Jonathan Paul Manziel
-
This team isn't going to win the SB so there is an argument to roll with Johnny first.
McCown gives us the better chance to win now but if Sunday was anything to go by, this team won't win many games in the now.
This team isn't going to win the SB so there is an argument to roll with Johnny first.
McCown gives us the better chance to win now but if Sunday was anything to go by, this team won't win many games in the now.
This team needs to lose the 'we're going to lose anyway' mentality. 5 years of winning no more than 5 games will instil that in you. A few years of 7-9, 8-8 isn't a terrible thing to break that habit, to elevate the browns from the status of laughing stock.
Putting in Manziel, going 5-11 this year, maybe 6-10 next year, is a recipe for a new GM/HC. Getting some credibility with another near .500 season is a recipe for giving the GM/HC more time, and a platform to build from.
-
This team isn't going to win the SB so there is an argument to roll with Johnny first.
McCown gives us the better chance to win now but if Sunday was anything to go by, this team won't win many games in the now.
This team isn't going to win the SB so there is an argument to roll with Johnny first.
McCown gives us the better chance to win now but if Sunday was anything to go by, this team won't win many games in the now.
I don't think you can go by Sunday and I don't think that score is any indication of how bad the team is. Over and over we heard about McCown being the leader of the team on the field and in the locker room and then he goes out in a devastating way early in the game. it seemed like the wheels came off. I think we will know more about this team how they respond this week against the Titans. I think Pettine will have them ready and I would like to see them come out with a chip on their shoulder to prove they are better team than that loss to the Jets. We'll find out soon enough.
-
I completely agree with you both, I wasn't advocating it or anything.
-
I think McCown is the quarterback right now who gives us the best chance to win so I would like to see him as the starter. I did see the potential in JM last Sunday and I think he can develop into a Russell Wilson type qb.
-
JM was so ill-prepared to play in 2014 that he could not help to look better prepared this year. Unfortunately JM 2014 is not the league's QB standard.
He needs to sit and learn behind McCown. That's the posture that a JM who has decided to work at his craft adopted this year. That's the posture that has produced what progress we have seen.
By any objective standard JM is not ready to start.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
JM was so ill-prepared to play in 2014 that he could not help to look better prepared this year. Unfortunately JM 2014 is not the league's QB standard.
He needs to sit and learn behind McCown. That's the posture that a JM who has decided to work at his craft adopted this year. That's the posture that has produced what progress we have seen.
By any objective standard JM is not ready to start.
JM was so ill-prepared to play in 2014 that he could not help to look better prepared this year. Unfortunately JM 2014 is not the league's QB standard.
He needs to sit and learn behind McCown. That's the posture that a JM who has decided to work at his craft adopted this year. That's the posture that has produced what progress we have seen.
By any objective standard JM is not ready to start.
What's the difference if they are going to run an entirely different offense when he's in? And he most certainly wasn't ready to start after sitting out the entire preseason.
WSS
www.westsidesteve.com www.myspace.com/westsidestevemusic www.cdbaby.com/artist/westsidestevesimmons -
JM was so ill-prepared to play in 2014 that he could not help to look better prepared this year. Unfortunately JM 2014 is not the league's QB standard.
He needs to sit and learn behind McCown. That's the posture that a JM who has decided to work at his craft adopted this year. That's the posture that has produced what progress we have seen.
By any objective standard JM is not ready to start.
JM was so ill-prepared to play in 2014 that he could not help to look better prepared this year. Unfortunately JM 2014 is not the league's QB standard.
He needs to sit and learn behind McCown. That's the posture that a JM who has decided to work at his craft adopted this year. That's the posture that has produced what progress we have seen.
By any objective standard JM is not ready to start.
Agree, to me JM is a rookie, last season was a write off.
-
must be nice to have a job where you get paid and decide to do nothing for a year, then come back the next year and expect to be somebody that is respected and trusted by your colleagues.
-
JM was so ill-prepared to play in 2014 that he could not help to look better prepared this year. Unfortunately JM 2014 is not the league's QB standard.
He needs to sit and learn behind McCown. That's the posture that a JM who has decided to work at his craft adopted this year. That's the posture that has produced what progress we have seen.
By any objective standard JM is not ready to start.
JM was so ill-prepared to play in 2014 that he could not help to look better prepared this year. Unfortunately JM 2014 is not the league's QB standard.
He needs to sit and learn behind McCown. That's the posture that a JM who has decided to work at his craft adopted this year. That's the posture that has produced what progress we have seen.
By any objective standard JM is not ready to start.
