What's wrong with Derek Carr?
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@mike-h said:
Pretty bad under pressure. Faced inferior competition. Not great in fourth quarter. Third of his passes were screens, a lot of his yardage was YAC. System QB.
After actually watching him, that's my take.
This. He looked pretty terrible against USC, the only team worth a squirt of piss that they played all year.
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Nothing is wrong with Derek Carr if we get Sammy Watkins.
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You don't draft a WR to make your QB position better. You actually draft the QB. Teams have tried... a lot, in fact. It's wagging the dog. The Browns won't be waiting for Garroppolo or Fales to draft their QB in a QB league. Not a prayer.
It's Manziel, Bridgewater, or Bortles. That's the discussion. No team with a clear-cut #1 WR is going to draft another in the top 5 unless his name is Matt Millen. That's absurd. You can't get a return on that investment from a #2 WR (especially with an All Pro TE taking a lot of looks, too).
Horrible idea.
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I still like Carr. He is a smart QB and is probably the purest pocket passer in the draft. He has prototypical size, and great touch on his passes. Needs to improve his footwork. He does get rattled in the pocket which reminds me of Weeden, so that is a major concern, but he is younger and can move around. I'd take him at 26 if he fell, but I'm pretty sure we'll be drafting Bridgewater or Bortles at 4, so it's probably a moot point...
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You don't draft a WR to make your QB position better. You actually draft the QB. Teams have tried... a lot, in fact. It's wagging the dog. The Browns won't be waiting for Garroppolo or Fales to draft their QB in a QB league. Not a prayer.
It's Manziel, Bridgewater, or Bortles. That's the discussion. No team with a clear-cut #1 WR is going to draft another in the top 5 unless his name is Matt Millen. That's absurd. You can't get a return on that investment from a #2 WR (especially with an All Pro TE taking a lot of looks, too).
Horrible idea.
You don't draft a WR to make your QB position better. You actually draft the QB. Teams have tried... a lot, in fact. It's wagging the dog. The Browns won't be waiting for Garroppolo or Fales to draft their QB in a QB league. Not a prayer.
It's Manziel, Bridgewater, or Bortles. That's the discussion. No team with a clear-cut #1 WR is going to draft another in the top 5 unless his name is Matt Millen. That's absurd. You can't get a return on that investment from a #2 WR (especially with an All Pro TE taking a lot of looks, too).
Horrible idea.
dude i can't give you anymore slack. you are just one god-awful QB loving queef.
QB/passing league. really?
put up the stats right now with the teams left in the playoffs and how they won that you can say that this is a QB pass-happy league.
show me. show me right now!
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You don't draft a WR to make your QB position better. You actually draft the QB. Teams have tried... a lot, in fact. It's wagging the dog. The Browns won't be waiting for Garroppolo or Fales to draft their QB in a QB league. Not a prayer.
It's Manziel, Bridgewater, or Bortles. That's the discussion. No team with a clear-cut #1 WR is going to draft another in the top 5 unless his name is Matt Millen. That's absurd. You can't get a return on that investment from a #2 WR (especially with an All Pro TE taking a lot of looks, too).
Horrible idea.
You don't draft a WR to make your QB position better. You actually draft the QB. Teams have tried... a lot, in fact. It's wagging the dog. The Browns won't be waiting for Garroppolo or Fales to draft their QB in a QB league. Not a prayer.
It's Manziel, Bridgewater, or Bortles. That's the discussion. No team with a clear-cut #1 WR is going to draft another in the top 5 unless his name is Matt Millen. That's absurd. You can't get a return on that investment from a #2 WR (especially with an All Pro TE taking a lot of looks, too).
Horrible idea.
you do know that Gordon is one mistake away from a year suspension. watkins would be the insurance policy for that doomsday scenario.
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I don't think there's any rules against having more than one good receiver.
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I was curious enough to look, as the Broncos stick out in my mind that they are only in the final four due to offense (i.e. P Manning). Just touching the surface of stats, we have:
Broncos rated #1 overall offense, by YPG for the regular season (#1 in passing YPG): http://www.nfl.com/stats/team?seasonId=2013&seasonType=REG&Submit=Go
P Manning threw 300+ yds for all games in the regular season but two (but still well past the 250+ mark). One of those they lost to Chargers 20-27, the other was a win against the Raiders, 34-14. The Broncos scored 30+ points in all their games except three. Two against Rivers and the Chargers, in which one they won 28-20 and the other they lost 20-27. The third game under 30 points was their win against the Chiefs 27-17.
