Jonathan Paul Manziel
-
Johnny's Evaluation on NFL.com:
Johnny Manziel, Cleveland Browns, No. 22 overallSEASON ANALYSIS
DJ: He's played less than a quarter of regular-season football, but he's already generated plenty of excitement. Manziel can accurately throw while rolling to both sides, and he is a threat as a runner when the play breaks down. His field vision and ball placement are inconsistent. Season grade: Incomplete
BB: Manziel hadn't seen much time on the field -- outside of an occasional gadget play -- before the Browns turned to him in the fourth quarter of Sunday's matchup with the Buffalo Bills. The diminutive playmaker immediately sparked the offense with his energy, athleticism and improvisational skills, calmly connecting on a handful of play-action and movement-based passes before scoring on a sensational 10-yard run that showcased his speed and burst on the perimeter. Although he benefitted from a questionable call that overturned what would have been a strip-sack fumble, Manziel's poise and confidence stood out. Season grade: Incomplete
AREAS FOR IMPROVEMENT
DJ: He needs to be more patient in the pocket and improve his vision down the field.
BB: Manziel's NFL résumé is too short to provide much specificity here, but it goes without saying that he must learn to operate from the pocket and rely more on his arm than his legs to make plays on the perimeter. While his athleticism and improvisational skills will make him a nightmare to defend, it is hard to build a successful game plan solely around an off-the-cuff playground-style approach. If Manziel can keep his wild forays in check, he could take the Browns' offense to the next level.
LONG-TERM PROSPECTS
DJ: Manziel is the ultimate wild card. With the young talent around him at the offensive skill positions in Cleveland, I think he can be successful as the Browns' starter, provided he protects himself better when he runs the ball.
BB: The NFL hasn't been kind to small, run-around quarterbacks, and it's hard to endorse Manziel as a long-term solution until he puts enough plays on tape. It'll be easy to get caught up in the spectacular moments he'll inevitably provide, but he must prove he can move the team from the pocket. If Brownscoach Mike Pettine makes Manziel the starter for the rest of the season, we should find out if his sandlot playing style can lead to success at this leve
-
Mudfly-not afraid of his long term skills, just afraid of how quickly the Browns have given up on QB's in the past. 4 games in one season to decide whether to draft another as some have suggested here is not good policy. But the Browns have that history. I want him to be given the time to become a great QB. That is hard enough to do in one season as we can see from the other struggling rookies. But 1/4 season would be ridiculous. Some on this board would be quick to desert him if he doesn't do what he did the first possession last Sunday multiple times a game. Yes, I still think he is one special kind of talent. It will show.
An analysis???
Mudfly-not afraid of his long term skills, just afraid of how quickly the Browns have given up on QB's in the past.
Who exactly have we given up on prematurely?
Since we rose in '99 we have invested seriously in 4 picks: Couch, Quinn, Weeden and now, JM. The only one of these you might argue we did not gave ample opportunity to succeed is now out of the league... twice. Only for JM is the story not yet written.
Other candidates were longshots picks we either chose or came by who did not pan out. Only DA came tantalizingly close for one season to being our dream date.
The remainder were retreads that either came to us from prefect or far better situations, or were on their last legs and somehow that fact escaped us.
Again, I ask... Who exactly have we given up on prematurely?
"We just figure, as receivers, we have to work more," Benjamin said. "If Johnny comes in the huddle and he pronounces the play wrong, we've got to make sure we correct it. We've got to make sure we correct him. Offensive linemen, tight ends, all the receivers, all the running backs, we've just got to make sure we've got to be in form when he's in the game."
Now that's a problem....i thought he's a smart dude? It's focking DECEMBER already and he still doesn't know his play book?
It's just a "pronounciation" issue...
You say tomayto and I say tomahto...
Bri says "play action" and John says "pluh axe-tin"
Let's call the whole thing off...
