Losses Vs. Gains Comparison
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lol...Charles Tillman...really?..Antoine Winfield?...two names that are a HUGE reach..Champ Bailey is WAY past his prime.....Richard Sherman?...never heard of him...Brandon Flowers?...asK Romeo why he doesnt have a job..Tim Jennings?..another HUGE reach....I'll give you PP and Revis but after that..YOUR REACHING!
Check the stats. Tillman and Winfield both had fantastic years. Bailey is still playing at a very high level and Sherman is the beast corner in Seattle and yes Brandon Flowers. You're an idiot if you think Romeo lost his job for drafting him. Hell you probably don't know 3/4th's of the corners on that list.
Check the stats. Tillman and Winfield both had fantastic years. Bailey is still playing at a very high level and Sherman is the beast corner in Seattle and yes Brandon Flowers. You're an idiot if you think Romeo lost his job for drafting him. Hell you probably don't know 3/4th's of the corners on that list.
I do...thats not the point...Stats dont always tell the tale of the tape...Stats arent the only way to measure the impact a DB has on theyre team...
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Check the stats. Tillman and Winfield both had fantastic years. Bailey is still playing at a very high level and Sherman is the beast corner in Seattle and yes Brandon Flowers. You're an idiot if you think Romeo lost his job for drafting him. Hell you probably don't know 3/4th's of the corners on that list.
I do...thats not the point...Stats dont always tell the tale of the tape...Stats arent the only way to measure the impact a DB has on theyre team...
I do...thats not the point...Stats dont always tell the tale of the tape...Stats arent the only way to measure the impact a DB has on theyre team...
False. That's just something people say when trying to defend a shitty player.
They are the best, and only, quantifiable representation of how a player plays and affects his team.
You just have to look at the right stats.
The cut and dry "INT", "TKL", "PDEF" stats don't just do it. You have to look situationally and at the game as a whole.
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I do...thats not the point...Stats dont always tell the tale of the tape...Stats arent the only way to measure the impact a DB has on theyre team...
False. That's just something people say when trying to defend a shitty player.
They are the best, and only, quantifiable representation of how a player plays and affects his team.
You just have to look at the right stats.
The cut and dry "INT", "TKL", "PDEF" stats don't just do it. You have to look situationally and at the game as a whole.
False. That's just something people say when trying to defend a shitty player.
They are the best, and only, quantifiable representation of how a player plays and affects his team.
You just have to look at the right stats.
The cut and dry "INT", "TKL", "PDEF" stats don't just do it. You have to look situationally and at the game as a whole.
No...Its only false to you because it doesnt agree with your philosophy .Like all stupid kids like you and vag...its not really about the stats...Its about always being right...Never in My life did I ever see such a group of thin skinned assholes..Right stats?..like interceptions,Passes knocked down that dont get accounted for..Dropped Passes by WR's that arent put on the responsibility of the WR..Get your head out of your asses..I mean...really?
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False. That's just something people say when trying to defend a shitty player.
They are the best, and only, quantifiable representation of how a player plays and affects his team.
You just have to look at the right stats.
The cut and dry "INT", "TKL", "PDEF" stats don't just do it. You have to look situationally and at the game as a whole.
No...Its only false to you because it doesnt agree with your philosophy .Like all stupid kids like you and vag...its not really about the stats...Its about always being right...Never in My life did I ever see such a group of thin skinned assholes..Right stats?..like interceptions,Passes knocked down that dont get accounted for..Dropped Passes by WR's that arent put on the responsibility of the WR..Get your head out of your asses..I mean...really?
No...Its only false to you because it doesnt agree with your philosophy .Like all stupid kids like you and vag...its not really about the stats...Its about always being right...Never in My life did I ever see such a group of thin skinned assholes..Right stats?..like interceptions,Passes knocked down that dont get accounted for..Dropped Passes by WR's that arent put on the responsibility of the WR..Get your head out of your asses..I mean...really?
It's not about always being right. I just happen to be right in this instance because you're a dumb fucking pussy.
You're right. Stats don't matter. And neither do points. And after the game everybody goes out for ice cream and then has a slumber party.
You tell me to get my head out of my ass...I tell you to get yours out of your vagina.
People who say stats don't matter are people who grew up losing and had to find a way to make themselves feel good.
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No...Its only false to you because it doesnt agree with your philosophy .Like all stupid kids like you and vag...its not really about the stats...Its about always being right...Never in My life did I ever see such a group of thin skinned assholes..Right stats?..like interceptions,Passes knocked down that dont get accounted for..Dropped Passes by WR's that arent put on the responsibility of the WR..Get your head out of your asses..I mean...really?
It's not about always being right. I just happen to be right in this instance because you're a dumb fucking pussy.
You're right. Stats don't matter. And neither do points. And after the game everybody goes out for ice cream and then has a slumber party.
You tell me to get my head out of my ass...I tell you to get yours out of your vagina.
People who say stats don't matter are people who grew up losing and had to find a way to make themselves feel good.
It's not about always being right. I just happen to be right in this instance because you're a dumb fucking pussy.
You're right. Stats don't matter. And neither do points. And after the game everybody goes out for ice cream and then has a slumber party.
You tell me to get my head out of my ass...I tell you to get yours out of your vagina.
People who say stats don't matter are people who grew up losing and had to find a way to make themselves feel good.
Come on sonny,let it all out...all I said is stats dont tell the entire story. Only part of the story...Now go play with your legos or something...jesus...stupid kids...
Nickers...."There are no old running QB's in the NFL "~Sam Rutigliano~ -
Zombo said:
I don't think I was being unreasonable ranking Haden top five and Ward top ten at their respective positions.
I'd love to hear the names of ten strong safeties that he would rank better than Ward, I wonder if they are as old as the corners he is naming.
I think he's just bitter because Ryan Clark and Troy Polymumu are collecting AARP and our two studs are 24 and 26 and headed into their prime.
Honestly, it must suck to be a Steeler fan right now.
