John Derbyshire
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Oh I thought of that. Hence the successful and american but you know what I mean. I'd imagine the highest paid athletes on this earth for football and basketball players.
But do you think there might be something physiological that would make, for instance, the guy from kenya the distance running champ year after year?
WSS
Well, sure, they think so. But the reason Kenyans dominate marathon running isn't because they're black. There are lots of countries with black athletes in them. Why do Kenyans specifically dominate marathons? It's got to do with the running culture and the altitude and the training regiment as well.
Why do Russians dominate in hockey?
If blacks are inherently better athletes, why does the one sports that is played equally around the world, soccer, not dominated by African countries? They're competitive, of course, but the dominant teams are from Brazil and Argentina and Spain and Italy.
Also, what are you getting at? Because there are physiological differences between the races you should be able to ...what? You're trying to go down a rabbit hole.
Well, sure, they think so. But the reason Kenyans dominate marathon running isn't because they're black. There are lots of countries with black athletes in them. Why do Kenyans specifically dominate marathons? It's got to do with the running culture and the altitude and the training regiment as well.
Why do Russians dominate in hockey?
If blacks are inherently better athletes, why does the one sports that is played equally around the world, soccer, not dominated by African countries? They're competitive, of course, but the dominant teams are from Brazil and Argentina and Spain and Italy.
Also, what are you getting at? Because there are physiological differences between the races you should be able to ...what? You're trying to go down a rabbit hole.
Not at all.
so if someone pointed out the professional sports in america is dominated by black athletes you counter said it's probably mostly due to culture. That seems to make sense.
On the other hand, if someone correctly points out that this 1 demographic has a higher rate of violent crime, for example, you claim racism.
And since I mostly agree on both fronts why are you so angry with me for blaming that culture?
Or do you blame white racism?
WSS
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Again, the numbers from studies of racial disparities in IQ studies are not the point, which you're clearly missing. That's not the racist part of the article, even though his figures are disputed in other studies. After all, in those studies, Jews and Asians post higher IQs than whites.
I believe that to be true.
So let's say I strongly identify myself as a white man.
How should I react to that statement?
Should I become angry with the people that conducted the study?
Should I demand that anyone who repeats those statistics be fired
Should I take a close look at my own adopted demographic and try to find ways to balance that out?
If you could take a minute to consider those questions without the knee jerk accusation of racism....
WSS
I believe that to be true.
So let's say I strongly identify myself as a white man.
How should I react to that statement?
Should I become angry with the people that conducted the study?
Should I demand that anyone who repeats those statistics be fired
Should I take a close look at my own adopted demographic and try to find ways to balance that out?
If you could take a minute to consider those questions without the knee jerk accusation of racism....
WSS
No, Steve, because that's not how science works. One study is never the be-all, end-all. Any study that you look at needs to be taken in context with the studies that preceded it as well as the studies that this one influenced. This moron is cherry picking studies he likes to make a stupid point. Not science.
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I believe that to be true.
So let's say I strongly identify myself as a white man.
How should I react to that statement?
Should I become angry with the people that conducted the study?
Should I demand that anyone who repeats those statistics be fired
Should I take a close look at my own adopted demographic and try to find ways to balance that out?
If you could take a minute to consider those questions without the knee jerk accusation of racism....
WSS
No, Steve, because that's not how science works. One study is never the be-all, end-all. Any study that you look at needs to be taken in context with the studies that preceded it as well as the studies that this one influenced. This moron is cherry picking studies he likes to make a stupid point. Not science.
No, Steve, because that's not how science works. One study is never the be-all, end-all. Any study that you look at needs to be taken in context with the studies that preceded it as well as the studies that this one influenced. This moron is cherry picking studies he likes to make a stupid point. Not science.
That's an excellent example of knee jerk.
I don't think your precious science has too much idea what causes basic differences and IQ.
There is, however, substantial evidence as to crime rates education rates poverty rates etcetra.
I will give it to you guys to figure out why those differences exist.
Or, as usual, just get mad because somebody mentioned them.
