Mike Iupati. Give him his asking price and watch the running game go.
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Right Tackle. Greco makes Schwartz look like a 12 year old girl
Yes. IF they opt to draft a projected "starter". RT would be the spot......though, personally, I think Schwartz does just fine and is more maligned than his play suggests he should be.....I guess #5 outta 5 is a fact...but 1 thru 4 are all pretty frigging good!
Really? There are 6 RGs ahead of Greco, but only 4 LGs??? I did not think NFL teams supported their RTs with their better OG that much. Not that #11 overall is low, but I'm actually surprised he's that low. He had a great year.
Yep....actually, Id say Greco was #6, cause one of the ones ahead didn't play a full season(Zietler-Cinn).....but Grecos PFF was in the green at +15.6....oh so solid.....and Bito was #2 LG at an amazing +22.4 (10.2 pass/11.7 run).....talk about solid....
Top 5 RG:
Marshall Yanda
T.J. Lang
Zach Martin
Brandon Brooks
Brandon Linder.......then Greco....
Top 5 LG:
Josh Sitton
Joel Bitonio....22.4
K. Osemele
Orlando Franklin
Mike Iupoti.....11.2
So, we go full circle, because we can see that Bito rated twice as high as Lupoti.....and Greco was higher too.....so, Id ask the OP who Lupoti is supposed to replace??? And are we supposed to change systems and assume he will switch sides and improve enough to be better than Greco???.......ha!....hilarious.....
Edit:..Ill add that Bito missed being #1 by just a few tenths of a point and had his only 2 negative grades the last 2 games.....meaning, had he had just played to his established season standard in the last game, he'd be #1.....
You did read the above where PFF graded Greco out higher than Iupati didn't you?
... Grecos PFF was in the green at +15.6....oh so solid...
Top 5 RG:
Marshall Yanda
T.J. Lang
Zach Martin
Brandon Brooks
Brandon Linder.......then Greco....
Top 5 LG:
Josh Sitton
Joel Bitonio....22.4
K. Osemele
Orlando Franklin
Mike Iupoti.....11.2
Oh... and Greco made Bito look like a choir boy.
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Grading out is an exact science. I've seen a ton of Niner games and Iupati can knock anyone on their ass. I just think Bitonio deserves another bully on the line like himself.
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Grading out is an exact science. I've seen a ton of Niner games and Iupati can knock anyone on their ass. I just think Bitonio deserves another bully on the line like himself.
Grading out is an exact science. I've seen a ton of Niner games and Iupati can knock anyone on their ass. I just think Bitonio deserves another bully on the line like himself.
At 8M or more a year when Greco is under contract for two more seasons with a cap hit which is less than 1M? Why not use that cap space to fill the needs of the team?
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Grading out is an exact science. I've seen a ton of Niner games and Iupati can knock anyone on their ass. I just think Bitonio deserves another bully on the line like himself.
Grading out is an exact science.
Glad you saw the light...
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
That reminds me... I have two games to grade yet. It'll be fun comparing to PFF.
I'm sorta with you on Mitchell, but I noticed you did not post where Mitch ranked...
No, he's not terrible, but rather than him being #5 in our O-line ranking of 1,2,3,4,5, I think it's more like 1,2,3,4,6... maybe 7. Even with Greco at 4 (which I'll grudgingly accept) there's still a gap to Mitch.
The problem with upgrading RT is I think we are still one, good O-lineman shy. I have zero faith that Mitch can step inside.
Same is likely true if we nab an OG, but I think either of our starting guards could step out to OT on their side and do fairly well.
I'm sorta with you on Mitchell, but I noticed you did not post where Mitch ranked...
No, he's not terrible, but rather than him being #5 in our O-line ranking of 1,2,3,4,5, I think it's more like 1,2,3,4,6... maybe 7. Even with Greco at 4 (which I'll grudgingly accept) there's still a gap to Mitch.
