Stockton Shorts Discusses Brian Hoyer
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Did Stockton really claim it was cause of Hoyer that our run game has stalled? If so can he be banned pls? There's just no place for that here. At the very least Hoorta you should lock every thread he starts and delete every post you see from him..no matter what. Eventually he'll get the point. That claim isn't even worth responding too and it's clearly a troll from a fan of another team.
Did Stockton really claim it was cause of Hoyer that our run game has stalled?
Where you been man?
do we need to start a word of the day thread to improve the vocabulary around here?
sorry,
do we need to start a word of the day thread to improve the vocabulary around here, fags?
OK.... that made me laugh...
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Did Stockton really claim it was cause of Hoyer that our run game has stalled? If so can he be banned pls? There's just no place for that here. At the very least Hoorta you should lock every thread he starts and delete every post you see from him..no matter what. Eventually he'll get the point. That claim isn't even worth responding too and it's clearly a troll from a fan of another team.
Did Stockton really claim it was cause of Hoyer that our run game has stalled? If so can he be banned pls? There's just no place for that here. At the very least Hoorta you should lock every thread he starts and delete every post you see from him..no matter what. Eventually he'll get the point. That claim isn't even worth responding too and it's clearly a troll from a fan of another team.
Well Stockton claims he isn't (a troll)- if he's ghosting being a Browns fan he's doing a good job of hiding it. Sad thing is his overall intelligence level of posting is pretty high- too bad we got his opinion concerning Hoyer around a moth ago. Just regurgitating the same opinion in 20 different ways.
And this is an aside to our pal Westside Steve. Sure Steve, we all feel in our hearts our viewpoint is right- but we don't go calling other posters "idiots" or "morons" just because they don't agree with us. Stockton has done that several times, and from a Mod standpoint his welcome is wearing mighty thin- I have zero doubt Mark agrees with me. As Tour pointed out shades of our departed Mike H- who developed a case of megalomania. I had to lock one thread because of ongoing idiocy. And yup I've had thoughts of having Z ban Stocky for a week for his incessant yammering.
He's smarter than everyone...he doesn't need to explain himself to a bunch of simple minded people who only care about wins and losses and not the "bigger picture" (whatever the fuck that means).
That challenge was so far beyond his ability level, he did what trolls do.....he ignored it.
Correct Mark- he won't debate when someone shoots holes in his beautiful theory- just call them idiots.
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@everlastingxxx said:
I think the piling on against Stockton is pathetic.
Takes balls to express an opinion that’s different from the cabal.
OK, ask any head coach or GM in the NFL if they agree with his "theory". FYI Farmer doesn't- you're going to hear the sound of silence- count on it.
You can posit anything- that doesn't mean it isn't total absurdity. I'd say the history of the NFL would show a quarterback with a 90+ qbr, and a starting record of 8-3 has never been benched if healthy for a rookie. If you haven't looked lately, Hoyer's stats are damn near identical to the guy he's playing against Thursday- Andy Dalton. Yup, Dalton just signed a franchise qb deal.
AND you saw first hand last Sunday the sort of shit quarterback play Browns fans have had to endure with the the likes of Brandon Wee-Done and equally incompetent bozos for 10 plus seasons, so excuse us Cleveland fans if we're happy as pigs in mud that we finally found a guy who doesn't single handedly lose a game, without even trying.
FYI Ghoolie (Vesna) can be a pain in the ass contrarian- but he knows when to be funny about it- and history more often than not has shown him to be right. Hoyer's history is still being written- and that's straight from Farmer. Get back to me after the Thursday night for an update.
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Hoorta that's nearly every post from every member. ......
WSS
not true.
there is a large majority on here that try to get along and know what the boundaries are for each member when posting and replying to each other.
stockton doesn't care about getting along or trying to fit in, his agenda is like an ice breaker on lake erie in february, just keep going and break as much up along the way as he can.