WSS
www.westsidesteve.com www.myspace.com/westsidestevemusic www.cdbaby.com/artist/westsidestevesimmons -
How did this turn into a discussion about racial disparities in IQ measurements? That's not what the column is about. It's only part of it.
Steve, answer the question: do you think the column is racist, or do you think he's just telling hard truths about the black community?
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How did this turn into a discussion about racial disparities in IQ measurements? That's not what the column is about. It's only part of it.
Steve, answer the question: do you think the column is racist, or do you think he's just telling hard truths about the black community?
How did this turn into a discussion about racial disparities in IQ measurements? That's not what the column is about. It's only part of it.
Steve, answer the question: do you think the column is racist, or do you think he's just telling hard truths about the black community?
I just read it again Heck.
I think that the article is based on the unfortunate truths in american society.
I think number 10 sums it up well.
I think if it bothers you so much that your anger is misdirected.
I don't have anything to lose so why pretend to be outraged?
I realize that the national review fears retaliation from demagogues such as yourself.
1 of the most troubling aspect of it is that it's acceptable and even required to fire someone for writing.
I will await your sermon.
WSS
www.westsidesteve.com www.myspace.com/westsidestevemusic www.cdbaby.com/artist/westsidestevesimmons -
No, Steve, because that's not how science works. One study is never the be-all, end-all. Any study that you look at needs to be taken in context with the studies that preceded it as well as the studies that this one influenced. This moron is cherry picking studies he likes to make a stupid point. Not science.
That's an excellent example of knee jerk.
I don't think your precious science has too much idea what causes basic differences and IQ.
There is, however, substantial evidence as to crime rates education rates poverty rates etcetra.
I will give it to you guys to figure out why those differences exist.
Or, as usual, just get mad because somebody mentioned them.
WSS
That's an excellent example of knee jerk.
I don't think your precious science has too much idea what causes basic differences and IQ.
There is, however, substantial evidence as to crime rates education rates poverty rates etcetra.
I will give it to you guys to figure out why those differences exist.
Or, as usual, just get mad because somebody mentioned them.
WSS
What are you talking about? Science doesn't have much of an idea of what causes differences in IQ, and I never stated otherwise. Guess what. Those sociological rates you're referring to, and the studies that allow us to come up with those rates are science. This guy is making blanket statements on an entire race of people based on what evidence?
I think that the article is based on the unfortunate truths in american society.
I think number 10 sums it up well.
I think if it bothers you so much that your anger is misdirected.
Okay, let's look at 10 again.
(10a) Avoid concentrations of blacks not all known to you personally.
(10b) Stay out of heavily black neighborhoods.
(10c) If planning a trip to a beach or amusement park at some date, find out whether it is likely to be swamped with blacks on that date (neglect of that one got me the closest I have ever gotten to death by gunshot).
(10d) Do not attend events likely to draw a lot of blacks.
(10e) If you are at some public event at which the number of blacks suddenly swells, leave as quickly as possible.
(10f) Do not settle in a district or municipality run by black politicians.
(10g) Before voting for a black politician, scrutinize his/her character much more carefully than you would a white.
(10h) Do not act the Good Samaritan to blacks in apparent distress, e.g., on the highway.
(10i) If accosted by a strange black in the street, smile and say something polite but keep moving.
Just to further clarify that you think he's speaking truths about the world we live in.
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It's the truth about the world heck. Something you have no idea about in your liberal sheltered place.y
This is a ridiculous statement that makes it seem like you were raised on a whites only religious nutjob compound. What, specifically, in this article tells you the secret truths of the world? That you are better than the blacks, and you shouldn't stop to help one stranded on the road? Fuck 'em right? Serves 'em right for being born black.
This is a ridiculous statement that makes it seem like you were raised on a whites only religious nutjob compound. What, specifically, in this article tells you the secret truths of the world? That you are better than the blacks, and you shouldn't stop to help one stranded on the road? Fuck 'em right? Serves 'em right for being born black.
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10h is my favorite. Why help a black dude with a flat tire? Hell only rape and kill you, right? Right?
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[quote name='VaporTrail' timestamp='1334155474' post='282
Okay, let's look at 10 again.
Just to further clarify that you think he's speaking truths about the world we live in.
Actually you didn't include 10.