They only lost three games. Aside from the Chargers game I mentioned above, the two other games were against Luck and the Colts, 33-39 and Brady and the Patriots, 31-34. http://www.nfl.com/teams/schedule?team=DEN
Yet they are nowhere to be found in the top 5 defenses this year in the regular season. They never held a team to single digit scores this season. Not one. And only four games did they hold their opponents to less than 20.
When we get to postseason, things change some. But they did only play one game as they had a bye. They are #1 overall in defense YPG (#4 in passing and #1 in rushing YPG): http://www.nfl.com/stats/team?seasonId=2013&seasonType=POST&Submit=Go
Interestingly they are not in the top 5 for offense at all in the postseason. Again this is only one game, vs the Chargers, which they won 24-17 and Peyton threw for under 300 yards again, at 230 total, his lowest for the entire season.
Ok I've run out of time to look up the other three right now, but this one I think is going to be the unique one where strong offense has clearly gotten the Broncos where they are today. IMO: what this means is you need a Peyton Fucking Manning caliber QB if you want to get far on the offense side of the ball and with average to less-than-elite defense at best. And probably none of the QBs coming out of this draft are going to be the next P Manning.
The remaining final four teams I believe the findings will be this in a nutshell:
Patriots: Tom Brady/Bill Belichick, 'nuff said. Their offense nor defense is listed as a top 5 by YPG in regular season. Postseason they are #5 overall offense and #1 in rushing offense YPG.
49ers/Seahawks: Defense defense defense. Seahawks #1 overall D and #1 in passing D YPG. 49ers are #5 overall and #4 in rushing D YPG.
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One more thing I noticed, in regards to top DEF's. Panthers, Bengals, and Saints are the other teams in the top 5. So why are they out already?
Bengals lost in playoffs because you still have to have a servicable offense/QB at minimum. Dalton is not even that.
Saints D is up there thanks to Rob Ryan, and Brees is obviously elite but couldn't get past the Seahawks crazy good D.
Panthers, I think, it's probably because Cam Newton is still young and learning. And they got knocked out by a solid 49er defense.
I heard Kaepernick has been struggling all season but I've not looked up his stats yet to see what's going on. So again a solid D is probably to thank for where they are today. (That and good 'ol Phil. Lol.)
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I was curious enough to look, as the Broncos stick out in my mind that they are only in the final four due to offense (i.e. P Manning). Just touching the surface of stats, we have:
Broncos rated #1 overall offense, by YPG for the regular season (#1 in passing YPG): http://www.nfl.com/stats/team?seasonId=2013&seasonType=REG&Submit=Go
P Manning threw 300+ yds for all games in the regular season but two (but still well past the 250+ mark). One of those they lost to Chargers 20-27, the other was a win against the Raiders, 34-14. The Broncos scored 30+ points in all their games except three. Two against Rivers and the Chargers, in which one they won 28-20 and the other they lost 20-27. The third game under 30 points was their win against the Chiefs 27-17.
They only lost three games. Aside from the Chargers game I mentioned above, the two other games were against Luck and the Colts, 33-39 and Brady and the Patriots, 31-34. http://www.nfl.com/teams/schedule?team=DEN
Yet they are nowhere to be found in the top 5 defenses this year in the regular season. They never held a team to single digit scores this season. Not one. And only four games did they hold their opponents to less than 20.
When we get to postseason, things change some. But they did only play one game as they had a bye. They are #1 overall in defense YPG (#4 in passing and #1 in rushing YPG): http://www.nfl.com/stats/team?seasonId=2013&seasonType=POST&Submit=Go
Interestingly they are not in the top 5 for offense at all in the postseason. Again this is only one game, vs the Chargers, which they won 24-17 and Peyton threw for under 300 yards again, at 230 total, his lowest for the entire season.
Ok I've run out of time to look up the other three right now, but this one I think is going to be the unique one where strong offense has clearly gotten the Broncos where they are today. IMO: what this means is you need a Peyton Fucking Manning caliber QB if you want to get far on the offense side of the ball and with average to less-than-elite defense at best. And probably none of the QBs coming out of this draft are going to be the next P Manning.
The remaining final four teams I believe the findings will be this in a nutshell:
Patriots: Tom Brady/Bill Belichick, 'nuff said. Their offense nor defense is listed as a top 5 by YPG in regular season. Postseason they are #5 overall offense and #1 in rushing offense YPG.