The problem with upgrading RT is I think we are still one, good O-lineman shy. I have zero faith that Mitch can step inside.
Same is likely true if we nab an OG, but I think either of our starting guards could step out to OT on their side and do fairly well.
I agree Mitchell is not the same caliber....just not as bad as people like to claim.....I will say the man hasnt missed a snap since he was drafted and is 1 of only 3 RT's that played every snap this year too....he was not plus or minus and graded out at a very even +0.5 overall.....ranking him 8th among right tackles and 24th overall tackle....
The real neg against him is his game grades out as very unbalanced, while our other guys seem to have it going both ways..... his pass blocking graded out at a very nice +6.3, but his run blocking was an abysmal -6.6.....tho, id rather it be this than the opposite....
Here is the whole line, with pass/rush/overall grades:
Thomas - +21/+14/+33......Note: Nothing new here. HOF type stuff. Again.
Bitonio - +10/+12/+22.... .Note: Extremely high in both run/pass block. Easily the best/most balanced #'s in the league
Mack - +1 / +5 / + 6 ......Note: factored over 16 games, Mack was on track for the low 20"s overall ( + zero penalties)
Greco - +2 /+12/+16 ......Note: Greco is one of only 2 guards in the whole league to score green in all 5 categories
Schwartz +6/ -6/ +0.5 ......Note: Only had 6 penalties over 1100 snaps
At 8M or more a year when Greco is under contract for two more seasons with a cap hit which is less than 1M? Why not use that cap space to fill the needs of the team?
I agree,,,,only makes sense....
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Frank Gore has no speed and the Niners running game has been great since he joined the team. Bitonio and Iupati play with a mean streak. Thomas and Mack are great technicians and finesse players. Bitonio or Iupati on the right side would balance out the line. Going from LG to RG isn't that drastic a switch.
Frank Gore has no speed and the Niners running game has been great since he joined the team. Bitonio and Iupati play with a mean streak. Thomas and Mack are great technicians and finesse players. Bitonio or Iupati on the right side would balance out the line. Going from LG to RG isn't that drastic a switch.
So you now want to take Iupati, move him to a spot he hasn't played in a long time (RG) and replace a RG with a better pass protection grade on the side with our weakest line in the Oline?
Is that about right?
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we need 2 OLmen (RG and a general backup/C) and 2 DLmen. i don't care where they come from just sign them.
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I was going to mention incognito's name yesterday but it appears buffalo likes him.
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I'm sorta with you on Mitchell, but I noticed you did not post where Mitch ranked...
No, he's not terrible, but rather than him being #5 in our O-line ranking of 1,2,3,4,5, I think it's more like 1,2,3,4,6... maybe 7. Even with Greco at 4 (which I'll grudgingly accept) there's still a gap to Mitch.
The problem with upgrading RT is I think we are still one, good O-lineman shy. I have zero faith that Mitch can step inside.
Same is likely true if we nab an OG, but I think either of our starting guards could step out to OT on their side and do fairly well.
I agree Mitchell is not the same caliber....just not as bad as people like to claim.....I will say the man hasnt missed a snap since he was drafted and is 1 of only 3 RT's that played every snap this year too....he was not plus or minus and graded out at a very even +0.5 overall.....ranking him 8th among right tackles and 24th overall tackle....
The real neg against him is his game grades out as very unbalanced, while our other guys seem to have it going both ways..... his pass blocking graded out at a very nice +6.3, but his run blocking was an abysmal -6.6.....tho, id rather it be this than the opposite....
Here is the whole line, with pass/rush/overall grades:
Thomas - +21/+14/+33......Note: Nothing new here. HOF type stuff. Again.
