Should we consider Andre Smith Should he Fall to #5
-
Smith may very well be one of those kids who can dominate at their level.
But, just because you have the stellar ability to play, doesn't mean you WANT to.
And, a player can act like he's motivated for a while, but with the $$$$$$ and a few
years, it will show that he doesn't really care.
There was a LOT of time for Smith to know if he wanted to go for it in the combine or not.
His pro day would have to include -extensive- reasons why he bailed at the combine.
I don't know...
Give me players who LOVE the freakin game and get mean about going after playing the game
at the next level.
-
Excellent post, Tom.
Smith is surprisingly athletic for the way he looks. The kid can play. As John Gruden said, there are alot of teams picking in the middle of the first round that are loving these conversations of Smith dropping out of the top 10.
You make a good point by saying he's not in trouble with the law nor mixed up with drugs and that kind of thing. He may not be the sharpest tool in the shed, or as you said, simply lacks the right kind of guidance from someone that he takes to heart, but the kid can play.
Having said all that, I can't see taking a Right Tackle with the #5 overall pick. I'm still on the Orakpo bandwagon.
-Al
Excellent post, Tom.
Smith is surprisingly athletic for the way he looks. The kid can play. As John Gruden said, there are alot of teams picking in the middle of the first round that are loving these conversations of Smith dropping out of the top 10.
You make a good point by saying he's not in trouble with the law nor mixed up with drugs and that kind of thing. He may not be the sharpest tool in the shed, or as you said, simply lacks the right kind of guidance from someone that he takes to heart, but the kid can play.
Having said all that, I can't see taking a Right Tackle with the #5 overall pick. I'm still on the Orakpo bandwagon.
-Al
Thanks Al! There's alot of exciting opportunities for us. It's like going grocery shopping when you're hungry - everything looks delicious and needed. We definitely need pass rushers/LBers on D.
Regarding Andre: there's coaches out there that could get alot of good football out of him. You know who REALLY work well with this kid? Mike Singletary and I think that's the team Gruden was referring to hoping Andre falls to them. It'll be interesting.
I doubt we're going after Andre BUT I certainly wouldn't lose any sleep if we did. To really feel his value - just look at Bama WITH him and then see how much they changed without him. HUGE difference.
If we just want to have a little fun here with an unlikely scenario - here's how we COULD look with Andre being our younger version of Erik Williams here:
Joe Thomas Eric Steinbach Hank Fraley R.Tucker/R.Hadnot Andre Smith
I'm not sure where we are with RG. I don't know who stays between Hadnot, Tucker, Shaffer and McKinnie. I think Shaffer would fare much better inside at RG against the wider girths than he does out on the edge. As history has shown us, we're 1 or 2 injuries away from "uh-oh" on the oline so you never know until that pick is announced.
Carolina went with the two 1st round draft picks at OT: Jordan Gross and Jeff Otah. That worked out real well.
- Tom F.
I welcome the only Defensive Coordinator to earn a Superbowl Ring in New Orleans while understanding Revenge of the Nerds is a sequel. "Come get some!" -
Not sure about Shaffer at RG. Don't think he's strong enough at the point to get push against short, wide-bodied DT's.
Remember, this is a guy who earned a big deal playing in Atlanta's ZBS. The only way I could see him moving inside is if we switched to a scheme that emphasized blocking on the move. And from what I can tell, we're moving in more of a power blocking direction.
-
Excellent post, Tom.
Smith is surprisingly athletic for the way he looks. The kid can play. As John Gruden said, there are alot of teams picking in the middle of the first round that are loving these conversations of Smith dropping out of the top 10.
You make a good point by saying he's not in trouble with the law nor mixed up with drugs and that kind of thing. He may not be the sharpest tool in the shed, or as you said, simply lacks the right kind of guidance from someone that he takes to heart, but the kid can play.
Having said all that, I can't see taking a Right Tackle with the #5 overall pick. I'm still on the Orakpo bandwagon.
-Al
Thanks Al! There's alot of exciting opportunities for us. It's like going grocery shopping when you're hungry - everything looks delicious and needed. We definitely need pass rushers/LBers on D.
Regarding Andre: there's coaches out there that could get alot of good football out of him. You know who REALLY work well with this kid? Mike Singletary and I think that's the team Gruden was referring to hoping Andre falls to them. It'll be interesting.
I doubt we're going after Andre BUT I certainly wouldn't lose any sleep if we did. To really feel his value - just look at Bama WITH him and then see how much they changed without him. HUGE difference.