Zombo
Polamalu is still much better than Ward and they drafted a missile in the 4th round this year with your draft pick lol. The only reason he lasted till the 4th was because of his size but he also happens to have a 40 inch vertical. I also couldn't be more pleased with the draft. It's gotta suck being a Browns fan if you wanna go there. How many times have you drafted inside the top 10 in the last decade? Your team may need to get sold again and they sh.it the bed in the most recent draft. AGAIN
Polamalu is still much better than Ward and they drafted a missile in the 4th round this year with your draft pick lol. The only reason he lasted till the 4th was because of his size but he also happens to have a 40 inch vertical. I also couldn't be more pleased with the draft. It's gotta suck being a Browns fan if you wanna go there. How many times have you drafted inside the top 10 in the last decade? Your team may need to get sold again and they sh.it the bed in the most recent draft. AGAIN
Kellen Winslow, Pro Bowler
Braylon Edwards, Pro Bowler,
Joe Thomas, Perennial All-Pro
Joe Haden, Future Pro Bowler
Trent Richardson, Future Pro Bowler
Barkevious Mingo, Future Slavemaster to Ben Roethlisberger
Yes, Winslow got injured and Edwards fell off the face of the earth, but I don't see how you can argue with any of the picks from Joe Thomas on.
Which leaves us with youngest, and probably most talented roster in the division moving forward.
Too bad you didnt get a top ten pick recently because your team is now mediocre and old and needs new blood.
Steeler starters over 30: QB Roethlisberger 31, TE Miller 30, DE Keisel 34, LB Foote, 32, CB Taylor 33, SS Polamalu 32, FS Clark 33
Browns starter over 30: None
So keep laughing at the young Top Ten talent we are accumulating because it is going to be a long, long, long time before your team is decent again.
Zombo
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Zombo said:
I don't think I was being unreasonable ranking Haden top five and Ward top ten at their respective positions.
I'd love to hear the names of ten strong safeties that he would rank better than Ward, I wonder if they are as old as the corners he is naming.
I think he's just bitter because Ryan Clark and Troy Polymumu are collecting AARP and our two studs are 24 and 26 and headed into their prime.
Honestly, it must suck to be a Steeler fan right now.
Zombo
Polamalu is still much better than Ward and they drafted a missile in the 4th round this year with your draft pick lol. The only reason he lasted till the 4th was because of his size but he also happens to have a 40 inch vertical. I also couldn't be more pleased with the draft. It's gotta suck being a Browns fan if you wanna go there. How many times have you drafted inside the top 10 in the last decade? Your team may need to get sold again and they sh.it the bed in the most recent draft. AGAIN
Yep you really got us, you drafted a undersized safety with a history of having concussions. I'm guessing he will start for you game 1, I would be impressed if he makes it the whole season.Polamalu is still much better than Ward and they drafted a missile in the 4th round this year with your draft pick lol. The only reason he lasted till the 4th was because of his size but he also happens to have a 40 inch vertical. I also couldn't be more pleased with the draft. It's gotta suck being a Browns fan if you wanna go there. How many times have you drafted inside the top 10 in the last decade? Your team may need to get sold again and they sh.it the bed in the most recent draft. AGAIN
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Polamalu is still much better than Ward and they drafted a missile in the 4th round this year with your draft pick lol. The only reason he lasted till the 4th was because of his size but he also happens to have a 40 inch vertical. I also couldn't be more pleased with the draft. It's gotta suck being a Browns fan if you wanna go there. How many times have you drafted inside the top 10 in the last decade? Your team may need to get sold again and they sh.it the bed in the most recent draft. AGAIN
Kellen Winslow, Pro Bowler
Braylon Edwards, Pro Bowler,
Joe Thomas, Perennial All-Pro
Joe Haden, Future Pro Bowler
Trent Richardson, Future Pro Bowler
Barkevious Mingo, Future Slavemaster to Ben Roethlisberger
Yes, Winslow got injured and Edwards fell off the face of the earth, but I don't see how you can argue with any of the picks from Joe Thomas on.
Which leaves us with youngest, and probably most talented roster in the division moving forward.
Too bad you didnt get a top ten pick recently because your team is now mediocre and old and needs new blood.
Steeler starters over 30: QB Roethlisberger 31, TE Miller 30, DE Keisel 34, LB Foote, 32, CB Taylor 33, SS Polamalu 32, FS Clark 33
Browns starter over 30: None
So keep laughing at the young Top Ten talent we are accumulating because it is going to be a long, long, long time before your team is decent again.
Zombo
Zombo said:
Kellen Winslow, Pro Bowler
Braylon Edwards, Pro Bowler,
Joe Thomas, Perennial All-Pro
Joe Haden, Future Pro Bowler
Trent Richardson, Future Pro Bowler
Barkevious Mingo, Future Slavemaster to Ben Roethlisberger
Yes, Winslow got injured and Edwards fell off the face of the earth, but I don't see how you can argue with any of the picks from Joe Thomas on.
Which leaves us with youngest, and probably most talented roster in the division moving forward.
Too bad you didnt get a top ten pick recently because your team is now mediocre and old and needs new blood.
Steeler starters over 30: QB Roethlisberger 31, TE Miller 30, DE Keisel 34, LB Foote, 32, CB Taylor 33, SS Polamalu 32, FS Clark 33
Browns starter over 30: None
So keep laughing at the young Top Ten talent we are accumulating because it is going to be a long, long, long time before your team is decent again.
Zombo
My point zombo was you have done absolutely nothing with all those top ten picks.
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It's not about always being right. I just happen to be right in this instance because you're a dumb fucking pussy.
You're right. Stats don't matter. And neither do points. And after the game everybody goes out for ice cream and then has a slumber party.
You tell me to get my head out of my ass...I tell you to get yours out of your vagina.
People who say stats don't matter are people who grew up losing and had to find a way to make themselves feel good.
Come on sonny,let it all out...all I said is stats dont tell the entire story. Only part of the story...Now go play with your legos or something...jesus...stupid kids...
Come on sonny,let it all out...all I said is stats dont tell the entire story. Only part of the story...Now go play with your legos or something...jesus...stupid kids...
I can agree with that. People who say "so and so is great because he had 400 passing yards blah blah blah" but fail to acknowledge that the team was down by 50 and were playing in essentially garbage time are fucking Retarded.
