Ask A Baylor Fan About Rg3
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DFWBear:
let me ask you this from someone who brings a different perspective than most of these guys that are just in love with RG3 for no other reason than his big smile and his cute dreads:
from a standpoint of building a team within a time line of say three years...... and if you look at the browns and their talent level right now with the roster they have and you realize you've got tons of holes to fill i.e. !) another cover CB 2) another DE 3) at least another WR 4) at least another LB 5) a RT 6) a speed RB. so right there that's 6-8 picks we need.
would you trade one of your picks to move up to get a QB or trade down, get another pick, and complete an already competent (but not dominate) defense, add some weapons at WR and RB and fix a problem on the right side of the OL?
another question: do you think 2 years is enough time to evaluate a rookie QB with no right side protection, no running game, wide receivers who can't get open and when they do drop the ball, injuries, a new coach and a new system in one of the toughest divisions in football?
do you think RG3 is a "once in a lifetime talent that we have to do anything we can to draft him?" (as i pointed out to the RG3 ball tuggers yesterday is that in my lifetime i've seen marino, kelly, elway, brees, rodgers, favre, brady, newton etc. etc. etc. drafted. i guess all of them were once in a lifetime too, if you're a flippin bee).
DFWBear:
let me ask you this from someone who brings a different perspective than most of these guys that are just in love with RG3 for no other reason than his big smile and his cute dreads:
from a standpoint of building a team within a time line of say three years...... and if you look at the browns and their talent level right now with the roster they have and you realize you've got tons of holes to fill i.e. !) another cover CB 2) another DE 3) at least another WR 4) at least another LB 5) a RT 6) a speed RB. so right there that's 6-8 picks we need.
would you trade one of your picks to move up to get a QB or trade down, get another pick, and complete an already competent (but not dominate) defense, add some weapons at WR and RB and fix a problem on the right side of the OL?
another question: do you think 2 years is enough time to evaluate a rookie QB with no right side protection, no running game, wide receivers who can't get open and when they do drop the ball, injuries, a new coach and a new system in one of the toughest divisions in football?
do you think RG3 is a "once in a lifetime talent that we have to do anything we can to draft him?" (as i pointed out to the RG3 ball tuggers yesterday is that in my lifetime i've seen marino, kelly, elway, brees, rodgers, favre, brady, newton etc. etc. etc. drafted. i guess all of them were once in a lifetime too, if you're a flippin bee).
I know this wasn't intended for me. But I wanted to address that each of the quarterbacks you mentioned had significant shortcomings entering the draft - save Elway. None (again, save Elway) was a transcendent talent. They were all outstanding college quarterbacks that managed to put it together at the pro level.
Marino was just a guy, Kelly - same way. The rest of them were too short, too slow, too skinny, system quarterbacks, or too undisciplined to be "can't miss.". And they didn't miss.
Without hindsight, only Elway was a whatever it takes to draft him kind of guy. The rest were guys that had the brains and heart... And enough of all of the physical traits to make it work.
What I'm talking about with RGIII is a collection of talents in one guy you've never seen before... And based on history, aren't likely to see again any time soon.
-jj
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DFWBear:
let me ask you this from someone who brings a different perspective than most of these guys that are just in love with RG3 for no other reason than his big smile and his cute dreads:
from a standpoint of building a team within a time line of say three years...... and if you look at the browns and their talent level right now with the roster they have and you realize you've got tons of holes to fill i.e. !) another cover CB 2) another DE 3) at least another WR 4) at least another LB 5) a RT 6) a speed RB. so right there that's 6-8 picks we need.
would you trade one of your picks to move up to get a QB or trade down, get another pick, and complete an already competent (but not dominate) defense, add some weapons at WR and RB and fix a problem on the right side of the OL?
another question: do you think 2 years is enough time to evaluate a rookie QB with no right side protection, no running game, wide receivers who can't get open and when they do drop the ball, injuries, a new coach and a new system in one of the toughest divisions in football?
do you think RG3 is a "once in a lifetime talent that we have to do anything we can to draft him?" (as i pointed out to the RG3 ball tuggers yesterday is that in my lifetime i've seen marino, kelly, elway, brees, rodgers, favre, brady, newton etc. etc. etc. drafted. i guess all of them were once in a lifetime too, if you're a flippin bee).