If we just want to have a little fun here with an unlikely scenario - here's how we COULD look with Andre being our younger version of Erik Williams here:
Joe Thomas Eric Steinbach Hank Fraley R.Tucker/R.Hadnot Andre Smith
I'm not sure where we are with RG. I don't know who stays between Hadnot, Tucker, Shaffer and McKinnie. I think Shaffer would fare much better inside at RG against the wider girths than he does out on the edge. As history has shown us, we're 1 or 2 injuries away from "uh-oh" on the oline so you never know until that pick is announced.
Carolina went with the two 1st round draft picks at OT: Jordan Gross and Jeff Otah. That worked out real well.
- Tom F.
Carolina went with the two 1st round draft picks at OT: Jordan Gross and Jeff Otah. That worked out real well.
- Tom F.
Gross was an 8th overall pick (2003).
Otah was 19th overall (2008).
I don't see anything wrong with that, but #5 overall is gonna command some serious dollars. There is a serious dropoff in dollars somewhere around that 7th/8th overall pick, so Carolina theoretically did very well for themselves with those two picks. There will likely be a better impact player for us at #5 than a RT. I'm tempted to say that putting a #5 overall caliber OT at RT would be wasting his talent.
The 2nd round is a nice place to find several quality starters, such as Safeties, SILBs, Centers, and RTs. There's always a Tony Ugoh or Marcus McNeill to be found in round 2...i.e. a guy who just doesn't have what it takes to be 1st round material. Maybe because of speed/footwork but not because of a lack of toughness.
The problem is that we only have one 2nd rounder, and without a 3rd rounder we have to get it right. If we're going to go OL in the 2nd in 2009, I'd like one of the Centers, preferably Eric Wood. 2nd rounders are dirt cheap. We really need a difference maker at #5 overall.
I would hate to see us trying to replace Tucker, Shaffer, and Fraley all in one year (2010?), but that 2nd rounder might be better used on a guy like Rashad Jennings or Shonn Greene. If we can get a solid RB in round 2, by all means jump all over that.
Somewhat surprisingly, the talent at Safety is thin in this year's draft. Same goes for ILBs. After Laurinitis and Maualuga, there's a big dropoff. That means that our best bet in round 2 would be OL or RB, possibly OLB.
-Al, who is glad that free agency starts Friday.
-
Not sure about Shaffer at RG. Don't think he's strong enough at the point to get push against short, wide-bodied DT's.
Remember, this is a guy who earned a big deal playing in Atlanta's ZBS. The only way I could see him moving inside is if we switched to a scheme that emphasized blocking on the move. And from what I can tell, we're moving in more of a power blocking direction.
Aloysius said:
Not sure about Shaffer at RG. Don't think he's strong enough at the point to get push against short, wide-bodied DT's.Remember, this is a guy who earned a big deal playing in Atlanta's ZBS. The only way I could see him moving inside is if we switched to a scheme that emphasized blocking on the move. And from what I can tell, we're moving in more of a power blocking direction.
Good point Aloy! Thanks! Who's coming back between Shaffer, Tucker, Hadnot and McKinney? Do you know?
- Tom F.
-
I just love this.....The guy is setting off one warning sign after another and there is still those out there that would want him.
It's says something about society today.
Pointing out that he is fat is just one of the many obvious problems with this kid.
It wasn't just the decision to not work out. From the reports it was more. There were reports that he was horrible in the interviews and dressed inappropriately for the interviews. I think it was a combination of things that made teams drop him from their big boards supposedly.
Since his fiasco with his agent before the bowl game (Which cost his team!) Smith has been on a steady downhill roll.....And yet some idiot GM and coach will still draft him in the first round. It'll come back to bite them in the ass.
You want guys that lack character and good judgement? Have at him.
How many guys that lack the motivation to get in shape and that lack good sound judgment become champions? Not many.
As another poster just said in another thread....It's heart, desire and motivation that seperates the great ones from the rest of the league. The things I suspect Smith lacks.
oldcow1945 said:
I just love this.....The guy is setting off one warning sign after another and there is still those out there that would want him.It's says something about society today.
Pointing out that he is fat is just one of the many obvious problems with this kid.
Inspite of me thinking Andre's a terrific football player, I COMPLETELY understand where you are coming from or any NFL thinking this way. I can't imagine blowing off the interviews did anything but hurt him. That's why I said I feel bad this kid isn't very bright. Before I said let's have fun with a scenario when I plugged him in as our RT, I made sure I prefaced it with I DOUBT we'll take him. Phil gave up too many draft picks in 07 and 08 for us to go high risk. I don't think Rey or Andre missed any regular season games to bad behavior in their final 2 seasons.
