Entire Browns Offense Preivew
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Nobody* is down on richardson - he's the #2 RB in the AFCN. Ray Rice had better years prior to 2013, but the ravens will not call his number as much now that they have Pierce as well. He used to get 300 carries and 70 catches.. last year he had 260/60 and that will probably decrease.
Nobody* has doubts about Little's hands -- he fixed that last year, if you bother to actually pay attention to how he performed. No question it was a problem in 2011, but his final 8 games (1 drop) were significantly different from the first 6 in 2012. Who led the AFCN in dropped passes in 2012? AJ Green.
Nobody* has doubts about Gordon's size/speed/route-running -- he's the #2WR in the AFCN behind Green, and well worth a second-round pick.
*Except skeptical, the self-appointed troll of this forum.
Nobody's down on richardson - he's the best RB in the AFCN.
Nobody has doubts about Little's hands -- he fixed that last year, if you bother to actually pay attention to how he performed. No question it was a problem in 2011, but his final 8 games were significantly different from the first 6 in 2012. Who led the AFCN in dropped passes in 2012? AJ Green.
Nobody has doubts about Gordon's size/speed/route-running -- he's the #2WR in the AFCN behind Green, and well worth a second-round pick.
Except skeptical, the self-appointed troll of this forum.
OK good, that's what I thought. Almost had to crack some metaphorical internet based skulls.
Although I'm not convinced Little's drops are behind him - a whole season of only dropping 2-3 passes and maybe we're beyond it, but for now it's difficult to say 100% it's dealt with.
But f*** me, I'm excited to see this team this year - a winning record isn't out of reach. Then Playoffs in 2014, and Superbowl winners by about 2017! Woo!
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Nobody's down on richardson - he's the best RB in the AFCN.
Nobody has doubts about Little's hands -- he fixed that last year, if you bother to actually pay attention to how he performed. No question it was a problem in 2011, but his final 8 games were significantly different from the first 6 in 2012. Who led the AFCN in dropped passes in 2012? AJ Green.
Nobody has doubts about Gordon's size/speed/route-running -- he's the #2WR in the AFCN behind Green, and well worth a second-round pick.
Except skeptical, the self-appointed troll of this forum.
OK good, that's what I thought. Almost had to crack some metaphorical internet based skulls.
Although I'm not convinced Little's drops are behind him - a whole season of only dropping 2-3 passes and maybe we're beyond it, but for now it's difficult to say 100% it's dealt with.
But f*** me, I'm excited to see this team this year - a winning record isn't out of reach. Then Playoffs in 2014, and Superbowl winners by about 2017! Woo!
whole season of only dropping 2-3 passes
Set realistic expectations.. that's neither possible nor probable because not every stat will have a baseline of zero. Gordon had 5 last year even with limited playing time the first 6 wks of the year, Torrey Smith had 4 for the ratbirds. I'd say 4,5 for Little would be reasonable.
I don't want to see Marecic with 4 dropped passes again.. he should have 0 because he shouldn't get playing time.
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whole season of only dropping 2-3 passes
Set realistic expectations.. that's neither possible nor probable because not every stat will have a baseline of zero. Gordon had 5 last year even with limited playing time the first 6 wks of the year, Torrey Smith had 4 for the ratbirds. I'd say 4,5 for Little would be reasonable.
I don't want to see Marecic with 4 dropped passes again.. he should have 0 because he shouldn't get playing time.
Set realistic expectations.. that's neither possible nor probable because not every stat will have a baseline of zero. Gordon had 5 last year even with limited playing time the first 6 wks of the year, Torrey Smith had 4 for the ratbirds. I'd say 4,5 for Little would be reasonable.
I don't want to see Marecic with 4 dropped passes again.. he should have 0 because he shouldn't get playing time.
Fair enough, I'll go with that. Less than 6 and we can call it a day on the drops count. Just make sure they're not touchdown-missing, game-losing drops, eh, Josh?
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Nobody* is down on richardson - he's the #2 RB in the AFCN. Ray Rice had better years prior to 2013, but the ravens will not call his number as much now that they have Pierce as well. He used to get 300 carries and 70 catches.. last year he had 260/60 and that will probably decrease.