-
Johnny's Evaluation on NFL.com:
Johnny Manziel, Cleveland Browns, No. 22 overallSEASON ANALYSIS
DJ: He's played less than a quarter of regular-season football, but he's already generated plenty of excitement. Manziel can accurately throw while rolling to both sides, and he is a threat as a runner when the play breaks down. His field vision and ball placement are inconsistent. Season grade: Incomplete
BB: Manziel hadn't seen much time on the field -- outside of an occasional gadget play -- before the Browns turned to him in the fourth quarter of Sunday's matchup with the Buffalo Bills. The diminutive playmaker immediately sparked the offense with his energy, athleticism and improvisational skills, calmly connecting on a handful of play-action and movement-based passes before scoring on a sensational 10-yard run that showcased his speed and burst on the perimeter. Although he benefitted from a questionable call that overturned what would have been a strip-sack fumble, Manziel's poise and confidence stood out. Season grade: Incomplete
AREAS FOR IMPROVEMENT
DJ: He needs to be more patient in the pocket and improve his vision down the field.
BB: Manziel's NFL résumé is too short to provide much specificity here, but it goes without saying that he must learn to operate from the pocket and rely more on his arm than his legs to make plays on the perimeter. While his athleticism and improvisational skills will make him a nightmare to defend, it is hard to build a successful game plan solely around an off-the-cuff playground-style approach. If Manziel can keep his wild forays in check, he could take the Browns' offense to the next level.
LONG-TERM PROSPECTS
DJ: Manziel is the ultimate wild card. With the young talent around him at the offensive skill positions in Cleveland, I think he can be successful as the Browns' starter, provided he protects himself better when he runs the ball.
BB: The NFL hasn't been kind to small, run-around quarterbacks, and it's hard to endorse Manziel as a long-term solution until he puts enough plays on tape. It'll be easy to get caught up in the spectacular moments he'll inevitably provide, but he must prove he can move the team from the pocket. If Brownscoach Mike Pettine makes Manziel the starter for the rest of the season, we should find out if his sandlot playing style can lead to success at this leve
It's a little silly they wrote an evaluation for a guy with 9 or so pass attempts.
We really gotta see him more. I fear he panics after the first read sometimes, and will roll out to escape non-existant pressure, or take off straight up the field. Sometimes he misses open guys because of it.
Otherwise I think he has good ball placement for the most part, good accuracy, good arm strength. Field vision is somewhat up in the air, idk that he's done so well seeing an entire NFL field. On that Dr. Dray pass that was considered a "tight" window was more so a fact of JM didn't see the safety and got lucky he was a half a step slow to a pick - something that also happened to Hoyer yesterday (didn't get as lucky) - but all together Hoyer tends not to miss stuff like that
Other things JM does well: Good awareness in the pocket, good awareness when he does pull it down to run. Gotta prove that he can see and read an NFL field - being a "baller" just won't be enough.
-
I have a splinter under the fingernail of my left hand couldn't get it out and it got infected. Index finger. Made it really harder and harder to play the guitar. Tried pins tweezers etc but so sore I could barely touch it. Finally went to an urgent care facility where a Chinese doctor looked at it grabbed my hand stuck in the forceps grab it and yanked it out. Hurt like a bitch but only for a little bit. He looked at me and said "no guts, no glory."
Situation 2, did you ever take months and months dragging out a break up or a divorce?
Make of that what you will.
WSS
www.westsidesteve.com www.myspace.com/westsidestevemusic www.cdbaby.com/artist/westsidestevesimmons -
Angry Browns Fan has good lyrics but can't sing or perform. You have good sound, but lyrics kinda lacking IMO, as you readily admitted. I think you two need to combine forces.
Zombo
Zombo said:
Angry Browns Fan has good lyrics but can't sing or perform. You have good sound, but lyrics kinda lacking IMO, as you readily admitted. I think you two need to combine forces.
Zombo
I'm open to the idea. I'd like to not bother with lyrics in general. When left up to me, lyrics usually end being about poop, boobs, getting drunk, etc.
