Jonathan Paul Manziel
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Because the coach is the face of the team.
Not the general manager, not the owner and not the president. Tony Grossi has been anti Johnny since before he came to Cleveland.
WSS
gee, i wonder why. Maybe he did better investigative work on the kid than our owner and gm did because i guarantee you this, his alcoholism did not begin once he was drafted by the browns...
gee, i wonder why. Maybe he did better investigative work on the kid than our owner and gm did because i guarantee you this, his alcoholism did not begin once he was drafted by the browns...
I sincerely doubt that a Cleveland beat writer did more pre-draft investigation of a prospect than an NFL franchise did. C'mon with that nonsense.
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gee, i wonder why. Maybe he did better investigative work on the kid than our owner and gm did because i guarantee you this, his alcoholism did not begin once he was drafted by the browns...
I sincerely doubt that a Cleveland beat writer did more pre-draft investigation of a prospect than an NFL franchise did. C'mon with that nonsense.
I sincerely doubt that a Cleveland beat writer did more pre-draft investigation of a prospect than an NFL franchise did. C'mon with that nonsense.
It doesn't seem that Grossi knows his ass from a hole in the ground about anything else.
WSS
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During the deflategate shit storm, you saw more of Kraft than Bill.There's no apology needed for the situation. He's the head coach and he's the guy you ask no matter what's going on with the team. I would say instead of getting your panties in a bunch about this he might want to be the apologist for the highest paid defense in the league.
WSS
A competent FO would show a little more unity than what's coming out of Berea.
At least my panties are dry, cause I'm not a charter member of the JM knob riding club.
During the deflategate shit storm, you saw more of Kraft than Bill.
A competent FO would show a little more unity than what's coming out of Berea.
At least my panties are dry, cause I'm not a charter member of the JM knob riding club.
1 because Bill Belichick is more important than Bob Kraft.
2 unity? On this non-issue that nobody cares about except some cry babies?
3 call it what you will.
You should probably check those supposedly dry panties though they might be wet from all the tears you are shedding over this non issue.
And I ain't ashamed. I don't hate any Cleveland Brown unless they really really give me a reason.
WSS
www.westsidesteve.com www.myspace.com/westsidestevemusic www.cdbaby.com/artist/westsidestevesimmons -
I know this has been and still is being said, HE IS NOT OUR STARTER so who gives a fuk, Why is he a distraction? Don't let it be one. If he was not a qb it would not be a distraction.
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What the hell's the difference? Until the losses can be laid at the feet of Josh McCown why would you make a switch?
(and that's coming from one of Johnny's fans, me.)
WSS
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@douche-nozzle said:
No.....I was referring to Vick's lauded travels. He was an amazing athlete who couldn't play the QB position but was hyped due to his heritage. Then he commits atrocities and goes to jail and is then mentored by the NFL (Tony Dungee) to bring him back for one more attempt at being the first elite black QB. Then he is kept around when he is absolute garbage.
Sad but true.
As far as the others you mention, you can see they did the same thing with Kaepernick, and it's waaaay too early to tell with Winston and Newton who are probably the best of the bunch.
The First Elite Black QB IMO was Warren Moon. And then you had Steve "air" McNair.
The First Elite Black QB IMO was Warren Moon. And then you had Steve "air" McNair.
Plus a number of pretty darn good ones through the years.....Williams, Cunningham, Evans, etc....
Truth is, that back in the day, almost all of the potential black QB's ended up at WR, RB, CB, etc...
FYI.....Brownies had a black dentist playing for us in the 70's.....Dr. David Mays.....remember him well......
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The First Elite Black QB IMO was Warren Moon. And then you had Steve "air" McNair.
Plus a number of pretty darn good ones through the years.....Williams, Cunningham, Evans, etc....
Truth is, that back in the day, almost all of the potential black QB's ended up at WR, RB, CB, etc...
FYI.....Brownies had a black dentist playing for us in the 70's.....Dr. David Mays.....remember him well......
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Johnny Got Angry, Johnny Got Mad. Johnny Gave her the biggest lecture she ever had. He was a brave man, he was a cave man. Johnny showed her that he really, really cared.
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Don't hate? Coming from you? That's rich. It still isn't a legitimate question it's bullshit no matter how many fish nip at the rubber worm.38 replies. 40 votes and thread labeled hot. So then there's that. Don't hate. It totally a legit question.