Nobody* has doubts about Little's hands -- he fixed that last year, if you bother to actually pay attention to how he performed. No question it was a problem in 2011, but his final 8 games (1 drop) were significantly different from the first 6 in 2012. Who led the AFCN in dropped passes in 2012? AJ Green.
Nobody* has doubts about Gordon's size/speed/route-running -- he's the #2WR in the AFCN behind Green, and well worth a second-round pick.
*Except skeptical, the self-appointed troll of this forum.
Nobody* is down on richardson - he's the #2 RB in the AFCN. Ray Rice had better years prior to 2013, but the ravens will not call his number as much now that they have Pierce as well. He used to get 300 carries and 70 catches.. last year he had 260/60 and that will probably decrease.
Nobody* has doubts about Little's hands -- he fixed that last year, if you bother to actually pay attention to how he performed. No question it was a problem in 2011, but his final 8 games (1 drop) were significantly different from the first 6 in 2012. Who led the AFCN in dropped passes in 2012? AJ Green.
Nobody* has doubts about Gordon's size/speed/route-running -- he's the #2WR in the AFCN behind Green, and well worth a second-round pick.
*Except skeptical, the self-appointed troll of this forum.
My prediction: Little's dropsy problem will re-surface more than people think in 2013.
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Nobody* is down on richardson - he's the #2 RB in the AFCN. Ray Rice had better years prior to 2013, but the ravens will not call his number as much now that they have Pierce as well. He used to get 300 carries and 70 catches.. last year he had 260/60 and that will probably decrease.
Nobody* has doubts about Little's hands -- he fixed that last year, if you bother to actually pay attention to how he performed. No question it was a problem in 2011, but his final 8 games (1 drop) were significantly different from the first 6 in 2012. Who led the AFCN in dropped passes in 2012? AJ Green.
Nobody* has doubts about Gordon's size/speed/route-running -- he's the #2WR in the AFCN behind Green, and well worth a second-round pick.
*Except skeptical, the self-appointed troll of this forum.
Nobody* is down on richardson - he's the #2 RB in the AFCN. Ray Rice had better years prior to 2013, but the ravens will not call his number as much now that they have Pierce as well. He used to get 300 carries and 70 catches.. last year he had 260/60 and that will probably decrease.
Nobody* has doubts about Little's hands -- he fixed that last year, if you bother to actually pay attention to how he performed. No question it was a problem in 2011, but his final 8 games (1 drop) were significantly different from the first 6 in 2012. Who led the AFCN in dropped passes in 2012? AJ Green.
Nobody* has doubts about Gordon's size/speed/route-running -- he's the #2WR in the AFCN behind Green, and well worth a second-round pick.
*Except skeptical, the self-appointed troll of this forum.
I have my opinions, but enjoy reading others, too. Gordon is not as good as Torey Smith of Baltimore right now, in my opinion, and the players, according to the NFL network top 100, rate Jacoby Jones one of the best in pro football (ranked #83 best NFL player according to the vote by the players). So far they have unveiled players 60-100 on the top 100 so we will see if Gordon makes the list. I doubt it at this point. Chance for Smith to make it.
Gordon has potential but as we enter the 2013 season I see Green, Smith and Jones ahead of him and Sanders and Brown in Pittsburgh are about even with him. Maybe he can achieve some separation from them (pun intended) in 2013! It would help Gordon if his QB improves!
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Nobody* is down on richardson - he's the #2 RB in the AFCN. Ray Rice had better years prior to 2013, but the ravens will not call his number as much now that they have Pierce as well. He used to get 300 carries and 70 catches.. last year he had 260/60 and that will probably decrease.
Nobody* has doubts about Little's hands -- he fixed that last year, if you bother to actually pay attention to how he performed. No question it was a problem in 2011, but his final 8 games (1 drop) were significantly different from the first 6 in 2012. Who led the AFCN in dropped passes in 2012? AJ Green.
Nobody* has doubts about Gordon's size/speed/route-running -- he's the #2WR in the AFCN behind Green, and well worth a second-round pick.
*Except skeptical, the self-appointed troll of this forum.