-
-
I have a splinter under the fingernail of my left hand couldn't get it out and it got infected. Index finger. Made it really harder and harder to play the guitar. Tried pins tweezers etc but so sore I could barely touch it. Finally went to an urgent care facility where a Chinese doctor looked at it grabbed my hand stuck in the forceps grab it and yanked it out. Hurt like a bitch but only for a little bit. He looked at me and said "no guts, no glory."
Situation 2, did you ever take months and months dragging out a break up or a divorce?
Make of that what you will.
WSS
Finally went to an urgent care facility where a Chinese doctor looked at it grabbed my hand stuck in the forceps grab it and yanked it out. Hurt like a bitch but only for a little bit. He looked at me and said "no guts, no glory."
He probably said "no gats no gorry"
-
Zombo said:
Angry Browns Fan has good lyrics but can't sing or perform. You have good sound, but lyrics kinda lacking IMO, as you readily admitted. I think you two need to combine forces.
Zombo
I'm open to the idea. I'd like to not bother with lyrics in general. When left up to me, lyrics usually end being about poop, boobs, getting drunk, etc.
When left up to me, lyrics usually end being about poop, boobs, getting drunk, etc.
what else do you need?
-
I didn't want to start a new thread, but looking over the two possessions by JM, he wasn't exactly helped out, was he? That pisses me off. First possession, Benji across the middle but off his finger tips. Maybe it was too far in front, but I expect a pro to dive for a ball like that. My coach would always say, if you can tip it, you can catch it. I didn't see 100% effort on that play. Second possession, second play, Drey on a hook pattern, JM hits him with a bullet and he drops it. Then on 4th down Austin's pattern is a yard short of the first down. He should know better than that. I know we keep focusing on the QB's but it's the rest of the the team that playing like shit. Fumble, wrong pattern, dropped balls, no running game in the second half. We need a better effort to make the playoffs.
-
I didn't want to start a new thread, but looking over the two possessions by JM, he wasn't exactly helped out, was he? That pisses me off. First possession, Benji across the middle but off his finger tips. Maybe it was too far in front, but I expect a pro to dive for a ball like that. My coach would always say, if you can tip it, you can catch it. I didn't see 100% effort on that play. Second possession, second play, Drey on a hook pattern, JM hits him with a bullet and he drops it. Then on 4th down Austin's pattern is a yard short of the first down. He should know better than that. I know we keep focusing on the QB's but it's the rest of the the team that playing like shit. Fumble, wrong pattern, dropped balls, no running game in the second half. We need a better effort to make the playoffs.
I didn't want to start a new thread, but looking over the two possessions by JM, he wasn't exactly helped out, was he? That pisses me off. First possession, Benji across the middle but off his finger tips. Maybe it was too far in front, but I expect a pro to dive for a ball like that. My coach would always say, if you can tip it, you can catch it. I didn't see 100% effort on that play. Second possession, second play, Drey on a hook pattern, JM hits him with a bullet and he drops it. Then on 4th down Austin's pattern is a yard short of the first down. He should know better than that. I know we keep focusing on the QB's but it's the rest of the the team that playing like shit. Fumble, wrong pattern, dropped balls, no running game in the second half. We need a better effort to make the playoffs.
This stuff happens to hoyer too on every possession, all guys need to play better, including him.
-
Tour-I seem to recall Colt McCoy, the current starter in Wash. was once a Brown. I thought he had good long term potential but needed the kind of guidance that JM is now getting under Pettine. I thought he came in too early and left too soon with the Browns. As he has gotten older he has developed a stronger passing arm and is maturing as a QB who is reading defenses better now. Am I wrong?
PS- and starting Weeden as a rookie over McCoy was the kiss of death for Weeden, so now he is elsewhere as a backup. I was mostly thinking about the most recent 2 cases when I made that statement.