DFWBear:
let me ask you this from someone who brings a different perspective than most of these guys that are just in love with RG3 for no other reason than his big smile and his cute dreads:
from a standpoint of building a team within a time line of say three years...... and if you look at the browns and their talent level right now with the roster they have and you realize you've got tons of holes to fill i.e. !) another cover CB 2) another DE 3) at least another WR 4) at least another LB 5) a RT 6) a speed RB. so right there that's 6-8 picks we need.
would you trade one of your picks to move up to get a QB or trade down, get another pick, and complete an already competent (but not dominate) defense, add some weapons at WR and RB and fix a problem on the right side of the OL?
another question: do you think 2 years is enough time to evaluate a rookie QB with no right side protection, no running game, wide receivers who can't get open and when they do drop the ball, injuries, a new coach and a new system in one of the toughest divisions in football?
do you think RG3 is a "once in a lifetime talent that we have to do anything we can to draft him?" (as i pointed out to the RG3 ball tuggers yesterday is that in my lifetime i've seen marino, kelly, elway, brees, rodgers, favre, brady, newton etc. etc. etc. drafted. i guess all of them were once in a lifetime too, if you're a flippin bee).
I can recall only 5 quarterbacks in the modern era that were considered "locks": King Hill in 58 out of Rice, Bradshaw in 70, Elway in 83, Manning in 98, Vick in 2000. All but Vick cleared that bar. No, I would not place Griffin in that group. If anyone is curious, yes, I would put Luck in that group.
Yes, I think 2 years is enough given the player that Colt is.
Finally, in today's NFL an elite QB is breathing room. The Giants had subpar running backs, merely above average WRs, average linebackers, and the worst secondary in the league. They just won the Super Bowl. Conversely, look at Baltimore ( I know you guys see them constantly ). Quality receivers, good line play, dominant defense, consistent running game, and haven't made it back to the Super Bowl since they've won because of the QB play. Without an elite QB, your margin is so slim it is borderline impossible to win a Super Bowl.
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DFWBear:
let me ask you this from someone who brings a different perspective than most of these guys that are just in love with RG3 for no other reason than his big smile and his cute dreads:
from a standpoint of building a team within a time line of say three years...... and if you look at the browns and their talent level right now with the roster they have and you realize you've got tons of holes to fill i.e. !) another cover CB 2) another DE 3) at least another WR 4) at least another LB 5) a RT 6) a speed RB. so right there that's 6-8 picks we need.
would you trade one of your picks to move up to get a QB or trade down, get another pick, and complete an already competent (but not dominate) defense, add some weapons at WR and RB and fix a problem on the right side of the OL?
another question: do you think 2 years is enough time to evaluate a rookie QB with no right side protection, no running game, wide receivers who can't get open and when they do drop the ball, injuries, a new coach and a new system in one of the toughest divisions in football?
do you think RG3 is a "once in a lifetime talent that we have to do anything we can to draft him?" (as i pointed out to the RG3 ball tuggers yesterday is that in my lifetime i've seen marino, kelly, elway, brees, rodgers, favre, brady, newton etc. etc. etc. drafted. i guess all of them were once in a lifetime too, if you're a flippin bee).
I know this wasn't intended for me. But I wanted to address that each of the quarterbacks you mentioned had significant shortcomings entering the draft - save Elway. None (again, save Elway) was a transcendent talent. They were all outstanding college quarterbacks that managed to put it together at the pro level.
Marino was just a guy, Kelly - same way. The rest of them were too short, too slow, too skinny, system quarterbacks, or too undisciplined to be "can't miss.". And they didn't miss.
Without hindsight, only Elway was a whatever it takes to draft him kind of guy. The rest were guys that had the brains and heart... And enough of all of the physical traits to make it work.
What I'm talking about with RGIII is a collection of talents in one guy you've never seen before... And based on history, aren't likely to see again any time soon.
-jj
What I'm talking about with RGIII is a collection of talents in one guy you've never seen before... And based on history, aren't likely to see again any time soon.
-jj
so if that's the case why is andrew luck projected to go #1. so he must be from planet krypton?
you RG3 guys are all the same: his skillset blah blah blah, his accuracy blah blah blah.
i guarantee you if we don't draft him and play mccoy and we address the other needs on the team including WR and RB and RT he will look 100% better.
if we address said needs AND draft RG3 and he starts, it will all be because RG3 is soooo much better.