49ers/Seahawks: Defense defense defense. Seahawks #1 overall D and #1 in passing D YPG. 49ers are #5 overall and #4 in rushing D YPG.
Ok I've run out of time to look up the other three right now, but this one I think is going to be the unique one where strong offense has clearly gotten the Broncos where they are today. IMO: what this means is you need a Peyton Fucking Manning caliber QB if you want to get far on the offense side of the ball and with average to less-than-elite defense at best. And probably none of the QBs coming out of this draft are going to be the next P Manning.
thank you.
and yes people can run around and throw for 1k yds every game. come to cleveland or seattle w/o a running game in january and see how far you go.
and yes DEFENSES WIN CHAMPIONSHIPS you stoopid muther fuckers.
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You don't draft a WR to make your QB position better. You actually draft the QB. Teams have tried... a lot, in fact. It's wagging the dog. The Browns won't be waiting for Garroppolo or Fales to draft their QB in a QB league. Not a prayer.
It's Manziel, Bridgewater, or Bortles. That's the discussion. No team with a clear-cut #1 WR is going to draft another in the top 5 unless his name is Matt Millen. That's absurd. You can't get a return on that investment from a #2 WR (especially with an All Pro TE taking a lot of looks, too).
Horrible idea.
dude i can't give you anymore slack. you are just one god-awful QB loving queef.
QB/passing league. really?
put up the stats right now with the teams left in the playoffs and how they won that you can say that this is a QB pass-happy league.
show me. show me right now!
dude i can't give you anymore slack. you are just one god-awful QB loving queef.
QB/passing league. really?
put up the stats right now with the teams left in the playoffs and how they won that you can say that this is a QB pass-happy league.
show me. show me right now!
Here are stats... not sure what they mean...
Of the 12 teams that made the playoffs...
12 out of 12 ranked in the top 16 in "Team Passer Rating" (4 out of 4 remaining, obviously)
11 of the 12 ranked in the top 16 in Points Per Game on offense (4 out of 4 remaining, all top 11)
9 of the 12 ranked in the top 16 in Points allowed Per game on defense (3 out of 4 remaining)
7 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Passing yards per game" (2 out of remaining 4)
10 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Passing TDs" (3 out of 4 remaining)
9 of the 12 ranked in the top 16 in "Yards per pass attempt" (3 out of 4 remaining)
9 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Rushing Yards per Game" (4 out of 4 remaining)
10 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Rusing TDs" (4 out of 4 remaining)
8 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Rusing Yards per attempt" (3 out of 4 remaining)
Looks to me like QB efficiency, balance on offense, and scoring points are key... wow, what a concept... unfortunately the Browns did none of those 3 things last year...
#Justsayin' -
dude i can't give you anymore slack. you are just one god-awful QB loving queef.
QB/passing league. really?
put up the stats right now with the teams left in the playoffs and how they won that you can say that this is a QB pass-happy league.
show me. show me right now!
Here are stats... not sure what they mean...
Of the 12 teams that made the playoffs...
12 out of 12 ranked in the top 16 in "Team Passer Rating" (4 out of 4 remaining, obviously)
11 of the 12 ranked in the top 16 in Points Per Game on offense (4 out of 4 remaining, all top 11)
9 of the 12 ranked in the top 16 in Points allowed Per game on defense (3 out of 4 remaining)
7 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Passing yards per game" (2 out of remaining 4)
10 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Passing TDs" (3 out of 4 remaining)
9 of the 12 ranked in the top 16 in "Yards per pass attempt" (3 out of 4 remaining)
9 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Rushing Yards per Game" (4 out of 4 remaining)
10 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Rusing TDs" (4 out of 4 remaining)
8 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Rusing Yards per attempt" (3 out of 4 remaining)
Looks to me like QB efficiency, balance on offense, and scoring points are key... wow, what a concept... unfortunately the Browns did none of those 3 things last year...
Here are stats... not sure what they mean...
Of the 12 teams that made the playoffs...