-
About the rest of the offense (and pass rush and punt returning and placekicking) stepping it up, yes, but it's also part of what happens when we're down to our 4th center, who's actually more a back-up tackle than center, 3rd and 4th TEs, rookie RBs and Josh Gordon's post-suspensions good and bad, which was the case for Hoyer's games last year, too. Even aside from injuries, which always happen to a degree, there were valid reasons why this was supposed to be another 10+ loss season and why we were going to see JFF by game 4.
I'll support and be excited with Hoyer or Manziel, but all that makes Hoyer at 7-5/9-5/10-5 at least respectable no matter how much credit/blame he should get (I prefer leaning toward credit considering the previous 15 years of QBs) and even you think JFF gives us the best shot to win now.
The make-up/injuries of the roster probably made Pettine more likely to stay with Hoyer because, like it or not, game managing, great defense, re-finding the +2, +3 turnover games and staying close enough for 1 or 2 more Hoyer comeback drives add up to our best shot for the next four games.
-
Tour-I seem to recall Colt McCoy, the current starter in Wash. was once a Brown. I thought he had good long term potential but needed the kind of guidance that JM is now getting under Pettine. I thought he came in too early and left too soon with the Browns. As he has gotten older he has developed a stronger passing arm and is maturing as a QB who is reading defenses better now. Am I wrong?
PS- and starting Weeden as a rookie over McCoy was the kiss of death for Weeden, so now he is elsewhere as a backup. I was mostly thinking about the most recent 2 cases when I made that statement.
Tour-I seem to recall Colt McCoy, the current starter in Wash. was once a Brown. I thought he had good long term potential but needed the kind of guidance that JM is now getting under Pettine. I thought he came in too early and left too soon with the Browns. As he has gotten older he has developed a stronger passing arm and is maturing as a QB who is reading defenses better now. Am I wrong?
PS- and starting Weeden as a rookie over McCoy was the kiss of death for Weeden, so now he is elsewhere as a backup. I was mostly thinking about the most recent 2 cases when I made that statement.
I was with you on Colt until the bitter end. As a rook he was pressed into service after our 1 and 2 QBs (Delhomme and Wallace) went down with high ankle sprains. He then played relatively well through 2011 before Harrison laid him out.
2012 brought Wheezy (drafted in a FO panic move... close on the heels of the earlier, trade-up-for-TR, panic move) and a sham competition to start in Shurmur's vertical scheme. In Colt's last appearance for us, he was over-throwing the ball and produced more worm-burners than completions. May have been his futile attempt to overcome his "noodle-arm" moniker, which IMO was always hyperbolic, and earn the regain job.
Speculation on my part, but I think we now see that Colt's arm was never right when he was with us. It was still healing from the Bowl game, nerve damage injury. His arm showed signs of being more "live" last year in SF; it shows more signs now.
Bottom line... Colt was given a last chance... and did not look the part.
While I agree a rookie can be ruined by starting too early, IMO, Wheezy never had "it". And you can't ruin what was never there. You can't give up prematurely on what is never there.
-
-
One year older, one year wiser.
-
I doubt he reads the board, why are you wishing him a Happy Birthday? Just because we needed another QB thread? Oh, Walter.
Let's see 22 years old, that was 1988 for this Johnny M. I was partying my ass off, traveling all over the country and nailing everything that moved. So we got that in common.
Zombo
--But I wasn't second string.
-
I just noticed it was his birthday a couple hours ago. saw it with other today's birthdays in an email advertising something. I was going to post it but didn't.
WSS
-
it's also the birthday of Agnes Moorehead. So there.
I posted that just to piss off the fans of Margaret Hamilton.
WSS
-
Happy bday future Browns HOF QB!
Hello! It looks like you're interested in this conversation, but you don't have an account yet.
Getting fed up of having to scroll through the same posts each visit? When you register for an account, you'll always come back to exactly where you were before, and choose to be notified of new replies (either via email, or push notification). You'll also be able to save bookmarks and upvote posts to show your appreciation to other community members.
With your input, this post could be even better 💗
Register Login