $3 million more than he's worth- not a significant upgrade over Little.
Our records for the last 3 years as you know are 5-11. 5-11 and 4-12. I am just fine with getting rid of half the crap on this team if we can bring in guys like DJax, Mario Williams, another good WR, and a good CB. We can fill the holes with rookies and lesser known free agents.
As far as Boldin and Manningham. Boldins last 2 seasons have been un Boldin like in comparison to what he has done in the past. Those are the 2 years though that yuou can compare to Manninghams better years statistically. Boldin however got his money after the big years not after the Manningham like years. I also don't think Manningham will get overpaid because of the abundance of good WRs available this year in free agency. If Manningham gets paid according to what he has actually produced he could be good value because he does have some upside. My interest in Manningham would realy depend on his asking price.
I agree about Manningham not being a significant upgrade over Litte. I wasn't looking to replace Little though. I was looking to add a good legit third option to go along with a guy like a Desean Jackson (or a big name WR) and Little.
Our records for the last 3 years as you know are 5-11. 5-11 and 4-12. I am just fine with getting rid of half the crap on this team if we can bring in guys like DJax, Mario Williams, another good WR, and a good CB. We can fill the holes with rookies and lesser known free agents.
Holmgren already stated he is not making any major changes this offseason. Sure we will release some guys and sign new ones, but there is no way in hell that we get rid of half the team. So why make predictions that won't ever come true? You are just wasting your time..
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That could be realistic in any sense of the word.
I would like to see the Browns move down inbetween 6-10 if RG3 is on the board and one of the teams give us a call and we pick up their second round pick this year.
Take Morris Claiborne 6-10
Take Burfict at 22
Sign Mario Willams in FA
Sign Desean Jackson in FA
Resign Peyton Hillis
Offense Cordinater Hired
A full productive off season.
That could be realistic in any sense of the word.
I would like to see the Browns move down inbetween 6-10 if RG3 is on the board and one of the teams give us a call and we pick up their second round pick this year.
Take Morris Claiborne 6-10
Take Burfict at 22
Sign Mario Willams in FA
Sign Desean Jackson in FA
Resign Peyton Hillis
Offense Cordinater Hired
A full productive off season.
Mario is going to be a hard get. Every team in the NFL wants Mario.
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Our records for the last 3 years as you know are 5-11. 5-11 and 4-12. I am just fine with getting rid of half the crap on this team if we can bring in guys like DJax, Mario Williams, another good WR, and a good CB. We can fill the holes with rookies and lesser known free agents.
Holmgren already stated he is not making any major changes this offseason. Sure we will release some guys and sign new ones, but there is no way in hell that we get rid of half the team. So why make predictions that won't ever come true? You are just wasting your time..
Holmgren already stated he is not making any major changes this offseason. Sure we will release some guys and sign new ones, but there is no way in hell that we get rid of half the team. So why make predictions that won't ever come true? You are just wasting your time..
Who is making predictions? I just stated that if they needed to get rid of half there team I would be fine with it because most of the team sucks anyway
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When does free agency start in reference to the draft? Because one is going to depend highly on the other.
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Zombo said:
Yes! What an addition he would be to that young defensive line. You pay him a boatload, but if you are expecting to be in the playoffs in two years you need these kind of vets.
Guy is consistent as hell and would turn Sheard loose.
Zombo
And at 30 the guy will play at a high level for the duration of his 4 year contract.
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That could be realistic in any sense of the word.
I would like to see the Browns move down inbetween 6-10 if RG3 is on the board and one of the teams give us a call and we pick up their second round pick this year.
Take Morris Claiborne 6-10
Take Burfict at 22
Sign Mario Willams in FA
Sign Desean Jackson in FA
Resign Peyton Hillis
Offense Cordinater Hired
A full productive off season.
This is a complete dream scenario if I have ever heard one. However, that COULD give us the best defense in the NFL assuming Burfict can keep his shit under control and stay on the field.
This is a complete dream scenario if I have ever heard one. However, that COULD give us the best defense in the NFL assuming Burfict can keep his shit under control and stay on the field.
I don't understand why if something is laid out well it is considered a dream scenario, i thought it was completely realistic and would give us the most improvement possible this off season, any futher moves would be nice but any less could leave me wondering why we aren't willing to plug those holes for year 4 (2013) now so we do give ourselves a legitimate chance in the AFC north within two years.
Yes i do believe if we drafted that way our defense would look completely nasty for the next few years and could start to be solid with only the need to fill gaps and not whole defenses.
Offense i only resigned Hillis and threw a contract offer at a WR it could be anyone top tier i don't care but desean brings that added speed downfield and i am sorry Josh Cribbs just doesn't do that for us, so get us someone that has to have over the top help so our 5-15 yard pass game can actually open up.
Does this make us a playoff contender next year if it exactly happened? Hard to say but in my opinion it would be taking steps in the right direction.
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The guys at Sportsmasher.com have the Browns drafting:
4) RGIII but mention that they will probably have to trade up to get him.
22) Melvin Ingram - OLB/DE - South Carolina, fiery pass rusher.
Full analysis here.
Thoughts?
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