Stats are meant as a complement. Not an end all be all of performance.
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Zombo said:
Kellen Winslow, Pro Bowler
Braylon Edwards, Pro Bowler,
Joe Thomas, Perennial All-Pro
Joe Haden, Future Pro Bowler
Trent Richardson, Future Pro Bowler
Barkevious Mingo, Future Slavemaster to Ben Roethlisberger
Yes, Winslow got injured and Edwards fell off the face of the earth, but I don't see how you can argue with any of the picks from Joe Thomas on.
Which leaves us with youngest, and probably most talented roster in the division moving forward.
Too bad you didnt get a top ten pick recently because your team is now mediocre and old and needs new blood.
Steeler starters over 30: QB Roethlisberger 31, TE Miller 30, DE Keisel 34, LB Foote, 32, CB Taylor 33, SS Polamalu 32, FS Clark 33
Browns starter over 30: None
So keep laughing at the young Top Ten talent we are accumulating because it is going to be a long, long, long time before your team is decent again.
Zombo
My point zombo was you have done absolutely nothing with all those top ten picks.
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Yep you really got us, you drafted a undersized safety with a history of having concussions. I'm guessing he will start for you game 1, I would be impressed if he makes it the whole season.Polamalu is still much better than Ward and they drafted a missile in the 4th round this year with your draft pick lol. The only reason he lasted till the 4th was because of his size but he also happens to have a 40 inch vertical. I also couldn't be more pleased with the draft. It's gotta suck being a Browns fan if you wanna go there. How many times have you drafted inside the top 10 in the last decade? Your team may need to get sold again and they sh.it the bed in the most recent draft. AGAIN
Yep you really got us, you drafted a undersized safety with a history of having concussions. I'm guessing he will start for you game 1, I would be impressed if he makes it the whole season.
Troy Polamalu is only 5'10 and Sharmarko Thomas has a 41 inch vertical. Polamalu had a history of concussions and we've all seen how that turned out. They wouldn't have traded up to draft Thomas if they were worried about the concussions.
Zombo, your point is moot. You've had a pick in the top 10 for a better part of a decade. Mingo is still a unknown, you then list Thomas, Haden and Richardson. I'm also not worried. The Browns will still finish last in the division. You also listed a bunch of players previously that are getting long in the tooth but in each instance there is a young buck or two waiting in the wings. The Steelers draft each April with that in mind and it's worked pretty well. Browns fans year after year are hilariously delusional.
AKA SNATCH98 or Rorbotron. The boards glorious admins decided to get cute and change my name to "homotron" Classy group of people. (Lost a bet with Columbus king and got banned for a month) -
Yep you really got us, you drafted a undersized safety with a history of having concussions. I'm guessing he will start for you game 1, I would be impressed if he makes it the whole season.
Troy Polamalu is only 5'10 and Sharmarko Thomas has a 41 inch vertical. Polamalu had a history of concussions and we've all seen how that turned out. They wouldn't have traded up to draft Thomas if they were worried about the concussions.
Zombo, your point is moot. You've had a pick in the top 10 for a better part of a decade. Mingo is still a unknown, you then list Thomas, Haden and Richardson. I'm also not worried. The Browns will still finish last in the division. You also listed a bunch of players previously that are getting long in the tooth but in each instance there is a young buck or two waiting in the wings. The Steelers draft each April with that in mind and it's worked pretty well. Browns fans year after year are hilariously delusional.
Troy Polamalu is only 5'10 and Sharmarko Thomas has a 41 inch vertical. Polamalu had a history of concussions and we've all seen how that turned out. They wouldn't have traded up to draft Thomas if they were worried about the concussions.
Zombo, your point is moot. You've had a pick in the top 10 for a better part of a decade. Mingo is still a unknown, you then list Thomas, Haden and Richardson. I'm also not worried. The Browns will still finish last in the division. You also listed a bunch of players previously that are getting long in the tooth but in each instance there is a young buck or two waiting in the wings. The Steelers draft each April with that in mind and it's worked pretty well. Browns fans year after year are hilariously delusional.
Lol...you calling people delusional,,Im caling it now...browns and steelers fight for last place with the steelers finishing "LAST'' of course..
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Yep you really got us, you drafted a undersized safety with a history of having concussions. I'm guessing he will start for you game 1, I would be impressed if he makes it the whole season.
Troy Polamalu is only 5'10 and Sharmarko Thomas has a 41 inch vertical. Polamalu had a history of concussions and we've all seen how that turned out. They wouldn't have traded up to draft Thomas if they were worried about the concussions.
Zombo, your point is moot. You've had a pick in the top 10 for a better part of a decade. Mingo is still a unknown, you then list Thomas, Haden and Richardson. I'm also not worried. The Browns will still finish last in the division. You also listed a bunch of players previously that are getting long in the tooth but in each instance there is a young buck or two waiting in the wings. The Steelers draft each April with that in mind and it's worked pretty well. Browns fans year after year are hilariously delusional.
You see this is where you get yourself in trouble,Troy Polamalu is only 5'10 and Sharmarko Thomas has a 41 inch vertical. Polamalu had a history of concussions and we've all seen how that turned out. They wouldn't have traded up to draft Thomas if they were worried about the concussions.
Zombo, your point is moot. You've had a pick in the top 10 for a better part of a decade. Mingo is still a unknown, you then list Thomas, Haden and Richardson. I'm also not worried. The Browns will still finish last in the division. You also listed a bunch of players previously that are getting long in the tooth but in each instance there is a young buck or two waiting in the wings. The Steelers draft each April with that in mind and it's worked pretty well. Browns fans year after year are hilariously delusional.
You automatically assume because troy is the same height and similar weight that the sham is going to be the same guy. Troy was projected 1st the best safety in his draft, don't remember troy having concussion problems at cal but whatever, he was projected 1st overall and taken 1st at his position. Sham was taken in the 4th because he is at his peak for body size and "has" a concussion problem. Also the steelers where desperate for a safety and didn't stay the course "Drafting the Steelers way" and panicked.. blew their load.. and made a desperate attempt at grabbing a safety, meanwhile getting older and trading away next years 3rd to the browns who will continue to stay young.