:lol: -
DFWBear:
let me ask you this from someone who brings a different perspective than most of these guys that are just in love with RG3 for no other reason than his big smile and his cute dreads:
from a standpoint of building a team within a time line of say three years...... and if you look at the browns and their talent level right now with the roster they have and you realize you've got tons of holes to fill i.e. !) another cover CB 2) another DE 3) at least another WR 4) at least another LB 5) a RT 6) a speed RB. so right there that's 6-8 picks we need.
would you trade one of your picks to move up to get a QB or trade down, get another pick, and complete an already competent (but not dominate) defense, add some weapons at WR and RB and fix a problem on the right side of the OL?
another question: do you think 2 years is enough time to evaluate a rookie QB with no right side protection, no running game, wide receivers who can't get open and when they do drop the ball, injuries, a new coach and a new system in one of the toughest divisions in football?
do you think RG3 is a "once in a lifetime talent that we have to do anything we can to draft him?" (as i pointed out to the RG3 ball tuggers yesterday is that in my lifetime i've seen marino, kelly, elway, brees, rodgers, favre, brady, newton etc. etc. etc. drafted. i guess all of them were once in a lifetime too, if you're a flippin bee).
I can recall only 5 quarterbacks in the modern era that were considered "locks": King Hill in 58 out of Rice, Bradshaw in 70, Elway in 83, Manning in 98, Vick in 2000. All but Vick cleared that bar. No, I would not place Griffin in that group. If anyone is curious, yes, I would put Luck in that group.
Yes, I think 2 years is enough given the player that Colt is.
Finally, in today's NFL an elite QB is breathing room. The Giants had subpar running backs, merely above average WRs, average linebackers, and the worst secondary in the league. They just won the Super Bowl. Conversely, look at Baltimore ( I know you guys see them constantly ). Quality receivers, good line play, dominant defense, consistent running game, and haven't made it back to the Super Bowl since they've won because of the QB play. Without an elite QB, your margin is so slim it is borderline impossible to win a Super Bowl.
The Giants had subpar running backs, merely above average WRs, average linebackers, and the worst secondary in the league. They just won the Super Bowl. Conversely, look at Baltimore ( I know you guys see them constantly ). Quality receivers, good line play, dominant defense, consistent running game, and haven't made it back to the Super Bowl since they've won because of the QB play. Without an elite QB, your margin is so slim it is borderline impossible to win a Super Bowl.
maybe when they played the cowboys they looked that way but you are way off base. living in NY and watching every flippin game they played this year: their OL is superior, bradshaw is better than any RB we have, their #4 wide receiver could beat out our number one, their secondary does suck but when you've got 4 DEs flushing you out of the pocket in 2 seconds you don't need a very good secondary. btw they play 2 DEs in LB positions at times.
put colt mccoy on that team and they have at least 10 wins. hell even RG3.
we've got none of that so you can't compare your hey the giants won the super bowl because of great qb play. they won because of defense. period.
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What I'm talking about with RGIII is a collection of talents in one guy you've never seen before... And based on history, aren't likely to see again any time soon.
-jj
so if that's the case why is andrew luck projected to go #1. so he must be from planet krypton?
you RG3 guys are all the same: his skillset blah blah blah, his accuracy blah blah blah.
i guarantee you if we don't draft him and play mccoy and we address the other needs on the team including WR and RB and RT he will look 100% better.
if we address said needs AND draft RG3 and he starts, it will all be because RG3 is soooo much better.
:lol: so if that's the case why is andrew luck projected to go #1. so he must be from planet krypton?
you RG3 guys are all the same: his skillset blah blah blah, his accuracy blah blah blah.
i guarantee you if we don't draft him and play mccoy and we address the other needs on the team including WR and RB and RT he will look 100% better.
if we address said needs AND draft RG3 and he starts, it will all be because RG3 is soooo much better.
:lol: Yeah, but how good is 100% more of what you've got?
-jj
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so if that's the case why is andrew luck projected to go #1. so he must be from planet krypton?
you RG3 guys are all the same: his skillset blah blah blah, his accuracy blah blah blah.
i guarantee you if we don't draft him and play mccoy and we address the other needs on the team including WR and RB and RT he will look 100% better.
if we address said needs AND draft RG3 and he starts, it will all be because RG3 is soooo much better.
:lol: Yeah, but how good is 100% more of what you've got?
-jj
Yeah, but how good is 100% more of what you've got?
