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Jonathan Paul Manziel

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  • Really, not being on board with Manziel from the gitgo....

    but he's a kid. Full of himself a bit outrageously, But he has

    that love for the game, I don't see him as a prick, I see him

    brash and intense about football. And immature.

    But not so immature that he doesn't get it. He's growing up

    all the time. The difference in manner with JF falling out of the

    top ten, vs others, like Quinn...is huge. JF is a classy guy.

    Give him a year, and he'll be the first one to admit he was just

    a kid, but he's grown now.

    I think he has all the skills to succeed. Maybe the only chance

    he won't succeed is maturity, because he has "it", and exceptional skills.

    Tall, cannon armed doofuses haven't worked, except in pukesburg's case..

    but they can have a Hoyer, and two younger, rookie qbs who can also move,

    have that fire and intelligence for the game, can make things happen on the field...

    JF's time will come. But it's a very big playbook and a whole new level of football.

    In Hoyer I trust. Til later on, like at least one season.

    Although, if the Browns are beating the squeelers 51-0 again...I'd say put

    JF in for a few plays....

  • JAFBFJ JAFBF

    Bne1zKeCYAEnchq.jpg

    @jafbf said:

    Bne1zKeCYAEnchq.jpg

    As a promo, and for a laugh it wouldn't surprise me to see Johnny come out in the Brownie Elf costume some time. Probably at an event geared for kids.

  • gftChrisG gftChris

    Something I don't really get to experience, btw, is there a divide between college fans and NFL fans? Big rivalry etc?

    @gftchris said:

    Something I don't really get to experience, btw, is there a divide between college fans and NFL fans? Big rivalry etc?

    I would say it depends on where you are from. In some places, college football IS king. Mostly places that do not have an NFL team nearby that think the college experience is better than the pro experience. And who knows, they may be right to an extent. Examples:

    Columbus, Ohio

    South Carolina

    Alabama

    Nebraska

    SW Texas (particularly Austin/San Antonio area)

    Oklahoma

    Now: Los Angeles. (not always)

    I would not say there is a rivalry between college football and the NFL. Even in areas where there are big time schools in both, they kind of prop each other up:

    Pittsburgh

    Detroit/Ann Arbor

    Minnesota

    Phoenix

    Bay area

    Seattle

    Dallas

    Missouri

    Baton Rouge/New Orleans

    Miami

  • @texasag1969 said:

    Just a little note of caution for all Browns fans both old timers here and new ones like me who are loyal to JFF.

    It is well known that Johnny actually participates as an anonymous poster on the best A&M boards and will likely do the same on the best Browns boards like this one.

    So be careful who you insult. He will be a new poster just like the rest of us showing up here. It was an ongoing guessing game to figure out who he was on Texags.com.

    If he can't take some people doubting him, along with the usual keyboard warrior bullshit versus fanatical homerism, he's probably not going to make it to the top.

  • @texasag1969 said:

    Just a little note of caution for all Browns fans both old timers here and new ones like me who are loyal to JFF.

    It is well known that Johnny actually participates as an anonymous poster on the best A&M boards and will likely do the same on the best Browns boards like this one.

    So be careful who you insult. He will be a new poster just like the rest of us showing up here. It was an ongoing guessing game to figure out who he was on Texags.com.

    My guess is WalterWhite

    miktoxicM 1 Reply
    👍
  • Tour2maT Tour2ma

    @bobpound said:

    What I liked on this set of downs was that he stayed in the pocket as long as he could. I watched him going through processions to at least 2nd and even 3rd receiver on one of the downs..

    I think the word you were looking for was "progressions"...

    I know you are having fun, but you are pretending you are evaluating a QB by watching the QB. You are not seeing the whole field, so you cannot tell whether progressing from his primary to his secondary was warranted.

    On the first series first pass here's what I saw:

    - In the initial sideline view it appeared Evans (split right) was his primary because JM looked right first. The corner was playing off so it looked like if Evans curled at the line to gain, then the first down was a cinch. I can't be sure, but I do not think Evans curled... it may not have been an option for him.

    - The endzone replay shows that next JM looks at double crossing routes just beyond the line to gain; he wisely does not force a throw into three defenders, but a moment later the receiver crossing right to left breaks clear by two steps and the throw is not made.

    - JM then pulls the ball down and takes off... at least he slid at the end.

    That JM misses a lot of throw opportunities was well documented by analyst after analyst leading up to the draft.

    The kid is exciting, but he is also raw. The is, after all, still a kid having only played 2 years at the college level. And he is about to play against bigger faster stronger players than he has ever seen.