Like I said if he'd gotten a DUI, or if the crazy bitches face had been smashed up, as it would have been had he bounced her mug off the dashboard... it might be legitimate to wonder what to do with him.
Think about it. If this story or about a Pittsburgh Steeler who had a loud and noisy fight with his head of a girlfriend even we wouldn't give a shit.
The only correct answer is to cut him if he can't play, (whether he goes to church or a combination beer joint whorehouse crackhouse opium den). And if he can, just get the fuck over it.
WSS
Like I said if he'd gotten a DUI, or if the crazy bitches face had been smashed up, as it would have been had he bounced her mug off the dashboard... it might be legitimate to wonder what to do with him.
curious......would your opinion change if you found out he was in the NFL drug program and was still drinking?....ala Josh Gordon?
Considering the NFL is investigating him and the Browns are "deeply disturbed" by his episodes(their words), why is it not a legitimate discussion....?....The NFL and Browns sure think it is.....
And Id agree 100% if it was a first offense(in fact, I did wayyy back then).....but since its like incident #10 involving alcohol and he's just out of rehab.....it seems like a VERY legit concern.....and since the whole country is discussing it, I dont see why we should be excluded from the same......
Late to work by 10 minute?.....not a big deal.......late to work by 10 minutes x 20.....fired......
and then, someone somewhere, will be saying I just got fired because I was only 10 minutes late....sheesh....
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The immediately legitimate question is.. can he beat out Austin Davis if Pettine held a fair competition [eg, don't consider where each guy was drafted] for the #2 spot?
I think he can't.
The more labels you have for yourself, the dumber they make you. "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." Paul Brown -
Black QBs career rankings in terms of total career yards passing in top 200. Bold means active:
#7 Warren Moon
#20 Donovan McNabb
#38 Steve McNair
#41 Randall Cunningham
#73 Daunte Culpepper
#87 Michael Vick
#91 Jeff Blake
#103 Aaron Brooks
#122 Doug Williams
#124 Jason Campell
#127 Rodney Peete
#131 David Garrard
#135 Cam Newton
#137 Tony Banks
#138 Kordell Stewart
#149 Josh Freeman
#`162 Russell Wilson
#167 Charlie Batch
#171 Byron Leftwich
#183 Colin Kaepernick
#184 Vince Evans
#191 Vince Young
#199 James Harris....considered first black QB (at least since the 20s and Fritz Pollard)
You know what we haven't had? Asian QBs. Where is the clamor for Asian QBs? I do not see a single Asian QB in the top 250 QBs in all time passing yards. (Not even Timmy Chang, or Tommy Chong)
And what about Hispanic QBs? I see 2, maybe 3 in the top 250: Jim Plunkett, Tom Flores....and maybe Jeff Garcia? (His name is hispanic, though he didn't look Hispanic).
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The immediately legitimate question is.. can he beat out Austin Davis if Pettine held a fair competition [eg, don't consider where each guy was drafted] for the #2 spot?
I think he can't.
The immediately legitimate question is.. can he beat out Austin Davis if Pettine held a fair competition [eg, don't consider where each guy was drafted] for the #2 spot?
I think he can't.
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Like I said if he'd gotten a DUI, or if the crazy bitches face had been smashed up, as it would have been had he bounced her mug off the dashboard... it might be legitimate to wonder what to do with him.
curious......would your opinion change if you found out he was in the NFL drug program and was still drinking?....ala Josh Gordon?
Considering the NFL is investigating him and the Browns are "deeply disturbed" by his episodes(their words), why is it not a legitimate discussion....?....The NFL and Browns sure think it is.....
And Id agree 100% if it was a first offense(in fact, I did wayyy back then).....but since its like incident #10 involving alcohol and he's just out of rehab.....it seems like a VERY legit concern.....and since the whole country is discussing it, I dont see why we should be excluded from the same......
Late to work by 10 minute?.....not a big deal.......late to work by 10 minutes x 20.....fired......
and then, someone somewhere, will be saying I just got fired because I was only 10 minutes late....sheesh....
curious......would your opinion change if you found out he was in the NFL drug program and was still drinking?....ala Josh Gordon?