I STILL say, I don't think Andre became a terrible football player on 2/21/09. I also don't think this is a case of a kid DISLIKING football more than it's an insecurity of barbells and track spikes don't tell the whole story about HOW WELL he plays. And if you CLEARLY don't have an agent when your peers have already practiced their dress rehearsals - maybe holding off until someone guides him better might be better than blank satres following questions he's not ready for. If Andre goes to a Head Coach like Singletary I think it's a perfect fit for him. When it's time for the snap I don't care if he has Jackie Slater abs as long as he's has Jackie Slater talent. I'll swim upstream and root for this kid - weren't peopple rooting for Jamal when he came here? How is it any different? Kids 21-24 have been known to do things they wished they hadn't.
Unfortunately, the NFL is loaded with head cases and MANY want to be the highest paid players on their team like Chad Johnson, Plex Burress, Steroids Merriman, Me-O. About 3 years ago, if you found 1 Albert Haynesworth fan after he stepped on Gurode's face that was 1 person I didn't know existed. TODAY, he's probably mentioned on every message board. Jamal Lewis went to jail and so did Ray Lewis. Steve Smith got suspended for bizarre behavior. Javon Kearse got a DWI about 3 weeks after getting his signing bonus when he came back to Tennessee. Brandon Marshall did something he had to miss games for. Cedric Benson never showed the Bears what he allegedly wanted NFL teams to think of him pre-draft. If Pac Man could actually cover anyone, he'd still be employed when he SHOULD be in jail. Makes me sick.
Many of those guys went to the Indy interviews after rehearsing the process/answers their agents wanted them to give future NFL employers. How different is the NBA? Are there any Kobe fans? When it's time to get the ball in the hoop guys like Kobe, Jiverson, Penny Hardaway, Barkely, Wallace and Carmello are/were players their teams really counted on. The sport markets their jerseys and they put people in the seats. Some even had coaches fired.
- Tom F.
-
I like character guys too......but am to a point I don't care what kind of eggheads we get as long as they are good.
Give me Smith...add in TO, Pac Man, Plax, Lewis...I don't care.....just win...that is all I care about from here on out.
The good soldier has waited 44 years and that hasn't worked...just win....give it another few years and I won't even care if we cheat.
-
i honestly think with smith's off the field issues as well as leaving the combine early that he will no longer be the first tackle taken. him not staying at the combine opens the door to other top 10 pick tackles to jump into the top 5 and bump smith.
-
From the interviews of kokinis and Mangini....they talk about loving the game,smart, diverse football players with drive and heart....A. smith 350 1 month before the combine, 332 at the combine, no drills done, no agent.......Does that sound like the traits the Browns say they are looking for? not to me
-
I agree, Solon.
Word is that the Browns spoke to Baylor OT Jason Smith. A bit curious, given that he's considered a pure LT, preferably in a zone blocking scheme. But if Curry, Crabtree, and Orakpo are off the board at #5, he wouldn't be such a crazy option.
Haven't heard whether the Browns met with Virginia OT Eugene Monroe.
-
I would imagine we would. It only makes sense to talk to the players who might be there when you draft..
Some of these tackles will be available, so you owe it to your team to talk to them....even if it is to show a false interest and get a team behind us worried we might take them.
I think the Bengals are going OT....any team hoping to get their guy will probably have to jump the Gals. It helps to know just how good a prospect is when people want in to your position to draft him....helps place a better value on the guy as it gives you an idea of how attractive a talent the player really is in relation to who else might be left.
-
this draft is stocked with tackles that we don't need. even if we did, we don't need a trouble maker like smith
How many Super bowls or playoffs have the Browns played in and you worry about a guy who has never got in trouble being a troublemaker
I just want good football players, I want the a very mean, nasty SOB who kicks butt on the field, smacks guys in the face , I am tired off all these so good guys we have that continue to give us 4 and 5 win seasons.
Give me nasty guys like James Harrison and Ray Lewis and I will take them type of players everyday
How many Super bowls or playoffs have the Browns played in and you worry about a guy who has never got in trouble being a troublemaker
I just want good football players, I want the a very mean, nasty SOB who kicks butt on the field, smacks guys in the face , I am tired off all these so good guys we have that continue to give us 4 and 5 win seasons.
Give me nasty guys like James Harrison and Ray Lewis and I will take them type of players everyday
Never got in trouble? Dude got suspended from his team before his bowl game.