    Fans, even his most ardent ones, would be wise to wait patiently for his time to come.

    @tour2ma said:

    I think the word you were looking for was "progressions"...

    I know you are having fun, but you are pretending you are evaluating a QB by watching the QB. You are not seeing the whole field, so you cannot tell whether progressing from his primary to his secondary was warranted.

    On the first series first pass here's what I saw:

    - In the initial sideline view it appeared Evans (split right) was his primary because JM looked right first. The corner was playing off so it looked like if Evans curled at the line to gain, then the first down was a cinch. I can't be sure, but I do not think Evans curled... it may not have been an option for him.

    - The endzone replay shows that next JM looks at double crossing routes just beyond the line to gain; he wisely does not force a throw into three defenders, but a moment later the receiver crossing right to left breaks clear by two steps and the throw is not made.

    - JM then pulls the ball down and takes off... at least he slid at the end.

    That JM misses a lot of throw opportunities was well documented by analyst after analyst leading up to the draft.

    The kid is exciting, but he is also raw. The is, after all, still a kid having only played 2 years at the college level. And he is about to play against bigger faster stronger players than he has ever seen.

    Fans, even his most ardent ones, would be wise to wait patiently for his time to come.

    Exactly- it was also pointed out JF didn't have to call out the line blocking @ A&M. If he misses something like that in the Pros and doesn't convey that to Mack, he's going to get killed.

    @texasag1969 said:

    For the Die Hard Browns Fans-apologies for giving hope. We understand the pain it brings when you get it back only to have it dashed again and again and again.

    MY hope is that this staff uses him as wisely as Seattle has used Russell Wilson. Teach him how to be a real pro QB, but don't squash that improvisational "It" factor that makes him unique.

    Tom Landry did it with this guy some years ago for those of you who have never seen him play. He had that same scrambling "It" factor and Landry tamed it down to fit the pros witout losing "It",

    That style can translate to the pros if done properly.

    I'm not saying his style of play can't translate to the Pros- but should he continue to scramble and dance the way we've all seen him do, he's going to wind up like RG III with an ACL in short order. Running qbs tend to have short shelf lives in the Pros- looking at JF, probably the closest comparison I can think of is Michael Vick- and not to be insulting, MHO is Vick has (had) every bit as much talent as Manziel- and probably more. A little FYI for ya here. There are legions of Ohio State fans that also post on this Board- I like to think we know a thing or two about the college game, and how it translates to the Pros- or doesn't. Also us guys who are on the high side of 40 (some of us way on the high side) don't get overly awed by college highlights. I've seen more than one college qb Heisman winner flop badly in the Pros- so I'll withhold my adulation until JF actually does something- and for more than one year. We had a six game wonder on the Browns named Derek Anderson for reference.

    @texasag1969 said:

    Just a little note of caution for all Browns fans both old timers here and new ones like me who are loyal to JFF.

    It is well known that Johnny actually participates as an anonymous poster on the best A&M boards and will likely do the same on the best Browns boards like this one.

    So be careful who you insult. He will be a new poster just like the rest of us showing up here. It was an ongoing guessing game to figure out who he was on Texags.com.

    Great- bring it on JF. A little criticism will do you a lot of good.

    @taco918 said:

    My guess is WalterWhite

    ROTFLMAO!

  • @texasag1969 said:

    Just a little note of caution for all Browns fans both old timers here and new ones like me who are loyal to JFF.

    It is well known that Johnny actually participates as an anonymous poster on the best A&M boards and will likely do the same on the best Browns boards like this one.

    So be careful who you insult. He will be a new poster just like the rest of us showing up here. It was an ongoing guessing game to figure out who he was on Texags.com.

    You mean we should not call him Johnny Cum Lately?

    (Actually, it would be very entertaining to have a player participate here...even anonymously)

    I mean, one day he could even become as legendary as Zombo, or Ghoolie....or The Gipper thank you very much and others.

    OsirisO 1 Reply
  • T Taco918

    @texasag1969 said:

    Just a little note of caution for all Browns fans both old timers here and new ones like me who are loyal to JFF.

    It is well known that Johnny actually participates as an anonymous poster on the best A&M boards and will likely do the same on the best Browns boards like this one.

    So be careful who you insult. He will be a new poster just like the rest of us showing up here. It was an ongoing guessing game to figure out who he was on Texags.com.

    My guess is WalterWhite

    @taco918 said:

    My guess is WalterWhite

    hilarious!

    his legend precedes him.