Also you project your missiles, and sledge hammer type players as the second coming of Christ and dismiss ours as unproven, because the steelers drafted them.
Fuck that. No one has taken a snap yet. You can't have it both ways.
We have reminded you and repeatedly tried to show you that the steelers past few drafts have sucked. Take an objective look without using words like; shown glimpses of being good, some good upside, etc. Can you do it?
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You see this is where you get yourself in trouble,Troy Polamalu is only 5'10 and Sharmarko Thomas has a 41 inch vertical. Polamalu had a history of concussions and we've all seen how that turned out. They wouldn't have traded up to draft Thomas if they were worried about the concussions.
Zombo, your point is moot. You've had a pick in the top 10 for a better part of a decade. Mingo is still a unknown, you then list Thomas, Haden and Richardson. I'm also not worried. The Browns will still finish last in the division. You also listed a bunch of players previously that are getting long in the tooth but in each instance there is a young buck or two waiting in the wings. The Steelers draft each April with that in mind and it's worked pretty well. Browns fans year after year are hilariously delusional.
You automatically assume because troy is the same height and similar weight that the sham is going to be the same guy. Troy was projected 1st the best safety in his draft, don't remember troy having concussion problems at cal but whatever, he was projected 1st overall and taken 1st at his position. Sham was taken in the 4th because he is at his peak for body size and "has" a concussion problem. Also the steelers where desperate for a safety and didn't stay the course "Drafting the Steelers way" and panicked.. blew their load.. and made a desperate attempt at grabbing a safety, meanwhile getting older and trading away next years 3rd to the browns who will continue to stay young.
Also you project your missiles, and sledge hammer type players as the second coming of Christ and dismiss ours as unproven, because the steelers drafted them.
Fuck that. No one has taken a snap yet. You can't have it both ways.
We have reminded you and repeatedly tried to show you that the steelers past few drafts have sucked. Take an objective look without using words like; shown glimpses of being good, some good upside, etc. Can you do it?
You see this is where you get yourself in trouble,
You automatically assume because troy is the same height and similar weight that the sham is going to be the same guy. Troy was projected 1st the best safety in his draft, don't remember troy having concussion problems at cal but whatever, he was projected 1st overall and taken 1st at his position. Sham was taken in the 4th because he is at his peak for body size and "has" a concussion problem. Also the steelers where desperate for a safety and didn't stay the course "Drafting the Steelers way" and panicked.. blew their load.. and made a desperate attempt at grabbing a safety, meanwhile getting older and trading away next years 3rd to the browns who will continue to stay young.
Also you project your missiles, and sledge hammer type players as the second coming of Christ and dismiss ours as unproven, because the steelers drafted them.
Fuck that. No one has taken a snap yet. You can't have it both ways.
We have reminded you and repeatedly tried to show you that the steelers past few drafts have sucked. Take an objective look without using words like; shown glimpses of being good, some good upside, etc. Can you do it?
The same could be said for a lot of us, too.
There's not too many purely objective views on this board, one way or the other.
I'm awesome, and I fuck dolphins. Ghoolie 12/2/2012: I have absolutely no skills, training or pride -
You see this is where you get yourself in trouble,Troy Polamalu is only 5'10 and Sharmarko Thomas has a 41 inch vertical. Polamalu had a history of concussions and we've all seen how that turned out. They wouldn't have traded up to draft Thomas if they were worried about the concussions.
Zombo, your point is moot. You've had a pick in the top 10 for a better part of a decade. Mingo is still a unknown, you then list Thomas, Haden and Richardson. I'm also not worried. The Browns will still finish last in the division. You also listed a bunch of players previously that are getting long in the tooth but in each instance there is a young buck or two waiting in the wings. The Steelers draft each April with that in mind and it's worked pretty well. Browns fans year after year are hilariously delusional.
You automatically assume because troy is the same height and similar weight that the sham is going to be the same guy. Troy was projected 1st the best safety in his draft, don't remember troy having concussion problems at cal but whatever, he was projected 1st overall and taken 1st at his position. Sham was taken in the 4th because he is at his peak for body size and "has" a concussion problem. Also the steelers where desperate for a safety and didn't stay the course "Drafting the Steelers way" and panicked.. blew their load.. and made a desperate attempt at grabbing a safety, meanwhile getting older and trading away next years 3rd to the browns who will continue to stay young.
Also you project your missiles, and sledge hammer type players as the second coming of Christ and dismiss ours as unproven, because the steelers drafted them.
Fuck that. No one has taken a snap yet. You can't have it both ways.
We have reminded you and repeatedly tried to show you that the steelers past few drafts have sucked. Take an objective look without using words like; shown glimpses of being good, some good upside, etc. Can you do it?
I never said he was going to be troy, what i did say wad troy is also small for a safety and it hasnt effected his game. You deduced the rest all on your own. The Steelers also werent "desperate" for a safety they just really wanted Thomas and apparently knew he wasnt going to last until their next pick. They re getting a third round comp for wallace next year, but even still they didnt trade that third for a aging veteran they traded it for a rookie so your point about age is bogus. They got the additional player this year rather than next. Simple math.You see this is where you get yourself in trouble,
You automatically assume because troy is the same height and similar weight that the sham is going to be the same guy. Troy was projected 1st the best safety in his draft, don't remember troy having concussion problems at cal but whatever, he was projected 1st overall and taken 1st at hios position. Sham was taken in the 4th because he is at his peak for body size and "has" a concussion problem. Also the steelers where desperate for a safety and didn't stay the course "Drafting the Steelers way" and panicked.. blew their load.. and made a desperate attempt at grabbing a safety, meanwhile getting older and trading away next years 3rd to the browns who will continue to stay young.
Also you project your missiles, and sledge hammer type players as the second coming of Christ and dismiss ours as unproven, because the steelers drafted them.
Fuck that. No one has taken a snap yet. You can't have it
ee ways.
We have reminded you and repeatedly tried to show you that the steelers past few drafts have sucked. Take an objective look without using words like; shown glimpses of being good, some good upside, etc. Can you do it?
