A note to those who want to dump Braylon Edwards.
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Shep come on, not "it is all about the QB" again.
Look when the QB is good, the better WR's make it happen. Good QB play does not mean mediocre WR's get you to the Super Bowl. You need a very good WR on one side to tilt coverage.
I dont care who is playing QB, you need a good WR like BE.
Shep come on, not "it is all about the QB" again.
Look when the QB is good, the better WR's make it happen. Good QB play does not mean mediocre WR's get you to the Super Bowl. You need a very good WR on one side to tilt coverage.
I dont care who is playing QB, you need a good WR like BE.
Butterfingers like so many other savage 1 hit wonders is not as complete or as good a WR as many percieve he frustrates easily and has no solutions to certain coverages and now that kw2 is gone we have no hands or open option at all..we should deal edwards its not like we are going anywhere this year so we should start seeking a new slot 1 that fits the mankok prototype..
DA looked bad because he drank butterfingers kewl-aid and tried to connect with him when he shouldnt have to many times after all your number 1 is the guy thats suppose to make it happen but braylon couldnt..
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@shepwrite said:
I'm not sure I buy the "Number One Receiver" concept. Brady never has a problem with two good receivers and neither does Phil Rivers. Harrison goes down in Indy and someone else steps up. Favre has thrown to some insane number of receivers and not all of them were awesome... especially when they left.It's not ALL the quarterback. It's just that nothing else comes remotely close... in all of team sports. WRs are WAY more dependent on QBs than the other way around. More guys can run and catch than play QB in the NFL.
(Say, remember when Mike Vick had shitty receivers, one of them named Roddy White and another named Michael Jenkins?)
That said, a quarterback is pretty damn dependent on getting solid pass protection.
The slot 1 guy has to be dangerous to open things up elsewhere he also has to accept the fact he is often a decoy instead of the target braylon doesnt like being a decoy and yet often didnt even look back to see if he was the target letting the ball sail right past him..
What im trying to get at is braylon wasnt a convincing decoy or even an aware reciever half the time out there defenders had him frustrated and they knew it..braylon knows he is not all that great but wants to blame anything and everything for his shortcomings..
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mz the pussy I agree with you.
Edwards suffered early from an ankle injury. Any of you couch potatos ever tried to do anything w/ a lacerated ankle?
While playing gimp on the ankle he got a shoulder injury. He dropped some balls early on, then later in the season he just didn't give a fook. Edwards is 100% correct on him being from Michigan leading to criticism.
The guy has more talent then just about every WR in the league, except the elite 3. He will not be traded. He will have another performance like 2007, which by the way, is the most successful season for a WR in Cleveland Browns History.
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The diva has no guts. Period
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@shepwrite said:
I'm not sure I buy the "Number One Receiver" concept. Brady never has a problem with two good receivers and neither does Phil Rivers. Harrison goes down in Indy and someone else steps up. Favre has thrown to some insane number of receivers and not all of them were awesome... especially when they left.You examples are Brady, Manning, Favre, and the guy who had a great year last season. Manning went from one #1 to another, Brady and Favre are freaks, and Rivers had an exceltional season.
You need a good #1. Doesn't have to be Edwards, but without Edwards we don't scare anyone. We, the Browns, need him or a just as good replacement. Coles isn't it.
Using Manning, Favre and Brady as examples of guys who didn't need a number 1 - and you're wrong about Manning, by the way - is not a convincing argument that teams do without. Some - very, very few - can do it.
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Dear mike,
What would be better a guy with less talent and paid less, but catches everything thrown at him
If you can prove to me how a guy with less talent makes more catches, let me in on the secret.
mz. said:
If you can prove to me how a guy with less talent makes more catches, let me in on the secret.No secret really
Just look at the receivers that didn't drop as many balls wait thats everyone 🥷
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mz the pussy I agree with you.
Edwards suffered early from an ankle injury. Any of you couch potatos ever tried to do anything w/ a lacerated ankle?
While playing gimp on the ankle he got a shoulder injury. He dropped some balls early on, then later in the season he just didn't give a fook. Edwards is 100% correct on him being from Michigan leading to criticism.
The guy has more talent then just about every WR in the league, except the elite 3. He will not be traded. He will have another performance like 2007, which by the way, is the most successful season for a WR in Cleveland Browns History.
mz the pussy I agree with you.
Edwards suffered early from an ankle injury. Any of you couch potatos ever tried to do anything w/ a lacerated ankle?
While playing gimp on the ankle he got a shoulder injury. He dropped some balls early on, then later in the season he just didn't give a fook. Edwards is 100% correct on him being from Michigan leading to criticism.