But if you feel comfortable stopping in the black part of town after dark and helping out somebody on the side of the road great.
I would say statistically like it says in 10, your risk of being hurt is probably greater.
If you don't believe that's true, fine.
WSS
www.westsidesteve.com www.myspace.com/westsidestevemusic www.cdbaby.com/artist/westsidestevesimmons -
(10) Thus, while always attentive to the particular qualities of individuals, on the many occasions where you have nothing to guide you but knowledge of those mean differences, use statistical common sense:
WSS
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How did this turn into a discussion about racial disparities in IQ measurements? That's not what the column is about. It's only part of it.
Steve, answer the question: do you think the column is racist, or do you think he's just telling hard truths about the black community?
I just read it again Heck.
I think that the article is based on the unfortunate truths in american society.
I think number 10 sums it up well.
I think if it bothers you so much that your anger is misdirected.
I don't have anything to lose so why pretend to be outraged?
I realize that the national review fears retaliation from demagogues such as yourself.
1 of the most troubling aspect of it is that it's acceptable and even required to fire someone for writing.
I will await your sermon.
WSS
I just read it again Heck.
I think that the article is based on the unfortunate truths in american society.
I think number 10 sums it up well.
I think if it bothers you so much that your anger is misdirected.
I don't have anything to lose so why pretend to be outraged?
I realize that the national review fears retaliation from demagogues such as yourself.
1 of the most troubling aspect of it is that it's acceptable and even required to fire someone for writing.
I will await your sermon.
WSS
Well, that's what I figured you'd say. When I read this my first thought was, "What the...?" I've read a lot of John Derbyshire over the years. He's often interesting. But he clearly has a distaste for blacks, and what he imagines is "black culture." He's often gotten fairly close to the line, but this was something entirely new. I've never read anything like it, and assumed it would get him instantly condemned, even by the right, and then fired. And it did.
One of my other thoughts was that you would agree with it, and not think it's racist at all.
And the National Review doesn't fear me, or demagogues. They fear having all of their writers and their magazine associated with someone with clearly racist views, which is why they fired him. Because when you're trying to make the case that the right doesn't have a racial problem, which they often do, it helps not to have a guy with obvious racial problems on your staff.
Like you said, you don't have to answer to anyone else, so you don't care if someone thinks you're a racist, or that what you've written in here over the years would get you fired as well, and quickly. I suppose this is liberating for you. As for me, I suppose i can stop trying to find where your line is. After the white power video, and now this, I'm not sure I want to find out.
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And to tell you the truth I'd never heard of him before this.
But I know you well enough to understand that you are obsessed with race.
That you believe that antisocial behavior isn't really a problem and even if it was it's someone else's fault.
So unless you are actually mentally unbalanced, I must just assume that this is just something you like to bicker about.
I understand the statistics upset you, they should.
But I didn't create those statistics so being angry with me does nothing.
Let me amend that.
That attitude serves to make the situation worse.
But only fools mistake your misplaced scorn for compassion.
So the next time the department of justice statistics come in, you can read them and pound your fist on the table and scream," damn you steve!"
WSS
www.westsidesteve.com www.myspace.com/westsidestevemusic www.cdbaby.com/artist/westsidestevesimmons -
And to tell you the truth I'd never heard of him before this.
But I know you well enough to understand that you are obsessed with race.
That you believe that antisocial behavior isn't really a problem and even if it was it's someone else's fault.
So unless you are actually mentally unbalanced, I must just assume that this is just something you like to bicker about.
I understand the statistics upset you, they should.
But I didn't create those statistics so being angry with me does nothing.
Let me amend that.
That attitude serves to make the situation worse.
But only fools mistake your misplaced scorn for compassion.
So the next time the department of justice statistics come in, you can read them and pound your fist on the table and scream," damn you steve!"
WSS
And to tell you the truth I'd never heard of him before this.
But I know you well enough to understand that you are obsessed with race.
That you believe that antisocial behavior isn't really a problem and even if it was it's someone else's fault.
So unless you are actually mentally unbalanced, I must just assume that this is just something you like to bicker about.
I understand the statistics upset you, they should.