-jj
do we really have to do this dance?
put RG3 in mccoy's shoes from the get go. started his rookie year after injuries to others and looked pretty good at times. i recall posts diring that time from guys now that are calling for his head "hey i like this kid's moxy", "this kid's showin me something" and on and on and on. starts the next year with no off-season, new coach, new system and the same squad on the field. you really think he would do any better?
i'll ask you this with or without a new qb next year are we making the playoffs? the answer is no. so why not NOT waste a pick on a position we already have filled on the roster? if i were H&H i'd pick cb, de, lb then wr rt and rb. hey maybe the next tom brady will be sitting there in the 6th round for us.
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If we really must take a QB, I'd take Brock Osweiler in the late third possibly fourth round range... I haven't seen him in many mocks and I think that he'll do okay as insurance for Colt. I could think of 32 ways to improve our roster without adding RG3 at all. I would prefer to use our early three picks to take players that we could scratch off our needs list next season.
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If we really must take a QB, I'd take Brock Osweiler in the late third possibly fourth round range... I haven't seen him in many mocks and I think that he'll do okay as insurance for Colt. I could think of 32 ways to improve our roster without adding RG3 at all. I would prefer to use our early three picks to take players that we could scratch off our needs list next season.
If we really must take a QB, I'd take Brock Osweiler in the late third possibly fourth round range... I haven't seen him in many mocks and I think that he'll do okay as insurance for Colt. I could think of 32 ways to improve our roster without adding RG3 at all. I would prefer to use our early three picks to take players that we could scratch off our needs list next season.
me too. mcshay (and i don't believe in what a lot of draft pundits say) says he has the most upside.
weird delivery, tall and lanky but accurate and manages the game with a great arm.
sounds like a bernie kosar to me.
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If we really must take a QB, I'd take Brock Osweiler in the late third possibly fourth round range... I haven't seen him in many mocks and I think that he'll do okay as insurance for Colt. I could think of 32 ways to improve our roster without adding RG3 at all. I would prefer to use our early three picks to take players that we could scratch off our needs list next season.
me too. mcshay (and i don't believe in what a lot of draft pundits say) says he has the most upside.
weird delivery, tall and lanky but accurate and manages the game with a great arm.
sounds like a bernie kosar to me.
me too. mcshay (and i don't believe in what a lot of draft pundits say) says he has the most upside.
weird delivery, tall and lanky but accurate and manages the game with a great arm.
sounds like a bernie kosar to me.
Yep... and he can make plays with his feet when he needs to... he's deceptively agile for a GIANT...
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Yeah, but how good is 100% more of what you've got?
-jj
do we really have to do this dance?
put RG3 in mccoy's shoes from the get go. started his rookie year after injuries to others and looked pretty good at times. i recall posts diring that time from guys now that are calling for his head "hey i like this kid's moxy", "this kid's showin me something" and on and on and on. starts the next year with no off-season, new coach, new system and the same squad on the field. you really think he would do any better?
i'll ask you this with or without a new qb next year are we making the playoffs? the answer is no. so why not NOT waste a pick on a position we already have filled on the roster? if i were H&H i'd pick cb, de, lb then wr rt and rb. hey maybe the next tom brady will be sitting there in the 6th round for us.
do we really have to do this dance?
put RG3 in mccoy's shoes from the get go. started his rookie year after injuries to others and looked pretty good at times. i recall posts diring that time from guys now that are calling for his head "hey i like this kid's moxy", "this kid's showin me something" and on and on and on. starts the next year with no off-season, new coach, new system and the same squad on the field. you really think he would do any better?
i'll ask you this with or without a new qb next year are we making the playoffs? the answer is no. so why not NOT waste a pick on a position we already have filled on the roster? if i were H&H i'd pick cb, de, lb then wr rt and rb. hey maybe the next tom brady will be sitting there in the 6th round for us.
I rarely dance.
Would RGIII have done better? Probably.
Moxie just means you can take a beating.
The Browns almost won 6 games last season... And were totally ill-equipped to do so. Why couldn't they make the playoffs next season?
Give yourself a couple of playmakers at key positions - quarterback for instance... And who knows?