AKA SNATCH98 or Rorbotron. The boards glorious admins decided to get cute and change my name to "homotron" Classy group of people. (Lost a bet with Columbus king and got banned for a month) -
Yep you really got us, you drafted a undersized safety with a history of having concussions. I'm guessing he will start for you game 1, I would be impressed if he makes it the whole season.
Troy Polamalu is only 5'10 and Sharmarko Thomas has a 41 inch vertical. Polamalu had a history of concussions and we've all seen how that turned out. They wouldn't have traded up to draft Thomas if they were worried about the concussions.
Zombo, your point is moot. You've had a pick in the top 10 for a better part of a decade. Mingo is still a unknown, you then list Thomas, Haden and Richardson. I'm also not worried. The Browns will still finish last in the division. You also listed a bunch of players previously that are getting long in the tooth but in each instance there is a young buck or two waiting in the wings. The Steelers draft each April with that in mind and it's worked pretty well. Browns fans year after year are hilariously delusional.
Zombo, your point is moot. You've had a pick in the top 10 for a better part of a decade. Mingo is still a unknown, you then list Thomas, Haden and Richardson. I'm also not worried. The Browns will still finish last in the division. You also listed a bunch of players previously that are getting long in the tooth but in each instance there is a young buck or two waiting in the wings. The Steelers draft each April with that in mind and it's worked pretty well. Browns fans year after year are hilariously delusional.
Vag, what you're not getting is that, Yes, Joe Thomas has been a great tackle on a bad team ... but now, you keep saying we haven't won with our top ten picks, like they haven't made a difference. I reiterate: Haden is 24, Richardson 22, Mingo, 22. They are just getting started. Not only is the jury not out yet on this Browns regime, they aren't even in session. New players, new owner, new coaching staff, new front office ... the only thing that is same the about past past Browns failures are the hiddens young gems that we kept: guys like Rubin, DQ Jackson and Thomas, all signed for the future and all under 30.
If you are trying to say the Browns have been a failure from 1999-2012, no one is arguing you. If you are telling me that you would trade the 2013 Steeler roster for the 2013 Browns roster, you are smoking crack.
Zombo
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Zombo said:
I don't think I was being unreasonable ranking Haden top five and Ward top ten at their respective positions.
I'd love to hear the names of ten strong safeties that he would rank better than Ward, I wonder if they are as old as the corners he is naming.
I think he's just bitter because Ryan Clark and Troy Polymumu are collecting AARP and our two studs are 24 and 26 and headed into their prime.
Honestly, it must suck to be a Steeler fan right now.
Zombo
Polamalu is still much better than Ward and they drafted a missile in the 4th round this year with your draft pick lol. The only reason he lasted till the 4th was because of his size but he also happens to have a 40 inch vertical. I also couldn't be more pleased with the draft. It's gotta suck being a Browns fan if you wanna go there. How many times have you drafted inside the top 10 in the last decade? Your team may need to get sold again and they sh.it the bed in the most recent draft. AGAIN
Polamalu is still much better than Ward.....you are just hanging onto the past with that claim
and they drafted a missile in the 4th round this year with your draft pick lol....and you are just hoping for the future with that one.
The only reason he lasted till the 4th was because of his size but he also happens to have a 40 inch vertical.
In other words....every team thought he wasn't that good?
I also couldn't be more pleased with the draft....we are truly not interested in what you do to pleasure yourself 🥷 . That said, you being pleased don't cut any mustard with what will really happen. A lot of Browns fans are not pleased....that doesn't mean these players taken won't be outstanding (won't mean they will be either)
It's gotta suck being a Browns fan if you wanna go there. How many times have you drafted inside the top 10 in the last decade? Your team may need to get sold again and they sh.it the bed in the most recent draft. AGAIN
The past has nothing to do with the future. Having 13 championships won't buy Cleveland one in the near future. Having the handfull of titles Pittsburgh has won't buy them any in the future either.
As to who had the better draft.....check back in 4 years for that answer.
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I'd love to know what rating system you are using, because CBS Sports and Walter Football both have every single player I mentioned rated higher than your beloved Sheldon Brown.
ESPN/FOX/NFL.com
Once again, you prove you know absolutely fucking nothing about but you spout off bullshit like its fact.
In that regard then, I simply am mimicking you, obviously
Why don't you just go ahead and turn this thread into another useless bullshit one about the places you've been or old TV shows you watched or how your son is some whatever expert...because you sure as shit don't know what you're talking about here.
What? Can't stand that I enjoy a well rounded existance? You are stuck in hillbilly heaven and never go anywhere, your sum total of TV experience is Duck Dynasty, and your kid is in prison.
I know just as much about what goes on in football as you do.....which is to say, not much
Analyzing a player is more than just asking "is this guy from the Cleveland area? Does he have a last name similar to mine? Does his aunt shop at the store where I bought my first hat? If so, then yes he's awesome and you're stupid for not seeing it"
NSS? What do you want? 40 times? Height/weight. I guess you want to bore people to death with that sort of thing, is that it? You have no more information about these players than I do, no more basis upon which to analyze them than anyone else.
Quit trying to apologize for the staff's fuck ups. They passed on FA to address it in the draft, and when the draft rolled around they missed the boat again. That's all there is to it.
I am not apologizing for them....in many respects I agree somewhat with what you say. Its just that your "I fucking know better than they do" attitude comes off as completely Retarded. You have no clue as to how well the players they obtained, like McFadden/Owen/Barnes/Slaughter are going to
vis a vis the guys you think they should have taken.
And your credibility further wanes by the notion that you think San Diego St. is a basketball school. Can you name one basketball player that came from SDSU? I don't think I can.
But, I can tell you that SDSU has been pretty damn good to the Cleveland Browns in the past: Brian Sipe, Webster Slaughter.
And don't forget HOFer Marshall Faulk.
Oh, and the fact that both Sid Gillman/Don Coryell, and John Madden used to coach there gives that school some pretty solid football credentials.
In essence, the Air Coryell version of the West Coast Offense was basically started there.
So, I expect Leon McFadden to follow in the Sipe/Slaughter footsteps and be damned fine player for the Cleveland Browns.
You're right, the Cleveland Browns haven't called me. But the Atlanta Falcons and the Baltimore Ravens did.