I have my opinions, but enjoy reading others, too. Gordon is not as good as Torey Smith of Baltimore right now, in my opinion, and the players, according to the NFL network top 100, rate Jacoby Jones one of the best in pro football (ranked #83 best NFL player according to the vote by the players). So far they have unveiled players 60-100 on the top 100 so we will see if Gordon makes the list. I doubt it at this point. Chance for Smith to make it.
Gordon has potential but as we enter the 2013 season I see Green, Smith and Jones ahead of him and Sanders and Brown in Pittsburgh are about even with him. Maybe he can achieve some separation from them (pun intended) in 2013! It would help Gordon if his QB improves!
Skeptical2013 said:
I have my opinions, but enjoy reading others, too. Gordon is not as good as Torey Smith of Baltimore right now, in my opinion, and the players, according to the NFL network top 100, rate Jacoby Jones one of the best in pro football (ranked #83 best NFL player according to the vote by the players). So far they have unveiled players 60-100 on the top 100 so we will see if Gordon makes the list. I doubt it at this point. Chance for Smith to make it.
Gordon has potential but as we enter the 2013 season I see Green, Smith and Jones ahead of him and Sanders and Brown in Pittsburgh are about even with him. Maybe he can achieve some separation from them (pun intended) in 2013! It would help Gordon if his QB improves!
Well I could care less about making a player list. Its fun to talk about but not necessarily accurate. For example, Jones has been in the league a long time and played against most teams and played for the SB champ. Gordon is a rookie, by most accounts the best rookie WR last yr and played on a bad team. Yet his rookie year is better than anything Jacoby Jones has put up in his career for the most part. So not accurate. I agree the Green and Smith are better, they also have an extra yr under their belt. Green is already one of the top WRs in the NFL so not sure Gordon will match that, but he should improve this season. Jacoby Jones isn't better than Gordon.
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Here's what I'll say about the Browns offense:
1. John Greco was the "secret superstar" of the Browns, 5th rated run blocking guard in the league, per Football Outsiders. That's why he's getting a good look at RG.
2. Watch for some "12" formations (like New England) with David Nelson as the other slot TE opposite Jordan Cameron (Little and Gordon outside). Serious matchup nightmares.
3. Davone Bess was a simply brilliant pickup. The dependable slot receiver is a staple of a lot of terrific teams. I swear, if he were white and played at Texas Tech, he'd be a very rich man right now!!
4. That predictable, old school WCO was really ugly. Eager to see two great offensive minds come together as CHORV. Should be fun, if nothing else. We will be chucking the rock.
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Greco was the 65th overall pick in 2008 - he just wasn't liked by the Rams staff. Good pickup, signed for $800k in 2013
Bademosi is now at FS behind Gipson.. but Horton's quote about that "It’s athletic men playing. We are trying to let athletic men find a place to play" makes more sense. The best 4 DB's will play = that's awesome
I'm glad to hear that Sheard is doing great at OLB in Horton's scheme.
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Nobody* is down on richardson - he's the #2 RB in the AFCN. Ray Rice had better years prior to 2013, but the ravens will not call his number as much now that they have Pierce as well. He used to get 300 carries and 70 catches.. last year he had 260/60 and that will probably decrease.
Nobody* has doubts about Little's hands -- he fixed that last year, if you bother to actually pay attention to how he performed. No question it was a problem in 2011, but his final 8 games (1 drop) were significantly different from the first 6 in 2012. Who led the AFCN in dropped passes in 2012? AJ Green.
Nobody* has doubts about Gordon's size/speed/route-running -- he's the #2WR in the AFCN behind Green, and well worth a second-round pick.
*Except skeptical, the self-appointed troll of this forum.
Nobody* is down on richardson - he's the #2 RB in the AFCN. Ray Rice had better years prior to 2013, but the ravens will not call his number as much now that they have Pierce as well. He used to get 300 carries and 70 catches.. last year he had 260/60 and that will probably decrease.
Nobody* has doubts about Little's hands -- he fixed that last year, if you bother to actually pay attention to how he performed. No question it was a problem in 2011, but his final 8 games (1 drop) were significantly different from the first 6 in 2012. Who led the AFCN in dropped passes in 2012? AJ Green.
Nobody* has doubts about Gordon's size/speed/route-running -- he's the #2WR in the AFCN behind Green, and well worth a second-round pick.