-jj
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do we really have to do this dance?
put RG3 in mccoy's shoes from the get go. started his rookie year after injuries to others and looked pretty good at times. i recall posts diring that time from guys now that are calling for his head "hey i like this kid's moxy", "this kid's showin me something" and on and on and on. starts the next year with no off-season, new coach, new system and the same squad on the field. you really think he would do any better?
i'll ask you this with or without a new qb next year are we making the playoffs? the answer is no. so why not NOT waste a pick on a position we already have filled on the roster? if i were H&H i'd pick cb, de, lb then wr rt and rb. hey maybe the next tom brady will be sitting there in the 6th round for us.
I rarely dance.
Would RGIII have done better? Probably.
Moxie just means you can take a beating.
The Browns almost won 6 games last season... And were totally ill-equipped to do so. Why couldn't they make the playoffs next season?
Give yourself a couple of playmakers at key positions - quarterback for instance... And who knows?
-jj
Give yourself a couple of playmakers at key positions - quarterback for instance... And who knows?
-jj
well why not just WR and RB and give colt a chance in that situation?
lord knows a RG3 is the 2nd coming of christ. oh no. it's the black version of tebow!!!!!
hey that's it! we can call all the RG3ers a faction of some fanatical group even before he get's drafted. anyone got a name?
RG3dreadheads?
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I'm not sure what I've done to offend you so... But seriously, other than holding down roughly the same job, what in earth does Tim Tebow have to do with Robert Griffin?
I feel like you have a point or two to make. But it's all clouded in this dismissive anti-argument. And I can't quite figure out what's driving it.
Are you saying that you'd rather upgrade the WR corps and go forward with Colt McCoy than package say 2 picks to draft RGIII?
That's ok. I'm not telling you your opinion is invalid. I'm just saying I disagree. And I'm pretty sure that's healthy.
If I was going to "fix" the Browns, given where they are drafting, I'd be looking to package picks to make sure I could replace Colt McCoy with RGIII. Then I'd go to work looking for WR's & RT's in free agency. I'd be looking to fill the DE & RB positions through the draft, as well as adding depth to the DB & LB groups.
But that's just me. I have genuine concerns about McCoy's ceiling. Now, if the Browns had won 3 more games and were drafting 13th, I wouldn't be at all interested in RGIII for the Browns.. Because getting from 13 to 2 would be possibly the two 1's and possibly 2 more picks - including next year's number 1 to get there.
But thinking that they could get a guy with this kiIthaca talent with two picks , it makes for a very compelling argument.
-jj
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The Giants had subpar running backs, merely above average WRs, average linebackers, and the worst secondary in the league. They just won the Super Bowl. Conversely, look at Baltimore ( I know you guys see them constantly ). Quality receivers, good line play, dominant defense, consistent running game, and haven't made it back to the Super Bowl since they've won because of the QB play. Without an elite QB, your margin is so slim it is borderline impossible to win a Super Bowl.
maybe when they played the cowboys they looked that way but you are way off base. living in NY and watching every flippin game they played this year: their OL is superior, bradshaw is better than any RB we have, their #4 wide receiver could beat out our number one, their secondary does suck but when you've got 4 DEs flushing you out of the pocket in 2 seconds you don't need a very good secondary. btw they play 2 DEs in LB positions at times.
put colt mccoy on that team and they have at least 10 wins. hell even RG3.
we've got none of that so you can't compare your hey the giants won the super bowl because of great qb play. they won because of defense. period.
maybe when they played the cowboys they looked that way but you are way off base. living in NY and watching every flippin game they played this year: their OL is superior, bradshaw is better than any RB we have, their #4 wide receiver could beat out our number one, their secondary does suck but when you've got 4 DEs flushing you out of the pocket in 2 seconds you don't need a very good secondary. btw they play 2 DEs in LB positions at times.
put colt mccoy on that team and they have at least 10 wins. hell even RG3.
we've got none of that so you can't compare your hey the giants won the super bowl because of great qb play. they won because of defense. period.
Colt would win 10 games on the Giants? So you're telling me Colt McCoy is better than Eli Manning now? The last time I checked Eli Manning only won 9 regular season games last year. If Colt was the QB last season the Giants would have had a losing record and missed the playoffs. And since you claim defense was the sole reason the Giants made the playoffs, the Browns should have went to the playoffs too since our defense is ranked much higher. Please do your research before posting.
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maybe when they played the cowboys they looked that way but you are way off base. living in NY and watching every flippin game they played this year: their OL is superior, bradshaw is better than any RB we have, their #4 wide receiver could beat out our number one, their secondary does suck but when you've got 4 DEs flushing you out of the pocket in 2 seconds you don't need a very good secondary. btw they play 2 DEs in LB positions at times.
put colt mccoy on that team and they have at least 10 wins. hell even RG3.
we've got none of that so you can't compare your hey the giants won the super bowl because of great qb play. they won because of defense. period.