Did they need a beer vendor?
That's funny, because here's ESPN's top 50 Free Agents at the start of free agency:
50. Mike Devito, DL
2012 team: New York Jets
49. Fred Davis, TE
2012 team: Washington Redskins
48. Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie, CB
2012 team: Philadelphia Eagles
47. Glover Quin, S
2012 team: Houston Texans
46. Kenny Phillips, S
2012 team: New York Giants
45. Dwight Freeney, DE
2012 team: Indianapolis Colts
44. Alan Branch, DT
2012 team: Seattle Seahawks
43. Erin Henderson, LB
2012 team: Minnesota Vikings
42. Israel Idonije, DE
2012 team: Chicago Bears
41. Gosder Cherilus, T
2012 team: Detroit Lions
40. Steven Jackson, RB
2012 team: St. Louis Rams
39. Andy Levitre, G
2012 team: Buffalo Bills
38. Dashon Goldson, S
2012 team: San Francisco 49ers
37. Desmond Bryant, DT
2012 team: Oakland Raiders
36. Randy Starks, DT
2012 team: Miami Dolphins
35. Cary Williams, CB
2012 team: Baltimore Ravens
34. Aqib Talib, CB
2012 team: New England Patriots
33. Michael Johnson, DE
2012 team: Cincinnati Bengals
32. Brian De La Puente, C
2012 team: New Orleans Saints
31. Brian Hartline, WR
2012 team: Miami Dolphins
30. Brandon Moore, G
2012 team: New York Jets
29. Adam Jones, CB
2012 team: Cincinnati Bengals
28. Dennis Pitta, TE
2012 team: Baltimore Ravens
27. Richard Seymour, DT
2012 team: Oakland Raiders
26. Phil Loadholt, T
2012 team: Minnesota Vikings
25. William Moore, S
2012 team: Atlanta Falcons
24. Sam Shields, CB
2012 team: Green Bay Packers
23. Cliff Avril, DE
2012 team: Detroit Lions
22. Danny Amendola, WR
2012 team: St. Louis Rams
21. Branden Albert, T
2012 team: Kansas City Chiefs
20. Andre Smith, T
2012 team: Cincinnati Bengals
19. Paul Kruger, OLB
2012 team: Baltimore Ravens
18. Will Beatty, T
2012 team: New York Giants
17. Martellus Bennett, TE
2012 team: New York Giants
16. Daryl Smith, LB
2012 team: Jacksonville Jaguars
15. Sebastian Vollmer, T
2012 team: New England Patriots
14. Mike Wallace, WR
2012 team: Pittsburgh Steelers
13. Victor Cruz, WR
2012 team: New York Giants
12. Anthony Spencer, OLB
2012 team: Dallas Cowboys
11. Brent Grimes, CB
2012 team: Atlanta Falcons
10. Michael Bennett, DE
2012 team: Tampa Bay Buccaneers
9. Jake Long, T
2012 team: Miami Dolphins
8. Tony Gonzalez, TE
2012 team: Atlanta Falcons
7. Dwayne Bowe, WR
2012 team: Kansas City Chiefs
6. Wes Welker, WR
2012 team: New England Patriots
5. Jairus Byrd, S
2012 team: Buffalo Bills
4. Ryan Clady, T
2012 team: Denver Broncos
3. Greg Jennings, WR
2012 team: Green Bay Packers
2. Henry Melton, DT
2012 team: Chicago Bears
1. Joe Flacco, QB
2012 team: Baltimore Ravens
Nowhere on there is Sheldon Brown.
Here's NFL.com's best corners available at the start of FA:
1. Brent Grimes, Atlanta Falcons
2. Sean Smith, Miami Dolphins (UPDATE: Agreed to terms with the Kansas City Chiefs)
3. Aqib Talib, New England Patriots (UPDATE: Agreed to deal with the New England Patriots.)
4. Chris Houston, Detroit Lions (UPDATE: Agreed to re-sign with the Detroit Lions)
5. Antoine Winfield, Minnesota Vikings
6. Keenan Lewis, Pittsburgh Steelers (UPDATE: Signed with the New Orleans Saints)
Nowhere on there is Sheldon Brown.
Just for shits and giggles:
Here's a list of NFL.com's top 85 FA's:
Here's a list of Rotoworld's top FA's by position:
http://www.rotoworld.com/articles/nfl/42077/309/nfl-free-agent-master-list-13
Sheldon Brown was never mentioned. Not once.
Sometimes I wonder if you actually even believe the shit you say.
Just as you were completely off-base with your "assessment" of the FA's available, you too are wrong about me. The only thing you know is that I'm from South Carolina which, according to you, means I'm an inbred, mouth breathing Jethro just living the days between hunting seasons.
You don't know that, per the IRS, nearly 1/5th of all New Yorkers that relocated to North Carolina, South Carolina, Georgia and Florida in the last 10 years moved into Horry/Georgetown County.
As of the last census, nearly half of the population in my hometown relocated from cities north of the Mason/Dixon line.
I've never shot a gun, much less owned one. I don't watch Duck Dynasty because I don't believe in cable television, as it rots your mind. Anything I need to watch is on Netflix or very easily downloadable.
Swing and a miss, strike two.
As for height/weight/40 time...you can keep them. Fools place too much emphasis on them. Not that you use them; your analysis of a player only extends to "Did he play for a school in or around my area?" or "Do we have the same last name?"
And no, they weren't calling for a beer vendor...although that seems to be right up your son's alley.
It was for an internship.
So you keep pretending that "knowing football" means Googling "who last kicked a left footed field goal in sub 40 degree temperatures while trailing by 13 points" and being content that our FO made "okay" moves.
For the record, I wasnt upset with the McFadden pick. He can be a solid cover corner for us. Horton's defense requires our corners to be on islands, often locked in man coverage in order to free up a blitzer. McFadden's strength lies in his man cover ability, as he was asked to do the same at SDSU.
My problem is that we picked him one to two rounds ahead of where we could have. That's where the failure lies.