*Except skeptical, the self-appointed troll of this forum.
uh, yeah....what???
your opinions are valid and you are a browns fan.....i think?!?
so how are you a troll???
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Greco was the 65th overall pick in 2008 - he just wasn't liked by the Rams staff. Good pickup, signed for $800k in 2013
Bademosi is now at FS behind Gipson.. but Horton's quote about that "It’s athletic men playing. We are trying to let athletic men find a place to play" makes more sense. The best 4 DB's will play = that's awesome
I'm glad to hear that Sheard is doing great at OLB in Horton's scheme.
Greco was the 65th overall pick in 2008 - he just wasn't liked by the Rams staff. Good pickup, signed for $800k in 2013
Bademosi is now at FS behind Gipson.. but Horton's quote about that "It’s athletic men playing. We are trying to let athletic men find a place to play" makes more sense. The best 4 DB's will play = that's awesome
I'm glad to hear that Sheard is doing great at OLB in Horton's scheme.
Yes, players look great out there in their shorts this time of the year -- no contact, nothing rally on the line. I do hope Sheard makes it. He's got some game in my view.
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Here's what I'll say about the Browns offense:
1. John Greco was the "secret superstar" of the Browns, 5th rated run blocking guard in the league, per Football Outsiders. That's why he's getting a good look at RG.
2. Watch for some "12" formations (like New England) with David Nelson as the other slot TE opposite Jordan Cameron (Little and Gordon outside). Serious matchup nightmares.
3. Davone Bess was a simply brilliant pickup. The dependable slot receiver is a staple of a lot of terrific teams. I swear, if he were white and played at Texas Tech, he'd be a very rich man right now!!
4. That predictable, old school WCO was really ugly. Eager to see two great offensive minds come together as CHORV. Should be fun, if nothing else. We will be chucking the rock.
Here's what I'll say about the Browns offense:
1. John Greco was the "secret superstar" of the Browns, 5th rated run blocking guard in the league, per Football Outsiders. That's why he's getting a good look at RG.
2. Watch for some "12" formations (like New England) with David Nelson as the other slot TE opposite Jordan Cameron (Little and Gordon outside). Serious matchup nightmares.
3. Davone Bess was a simply brilliant pickup. The dependable slot receiver is a staple of a lot of terrific teams. I swear, if he were white and played at Texas Tech, he'd be a very rich man right now!!
4. That predictable, old school WCO was really ugly. Eager to see two great offensive minds come together as CHORV. Should be fun, if nothing else. We will be chucking the rock.
That 12 formation sounds like a wonderful idea for Nelson. Terry Pluto said Bess looked fanatstic at practice. Over time, the Browns will have to find a way to get Chris Faulk in the lineup on the OL, maybe at guard.
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Skeptical2013 said:
I have my opinions, but enjoy reading others, too. Gordon is not as good as Torey Smith of Baltimore right now, in my opinion, and the players, according to the NFL network top 100, rate Jacoby Jones one of the best in pro football (ranked #83 best NFL player according to the vote by the players). So far they have unveiled players 60-100 on the top 100 so we will see if Gordon makes the list. I doubt it at this point. Chance for Smith to make it.
Gordon has potential but as we enter the 2013 season I see Green, Smith and Jones ahead of him and Sanders and Brown in Pittsburgh are about even with him. Maybe he can achieve some separation from them (pun intended) in 2013! It would help Gordon if his QB improves!
Well I could care less about making a player list. Its fun to talk about but not necessarily accurate. For example, Jones has been in the league a long time and played against most teams and played for the SB champ. Gordon is a rookie, by most accounts the best rookie WR last yr and played on a bad team. Yet his rookie year is better than anything Jacoby Jones has put up in his career for the most part. So not accurate. I agree the Green and Smith are better, they also have an extra yr under their belt. Green is already one of the top WRs in the NFL so not sure Gordon will match that, but he should improve this season. Jacoby Jones isn't better than Gordon.
Well I could care less about making a player list. Its fun to talk about but not necessarily accurate. For example, Jones has been in the league a long time and played against most teams and played for the SB champ. Gordon is a rookie, by most accounts the best rookie WR last yr and played on a bad team. Yet his rookie year is better than anything Jacoby Jones has put up in his career for the most part. So not accurate. I agree the Green and Smith are better, they also have an extra yr under their belt. Green is already one of the top WRs in the NFL so not sure Gordon will match that, but he should improve this season. Jacoby Jones isn't better than Gordon.
