Jonathan Paul Manziel
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Arm strength is a combination of things, some of which can be taught, some can't. You need wrist snap, you need shoulder and elbow snap - you can train your quick-twitch muscles to some degree, but some people just have more aptitude than others. You can train all your life and not crack a 10-second 100m; Usain Bolt can train one day a week and do that for the next 5 years easy.
agreed....its about way more than strength.....
Id think it was a lot like swinging a ball bat or golf club....motion and speed control distance as much or more than pure strength
A natural motion will get you more power than any weight training will.....and I think it's hard to develop that.....
I love Connor Shaw...but am willing to accept he likely wont suddenly develop the physical tools needed to be a great passer......
agreed....its about way more than strength.....
Id think it was a lot like swinging a ball bat or golf club....motion and speed control distance as much or more than pure strength
A natural motion will get you more power than any weight training will.....and I think it's hard to develop that.....
I love Connor Shaw...but am willing to accept he likely wont suddenly develop the physical tools needed to be a great passer......
I'd take a clone of Brian Hoyer though, he could be an excellent backup to JFF in a few years...
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Kinda feel for Hoyer right now......Last year, he was so preoccupied and discombobulated by JFF and the high profile QB competition that he couldn't just settle in an focus....and now, somehow, he's gotten himself back into another one.....and it's on hard knocks to boot.....ha!
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Kinda feel for Hoyer right now......Last year, he was so preoccupied and discombobulated by JFF and the high profile QB competition that he couldn't just settle in an focus....and now, somehow, he's gotten himself back into another one.....and it's on hard knocks to boot.....ha!
Kinda feel for Hoyer right now......Last year, he was so preoccupied and discombobulated by JFF and the high profile QB competition that he couldn't just settle in an focus....and now, somehow, he's gotten himself back into another one.....and it's on hard knocks to boot.....ha!
Oh that slipped by me! I saw it was the texans, but didn't register that it was Hoyer vs Mallett. Should be interesting.
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.....It seems like you just think Johnnys cool and took 20 posts to articulate it.....and you assume that since you think JFF is cool, that EVERYBODY else must agree.....(and, somehow, JERSEYS are the proof....cause everybody buys jerseys based upon "cool factor")(which I think is very wrong...normally, its kids who buy based upon cool factor)
The videos you posted are of JFF getting a penalty for running his mouth....and a video of him tea bagging(disrespecting) an opponent....etc.....and then you claim this is edgy bad boy type stuff we should all like and want from our leader... while many of us just consider it childish immature stuff we dont like....see?........
Heck.... there are kids who love Beiber and think he's cool too....and they arent able to understand why so many people mock him......BUT, as they grow up, it becomes more obvious to them......takes time....
In the end....it's about polarity....the traits that make him so popular are the exact same traits that so many hate....
My analogy.....Johnny is like a pair of sagging pants......some think it's super cool......others laugh and think it's stupid.....
And no one will ever agree.......polarity 101......
Talking about Johnny is like debating abortion, climate change, politics and religion.....there are too many delusional extremists on both sides that wont even allow it to be a reasonable discussion....
It was more than just kids that loved him at A&M.
I posted the clips because Zombo's delusional self tried to act like he was a total wuss on the field (because 6 quarters against 3 quality defenses OBVIOUSLY cancelled out 26 college games).
The average A&M fan....went to A&M. The average NFL fan has a bit less of an academic resume. But we were all just a bunch of little schoolgirls and we can count on the über enlightened and mature NFL fans to set us all straight? Come on.
I posted the clips because Zombo's delusional self tried to act like he was a total wuss on the field
What? What did I say about him on the field?
Zombo
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I posted the clips because Zombo's delusional self tried to act like he was a total wuss on the field
What? What did I say about him on the field?
Zombo
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I hope you're right and hell I could be wrong but I just don't get that vibe as much as you do. It doesn't matter though when Thad "the champ" Lewis beats everyone else out and leads us to the promise land. Right? Anyone?
I like Connor Shaw but his negative is lack of arm strength. I have read a couple articles on working on improving throwing strength and some say it can be developed through training while others say it basically is something after a certain age you either have it or you don't.