I agree also Tour. I admit I didn't watch too much of Manziel at A & M except the big games like Alabama. I believe I am seeing now out of Manziel some of the things I have heard on this forum from A& M people (who did follow Manziel closely at A & M) about Manziel's competitiveness and abilities. I was one of Manziel's biggest critics last year as I didn't like his attitude and lack of work ethic. He has cleaned that up this year. He may not be ready to start but at least this season when he was forced to start we did not see a repeat performance of the Cincy game. He was much improved. Not there yet but better. I know comparing him to last season is a low bar but I give him credit for what he has been doing and I believe he will continue to improve.
-
Like everyone has said, this is basically the rookie year he should have had last year. He'll have a steep learning curve, probably isn't ready just yet, but I'd love to see him take over by about game 9 (assuming we're not in playoff contention), to hopefully get him the game experience he needs to start next year.
-
never like the johnny pick. really didn't like the way he came in and shit the bed last year after all his hype.
what i've seen of him so far this year i like. he's looks the part in the huddle and is now showing leadership and humility. just wondering if this is him topped out? he has the arm. he has the mobility but like my pitbull i think he has some things hard wired into his sytem where when the shit starts flying he reverts back to JF and pulls it down and runs. some guys come in and take over from day one. some don't. just don't see the aaron rodgers in him as of yet and how much time does this core team have to wait?
-
never like the johnny pick. really didn't like the way he came in and shit the bed last year after all his hype.
what i've seen of him so far this year i like. he's looks the part in the huddle and is now showing leadership and humility. just wondering if this is him topped out? he has the arm. he has the mobility but like my pitbull i think he has some things hard wired into his sytem where when the shit starts flying he reverts back to JF and pulls it down and runs. some guys come in and take over from day one. some don't. just don't see the aaron rodgers in him as of yet and how much time does this core team have to wait?
never like the johnny pick. really didn't like the way he came in and shit the bed last year after all his hype.
what i've seen of him so far this year i like. he's looks the part in the huddle and is now showing leadership and humility. just wondering if this is him topped out? he has the arm. he has the mobility but like my pitbull i think he has some things hard wired into his sytem where when the shit starts flying he reverts back to JF and pulls it down and runs. some guys come in and take over from day one. some don't. just don't see the aaron rodgers in him as of yet and how much time does this core team have to wait?
I think he will improve if he doesn't get injured again this year. Got to try and keep the running to a minimum and learn to pass from the pocket. Need a running game to help him out, and of course the OL must provide adequate protection.
-
My gripe with the Johnny -- Russell comparison is that Wilson was an effective pocket passer before he got to the NFL. Petey didn't ask nor did he need to tailor the offense just for Russell to be effective.
-
I'm glad we have another Manziel thread.
-
My gripe with the Johnny -- Russell comparison is that Wilson was an effective pocket passer before he got to the NFL. Petey didn't ask nor did he need to tailor the offense just for Russell to be effective.
My gripe with the Johnny -- Russell comparison is that Wilson was an effective pocket passer before he got to the NFL. Petey didn't ask nor did he need to tailor the offense just for Russell to be
Indeed he was, that's why he had success. Manziel needs to become an effective pocket passer, and then can hopefully enjoy similar success. That's what I was saying, nothing more, not sure why the gripe?
-
JM was so ill-prepared to play in 2014 that he could not help to look better prepared this year. Unfortunately JM 2014 is not the league's QB standard.
He needs to sit and learn behind McCown. That's the posture that a JM who has decided to work at his craft adopted this year. That's the posture that has produced what progress we have seen.
By any objective standard JM is not ready to start.
What's the difference if they are going to run an entirely different offense when he's in? And he most certainly wasn't ready to start after sitting out the entire preseason.
WSS
What's the difference if they are going to run an entirely different offense when he's in?
And he most certainly wasn't ready to start after sitting out the entire preseason.
I'll watch for the "different offense", Steve, but I do not think it is the case. The use of the Pistol appears with JM in, but that does not mean the play calls change. I'll add that IMO the Pistol reduces the effectiveness of Play Action which should be an integral part of our offense.
Entire pre-season? He played in good chunks of games one and two. One pre-season game is what effectively what would have been added had his elbow not flared up. That would not have made an appreciable difference in his readiness to start the season.
-
Valid point Tiam but even at A & M Manziel was improving as a pocket passer. If he continues in this area I think he can be a Russell Wilson type qb.
Gruden QB camp: Johnny Manziel 3/27/14Biggest improvement: pocket passing
Entering the 2013 season, Todd McShay broke down Manziel’s film and noted that he needed to “upgrade his accuracy” and “become more disciplined as a pocket passer."
Manziel passing inside pocket
Last 2 seasonsIn 2013, Manziel increased his completion percentage by almost 2 full percentage points (to 69.9 percent) despite increasing his average pass distance from 8.4 yards per attempt to 9.1 yards per attempt. Only three FBS quarterbacks had a higher completion percentage than Manziel's last season.