Well I don't know mik...not true.
there is a large majority on here that try to get along and know what the boundaries are for each member when posting and replying to each other.
stockton doesn't care about getting along or trying to fit in, his agenda is like an ice breaker on lake erie in february, just keep going and break as much up along the way as he can.
The guy does seem to be a dick head of the first order but let's be honest these threads seemed to go on forever and ever and ever so somebody must be responding the same old way.
WSS
www.westsidesteve.com www.myspace.com/westsidestevemusic www.cdbaby.com/artist/westsidestevesimmons -
@everlastingxxx said:
I think the piling on against Stockton is pathetic.
Takes balls to express an opinion thats different from the cabal.
Its one thing to express a different opinion. Its another to constantly blast it and tell other people how stupid they are for not having the same opinion.
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@everlastingxxx said:
I think the piling on against Stockton is pathetic.
Takes balls to express an opinion that’s different from the cabal.
I would say it takes a low IQ to repeatedly say the same stupid opinion over and over. Not so much balls but just an empty head.
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Ghoolie pisses a lot of people off with many of his posts but, to me, he simply seems to
enjoy playing the gadfly. Most of his posts seem to be tongue-in-cheek and meant to
rile people up. And yes, over the last 2 or 3 years his win/loss prediction has usually been
right on.
Now Stockton, on the other hand...
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Well I don't know mik...not true.
there is a large majority on here that try to get along and know what the boundaries are for each member when posting and replying to each other.
stockton doesn't care about getting along or trying to fit in, his agenda is like an ice breaker on lake erie in february, just keep going and break as much up along the way as he can.
The guy does seem to be a dick head of the first order but let's be honest these threads seemed to go on forever and ever and ever so somebody must be responding the same old way.
WSS
Well I don't know mik...
The guy does seem to be a dick head of the first order but let's be honest these threads seemed to go on forever and ever and ever so somebody must be responding the same old way.
WSS
Especially since Stockton hasn't even posted on this thread since page 6 or 7ish. Thats page after page of people talking about Stockton, but no Stockton. Yes, Im guilty too. But Im sure he has accomplished his goal and is enjoying all the attention immensely.
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TL;DR.
Stockton said to cut Manziel and give Hoyer a $100M contract, right?
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@everlastingxxx said:
I think the piling on against Stockton is pathetic.
Takes balls to express an opinion that’s different from the cabal.
Hi opinion has been duly noted...the first dozen times.
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Well I don't know mik...
The guy does seem to be a dick head of the first order but let's be honest these threads seemed to go on forever and ever and ever so somebody must be responding the same old way.
WSS
Especially since Stockton hasn't even posted on this thread since page 6 or 7ish. Thats page after page of people talking about Stockton, but no Stockton. Yes, Im guilty too. But Im sure he has accomplished his goal and is enjoying all the attention immensely.
Especially since Stockton hasn't even posted on this thread since page 6 or 7ish. Thats page after page of people talking about Stockton, but no Stockton. Yes, Im guilty too. But Im sure he has accomplished his goal and is enjoying all the attention immensely.
Wikipedia needs help with talk about Stockton
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I actually agree with a lot that Stockton has to say.
I don't think Hoyer is the long-term solution in Cleveland. I don't think that championing a few stats against the worst pass defenses in the NFL is an argument FOR his efficiency. The combination of Mack going down and teams loading up against the Browns' running game (with little fear of Hoyer's arm) is real and is the reason that the Browns are having some real problems sustaining drives. When he lists top QBs and says Hoyer isn't anywhere near them, he's right. When he says that it's very unlikely you can win without that level of player, he's also right.
I think that a lot of his lashing out is in response to lousy arguments against what he's saying. He's not sucking Johnny's knob... It's not that kind of argument. I'm impressed with Hoyer's record as the Browns' starter, but am decidedly less infatuated with (let's say) his QB rating against the Bucs. I think if you want to make an argument FOR Hoyer, you look at his overall record without getting too much deeper... Other stats don't come out necessarily in his favor.