Colt would win 10 games on the Giants? So you're telling me Colt McCoy is better than Eli Manning now? The last time I checked Eli Manning only won 9 regular season games last year. If Colt was the QB last season the Giants would have had a losing record and missed the playoffs. And since you claim defense was the sole reason the Giants made the playoffs, the Browns should have went to the playoffs too since our defense is ranked much higher. Please do your research before posting.
Colt would win 10 games on the Giants? So you're telling me Colt McCoy is better than Eli Manning now? The last time I checked Eli Manning only won 9 regulations season games last year. If Colt was the QB last season the Giants would have had a losing record and missed the playoffs. And since you claim defense was the sole reason the Giants made the playoffs, the Browns should have went to the playoffs too since our defense is ranked much higher. Please do your research before posting.
The Browns defense has some serious holes in it. Another quality DE is needed, plus at least one more DL decent backup. Our entire LB corps could us replacing....and that includes DQJ in my opinion. And we need another safety and another corner.
So, upgrading 5 defensive positions are in order in my opinion. That is as much as the Offense needs.
Offense needs upgrade at: WR, ROG, RT, maybe QB, maybe RB.
I would think and hope the Browns TEs can make the grade. Retaining Hillis would help, but we also need a scatback. FB might need an upgrade, but maybe that will come with experience gained my Marecic, hopefully.
Yes, it seems that it is the offense that needs the most work, but that is because we need those offensive playmakers, but in reality, strictly by the numbers, the Browns need as much help on defense as they do on offense.
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Colt would win 10 games on the Giants? So you're telling me Colt McCoy is better than Eli Manning now? The last time I checked Eli Manning only won 9 regulations season games last year. If Colt was the QB last season the Giants would have had a losing record and missed the playoffs. And since you claim defense was the sole reason the Giants made the playoffs, the Browns should have went to the playoffs too since our defense is ranked much higher. Please do your research before posting.
The Browns defense has some serious holes in it. Another quality DE is needed, plus at least one more DL decent backup. Our entire LB corps could us replacing....and that includes DQJ in my opinion. And we need another safety and another corner.
So, upgrading 5 defensive positions are in order in my opinion. That is as much as the Offense needs.
Offense needs upgrade at: WR, ROG, RT, maybe QB, maybe RB.
I would think and hope the Browns TEs can make the grade. Retaining Hillis would help, but we also need a scatback. FB might need an upgrade, but maybe that will come with experience gained my Marecic, hopefully.
Yes, it seems that it is the offense that needs the most work, but that is because we need those offensive playmakers, but in reality, strictly by the numbers, the Browns need as much help on defense as they do on offense.
The Browns defense has some serious holes in it. Another quality DE is needed, plus at least one more DL decent backup. Our entire LB corps could us replacing....and that includes DQJ in my opinion. And we need another safety and another corner.
So, upgrading 5 defensive positions are in order in my opinion. That is as much as the Offense needs.
Offense needs upgrade at: WR, ROG, RT, maybe QB, maybe RB.
I would think and hope the Browns TEs can make the grade. Retaining Hillis would help, but we also need a scatback. FB might need an upgrade, but maybe that will come with experience gained my Marecic, hopefully.
Yes, it seems that it is the offense that needs the most work, but that is because we need those offensive playmakers, but in reality, strictly by the numbers, the Browns need as much help on defense as they do on offense.
By the numbers our defense was ranked #10 in total yards and #5 in scoring despite spending long periods of time on the field. Our offense was ranked #30 in scoring and #29 in yards per game. According to these rankings it appears that the Browns need a lot more help on offense than they do on defense. I'm really getting tired of people posting on here who haven't done any research. It kills your credibility. I love a good debate, but please back up your posts with some solid facts.
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The defense shows promise but their rankings are misleading. Opposing offenses had no pressure to score high against us because our offense was so horrid. It only took 17 points to beat the Browns so they stayed conservative and ran it down our throats.
If the Browns had anything close to something that resembled a competent NFL offense our pass defense numbers would not be so deceiving.
The Giants and Pats have some pretty big holes on their defense as well.
Ravens and 49ers have pretty solid defenses.