  • @texasag1969 said:

    For the Die Hard Browns Fans-apologies for giving hope. We understand the pain it brings when you get it back only to have it dashed again and again and again.

    MY hope is that this staff uses him as wisely as Seattle has used Russell Wilson. Teach him how to be a real pro QB, but don't squash that improvisational "It" factor that makes him unique.

    Tom Landry did it with this guy some years ago for those of you who have never seen him play. He had that same scrambling "It" factor and Landry tamed it down to fit the pros witout losing "It",

    That style can translate to the pros if done properly.

    Yes, it "can", but how often has it really translated?

    For me any comparison between Manziel and Staubach currently ends at the edge of the field. I remember Roger being a fully matured, confident, yet humble, man with four years of college and a 4-year(?) service stint before he took his first NFL snap. And then he spent the lion's share of his first 4-years on the bench behind Craig Morton. JM is still a kid with only 3-years of college and only 2 on the field. How long can you see him waiting?

    I do agree 100% though that you cannot kill that in JM that makes him him.

    As for the heartbreaks of the past... I think the impact of those on any JM skepticism is overestimated. Attributing skepticism to our damaged psyche is more of a JM fan coping mechanism than a real thing. Sure there's a measure of cumulative frustration, but I'd maintain that it manifests itself more as hope for JM than skepticism of him.

    But regardless, it's a pleasure disagreeing with you, Sir...

    @texasag1969 said:

    It is well known that Johnny actually participates as an anonymous poster on the best A&M boards and will likely do the same on the best Browns boards like this one.

    While I could care less whether he posts here or not, I am curious as to why he would choose to be anonymous.

    Then again... come to think of it... I am anonymous, too... 🙂

    "When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196

  • @txdawg said:

    He will be making McD's commercials soon, car dealerships, etc.

    "You planning on having a long relationship with that glass or are you going to drink it? Drink up, man. Maybe we can get another.” - Janis Joplin, 1970.
  • The GipperT The Gipper

    @texasag1969 said:

    Just a little note of caution for all Browns fans both old timers here and new ones like me who are loyal to JFF.

    It is well known that Johnny actually participates as an anonymous poster on the best A&M boards and will likely do the same on the best Browns boards like this one.

    So be careful who you insult. He will be a new poster just like the rest of us showing up here. It was an ongoing guessing game to figure out who he was on Texags.com.

    You mean we should not call him Johnny Cum Lately?

    (Actually, it would be very entertaining to have a player participate here...even anonymously)

    I mean, one day he could even become as legendary as Zombo, or Ghoolie....or The Gipper thank you very much and others.

    @the-gipper said:

    You mean we should not call him Johnny Cum Lately?

    (Actually, it would be very entertaining to have a player participate here...even anonymously)

    I mean, one day he could even become as legendary as Zombo, or Ghoolie....or The Gipper thank you very much and others.

    The real question would be what would he choose as his forum handle?

    "I said, 'I need someone who's going to want to get on the roller coaster with me knowing that it's not always going to be fun,'" -Paul DePodesta
    slimdawgS 1 Reply
  • D BoneD D Bone

    When you Johnny Lovers post videos like this, it doesn't help your case. I saw lots of things in that video that in the NFL will 1) get him killed, 2) turn the ball over, 3) ultimately be a bust............... The more I see these montages the more I wish we would have taken Carr in the 2nd.

    @d-bone said:

    When you Johnny Lovers post videos like this, it doesn't help your case. I saw lots of things in that video that in the NFL will 1) get him killed, 2) turn the ball over, 3) ultimately be a bust............... The more I see these montages the more I wish we would have taken Carr in the 2nd.

    Not an expert but I watched enough football in my life to see that same thing happen many many times in the NFL, some of the greatest qb's found ways to extend the play when need be. Highlights are going to be the bulk of this kind of play so unless all you doubters have watched the hundreds and hundreds hours of film then you just don't know. I am not fully sold on Manziel but the Browns were not the only ones interested in him. So let's wait and see before trashing his style and before Shanahan gets done with him.

  • The more you watch him, the more you like his chances of success. He didnt dominate by accident. He will have to alter his style, and use his escape ability to buy time in the pocket almost exclusively. I said it before and Ill say it again, Manziel was the best thrower in the draft, his elusiveness is icing on the cake. The reason I say hes the best thrower, is that he can throw from any, and I mean any, body position when shit breaks down. I really dont know how he makes some of the throws he does. If he puts staying healthy above extra yards, hes gonna succeed.

  • Browns announced that they would not be allowing the national media to attend rookie mini camp this weekend. Said they want the focus to be on all the rookies and they want Manziel to be focused on football. Said they don't want to have a Tebow Mania situation.