Here's the thing (if Stockton will indulge me a couple of questions answered), is that I think a leap is being made that I can't make sense of.
1) As a Browns fan, would you seriously prefer to see them lose, even though they have a QB you don't believe in?
2) Who gives the team a better chance to win right NOW. Hoyer or Manziel?
3) Why are winning and team-building considered mutually exclusive? What prevents the Browns from going (let's say) 8-8 this year, having another strong draft and another battle for starting quarterback next year and continuing to build on this season's successes?
Being lousy hasn't gotten this franchise anywhere for the last 15 years. I'm sorry man, I WANT TO WIN. 8-8 would be a BIG fucking year for this team. And right now, the guy who has the best chance of getting us there is Brian Hoyer. A 7-3 record as a starter is impressive, even if it IS against shitty competition. If nothing else, it's evidence that the Browns are no longer in that shitty grouping; that there are games you can reasonably EXPECT the Browns to win... And that's a positive, man. And Hoyer is a part of that positive.
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That was a pretty good post Mr makebelieve.
WSS
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The two aren't mutually exclusive.
If Rodgers sat, Manziel sits.. period. The first 2 yrs [05, 06] after Rodgers was drafted, Favre was just above average with more interceptions than Hoyer.
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Hoyer's last start was without his pro bowl WR, TE and center. Guess that doesn't account for anything huh? "Just plug in their backups and the QB shouldn't miss a beat" is the expectation from some. Would Johnny have done better? We'll never know, because as it stands now, he hasn't shown the coaches anything that makes them believe that he gives the Browns a better chance to win than Brian currently does.
If anyone thinks for a second that the coaches won't play who they believe gives the team the best shot to win, hasn't been paying attention this year.......... Ask Tate, Crow and West, they'll tell you.
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Hoyer's last start was without his pro bowl WR, TE and center. Guess that doesn't account for anything huh? "Just plug in their backups and the QB shouldn't miss a beat" is the expectation from some. Would Johnny have done better? We'll never know, because as it stands now, he hasn't shown the coaches anything that makes them believe that he gives the Browns a better chance to win than Brian currently does.
If anyone thinks for a second that the coaches won't play who they believe gives the team the best shot to win, hasn't been paying attention this year.......... Ask Tate, Crow and West, they'll tell you.
Hoyer's last start was without his pro bowl WR, TE and center. Guess that doesn't account for anything huh? "Just plug in their backups and the QB shouldn't miss a beat" is the expectation from some. Would Johnny have done better? We'll never know, because as it stands now, he hasn't shown the coaches anything that makes them believe that he gives the Browns a better chance to win than Brian currently does.
If anyone thinks for a second that the coaches won't play who they believe gives the team the best shot to win, hasn't been paying attention this year.......... Ask Tate, Crow and West, they'll tell you.
^exactly.
no one discounts the fact that brian hoyer isn't perfect, that he hasn't shined in some games that all brown's fans should've thought he'd excel in. we've seen many teams in the past that have just folded after a key element on either side of the ball has been out because of injury. wasn't atlanta on a run there for a second years ago and julio went out and they flopped? when gronk was out didn't the patriots with the hall-of-famer brady look like trash? i mean our run game is down to zero and our only legit star wideout was our TE who is now out.........but we continue to win.
so why all the bitching?
god forbid we lose tomorrow night cuz all the JF fags will be racing in (along with the 1/2 JF fag brown's fans) to say it's time for JOHNNY MANZIEL.
throw him in and let him get busted. then you'll all be happy correct?
bunch of fucking idiots.
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I actually agree with a lot that Stockton has to say.
I don't think Hoyer is the long-term solution in Cleveland. I don't think that championing a few stats against the worst pass defenses in the NFL is an argument FOR his efficiency. The combination of Mack going down and teams loading up against the Browns' running game (with little fear of Hoyer's arm) is real and is the reason that the Browns are having some real problems sustaining drives. When he lists top QBs and says Hoyer isn't anywhere near them, he's right. When he says that it's very unlikely you can win without that level of player, he's also right.