Then throw in his combine walk out, giving multiple teams different stories of why he wasn't working out at the combine, and showing up way out of shape. This guy has head case trouble player written all over him.
-
Alabama’s Smith does not post stellar numbers
Andre Smith, one of the top offensive tackle prospects in this year’s draft, said he was relying on Alabama’s pro day to make up for the disappearing act he put on at the combine. Well, his times were not overly impressive, but he did at least work out.
Smith measured in at 6-foot-4 ¼, 325 pounds and ran the 40-yard dash in 5.28 and 5.33 seconds. He had a 25-inch vertical, a 7-foot, 10-inch broad jump, a 7.88-second three-cone drill and 19 bench press reps at 225 pounds. His short shuttle time is still to come as are the times from his Alabama teammates.
To put Smith’s workout in perspective, he did not post a single number that would have placed him in the top performers at his position at the combine and many of his numbers were not even close to the top 10 at his position at the combine.
The 19 reps of 225 is very disappointing. Though Smith has very long arms, you'd think a guy that strong could work his way into the 25-30 range. The bench press is also considered a measure of endurance; that could have been a factor in Smith's poor performance.
-
Alabama’s Smith does not post stellar numbers
Andre Smith, one of the top offensive tackle prospects in this year’s draft, said he was relying on Alabama’s pro day to make up for the disappearing act he put on at the combine. Well, his times were not overly impressive, but he did at least work out.
Smith measured in at 6-foot-4 ¼, 325 pounds and ran the 40-yard dash in 5.28 and 5.33 seconds. He had a 25-inch vertical, a 7-foot, 10-inch broad jump, a 7.88-second three-cone drill and 19 bench press reps at 225 pounds. His short shuttle time is still to come as are the times from his Alabama teammates.
To put Smith’s workout in perspective, he did not post a single number that would have placed him in the top performers at his position at the combine and many of his numbers were not even close to the top 10 at his position at the combine.
The 19 reps of 225 is very disappointing. Though Smith has very long arms, you'd think a guy that strong could work his way into the 25-30 range. The bench press is also considered a measure of endurance; that could have been a factor in Smith's poor performance.
Aloysius said:
The 19 reps of 225 is very disappointing. Though Smith has very long arms, you'd think a guy that strong could work his way into the 25-30 range. The bench press is also considered a measure of endurance; that could have been a factor in Smith's poor performance.19 reps is weak for a tackle who was once thought to be a lock for a top 3 pick.
By the way, thanks for not posting the video of him running the 40. It's not a pretty sight when 340 pounders run with their shirts off.
-
I think this guy has bust written all over him. I wouldn't touch him with a 10 foot pole in any round, let alone the first.
-
From a premium draft site:
The situation has gone from bad to worse for Andre Smith. His bench press results were a pitiful 19-reps. His position work was also very mediocre. One scout has told us is it the "worst workout he ever saw" and a number of scouts are cranky that they made the long trip to Alabama to watch the pitiful workout. A second scout has told us "Smith lost millions of dollars".
-
PFT:
labama offensive tackle Andre Smith’s campus workout today in front of NFL scouts was a “disaster,” according to Tony Pauline of SI.com.
Quoting an unnamed scout, Pauline writes that Smith’s lack of preparation was obvious as he was overweight. One scout called the performance, “one of the worst workouts I’ve ever seen.”
Another AFC East scout told Pauline: “He lost millions today.”
As a league source told us earlier today, Smith ran with his shirt off.
According to Pauline, comments were made about “the flab and the rolls on his body” during Smith’s 40-yard dashes as he posted times between 5.21 and 5.29 seconds.
Per the article, several scouts weren’t happy to travel a long way only to witness a bad workout. And Smith’s trainers were not pleased, either.
and
Alabama offensive tackle Andre Smith didn’t perform well at his Pro Day workout today in front of the entire league after creating a stir by leaving the NFL scouting combine early last month. One league source told us: “He bombed.”
According to NFL.com, Smith was not “overly impressive.” His top 40-yard dash time was 5.28 seconds and he bench pressed 225 pounds just 19 times.
According to our league source, Smith ran with no shirt on and was visibly overweight. With a group of trainers urging him on to run faster, Smith had a generally rough day.
Hello! It looks like you're interested in this conversation, but you don't have an account yet.
Getting fed up of having to scroll through the same posts each visit? When you register for an account, you'll always come back to exactly where you were before, and choose to be notified of new replies (either via email, or push notification). You'll also be able to save bookmarks and upvote posts to show your appreciation to other community members.
With your input, this post could be even better 💗
Register Login