12 out of 12 ranked in the top 16 in "Team Passer Rating" (4 out of 4 remaining, obviously)
11 of the 12 ranked in the top 16 in Points Per Game on offense (4 out of 4 remaining, all top 11)
9 of the 12 ranked in the top 16 in Points allowed Per game on defense (3 out of 4 remaining)
7 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Passing yards per game" (2 out of remaining 4)
10 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Passing TDs" (3 out of 4 remaining)
9 of the 12 ranked in the top 16 in "Yards per pass attempt" (3 out of 4 remaining)
9 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Rushing Yards per Game" (4 out of 4 remaining)
10 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Rusing TDs" (4 out of 4 remaining)
8 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Rusing Yards per attempt" (3 out of 4 remaining)
Looks to me like QB efficiency, balance on offense, and scoring points are key... wow, what a concept... unfortunately the Browns did none of those 3 things last year...
thanks for putting that together.
yes of course you need to be able to throw the ball and that's fine and dandy in oct and nov but when you got homefield advantage on a LAKE where the winds are whipping up to 40mph gusts and the snow is falling sideways......you better have a running game.
and the stats that i was talking about is what these last four teams did in their last playoff games in rushing vs. passing to win. those are the stats i want to see.
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You need to throw the ball to make the playoffs. Then you have 12 great passing teams that throw the ball very well and the best/hottest defense wins out.
Z
Zombo said:
You need to throw the ball to make the playoffs. Then you have 12 great passing teams that throw the ball very well and the best/hottest defense wins out.
Z
the best BALANCED offense with a great defense.
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Zombo said:
You need to throw the ball to make the playoffs. Then you have 12 great passing teams that throw the ball very well and the best/hottest defense wins out.
Z
the best BALANCED offense with a great defense.
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Here are stats... not sure what they mean...
Of the 12 teams that made the playoffs...
12 out of 12 ranked in the top 16 in "Team Passer Rating" (4 out of 4 remaining, obviously)
11 of the 12 ranked in the top 16 in Points Per Game on offense (4 out of 4 remaining, all top 11)
9 of the 12 ranked in the top 16 in Points allowed Per game on defense (3 out of 4 remaining)
7 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Passing yards per game" (2 out of remaining 4)
10 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Passing TDs" (3 out of 4 remaining)
9 of the 12 ranked in the top 16 in "Yards per pass attempt" (3 out of 4 remaining)
9 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Rushing Yards per Game" (4 out of 4 remaining)
10 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Rusing TDs" (4 out of 4 remaining)
8 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Rusing Yards per attempt" (3 out of 4 remaining)
Looks to me like QB efficiency, balance on offense, and scoring points are key... wow, what a concept... unfortunately the Browns did none of those 3 things last year...
thanks for putting that together.
yes of course you need to be able to throw the ball and that's fine and dandy in oct and nov but when you got homefield advantage on a LAKE where the winds are whipping up to 40mph gusts and the snow is falling sideways......you better have a running game.
and the stats that i was talking about is what these last four teams did in their last playoff games in rushing vs. passing to win. those are the stats i want to see.
thanks for putting that together.
yes of course you need to be able to throw the ball and that's fine and dandy in oct and nov but when you got homefield advantage on a LAKE where the winds are whipping up to 40mph gusts and the snow is falling sideways......you better have a running game.
and the stats that i was talking about is what these last four teams did in their last playoff games in rushing vs. passing to win. those are the stats i want to see.
The post-season is different b/c it is so based on match ups and game planning, but here we go...
New England - Facing a team with 42 sacks during the season, and giving up only 232 passing yds/game, they decided to exploit the #26 ranked run D. They started on the ground and stayed on the ground for 234 yds and 6 TDs, so they only needed 198 yds from Brady to shut it down... That plan worked out very well as they dominated in TOP 35min - 25min. Combine that with 4 INTs on D, and you got yourself an easy W
Denver - Controlled the clock. Combination of rushing for 133 yds and 1 TD, throwing for 230 and 2 TDs, 26 first downs including 9/13 on 3rd down. Denver played the ultimate balanced offense the entire game, taking advantage of what the D was giving them and moving the chains while calling a 36:34 pass:run ratio throughout the game. Their game plan led to a TOP domination of 35:30 - 24:30. San Diego finished 29th against the pass during the season, which Manning was able to exploit the entire game.
Seattle - Being "outeverythinged" except rushing yds where they were able to rush for 174 yds and 2 TDs, and only threw for 103 yds. The D was able to force the Saints to be one-dimensional where they called a 44:26 pass to run ratio. Brees had a good game going for 309 and 1 TD, but needed an excellent game, and more balanced play calling to pull this one off.