Jacoby Jones made the pro bowl squad last year and became the first player in SB history to both run back a kick for a TD and to catch a receiving TD. That's quite an accomplishment in the Big Game as the guy showed he can get it done with the most on the line. Does Josh Gordon have this kind of accomplishment on his resume? Ah, no. Right now Jones is the better receiver. Maybe in a year or two Gordon will be better, but Gordon needs to run patterns better and work on his separation from DBs. Gordon lacks elite speed. That hurts him.
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Nobody* is down on richardson - he's the #2 RB in the AFCN. Ray Rice had better years prior to 2013, but the ravens will not call his number as much now that they have Pierce as well. He used to get 300 carries and 70 catches.. last year he had 260/60 and that will probably decrease.
Nobody* has doubts about Little's hands -- he fixed that last year, if you bother to actually pay attention to how he performed. No question it was a problem in 2011, but his final 8 games (1 drop) were significantly different from the first 6 in 2012. Who led the AFCN in dropped passes in 2012? AJ Green.
Nobody* has doubts about Gordon's size/speed/route-running -- he's the #2WR in the AFCN behind Green, and well worth a second-round pick.
*Except skeptical, the self-appointed troll of this forum.
I have my opinions, but enjoy reading others, too. Gordon is not as good as Torey Smith of Baltimore right now, in my opinion, and the players, according to the NFL network top 100, rate Jacoby Jones one of the best in pro football (ranked #83 best NFL player according to the vote by the players). So far they have unveiled players 60-100 on the top 100 so we will see if Gordon makes the list. I doubt it at this point. Chance for Smith to make it.
Gordon has potential but as we enter the 2013 season I see Green, Smith and Jones ahead of him and Sanders and Brown in Pittsburgh are about even with him. Maybe he can achieve some separation from them (pun intended) in 2013! It would help Gordon if his QB improves!
Skeptical2013 said:
I have my opinions, but enjoy reading others, too. Gordon is not as good as Torey Smith of Baltimore right now, in my opinion, and the players, according to the NFL network top 100, rate Jacoby Jones one of the best in pro football (ranked #83 best NFL player according to the vote by the players). So far they have unveiled players 60-100 on the top 100 so we will see if Gordon makes the list. I doubt it at this point. Chance for Smith to make it.
Gordon has potential but as we enter the 2013 season I see Green, Smith and Jones ahead of him and Sanders and Brown in Pittsburgh are about even with him. Maybe he can achieve some separation from them (pun intended) in 2013! It would help Gordon if his QB improves!
Josh Gordon 40 time prior to the Supplemental Draft: 4.52
Torey Smith 40 yard time athe Combine: 4.43.
Now, Gordon is probably better than 4.52 but he is not as fast as Smith. Lack of top line speed may hurt Gordon's ability to become a big time receiver. We'll see.
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Well I could care less about making a player list. Its fun to talk about but not necessarily accurate. For example, Jones has been in the league a long time and played against most teams and played for the SB champ. Gordon is a rookie, by most accounts the best rookie WR last yr and played on a bad team. Yet his rookie year is better than anything Jacoby Jones has put up in his career for the most part. So not accurate. I agree the Green and Smith are better, they also have an extra yr under their belt. Green is already one of the top WRs in the NFL so not sure Gordon will match that, but he should improve this season. Jacoby Jones isn't better than Gordon.
Jacoby Jones made the pro bowl squad last year and became the first player in SB history to both run back a kick for a TD and to catch a receiving TD. That's quite an accomplishment in the Big Game as the guy showed he can get it done with the most on the line. Does Josh Gordon have this kind of accomplishment on his resume? Ah, no. Right now Jones is the better receiver. Maybe in a year or two Gordon will be better, but Gordon needs to run patterns better and work on his separation from DBs. Gordon lacks elite speed. That hurts him.
Skeptical2013 said:
Jacoby Jones made the pro bowl squad last year and became the first player in SB history to both run back a kick for a TD and to catch a receiving TD. That's quite an accomplishment in the Big Game as the guy showed he can get it done with the most on the line. Does Josh Gordon have this kind of accomplishment on his resume? Ah, no. Right now Jones is the better receiver. Maybe in a year or two Gordon will be better, but Gordon needs to run patterns better and work on his separation from DBs. Gordon lacks elite speed. That hurts him.