Bitonio - +10/+12/+22.... .Note: Extremely high in both run/pass block. Easily the best/most balanced #'s in the league
Mack - +1 / +5 / + 6 ......Note: factored over 16 games, Mack was on track for the low 20"s overall ( + zero penalties)
Greco - +2 /+12/+16 ......Note: Greco is one of only 2 guards in the whole league to score green in all 5 categories
Schwartz +6/ -6/ +0.5 ......Note: Only had 6 penalties over 1100 snaps
At 8M or more a year when Greco is under contract for two more seasons with a cap hit which is less than 1M? Why not use that cap space to fill the needs of the team?
I agree,,,,only makes sense....
Mitchell... was not plus or minus and graded out at a very even +0.5 overall.....ranking him 8th among right tackles and 24th overall tackle...
The real neg against him is his game grades out as very unbalanced, while our other guys seem to have it going both ways..... his pass blocking graded out at a very nice +6.3, but his run blocking was an abysmal -6.6.....tho, id rather it be this than the opposite....
Here is the whole line, with pass/rush/overall grades:
Thomas - +21/+14/+33......Note: Nothing new here. HOF type stuff. Again.
Bitonio - +10/+12/+22.... .Note: Extremely high in both run/pass block. Easily the best/most balanced #'s in the league
Mack - +1 / +5 / + 6 ......Note: factored over 16 games, Mack was on track for the low 20"s overall ( + zero penalties)
Greco - +2 /+12/+16 ......Note: Greco is one of only 2 guards in the whole league to score green in all 5 categories
Schwartz +6/ -6/ +0.5 ......Note: Only had 6 penalties over 1100 snaps
"Very even" sounds like an almost complement.
Mitch is the one O-lineman that is hurt by the ZBS.
What are the other categories?
we need 2 OLmen (RG and a general backup/C) and 2 DLmen. i don't care where they come from just sign them.
You and your frickin' RG calls... like a faucet dripping... Leave John boy alone.
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sorry tour. throw all the statistical mumbo jumbo at us all you want.
schwartz sucks and everyone knows it.
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sorry tour. throw all the statistical mumbo jumbo at us all you want.
schwartz sucks and everyone knows it.
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Schwartz isn't bad. he's just not good either. replace him, put him as the #1 backup, and that's how our numbers increase.
The more labels you have for yourself, the dumber they make you. "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." Paul Brown -
sorry tour. throw all the statistical mumbo jumbo at us all you want.
schwartz sucks and everyone knows it.
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Schwartz isn't bad. he's just not good either. replace him, put him as the #1 backup, and that's how our numbers increase.
Schwartz isn't bad.....
Nope.....he's not.
Now, Nick McDonald?......he was bad(real bad)....- 28.3......yet there were 2 others who were worse....is that even possible?
No, not really...and had our guy played all 16, he'd be minus 70 or so......maybe worse....?
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Maybe, but you have to remember that Nick actually improved quite a bit in his last couple games. Then got his ankle rolled vs. BUF.
Fortunately Seymore was there to set us back when Nick went down...
It is only when you toss MqQuistan's utter failure at RG into the mix that you begin to appreciate how truly thin we were in the O-line.
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we need 2 OLmen (RG and a general backup/C) and 2 DLmen. i don't care where they come from just sign them.
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Why can't we move Mitchell Schwartz inside?fixed it. (was raging war yesterday).
i like unsympathic's idea of replacing schwartz with someone better and keeping him as a backup lineman.
WSS
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Why can't we move Mitchell Schwartz inside?
No reason why you can't. Question is, why would you want to?
Personally I've never seen anything in him that makes me think he'd be more successful at OG.
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We have 2 tackles who haven't missed a snap EVER and our whole offense collapsed this season because we didn't have a viable Guard or Center back up.....yet I keep hearing we should draft tackle.....
My theory is the only OT that is gonna replace Schwartz is gonna come 1st round. And THAT isnt our primary need on o line. Guard/Center is.....so we still have to correct THIS, so that means yet another high OL pick?.....
If we do that, then it leaves very little for D line, LB, WR, etc......
So.....for me.....OT early this year is a mistake.....
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