That's funny, because here's ESPN's top 50 Free Agents at the start of free agency:
50. Mike Devito, DL
2012 team: New York Jets
49. Fred Davis, TE
2012 team: Washington Redskins
48. Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie, CB
2012 team: Philadelphia Eagles
47. Glover Quin, S
2012 team: Houston Texans
46. Kenny Phillips, S
2012 team: New York Giants
45. Dwight Freeney, DE
2012 team: Indianapolis Colts
44. Alan Branch, DT
2012 team: Seattle Seahawks
43. Erin Henderson, LB
2012 team: Minnesota Vikings
42. Israel Idonije, DE
2012 team: Chicago Bears
41. Gosder Cherilus, T
2012 team: Detroit Lions
40. Steven Jackson, RB
2012 team: St. Louis Rams
39. Andy Levitre, G
2012 team: Buffalo Bills
38. Dashon Goldson, S
2012 team: San Francisco 49ers
37. Desmond Bryant, DT
2012 team: Oakland Raiders
36. Randy Starks, DT
2012 team: Miami Dolphins
35. Cary Williams, CB
2012 team: Baltimore Ravens
34. Aqib Talib, CB
2012 team: New England Patriots
33. Michael Johnson, DE
2012 team: Cincinnati Bengals
32. Brian De La Puente, C
2012 team: New Orleans Saints
31. Brian Hartline, WR
2012 team: Miami Dolphins
30. Brandon Moore, G
2012 team: New York Jets
29. Adam Jones, CB
2012 team: Cincinnati Bengals
28. Dennis Pitta, TE
2012 team: Baltimore Ravens
27. Richard Seymour, DT
2012 team: Oakland Raiders
26. Phil Loadholt, T
2012 team: Minnesota Vikings
25. William Moore, S
2012 team: Atlanta Falcons
24. Sam Shields, CB
2012 team: Green Bay Packers
23. Cliff Avril, DE
2012 team: Detroit Lions
22. Danny Amendola, WR
2012 team: St. Louis Rams
21. Branden Albert, T
2012 team: Kansas City Chiefs
20. Andre Smith, T
2012 team: Cincinnati Bengals
19. Paul Kruger, OLB
2012 team: Baltimore Ravens
18. Will Beatty, T
2012 team: New York Giants
17. Martellus Bennett, TE
2012 team: New York Giants
16. Daryl Smith, LB
2012 team: Jacksonville Jaguars
15. Sebastian Vollmer, T
2012 team: New England Patriots
14. Mike Wallace, WR
2012 team: Pittsburgh Steelers
13. Victor Cruz, WR
2012 team: New York Giants
12. Anthony Spencer, OLB
2012 team: Dallas Cowboys
11. Brent Grimes, CB
2012 team: Atlanta Falcons
10. Michael Bennett, DE
2012 team: Tampa Bay Buccaneers
9. Jake Long, T
2012 team: Miami Dolphins
8. Tony Gonzalez, TE
2012 team: Atlanta Falcons
7. Dwayne Bowe, WR
2012 team: Kansas City Chiefs
6. Wes Welker, WR
2012 team: New England Patriots
5. Jairus Byrd, S
2012 team: Buffalo Bills
4. Ryan Clady, T
2012 team: Denver Broncos
3. Greg Jennings, WR
2012 team: Green Bay Packers
2. Henry Melton, DT
2012 team: Chicago Bears
1. Joe Flacco, QB
2012 team: Baltimore Ravens
Nowhere on there is Sheldon Brown.
Here's NFL.com's best corners available at the start of FA:
1. Brent Grimes, Atlanta Falcons
2. Sean Smith, Miami Dolphins (UPDATE: Agreed to terms with the Kansas City Chiefs)
3. Aqib Talib, New England Patriots (UPDATE: Agreed to deal with the New England Patriots.)
4. Chris Houston, Detroit Lions (UPDATE: Agreed to re-sign with the Detroit Lions)
5. Antoine Winfield, Minnesota Vikings
6. Keenan Lewis, Pittsburgh Steelers (UPDATE: Signed with the New Orleans Saints)
Nowhere on there is Sheldon Brown.
Just for shits and giggles:
Here's a list of NFL.com's top 85 FA's:
Here's a list of Rotoworld's top FA's by position:
http://www.rotoworld.com/articles/nfl/42077/309/nfl-free-agent-master-list-13
Sheldon Brown was never mentioned. Not once.
So? You want to play the game of dueling experts....Just Google the ones I referred to and you can see what they had to say.
Sometimes I wonder if you actually even believe the shit you say.
By no means do I believe all the bullshit I say...that is why it is called Bullshit. Your mission is to try to filter out the Bullshit from the real thing. Good Luck
Just as you were completely off-base with your "assessment" of the FA's available,
You mean you believe my dueling experts were off base. Maybe they were, maybe they weren't. You have no more clue than I do if they were or weren't.
you too are wrong about me. The only thing you know is that I'm from South Carolina which, according to you, means I'm an inbred, mouth breathing Jethro just living the days between hunting seasons.
Right....I applied your methodology and utilized an ignorant stereotype of you. Why not? Works for you in your mind.
You don't know that, per the IRS, nearly 1/5th of all New Yorkers that relocated to North Carolina, South Carolina, Georgia and Florida in the last 10 years moved into Horry/Georgetown County.
As of the last census, nearly half of the population in my hometown relocated from cities north of the Mason/Dixon line.
So? Are you telling me you moved from New York to SC, or that you are from SC? And I thought you had lived in the Outer Banks, or am I confusing you with another inbred hillbilly?
I've never shot a gun, much less owned one. I don't watch Duck Dynasty because I don't believe in cable television, as it rots your mind. Anything I need to watch is on Netflix or very easily downloadable.
Swing and a miss, strike two. (you didn't mention strike 3)
As for height/weight/40 time...you can keep them. Fools place too much emphasis on them. Not that you use them; your analysis of a player only extends to "Did he play for a school in or around my area?" or "Do we have the same last name?"
And no, they weren't calling for a beer vendor...although that seems to be right up your son's alley.
You would be surprised at how scientific the brewing process is as many molecular or micro biologists work for breweries.
It was for an internship....a beer vending internship?