It is always a question with these guys: how good are these #2 WR guys when the #1 guy leaves.
The Ravens lost Anquan Boldin...the heart and soul of that WR corps. How good will Smith and Jones be now that they have to step up.
Ask Steeler fans.....after Hines Ward retired it is their claim that Mike Wallace definitely shrank in stature and productivity. And several of them who post here say they were not sorry to see him go to greener pastures.
Smith and Jones can look good when they are not the focus of the defense....but what about now?
Sure, on paper it seems like they ought to become the team's star.....but that is paper.
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Skeptical2013 said:
Jacoby Jones made the pro bowl squad last year and became the first player in SB history to both run back a kick for a TD and to catch a receiving TD. That's quite an accomplishment in the Big Game as the guy showed he can get it done with the most on the line. Does Josh Gordon have this kind of accomplishment on his resume? Ah, no. Right now Jones is the better receiver. Maybe in a year or two Gordon will be better, but Gordon needs to run patterns better and work on his separation from DBs. Gordon lacks elite speed. That hurts him.
It is always a question with these guys: how good are these #2 WR guys when the #1 guy leaves.
The Ravens lost Anquan Boldin...the heart and soul of that WR corps. How good will Smith and Jones be now that they have to step up.
Ask Steeler fans.....after Hines Ward retired it is their claim that Mike Wallace definitely shrank in stature and productivity. And several of them who post here say they were not sorry to see him go to greener pastures.
Smith and Jones can look good when they are not the focus of the defense....but what about now?
Sure, on paper it seems like they ought to become the team's star.....but that is paper.
It is always a question with these guys: how good are these #2 WR guys when the #1 guy leaves.
The Ravens lost Anquan Boldin...the heart and soul of that WR corps. How good will Smith and Jones be now that they have to step up.
Ask Steeler fans.....after Hines Ward retired it is their claim that Mike Wallace definitely shrank in stature and productivity. And several of them who post here say they were not sorry to see him go to greener pastures.
Smith and Jones can look good when they are not the focus of the defense....but what about now?
Sure, on paper it seems like they ought to become the team's star.....but that is paper.
In the 2012 playoffs, Smith had 11 catches for a 21.2 average and caught 49 during the regular season good for 8TDs. in 2011,
he had 50 catches and 7 TDs. He'll have a good season in 2013. Smith is a little faster than Gordon.
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It is always a question with these guys: how good are these #2 WR guys when the #1 guy leaves.
The Ravens lost Anquan Boldin...the heart and soul of that WR corps. How good will Smith and Jones be now that they have to step up.
Ask Steeler fans.....after Hines Ward retired it is their claim that Mike Wallace definitely shrank in stature and productivity. And several of them who post here say they were not sorry to see him go to greener pastures.
Smith and Jones can look good when they are not the focus of the defense....but what about now?
Sure, on paper it seems like they ought to become the team's star.....but that is paper.
In the 2012 playoffs, Smith had 11 catches for a 21.2 average and caught 49 during the regular season good for 8TDs. in 2011,
he had 50 catches and 7 TDs. He'll have a good season in 2013. Smith is a little faster than Gordon.
Skeptical2013 said:
In the 2012 playoffs, Smith had 11 catches for a 21.2 average and caught 49 during the regular season good for 8TDs. in 2011,
he had 50 catches and 7 TDs. He'll have a good season in 2013. Smith is a little faster than Gordon.
Yes, and that offense had Anquan Boldin doing the heavy lifting. What were his playoff stats? Smith and Jone will not have the opposing defenses paying attention to the monster that was Boldin. They will have to stand on their own. Maybe they can, maybe they can't.
Speed alone doesn't make a great receiver.....see Boldin, not the fastest guy.
David Heyward-Bey would be the shit if that were so.
And Ronaldo Nehemiah would not have been a bust.
I am not saying that Smith and Jones won't be good....just that they will be much more tested....and will have to pass that test against much more difficult odds.
(one of those being the vast improved Cleveland Browns defensive backfield
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