I think that a lot of his lashing out is in response to lousy arguments against what he's saying. He's not sucking Johnny's knob... It's not that kind of argument. I'm impressed with Hoyer's record as the Browns' starter, but am decidedly less infatuated with (let's say) his QB rating against the Bucs. I think if you want to make an argument FOR Hoyer, you look at his overall record without getting too much deeper... Other stats don't come out necessarily in his favor.
Here's the thing (if Stockton will indulge me a couple of questions answered), is that I think a leap is being made that I can't make sense of.
1) As a Browns fan, would you seriously prefer to see them lose, even though they have a QB you don't believe in?
2) Who gives the team a better chance to win right NOW. Hoyer or Manziel?
3) Why are winning and team-building considered mutually exclusive? What prevents the Browns from going (let's say) 8-8 this year, having another strong draft and another battle for starting quarterback next year and continuing to build on this season's successes?
Being lousy hasn't gotten this franchise anywhere for the last 15 years. I'm sorry man, I WANT TO WIN. 8-8 would be a BIG fucking year for this team. And right now, the guy who has the best chance of getting us there is Brian Hoyer. A 7-3 record as a starter is impressive, even if it IS against shitty competition. If nothing else, it's evidence that the Browns are no longer in that shitty grouping; that there are games you can reasonably EXPECT the Browns to win... And that's a positive, man. And Hoyer is a part of that positive.
I actually agree with a lot that Stockton has to say.
I don't think Hoyer is the long-term solution in Cleveland. I don't think that championing a few stats against the worst pass defenses in the NFL is an argument FOR his efficiency. The combination of Mack going down and teams loading up against the Browns' running game (with little fear of Hoyer's arm) is real and is the reason that the Browns are having some real problems sustaining drives.
I think that a lot of his lashing out is in response to lousy arguments against what he's saying. He's not sucking Johnny's knob... It's not that kind of argument. I'm impressed with Hoyer's record as the Browns' starter, but am decidedly less infatuated with (let's say) his QB rating against the Bucs. I think if you want to make an argument FOR Hoyer, you look at his overall record without getting too much deeper... Other stats don't come out necessarily in his favor.
Most here do agree with aspects of StockBoy's argument. I agree with aspects. Hell, during a running battle with Mikey, I posted aspects months before he came along.
The basic disagreement, as you get to in the last half of your post, is timing. StockBoy argues the result is inevitable, so make the change now. I and others argue you simply cannot justify that decision now; you have to let it play out.
StockBoy lashes out because what matters most to him is that others adopt his position. He is here to be admired, not to debate and discuss. Simply acknowledging his position and agreeing to disagree, is not an option. And so the name-calling ensued...
One last point, no one has yet posted any data supporting a statement that "teams (are) loading up against the Browns' running game (with little fear of Hoyer's arm)". If you have some, I'd love to see it, because the data I have generated does not show "loading up" is occurring.
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Hoyer's last start was without his pro bowl WR, TE and center. Guess that doesn't account for anything huh? "Just plug in their backups and the QB shouldn't miss a beat" is the expectation from some. Would Johnny have done better? We'll never know, because as it stands now, he hasn't shown the coaches anything that makes them believe that he gives the Browns a better chance to win than Brian currently does.
If anyone thinks for a second that the coaches won't play who they believe gives the team the best shot to win, hasn't been paying attention this year.......... Ask Tate, Crow and West, they'll tell you.
^exactly.
no one discounts the fact that brian hoyer isn't perfect, that he hasn't shined in some games that all brown's fans should've thought he'd excel in. we've seen many teams in the past that have just folded after a key element on either side of the ball has been out because of injury. wasn't atlanta on a run there for a second years ago and julio went out and they flopped? when gronk was out didn't the patriots with the hall-of-famer brady look like trash? i mean our run game is down to zero and our only legit star wideout was our TE who is now out.........but we continue to win.
so why all the bitching?
god forbid we lose tomorrow night cuz all the JF fags will be racing in (along with the 1/2 JF fag brown's fans) to say it's time for JOHNNY MANZIEL.
throw him in and let him get busted. then you'll all be happy correct?
bunch of fucking idiots.