    Ruining threads since 1897.
    D BoneD hoortaH 2 Replies

  • I'm sure lots of teams were interested in him. Just not any of the first 21 teams....particularly in the top 10 where the most needy teams land.

    Doubters have reasons to doubt. You honks and "new browns fan"s see him do no wrong.

    No one wants any of you Texas honks on our bandwagon. You offer nothing to anyone here other than yanking the manhood of a tiny QB that's gonna struggle adjusting to the game. Please....do us all a favor....get the fuck out.

  • Kosar_For_PresidentK Kosar_For_President

    @texasag1969 said:

    For the Die Hard Browns Fans-apologies for giving hope. We understand the pain it brings when you get it back only to have it dashed again and again and again.

    MY hope is that this staff uses him as wisely as Seattle has used Russell Wilson. Teach him how to be a real pro QB, but don't squash that improvisational "It" factor that makes him unique.

    Tom Landry did it with this guy some years ago for those of you who have never seen him play. He had that same scrambling "It" factor and Landry tamed it down to fit the pros witout losing "It",

    That style can translate to the pros if done properly.

    Don't you fucking dare coming in here with this shit.

    @kosar_for_president said:

    Don't you fucking dare coming in here with this shit.

    It is a valid point.

    The comparison may be off, but it is valid nonetheless.

    It's much easier to teach a game changer to dial it down than it is to teach a one dimensional QB to dial it up.

    The it factor is a real thing. When's the last time a Browns QB trotted onto the field when we were down and you thought "He's got this."

    For me, it was Brian Hoyer against Minnesota. Before that...I couldn't tell you.

    I'm awesome, and I fuck dolphins. Ghoolie 12/2/2012: I have absolutely no skills, training or pride

  • @mike-h said:

    The only people upset about the influx of Johnny/new Browns fans are the same people who were against picking him, and are hoping he fails. True Browns fans, they say... yep.

    I'd rather have the bandwagoners (ESPN ranked CLE 32nd in their opening power rankings, so is it a bandwagon?) than the salty old douches who can't accept being wrong and will root against their own team just to feel good about their "analysis" and opinions.

    Truly a sad day.

    Ah, it's not just the old guys, this has been going on forever ... especially with the QBs.

    I happened to like Manziel a lot, had him highest rated QB, just didn't like him at four. Thought he'd be great at 15. Thought we stole him at 22.

    I'm a fan. As a mod though, he's a a headache because he is bringing in the whole world and they all want to start a thread. Well worth it if he gets us to the playoffs though.

    Zombo

  • Z Zombo

    @mike-h said:

    The only people upset about the influx of Johnny/new Browns fans are the same people who were against picking him, and are hoping he fails. True Browns fans, they say... yep.

    I'd rather have the bandwagoners (ESPN ranked CLE 32nd in their opening power rankings, so is it a bandwagon?) than the salty old douches who can't accept being wrong and will root against their own team just to feel good about their "analysis" and opinions.

    Truly a sad day.

    Ah, it's not just the old guys, this has been going on forever ... especially with the QBs.

    I happened to like Manziel a lot, had him highest rated QB, just didn't like him at four. Thought he'd be great at 15. Thought we stole him at 22.

    I'm a fan. As a mod though, he's a a headache because he is bringing in the whole world and they all want to start a thread. Well worth it if he gets us to the playoffs though.

    Zombo

    Zombo said:

    Ah, it's not just the old guys, this has been going on forever ... especially with the QBs.

    I happened to like Manziel a lot, had him highest rated QB, just didn't like him at four. Thought he'd be great at 15. Thought we stole him at 22.

    I'm a fan. As a mod though, he's a a headache because he is bringing in the whole world and they all want to start a thread. Well worth it if he gets us to the playoffs though.

    Zombo

    I'll drink to that.

  • @walterwhite said:

    Nailed it.

    Yes....he did. Dumb fuck mike thinks its because one doesn't like the pick....

    Sucks to be a writer with poor reading comprehension.

    I'm not interested in johnny fans.....only browns fans. The bandwagoners can fuck off as far as I'm concerned.

  • @mike-h said:

    I've actually talked to a guy who was a scout for over 20 years -- he said he prefers a QB who can make throws off his back foot and from hard angles/release points, because there's rarely a clean pocket where a QB gets to plant, step and execute a perfect throw.

    yep. Not having that skill has doomed many a QBs. Weve had a bunch of em. Weeden was the worst ive seen when he had to adjust haha. He was too used to having that mound to throw from.
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