But I didn't create those statistics so being angry with me does nothing.
Let me amend that.
That attitude serves to make the situation worse.
But only fools mistake your misplaced scorn for compassion.
So the next time the department of justice statistics come in, you can read them and pound your fist on the table and scream," damn you steve!"
WSS
Uh, I don't even know what to say to that. "That you believe that antisocial behavior isn't really a problem and even if it was it's someone else's fault." I don't even know what you're really referring to, but I can guess, and once again your approximations of what I think are ridiculous cartoons. But you can sleep easy knowing that I don't pound my fist and curse your name. After all, I'm the one who found you those statistics. Why should they upset me?
Vapor has been trying to make a point in this thread and it doesn't seem like you get it, and it's what you still don't seem to get about the Derbyshire article. Because the same critique people - on the right - are making of the Derbyshire article is the same problem with your opinions regarding race.
I suppose we should stop trying. Your car only gets into 3rd gear, 4th on a good day.
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And today, in the National Review:
Regarding Robert Weissberg
By Rich Lowry
Unbeknowst to us, occasional Phi Beta Cons contributor Robert Weissberg (whose book was published a few years ago by Transaction) participated in an American Renaissance conference where he delivered a noxious talk about the future of white nationalism. He will no longer be posting here. Thanks to those who brought it to our attention.
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And today, in the National Review:
Regarding Robert Weissberg
By Rich Lowry
Unbeknowst to us, occasional Phi Beta Cons contributor Robert Weissberg (whose book was published a few years ago by Transaction) participated in an American Renaissance conference where he delivered a noxious talk about the future of white nationalism. He will no longer be posting here. Thanks to those who brought it to our attention.
And today, in the National Review:
Regarding Robert Weissberg
By Rich Lowry
Unbeknowst to us, occasional Phi Beta Cons contributor Robert Weissberg (whose book was published a few years ago by Transaction) participated in an American Renaissance conference where he delivered a noxious talk about the future of white nationalism. He will no longer be posting here. Thanks to those who brought it to our attention.
So?
( See how they run)
But that aside, what was VTs point?
I'm assuming you have no idea but just wanted to toss him a bone.
WSS
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Steve, let's not. Your childish provocations have become tiresome. Go write a new song, Let's be productive today.
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[quote name='VaporTrail' timestamp='1334155474' post='282
Okay, let's look at 10 again.
Just to further clarify that you think he's speaking truths about the world we live in.
Actually you didn't include 10.
But if you feel comfortable stopping in the black part of town after dark and helping out somebody on the side of the road great.
I would say statistically like it says in 10, your risk of being hurt is probably greater.
If you don't believe that's true, fine.
WSS
Actually you didn't include 10.
But if you feel comfortable stopping in the black part of town after dark and helping out somebody on the side of the road great.
I would say statistically like it says in 10, your risk of being hurt is probably greater.
If you don't believe that's true, fine.
WSS
Steve, this guy doesn't make those concessions. Instead, he blatantly says don't help out black people, no matter if they're in Compton or the middle of Iowa.
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Daniel Foster, in the NRO:
"...I can’t rightly speak to John’s reputation for personal warmth and charm, but I trust my colleagues that he is both warm and charming. And though I don’t know him personally, I can say that I, like so many others, admire (envy) his polymath’s talent. Jay says in his latest Impromptus that he always reads Derb, even on topics he finds dull or inaccessible, and that strikes me as both a great compliment and a true one.
That’s why I was so confused when I read the infamous column. Not only was it baldly racist, it was, of all things, dumb. On the topic of what made it dumb, I don’t have much to add to Jason’s post. John commits a statistical fallacy he is far too smart to have fallen for en route to a set of odious moral commitments that don’t follow from anything he’s put to paper — that seem to follow instead from unreflective prejudices informed by cherry-picked anecdotes, from a general misanthropy, and from a narrow, amoral scientism positively Victorian in its vintage. I found the column deplorable and I certainly understand Rich’s determination that its very outrageousness constituted a kind of letter of resignation."
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This might be what Vapor and I are trying to get across to you, Steve - exactly what Foster is saying about Derbyshire he might as well be saying about you.
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