^exactly.
no one discounts the fact that brian hoyer isn't perfect, that he hasn't shined in some games that all brown's fans should've thought he'd excel in. we've seen many teams in the past that have just folded after a key element on either side of the ball has been out because of injury. wasn't atlanta on a run there for a second years ago and julio went out and they flopped? when gronk was out didn't the patriots with the hall-of-famer brady look like trash? i mean our run game is down to zero and our only legit star wideout was our TE who is now out.........but we continue to win.
so why all the bitching?
god forbid we lose tomorrow night cuz all the JF fags will be racing in (along with the 1/2 JF fag brown's fans) to say it's time for JOHNNY MANZIEL.
throw him in and let him get busted. then you'll all be happy correct?
bunch of fucking idiots.
Preach it!
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Terry ain't got nothing on us...
Exactly the attitude that is going to ruin the franchise.
Browns are a middle team, not good enough for the playoffs. Have played by far the easiest schedule in the NFL this year and are still in last in the division.
We'll win on Sunday and people will start doubling down on the "WE'RE 5-3! 5-3!!!!" chants, meanwhile the distance between us and the next easiest NFL schedule will only grow.
The absolute worst thing that could happen to the Browns is to hang in the hunt for the 6 seed so long that Manziel gets no playing time. 1) Browns won't make the playoffs, once the back half of the schedule starts next Thursday it'll become pretty obvious and 2) Hoyer isn't the answer, couldn't be more clear and not finding out if Manziel is the answer before this offseason would be a disaster for a building franchise.
Jacksonville, Minnesota, Oakland and Tennessee are ALL in better positions for their future because they're learning about what the next 5 years holds right now. The Browns are selling the future to try and make the 6th seed this year. Awful strategy when you don't know who your franchise QB is. Awful that will only come back to hurt the Browns.
You want to be on the beach or in the ocean, one or the other. If you're in the surf you'll die. The Browns are hanging out in the surf and the low self esteem of the fans who get a hard on at the prospects of a winning record, even though the team isn't a contender, are the ones drowning the team.
Exactly the attitude that is going to ruin the franchise.
Browns are a middle team, not good enough for the playoffs. Have played by far the easiest schedule in the NFL this year and are still in last in the division.
We'll win on Sunday and people will start doubling down on the "WE'RE 5-3! 5-3!!!!" chants, meanwhile the distance between us and the next easiest NFL schedule will only grow.
The absolute worst thing that could happen to the Browns is to hang in the hunt for the 6 seed so long that Manziel gets no playing time. 1) Browns won't make the playoffs, once the back half of the schedule starts next Thursday it'll become pretty obvious and 2) Hoyer isn't the answer, couldn't be more clear and not finding out if Manziel is the answer before this offseason would be a disaster for a building franchise.
Jacksonville, Minnesota, Oakland and Tennessee are ALL in better positions for their future because they're learning about what the next 5 years holds right now. The Browns are selling the future to try and make the 6th seed this year. Awful strategy when you don't know who your franchise QB is. Awful that will only come back to hurt the Browns.
You want to be on the beach or in the ocean, one or the other. If you're in the surf you'll die. The Browns are hanging out in the surf and the low self esteem of the fans who get a hard on at the prospects of a winning record, even though the team isn't a contender, are the ones drowning the team.
Getting no playing time for a few years really fucked up Aaron Rogers too! Some of your posts are so stupid its painful on the eyes to read,
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I actually agree with a lot that Stockton has to say.