The guy has more talent then just about every WR in the league, except the elite 3. He will not be traded. He will have another performance like 2007, which by the way, is the most successful season for a WR in Cleveland Browns History.
Fine then he leaves cleveland and we don't get SQUAT! Stupid! Find a guy that wants to be here.
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Shep, et al,
Just posted this in another thread, but before we casually impode our entire receiving corps, we might want to look at the four starting WR's from this past SB as a proof statement of their importance:
Fitzgerald
Boldin
Ward
Holmes (lowest rep on this list, but played inspired ball that Sunday)
I shudder to think of starting this next season with a brand new corps of starting WR's/TE's. We're not New England; it won't work.
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the reason to dump BE has nothing to do with talent or dropped passes . It has to do to the fact he'll be a free agent next year. He doesn't want to be a Brown and wants the Fack out of OHIO.
Thank you for your response, Jim, and that scares me a little, too. But if we offered him a lucrative extension, I'm sure he'd take it faster than you can say 'Josh Freeman.'
mz. said:
Thank you for your response, Jim, and that scares me a little, too. But if we offered him a lucrative extension, I'm sure he'd take it faster than you can say 'Josh Freeman.'Don't be hating...I'm right that he is the best QB in this draft....we'll wait and see 3 years from now...anyway...BE will not accept an offer from us...he will be gone...probably to a very large market where he can get endorsements and start his acting career...
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I personally think you don't ever draft a receiver in the top 10 due to the fact there are so many good quality receivers around. I think the position is overrated when it comes to how important it is to have top tier talent. Give me a killer running game and I'll take a couple quality receivers any day over the divas in the league.
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Shep, et al,
Just posted this in another thread, but before we casually impode our entire receiving corps, we might want to look at the four starting WR's from this past SB as a proof statement of their importance:
Fitzgerald
Boldin
Ward
Holmes (lowest rep on this list, but played inspired ball that Sunday)
I shudder to think of starting this next season with a brand new corps of starting WR's/TE's. We're not New England; it won't work.
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mz. said:
Thank you for your response, Jim, and that scares me a little, too. But if we offered him a lucrative extension, I'm sure he'd take it faster than you can say 'Josh Freeman.'Don't be hating...I'm right that he is the best QB in this draft....we'll wait and see 3 years from now...anyway...BE will not accept an offer from us...he will be gone...probably to a very large market where he can get endorsements and start his acting career...
Don't be hating...I'm right that he is the best QB in this draft....we'll wait and see 3 years from now...anyway...BE will not accept an offer from us...he will be gone...probably to a very large market where he can get endorsements and start his acting career...
also don't be too surprised if NE takes freeman at 23
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i'm all for washing our hands of as many players from last years shitfest as possible.
Get what we can, while we can
guns don't kill kids-pitt bulls do. -
Bill Belichick and others have proved that you don't need a star or stud WR to win championships. It's a big plus to have a dominant WR. But it's not what wins championship games.
I want a good offensive line and a stud defense....(Steeler's defense anyone?)
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Shep come on, not "it is all about the QB" again.
Look when the QB is good, the better WR's make it happen. Good QB play does not mean mediocre WR's get you to the Super Bowl. You need a very good WR on one side to tilt coverage.
I dont care who is playing QB, you need a good WR like BE.
Shep come on, not "it is all about the QB" again.
Look when the QB is good, the better WR's make it happen. Good QB play does not mean mediocre WR's get you to the Super Bowl. You need a very good WR on one side to tilt coverage.
I dont care who is playing QB, you need a good WR like BE.
Really? What great WR's did Tom Brady throw to for all of the Patriot championship teams?
David Patten? Torrence Small? Troy Brown? Deion Branch? Kevin Kasper? David Givens?
Shep is exactly right!!!
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i'm all for washing our hands of as many players from last years shitfest as possible.
Get what we can, while we can
i'm all for washing our hands of as many players from last years shitfest as possible.
Get what we can, while we can
i just wanted to say it again
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Shep come on, not "it is all about the QB" again.
Look when the QB is good, the better WR's make it happen. Good QB play does not mean mediocre WR's get you to the Super Bowl. You need a very good WR on one side to tilt coverage.
I dont care who is playing QB, you need a good WR like BE.
Really? What great WR's did Tom Brady throw to for all of the Patriot championship teams?
David Patten? Torrence Small? Troy Brown? Deion Branch? Kevin Kasper? David Givens?
Shep is exactly right!!!
oldcow1945 said:
Really? What great WR's did Tom Brady throw to for all of the Patriot championship teams?David Patten? Torrence Small? Troy Brown? Deion Branch? Kevin Kasper? David Givens?