Looking just at passes from inside the pocket, Manziel led all AQ quarterbacks with a 73.5 percent completion percentage. While his interceptions were up last season, so too were his passing touchdowns and 20-yard completions from inside the pocket.
Greatest strength: improvisation
Manziel’s highlight reel is filled with plays in which he is forced to improvise. Whether he is scrambling for a first down on third-and-long or running around the backfield before completing a deep pass, Manziel has a knack for making plays when things break down.
Johnny Manziel on scrambles
Last 2 seasonsIn fact, over the past two seasons, Texas A&M gained 2,546 yards as a result of Manziel's scrambling. If you subtracted those yards from Texas A&M’s total, the Aggies would have gone from the third-most yards in the nation to 26th.
On third down specifically, Manziel scrambled for 30 first downs over the past two seasons, 14 more than any other AQ player. He also converted 55 percent of his third-down passing plays when forced out of the pocket, which is more than twice the rate of the AQ average (25 percent).
As a result, Manziel led the Football Bowl Subdivision with a 97.0 third-down Total QBR since the start of last season.
-
never like the johnny pick. really didn't like the way he came in and shit the bed last year after all his hype.
what i've seen of him so far this year i like. he's looks the part in the huddle and is now showing leadership and humility. just wondering if this is him topped out? he has the arm. he has the mobility but like my pitbull i think he has some things hard wired into his sytem where when the shit starts flying he reverts back to JF and pulls it down and runs. some guys come in and take over from day one. some don't. just don't see the aaron rodgers in him as of yet and how much time does this core team have to wait?
never like the johnny pick. really didn't like the way he came in and shit the bed last year after all his hype.
what i've seen of him so far this year i like. he's looks the part in the huddle and is now showing leadership and humility. just wondering if this is him topped out? he has the arm. he has the mobility but like my pitbull i think he has some things hard wired into his sytem where when the shit starts flying he reverts back to JF and pulls it down and runs. some guys come in and take over from day one. some don't. just don't see the aaron rodgers in him as of yet and how much time does this core team have to wait?
Reversion under pressure is something any golfer can attest to... get shit worked out on the range and it runs back there when the heat is on... and it keeps running back until it doesn't. You have to go back to the range again and again to keep finding "it". You cannot find it on the golf course.
No better football example this year than Tebow. All that work on his mechanics, and they did look much better, but by the time of his last serious audition the improvements were gone.
JM is fortunate in that it is not his mechanics that need fixing... it's his head. And he has made mighty strides in that area.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
never like the johnny pick. really didn't like the way he came in and shit the bed last year after all his hype.
what i've seen of him so far this year i like. he's looks the part in the huddle and is now showing leadership and humility. just wondering if this is him topped out? he has the arm. he has the mobility but like my pitbull i think he has some things hard wired into his sytem where when the shit starts flying he reverts back to JF and pulls it down and runs. some guys come in and take over from day one. some don't. just don't see the aaron rodgers in him as of yet and how much time does this core team have to wait?
Reversion under pressure is something any golfer can attest to... get shit worked out on the range and it runs back there when the heat is on... and it keeps running back until it doesn't. You have to go back to the range again and again to keep finding "it". You cannot find it on the golf course.
No better football example this year than Tebow. All that work on his mechanics, and they did look much better, but by the time of his last serious audition the improvements were gone.
JM is fortunate in that it is not his mechanics that need fixing... it's his head. And he has made mighty strides in that area.
Reversion under pressure is something any golfer can attest to... get shit worked out on the range and it runs back there when the heat is on... and it keeps running back until it doesn't. You have to go back to the range again and again to keep finding "it". You cannot find it on the golf course.
No better football example this year than Tebow. All that work on his mechanics, and they did look much better, but by the time of his last serious audition the improvements were gone.
JM is fortunate in that it is not his mechanics that need fixing... it's his head. And he has made mighty strides in that area.
I just don't see him as an NFL QB.. He looks small and he plays even smaller.. He panics far too much and takes off with the ball far too often.. He hangs receivers out to dry and in a real bad way, where guys are gettin clobbered, as soon as they get the ball.. He relies too much on the hot reads and seldom leads a WR open. I feel he's more suited for 3rd down tail back.. thats My honest opinion.. some people dont like that.. But if were really being honest.. This kid has no business being an NFL QB.. Tail back?.. yes!
-
Of course Seattle have had to tailor their offense to fit Wilson, been doing it since he joined, they are brilliantly coached.
Hello! It looks like you're interested in this conversation, but you don't have an account yet.
Getting fed up of having to scroll through the same posts each visit? When you register for an account, you'll always come back to exactly where you were before, and choose to be notified of new replies (either via email, or push notification). You'll also be able to save bookmarks and upvote posts to show your appreciation to other community members.
With your input, this post could be even better 💗
Register Login