I don't think Hoyer is the long-term solution in Cleveland. I don't think that championing a few stats against the worst pass defenses in the NFL is an argument FOR his efficiency. The combination of Mack going down and teams loading up against the Browns' running game (with little fear of Hoyer's arm) is real and is the reason that the Browns are having some real problems sustaining drives. When he lists top QBs and says Hoyer isn't anywhere near them, he's right. When he says that it's very unlikely you can win without that level of player, he's also right.
I think that a lot of his lashing out is in response to lousy arguments against what he's saying. He's not sucking Johnny's knob... It's not that kind of argument. I'm impressed with Hoyer's record as the Browns' starter, but am decidedly less infatuated with (let's say) his QB rating against the Bucs. I think if you want to make an argument FOR Hoyer, you look at his overall record without getting too much deeper... Other stats don't come out necessarily in his favor.
Here's the thing (if Stockton will indulge me a couple of questions answered), is that I think a leap is being made that I can't make sense of.
1) As a Browns fan, would you seriously prefer to see them lose, even though they have a QB you don't believe in?
2) Who gives the team a better chance to win right NOW. Hoyer or Manziel?
3) Why are winning and team-building considered mutually exclusive? What prevents the Browns from going (let's say) 8-8 this year, having another strong draft and another battle for starting quarterback next year and continuing to build on this season's successes?
Being lousy hasn't gotten this franchise anywhere for the last 15 years. I'm sorry man, I WANT TO WIN. 8-8 would be a BIG fucking year for this team. And right now, the guy who has the best chance of getting us there is Brian Hoyer. A 7-3 record as a starter is impressive, even if it IS against shitty competition. If nothing else, it's evidence that the Browns are no longer in that shitty grouping; that there are games you can reasonably EXPECT the Browns to win... And that's a positive, man. And Hoyer is a part of that positive.
I actually agree with a lot that Stockton has to say.
I don't think Hoyer is the long-term solution in Cleveland. I don't think that championing a few stats against the worst pass defenses in the NFL is an argument FOR his efficiency. The combination of Mack going down and teams loading up against the Browns' running game (with little fear of Hoyer's arm) is real and is the reason that the Browns are having some real problems sustaining drives. When he lists top QBs and says Hoyer isn't anywhere near them, he's right. When he says that it's very unlikely you can win without that level of player, he's also right.
I think that a lot of his lashing out is in response to lousy arguments against what he's saying. He's not sucking Johnny's knob... It's not that kind of argument. I'm impressed with Hoyer's record as the Browns' starter, but am decidedly less infatuated with (let's say) his QB rating against the Bucs. I think if you want to make an argument FOR Hoyer, you look at his overall record without getting too much deeper... Other stats don't come out necessarily in his favor.
Here's the thing (if Stockton will indulge me a couple of questions answered), is that I think a leap is being made that I can't make sense of.
1) As a Browns fan, would you seriously prefer to see them lose, even though they have a QB you don't believe in?
2) Who gives the team a better chance to win right NOW. Hoyer or Manziel?
3) Why are winning and team-building considered mutually exclusive? What prevents the Browns from going (let's say) 8-8 this year, having another strong draft and another battle for starting quarterback next year and continuing to build on this season's successes?
Being lousy hasn't gotten this franchise anywhere for the last 15 years. I'm sorry man, I WANT TO WIN. 8-8 would be a BIG fucking year for this team. And right now, the guy who has the best chance of getting us there is Brian Hoyer. A 7-3 record as a starter is impressive, even if it IS against shitty competition. If nothing else, it's evidence that the Browns are no longer in that shitty grouping; that there are games you can reasonably EXPECT the Browns to win... And that's a positive, man. And Hoyer is a part of that positive.
Number 3) equals winner winner chicken dinner. We need to manage both the short term and long term plan. Hoyer managing the field in the short term is the right decision and its working well. Johnny is getting the chance to develop and that's a good thing. Far to many of these young QB's get rushed into action. Regardless of whether Johnny has played in a game or not you can bet that the staff of experts know if he has a future.
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