I like Connor Shaw but his negative is lack of arm strength. I have read a couple articles on working on improving throwing strength and some say it can be developed through training while others say it basically is something after a certain age you either have it or you don't.
I'm definitely on the latter side of that equation for sure. College is the time to figure out mechanics, hone arm strength and develop footwork. It's very rare (and I'm sure there's instances before someone spouts it off) that QB's drastically increase arm strength in the NFL. Shaw is who he is and I think he's got the makings to be a journeyman back-up, but that's it.
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Don't need to be sorry to me. I'm one of the few old men that think having Ice Cream Men (they dress in all white ice cream men uniforms and all they need is a cap) as cheerleaders is a throwback to the middle ages. We need to hire Kate Upton to choose our cheerleaders for us,.
So letting a civilian become a Yell Leader wasn't enough for you?
So letting a civilian become a Yell Leader wasn't enough for you?
Not a difficult choice at all for me.
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Johnny Manziel will be MVP.................
.400+ hitter and infielder in HS who was a late rounder for San Diego Padres (not Chargers). LOL!
All kidding aside-I really like Joe Haden-the team leader in so many ways for the Browns both on and off the field!!
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Johnny Manziel will be MVP.................
.400+ hitter and infielder in HS who was a late rounder for San Diego Padres (not Chargers). LOL!
All kidding aside-I really like Joe Haden-the team leader in so many ways for the Browns both on and off the field!!
All kidding aside-I really like Joe Haden-the team leader in so many ways for the Browns both on and off the field!!
Everybody likes Haden!.....(Im pretty sure)......and Joe Thomas too......which, I think, is the point we are all trying to make.....
WHY?......first, because they are great players......BUT what makes them REALLY loved is that they are class guys......total professionals....civic minded.....active in the community....and GREAT team mates......(on top of being great players)...
Haden is in the news almost daily.....highly visible...a pretty stylish playa.....at all the Cavs games....on social media....etc etc etc and it's ALWAYS good.....always.....
Yet, I keep hearing we should embrace(and actually prefer) the bad boy thing .........
Given the choice, who wouldn't prefer a player with the "whole package" over one who plays great, but detracts in other ways????
Examples.....(assuming the players were about equal and I know some arent)...but who would you prefer...
a guy like T.O..... or Jerry Rice?
a guy like A. Suh.. or AJ Watt?
a guy like Manziel...or Russell Wilson?
a guy like M. Lynch....or Walter Payton?
And Ive heard "if he plays great, then suddenly you'll all love him"......well, I remember Albert Belle all too well......I did like his homers, but never liked him.....and never was a "fan" of his......all my love goes to Thome......why?.....cause I LIKED him and he played great....thats why........no love for Bell though....and he played GREAT!.....why?...because he was an asshole and constantly embarrassed his team, our city and fans.......over and over again......
Look....Cleveland is has been a whipping boy for decades....especially the Browns ....we dont need it anymore and JFF adds to the "clevelands a joke" thing on a weekly(or mnthly) basis.....
So, excuse me if I dont get excited about the prospect of my QB(great or not) teabagging opposing players.....talking back to refs.....and generally being a rooster on AND off the field........especially one who is unwilling to sacrifice his personal fun time to achieving at a career most of could only dream of.....
So, for the ones who love him "no matter what" .....be prepared for some to still not like him, even if he gets great, unless he learns some of the people skills that guys like Thomas and Haden have.........
You all act so freaking upset that people talk about him, yet THAT was the whole issue coming in from day #1....shoulda seen this coming, cause we did.....you got your boy, but just dont want to deal with the stink we all knew was swirling around him......
Remember Charlie Browns buddy Pigpen?...probably a nice guy with good traits, but man, peeee yewwww.......
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I posted the clips because Zombo's delusional self tried to act like he was a total wuss on the field
What? What did I say about him on the field?
Zombo
Zombo said:
What? What did I say about him on the field?
Zombo
"You know he's not a real "bad boy", right? Real bad boys don't "flip off" guys, go to rehab and throw water bottles.