And notice how Brady's quarterback rating went up 30 points when he got to throw to Moss and Welker.
Branch and Givens are/were pretty good receivers, btw. The Pats were able to get a 1st Round pick in exchange for Branch, and Givens ended up signing a big FA contract. Were it not for a terrible knee injury, Givens might have developed into a great #2 receiver.
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@shepwrite said:
On the other hand, Calvin Johnson is the most talented WR in the history of hands... and he went 0-16. That was his effect on the bottom line given a shaky QB situation.Dude had 78 catches, 1,331 yards, and 12 TD's last year.
Instead of saying, "He's nothing without a good QB," you should be saying, "With a good quarterback, he could be one of the best ever."
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oldcow1945 said:
Really? What great WR's did Tom Brady throw to for all of the Patriot championship teams?David Patten? Torrence Small? Troy Brown? Deion Branch? Kevin Kasper? David Givens?
And notice how Brady's quarterback rating went up 30 points when he got to throw to Moss and Welker.
Branch and Givens are/were pretty good receivers, btw. The Pats were able to get a 1st Round pick in exchange for Branch, and Givens ended up signing a big FA contract. Were it not for a terrible knee injury, Givens might have developed into a great #2 receiver.
Aloysius said:
And notice how Brady's quarterback rating went up 30 points when he got to throw to Moss and Welker.Branch and Givens are/were pretty good receivers, btw. The Pats were able to get a 1st Round pick in exchange for Branch, and Givens ended up signing a big FA contract. Were it not for a terrible knee injury, Givens might have developed into a great #2 receiver.
Yep....And how did that trade go for the Seahawks? Wait....Branch was never the same. It was Tom Brady that made him a good WR.
David Givens was pretty good? This 7th round pick caught 2, 3, 6 and 1 TD in his four seasons with the Pats. Tw0 seasons of over 50 catches. Let's have a comparison...Braylon Edwards caught 55 pases and 3 TD's this year. That was an Average year for Givens....For two years anyways. He didn't do anything but for those two years. I'd barely call him average.
Let's take a closer look at David Patten to prove this point even further...In his 12 season career he has had 4 moderately successful seasons. Guess who 3 of those 4 successful seasons were with? The Pats.
But your post misses the entire point. Whether or not Brady and the Pats had a year for the record books in 2007, it has no bearing on my point. The point is Tom brady was going to go down as one of the top 10 QB's in the history of the NFL before Randy Moss....And Tom brady won numerous Championships and MVP's with, yes, very average WR's.
We are talking great Qb's and Championships here......And my point is still the same and just as valid.
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Aloysius said:
And notice how Brady's quarterback rating went up 30 points when he got to throw to Moss and Welker.Branch and Givens are/were pretty good receivers, btw. The Pats were able to get a 1st Round pick in exchange for Branch, and Givens ended up signing a big FA contract. Were it not for a terrible knee injury, Givens might have developed into a great #2 receiver.
Yep....And how did that trade go for the Seahawks? Wait....Branch was never the same. It was Tom Brady that made him a good WR.
David Givens was pretty good? This 7th round pick caught 2, 3, 6 and 1 TD in his four seasons with the Pats. Tw0 seasons of over 50 catches. Let's have a comparison...Braylon Edwards caught 55 pases and 3 TD's this year. That was an Average year for Givens....For two years anyways. He didn't do anything but for those two years. I'd barely call him average.
Let's take a closer look at David Patten to prove this point even further...In his 12 season career he has had 4 moderately successful seasons. Guess who 3 of those 4 successful seasons were with? The Pats.
But your post misses the entire point. Whether or not Brady and the Pats had a year for the record books in 2007, it has no bearing on my point. The point is Tom brady was going to go down as one of the top 10 QB's in the history of the NFL before Randy Moss....And Tom brady won numerous Championships and MVP's with, yes, very average WR's.
We are talking great Qb's and Championships here......And my point is still the same and just as valid.
oldcow1945 said:
But your post misses the entire point. Whether or not Brady and the Pats had a year for the record books in 2007, it has no bearing on my point. The point is Tom brady was going to go down as one of the top 10 QB's in the history of the NFL before Randy Moss....And Tom brady won numerous Championships and MVP's with, yes, very average WR's.We are talking great Qb's and Championships here......And my point is still the same and just as valid.
If that's your point, doesn't it speak more to the greatness of Tom Brady than what we should do to insure our young QB succeeds?
If we make personnel moves based on the assumption that we already have a Tom Brady, we won't do enough to make sure BQ has anywhere near that kind of success.
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