Difference between them?
QUARTERBACK!
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The Browns defense has some serious holes in it. Another quality DE is needed, plus at least one more DL decent backup. Our entire LB corps could us replacing....and that includes DQJ in my opinion. And we need another safety and another corner.
So, upgrading 5 defensive positions are in order in my opinion. That is as much as the Offense needs.
Offense needs upgrade at: WR, ROG, RT, maybe QB, maybe RB.
I would think and hope the Browns TEs can make the grade. Retaining Hillis would help, but we also need a scatback. FB might need an upgrade, but maybe that will come with experience gained my Marecic, hopefully.
Yes, it seems that it is the offense that needs the most work, but that is because we need those offensive playmakers, but in reality, strictly by the numbers, the Browns need as much help on defense as they do on offense.
By the numbers our defense was ranked #10 in total yards and #5 in scoring despite spending long periods of time on the field. Our offense was ranked #30 in scoring and #29 in yards per game. According to these rankings it appears that the Browns need a lot more help on offense than they do on defense. I'm really getting tired of people posting on here who haven't done any research. It kills your credibility. I love a good debate, but please back up your posts with some solid facts.
By the numbers our defense was ranked #10 in total yards and #5 in scoring despite spending long periods of time on the field. Our offense was ranked #30 in scoring and #29 in yards per game. According to these rankings it appears that the Browns need a lot more help on offense than they do on defense. I'm really getting tired of people posting on here who haven't done any research. It kills your credibility. I love a good debate, but please back up your posts with some solid facts.
I have more credibility on the tip of my nipple than you can summon in your soul.
I am saying that as far as numerical positions the Browns have as many deficiencies on defense as we do on offense. And that is an absolute fact, Jack.
I also said that while the numbers are the same, the ones on offense are more glaring because they are at the offensive playmaker positions. Did you actually read that part? Appparently not. You just wanted to spew your crapola in order to fluff up your own opinion instead of actually comprehending what I said.
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The defense shows promise but their rankings are misleading. Opposing offenses had no pressure to score high against us because our offense was so horrid. It only took 17 points to beat the Browns so they stayed conservative and ran it down our throats.
If the Browns had anything close to something that resembled a competent NFL offense our pass defense numbers would not be so deceiving.
The Giants and Pats have some pretty big holes on their defense as well.
Ravens and 49ers have pretty solid defenses.
Difference between them?
QUARTERBACK!
The defense shows promise but their rankings are misleading. Opposing offenses had no pressure to score high against us because our offense was so horrid. It only took 17 points to beat the Browns so they stayed conservative and ran it down our throats.
If the Browns had anything close to something that resembled a competent NFL offense our pass defense numbers would not be so deceiving.
The Giants and Pats have some pretty big holes on their defense as well.
Ravens and 49ers have pretty solid defenses.
Difference between them?
QUARTERBACK!
See folks! Here's a fan who actually backs up his viewpoint with some facts. Yes the teams that scored the most points on offense usually surrendered the most passing yards on defense as teams were forced to throw the ball. Teams who had weak offenses like the Browns and Rams for example had the ball run down their throats as evidenced by the fact that opponents averaged the most rushing attempts per game against the lowest scoring teams. Good solid analysis by Bad News Browns.
However, unlike the Rams, Bucs and Colts the Browns defense managed to keep opposing teams out of the end zone. Every team that surrendered fewer points than the Browns made the playoffs. So I think the Browns are definitely closer to turning things around than the Rams, Bucs and Colts because our defense should have been good enough for us to win. Even if we had the Steelers defense which allowed the fewest points (14.2) and YPG we still would have been outscored by our opponents! When our pathetic offense cannot even score 2 TD's a game you have to say that our offense is in a state of crisis. So unless we have a defense that is better than the Steelers defense next season it is imperative that we draft offensive playmakers if we want to win games. I happen to believe RG3 is the biggest playmaker realistically available. We need to get him.
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I just hope if we get RG3 they'll be a little more flexible with the play calling and tailor it to his strengths a bit. From what we seen so far I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't.
I think our crap offense goes deeper than just lack of talent. Hopefully with a full off season and an OC things will be better next year.
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Thanks for those writeups DFW, that is awesome stuff to read for someone who knows little more than what they see on tv about the QB position.
I will say that I am slowly moving from the 'take him if he is there' camp, to the 'trade up for the guy' camp.
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