Bad boys drink tequila, shit fire, fuck your wife, and don't explain anything.
IF, they throw something ... it's not water, it doesn't happen at a country club pool, it's not at a 18 year old boy, and they don't miss."
Let me guess "that's not about him on the field"? You are a semantics and hair splitting legend.
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If the talent level is about equal (as you stipulated), I'll take Lynch over Payton all day. Fun dude to watch. Wilson is really good. Love him on the field. but yes he is really boring off it.
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Zombo said:
What? What did I say about him on the field?
Zombo
"You know he's not a real "bad boy", right? Real bad boys don't "flip off" guys, go to rehab and throw water bottles.
Bad boys drink tequila, shit fire, fuck your wife, and don't explain anything.
IF, they throw something ... it's not water, it doesn't happen at a country club pool, it's not at a 18 year old boy, and they don't miss."
Let me guess "that's not about him on the field"? You are a semantics and hair splitting legend.
"You know he's not a real "bad boy", right? Real bad boys don't "flip off" guys, go to rehab and throw water bottles.
Bad boys drink tequila, shit fire, fuck your wife, and don't explain anything.
IF, they throw something ... it's not water, it doesn't happen at a country club pool, it's not at a 18 year old boy, and they don't miss."
Let me guess "that's not about him on the field"? You are a semantics and hair splitting legend.
Ummm .. No, that's not about him on the field.
Are you for real?
Zombo
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If the talent level is about equal (as you stipulated), I'll take Lynch over Payton all day. Fun dude to watch. Wilson is really good. Love him on the field. but yes he is really boring off it.
If the talent level is about equal (as you stipulated), I'll take Lynch over Payton all day. Fun dude to watch.
Ha!.....not surprised by that.....at all.....
See....I saw a team(the Seahawks) work real hard to reach the top....then during "their" big week, get totally out shadowed by a guy acting the jerk......and making "me first" headlines....... when it shoulda been about the team......
Same view.....different perspective....
If we ever reached the promised land, Id hope our guys act more like a Thomas or Haden, than a Lynch........and NOT do things that will suck the fun out of it for the majority of fans and the rest of the team....
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"You know he's not a real "bad boy", right? Real bad boys don't "flip off" guys, go to rehab and throw water bottles.
Bad boys drink tequila, shit fire, fuck your wife, and don't explain anything.
IF, they throw something ... it's not water, it doesn't happen at a country club pool, it's not at a 18 year old boy, and they don't miss."
Let me guess "that's not about him on the field"? You are a semantics and hair splitting legend.
Ummm .. No, that's not about him on the field.
Are you for real?
Zombo
Zombo said:
Ummm .. No, that's not about him on the field.
Are you for real?
Zombo
Oh I suppose you meant he was a total dweeb off the field but you agree he's a bad boy on it. Got it.
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If the talent level is about equal (as you stipulated), I'll take Lynch over Payton all day. Fun dude to watch.
Ha!.....not surprised by that.....at all.....
See....I saw a team(the Seahawks) work real hard to reach the top....then during "their" big week, get totally out shadowed by a guy acting the jerk......and making "me first" headlines....... when it shoulda been about the team......
Same view.....different perspective....
If we ever reached the promised land, Id hope our guys act more like a Thomas or Haden, than a Lynch........and NOT do things that will suck the fun out of it for the majority of fans and the rest of the team....
Ha!.....not surprised by that.....at all.....
See....I saw a team(the Seahawks) work real hard to reach the top....then during "their" big week, get totally out shadowed by a guy acting the jerk......and making "me first" headlines....... when it shoulda been about the team......
Same view.....different perspective....
If we ever reached the promised land, Id hope our guys act more like a Thomas or Haden, than a Lynch........and NOT do things that will suck the fun out of it for the majority of fans and the rest of the team....
Yeah I disagree. The personality of the team as a whole is that of Marshawn Lynch. He makes their uber mediocre OL look great. He makes a safe, game-managing QB look great (Wilson's wheels do that also), and it's his personality that lays the groundwork for LOB, Sherman's antics, etc.
Maybe I'm just friends with a bunch of 12 year olds but everyone I know views them as the NFL's bad boy team, and think it's cool. I think it's helped their national branding. But I respect your position.