So you keep pretending that "knowing football" means Googling "who last kicked a left footed field goal in sub 40 degree temperatures while trailing by 13 points" and being content that our FO made "okay" moves.
Keep pretending that just because you played small college foosball that it means you know more about football. Some of the dumbest people about football are former players. The worst analyzers
For the record, I wasnt upset with the McFadden pick. He can be a solid cover corner for us. Horton's defense requires our corners to be on islands, often locked in man coverage in order to free up a blitzer. McFadden's strength lies in his man cover ability, as he was asked to do the same at SDSU.
My problem is that we picked him one to two rounds ahead of where we could have. That's where the failure lies.
And, again, and again, and again....you are simply substituting your opinion for those of the people that actually have the job.
Here is a clue for you: your opinion is worth no more than mine. Whether you played, whether you interned, whether you sell beer, dope, canned beans, timeshares. Whether you are from NY, SC, Ohio, or buttfuck Nairobi. Your opinion don't count. Not to the Browns, or the NFL or anyone. Including just about everyone on here.
Sorry, you are just going to have to deal with that. And unlike you, I at least recognize that my opinion carries no authority.
I can say: I would have liked to see the Browns pick up Grimes...and Goldson...and drafted Milliner and maybe Rambo or Thomas or whomever.
But, they didn't. So now I (and you) just have to live with the players they do have and deal with it.
I cannot indulge in self-flagellation over spilt milk
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And here is this: Guess who is #1:
At no point did I say Joe Haden wasn't a top 5 corner.
I understand that most of your attention span is now devoted to trying to rouse and maintain an erection, but at least try and remember what argument you're having and with who. Okay, grandpa?
It is interesting to see that you claim there weren't any good CBs available for us to get and then you link to an article that contains most of the corners I mentioned and excludes Sheldon Brown.
At no point did I say Joe Haden wasn't a top 5 corner.
I understand that most of your attention span is now devoted to trying to rouse and maintain an erection, but at least try and remember what argument you're having and with who. Okay, grandpa?
It is interesting to see that you claim there weren't any good CBs available for us to get and then you link to an article that contains most of the corners I mentioned and excludes Sheldon Brown.
And you are saying that devoting time to rouse and maintain an erection is not a good thing?
I mean, when people tell me to Get Fucked, my response is "I'd love to"
Don't get me wrong....I think Sheldon Brown was terrible. When I saw some places that said that he was like in the Top 5 available FA CBs I said: you must be kidding.
And that is my whole point.....every opinion has an asshole and every asshole has an opinion.
I would have liked to see this team do better with its secondary FA choices.
But, they didn't.
So, for me, I will merely hope that what moves they did make will turn out.
So, if you want to jump from the High Street Bridge over what moves they did not make, be my guest. I will carry on.
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Yep you really got us, you drafted a undersized safety with a history of having concussions. I'm guessing he will start for you game 1, I would be impressed if he makes it the whole season.
Troy Polamalu is only 5'10 and Sharmarko Thomas has a 41 inch vertical. Polamalu had a history of concussions and we've all seen how that turned out. They wouldn't have traded up to draft Thomas if they were worried about the concussions.
Zombo, your point is moot. You've had a pick in the top 10 for a better part of a decade. Mingo is still a unknown, you then list Thomas, Haden and Richardson. I'm also not worried. The Browns will still finish last in the division. You also listed a bunch of players previously that are getting long in the tooth but in each instance there is a young buck or two waiting in the wings. The Steelers draft each April with that in mind and it's worked pretty well. Browns fans year after year are hilariously delusional.
Troy Polamalu is only 5'10 and Sharmarko Thomas has a 41 inch vertical. Polamalu had a history of concussions and we've all seen how that turned out. They wouldn't have traded up to draft Thomas if they were worried about the concussions.
Zombo, your point is moot. You've had a pick in the top 10 for a better part of a decade. Mingo is still a unknown, you then list Thomas, Haden and Richardson. I'm also not worried. The Browns will still finish last in the division. You also listed a bunch of players previously that are getting long in the tooth but in each instance there is a young buck or two waiting in the wings. The Steelers draft each April with that in mind and it's worked pretty well. Browns fans year after year are hilariously delusional.
The Browns last 6 first round draft picks have been:
Barkevious Mingo
Trent Richardson
Phil Taylor
Joe Haden
Alex Mack
Joe Thomas
(edit note: forgot BW3...also a first rounder)
The Steelers last 6 draft picks have been:
Jarvis Jones
David DeCastro
Cameron Heyward
Maurkice Pouncey
Evander Hood
Rashard Mendenhall.
I don't know about anyone else, but under no circumstances would I trade even up the Browns choices for the Steelers choices.
And of course your retort will be: why have the Steelers won so much more than the Browns.
Simple....because, no doubt your "old" guys were undoubtedly a lot better than the Browns old guys.
Yea,
Santonio Holmes was better than Braylon Edwards
Heath Miller did turn out better than K2
Casey Hampton was better than Gerard Warren
Polamalu turned out better than Courtney Brown
BR turned out better thanBrady Quinn
and Steelers 2d and later round picks turned out better overall than Browns 2 round picks.
The Browns had beauties like Brian Robiskie, MoMass, David Veikune, Eric Wright, Brodney Pool, Sean Jones, Chaun Thompson, Andre Davis, Quincy Morgan.
I think though the Browns have done much better recently in the second round with guys like D'Qwell Jackson, TJ Ward, Jaball Sheard and Mitchell Scwartz.
Compare those to the like Marcus Gilbert, Jason Worlds, Limas Sweed, and Lamar Woodley, Steelers second rounders.
Personally I think the Browns recent first and second round talent acquisitions have been much better than the Steelers. (and, of course, they should be...given their positioning)
One thing the Steelers have had to go along with their talent however: far superior coaching.
Admittedly the Tomlin/Cowher/LeBeau "team" has far surpassed the likes of Pat Shurmur/Eric Mangini/Romeo Crennel.....no one could argue about that.
And, needless to say, this advantage has extended to the front office. At least, ownership for sure. And Holmgren was certainly a waste. But I think Tom Heckert did a fine job here....and is to some extent responsible for the edge in talent the Browns may maintain at this point.
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