San Francisco - They beat GB by rushing 30 times for 167 yds and 1 TD. I doubt it was Kaep's passing game, 227 yds, 1 TD, and 1 INT, that won this one. Against, Carolina it was pure D, forcing 2 turnovers and getting 3 redzone stops. They finished that game passing for 196 and 1 TD while rushing for 126 and 1 TD.
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Here are stats... not sure what they mean...
Of the 12 teams that made the playoffs...
12 out of 12 ranked in the top 16 in "Team Passer Rating" (4 out of 4 remaining, obviously)
11 of the 12 ranked in the top 16 in Points Per Game on offense (4 out of 4 remaining, all top 11)
9 of the 12 ranked in the top 16 in Points allowed Per game on defense (3 out of 4 remaining)
7 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Passing yards per game" (2 out of remaining 4)
10 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Passing TDs" (3 out of 4 remaining)
9 of the 12 ranked in the top 16 in "Yards per pass attempt" (3 out of 4 remaining)
9 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Rushing Yards per Game" (4 out of 4 remaining)
10 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Rusing TDs" (4 out of 4 remaining)
8 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Rusing Yards per attempt" (3 out of 4 remaining)
Looks to me like QB efficiency, balance on offense, and scoring points are key... wow, what a concept... unfortunately the Browns did none of those 3 things last year...
thanks for putting that together.
yes of course you need to be able to throw the ball and that's fine and dandy in oct and nov but when you got homefield advantage on a LAKE where the winds are whipping up to 40mph gusts and the snow is falling sideways......you better have a running game.
and the stats that i was talking about is what these last four teams did in their last playoff games in rushing vs. passing to win. those are the stats i want to see.
thanks for putting that together.
yes of course you need to be able to throw the ball and that's fine and dandy in oct and nov but when you got homefield advantage on a LAKE where the winds are whipping up to 40mph gusts and the snow is falling sideways......you better have a running game.
and the stats that i was talking about is what these last four teams did in their last playoff games in rushing vs. passing to win. those are the stats i want to see.
Yes. The stats from one game on the season outweigh the season averages. How could be so blind?
Considering as a Super Bowl will never be played in Cleveland and getting home field advantage throughout the playoffs is something the Browns haven't done in 28 years, I think worrying about how a QB plays in Cleveland in January is putting the cart before the horse.
How about we focus on making it to the postseason before we start worrying about how well our QB plays at home in January?
I swear, it's like some of you don't even want to see the Browns win.
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Spot on^
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dude i can't give you anymore slack. you are just one god-awful QB loving queef.
QB/passing league. really?
put up the stats right now with the teams left in the playoffs and how they won that you can say that this is a QB pass-happy league.
show me. show me right now!
Here are stats... not sure what they mean...
Of the 12 teams that made the playoffs...
12 out of 12 ranked in the top 16 in "Team Passer Rating" (4 out of 4 remaining, obviously)
11 of the 12 ranked in the top 16 in Points Per Game on offense (4 out of 4 remaining, all top 11)
9 of the 12 ranked in the top 16 in Points allowed Per game on defense (3 out of 4 remaining)
7 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Passing yards per game" (2 out of remaining 4)
10 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Passing TDs" (3 out of 4 remaining)
9 of the 12 ranked in the top 16 in "Yards per pass attempt" (3 out of 4 remaining)
9 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Rushing Yards per Game" (4 out of 4 remaining)
10 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Rusing TDs" (4 out of 4 remaining)
8 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Rusing Yards per attempt" (3 out of 4 remaining)
Looks to me like QB efficiency, balance on offense, and scoring points are key... wow, what a concept... unfortunately the Browns did none of those 3 things last year...
Just for fun... or torture...
Of the 12 teams that made the playoffs...
12 out of 12 ranked in the top 16 in "Team Passer Rating" Browns ranked 25th
11 of the 12 ranked in the top 16 in Points Per Game on offense Browns ranked 27th
9 of the 12 ranked in the top 16 in Points allowed Per game on defense Browns ranked 23rd
7 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Passing yards per game" Browns ranked 11th
10 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Passing TDs" Browns ranked 11th
9 of the 12 ranked in the top 16 in "Yards per pass attempt" Browns ranked 29th
9 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Rushing Yards per Game" Browns ranked 27th
10 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Rusing TDs" Browns ranked 32nd
8 of the 12 teams ranked in the top 16 in "Team Rushing Yards per attempt" Browns ranked 23rd
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