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Ha!.....not surprised by that.....at all.....
See....I saw a team(the Seahawks) work real hard to reach the top....then during "their" big week, get totally out shadowed by a guy acting the jerk......and making "me first" headlines....... when it shoulda been about the team......
Same view.....different perspective....
If we ever reached the promised land, Id hope our guys act more like a Thomas or Haden, than a Lynch........and NOT do things that will suck the fun out of it for the majority of fans and the rest of the team....
Yeah I disagree. The personality of the team as a whole is that of Marshawn Lynch. He makes their uber mediocre OL look great. He makes a safe, game-managing QB look great (Wilson's wheels do that also), and it's his personality that lays the groundwork for LOB, Sherman's antics, etc.
Maybe I'm just friends with a bunch of 12 year olds but everyone I know views them as the NFL's bad boy team, and think it's cool. I think it's helped their national branding. But I respect your position.
but everyone I know views them as the NFL's bad boy team, and think it's cool. ....
which is what Ive been saying all along.....that YOU think he's cool....
And maybe? you now get that EVERYBODY doesnt share that view?.....can you accept its probably mostly 25 and younger that do(and those are probably a large part of the "everyone you know" comment)?.....can you accept that 25 and above just might have different values?.....
And if so.....we come full robin back to my original point....which you've argued to death.....which was that "Jersey sales do not have anything to do with whether Browns fans like bad guys and do not show that "we" wanted a bad boy?....which was my only argument to begin with ?
And after 10 pages you say "i respect your position"....ha....only took ten pages for you to even consider there are people who actually think differently....and your whole Jersey tangent was a nonsense point which completely derailed an otherwise splendid discussion on our boy Johnny.....
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"can you accept its probably mostly 25 and younger that do(and those are probably a large part of the "everyone you know" comment)?.....can you accept that 25 and above just might have different values?....."
Sure. Except that I know a ton of Ags a lot older than that that love Johnny. So no I would never say that 25+ by and large wouldn't like him. I think the most that wouldn't enjoy it would be 50% (and even then you wouldn't hear from them because we'd be winning).
I already conceded you had good data on the jersey sales. I said you were right, it disproved my point. Thought I pretty strongly implied I respected your position then too. Not sure what more you want. You turned me on to PFF, so I'll always like you for that
I'm not even a total Manzielot or anything is what's ironic. I was fairly indifferent when the Browns drafted him (as a Browns fan). I like the Mccown signing. I'm not sure whether Johnny will ever be good in the NFL but I do lean toward no, for now. I do think he should stay home instead of going to big events. Not that much daylight between those positions and everyone else's. But I do think he'd be loved in Cleveland if he were good (duh), and especially if he was still edgy on the field. That's all I've said in this thread. Since we are throwing out jersey sales as a data point, we really have nothing to look to yet.
What I don't do is make fun of him at every turn, act like he screwed my girlfriend, or generally devolve into a crotchety old woman at the mere mention of his name (not referring to you Mud, but others do).
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Zombo said:
Ummm .. No, that's not about him on the field.
Are you for real?
Zombo
Oh I suppose you meant he was a total dweeb off the field but you agree he's a bad boy on it. Got it.
Oh I suppose you meant he was a total dweeb off the field but you agree he's a bad boy on it. Got it.
No, you made up something about me saying Johnny was a wuss on the field.
Then you backed it up with a quote by me saying that water bottle incident (off the field) didn't make him a bad a boy.
I've never mentioned Johnny on the field in this thread.
You are making up stuff that I never said and then using it as a reference point.
There is something not right about you. Are you a troll I banned before?
Zombo
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Oh I suppose you meant he was a total dweeb off the field but you agree he's a bad boy on it. Got it.
No, you made up something about me saying Johnny was a wuss on the field.
Then you backed it up with a quote by me saying that water bottle incident (off the field) didn't make him a bad a boy.
I've never mentioned Johnny on the field in this thread.
You are making up stuff that I never said and then using it as a reference point.
There is something not right about you. Are you a troll I banned before?
Zombo
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