Considering the NFL is investigating him and the Browns are "deeply disturbed" by his episodes(their words), why is it not a legitimate discussion....?....The NFL and Browns sure think it is.....
And Id agree 100% if it was a first offense(in fact, I did wayyy back then).....but since its like incident #10 involving alcohol and he's just out of rehab.....it seems like a VERY legit concern.....and since the whole country is discussing it, I dont see why we should be excluded from the same......
Late to work by 10 minute?.....not a big deal.......late to work by 10 minutes x 20.....fired......
and then, someone somewhere, will be saying I just got fired because I was only 10 minutes late....sheesh....
Well your question is the first paragraph I assume. The rest of it is speculation on your part, which you are certainly allowed to do but has no bearing on the situation nor my opinion. If he was in fact in an NFL or Cleveland Browns program that had a zero tolerance policy I'd say it might well be an issue.
If and when that information comes to light I will certainly consider it. Just remember we have absolutely no evidence of that and we know almost nothing about the terms of his rehab, what it was for or much of anything. Besides speculation from people like Tony Grossi who apparently knows less than the guys on this board.
Bottom line is if you are prone to hating the guy this is an outrage!
My opinion remains the same, if he's improving and can play quarterback in the NFL great. If he can't? Let him go. It's as simple as that.
As for the ridiculous comparison to Josh Gordon is that weed, for better or worse, is illegal and strictly against league policy.
Drunk driving is against the law.
A drink or two and a loud argument with a girlfriend is not against the law.
WSS
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The First Elite Black QB IMO was Warren Moon. And then you had Steve "air" McNair.
Plus a number of pretty darn good ones through the years.....Williams, Cunningham, Evans, etc....
Truth is, that back in the day, almost all of the potential black QB's ended up at WR, RB, CB, etc...
FYI.....Brownies had a black dentist playing for us in the 70's.....Dr. David Mays.....remember him well......
I sat in the stadium on my birthday in 20 degree weather with a wind chill of God knows what watching the Cleveland Browns lose 9 to nothing to the Los Angeles Rams with both quarterbacks, (I think ours was Mike Phipps, and theirs was Joe Namath) The quarterbacks starting or Pat Haden and Dr Bomb, who can throw long and far but never often to the right place.Plus a number of pretty darn good ones through the years.....Williams, Cunningham, Evans, etc....
Truth is, that back in the day, almost all of the potential black QB's ended up at WR, RB, CB, etc...
FYI.....Brownies had a black dentist playing for us in the 70's.....Dr. David Mays.....remember him well......
WSS
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just to throw this into this thread that somehow got to black QBs....
how many won superbowls? off the top of my head i can only think of doug williams and russell wilson.
would love to include dilfer, but he's only black from the neck up.......
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The First Elite Black QB IMO was Warren Moon. And then you had Steve "air" McNair.
Plus a number of pretty darn good ones through the years.....Williams, Cunningham, Evans, etc....
Truth is, that back in the day, almost all of the potential black QB's ended up at WR, RB, CB, etc...
FYI.....Brownies had a black dentist playing for us in the 70's.....Dr. David Mays.....remember him well......
Plus a number of pretty darn good ones through the years.....Williams, Cunningham, Evans, etc....
Truth is, that back in the day, almost all of the potential black QB's ended up at WR, RB, CB, etc...
FYI.....Brownies had a black dentist playing for us in the 70's.....Dr. David Mays.....remember him well......
Yup , he filled in for an injured Brian Sipe and beat the Steelers.
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just to throw this into this thread that somehow got to black QBs....
how many won superbowls? off the top of my head i can only think of doug williams and russell wilson.
would love to include dilfer, but he's only black from the neck up.......
just to throw this into this thread that somehow got to black QBs....
how many won superbowls? off the top of my head i can only think of doug williams and russell wilson.
would love to include dilfer, but he's only black from the neck up.......
Well, think about this: I gave you the number of black QBs in the top 200 in passing yards in NFL history. There were 23 out of the top 200, or about 11.5%. Which is close to the percentage of African Americans in the entire population in the US. (12.3% per US Census).
So, you could say that African Americans are almost perfectly represented among QBs per their ratio to members of overall society.
(of course amongst all players they have a vast overrepresentation in the NFL compared to society)
It may be Hispanics that are "shorted". As I noted, only maybe 3 of the Top 200 are Hispanic or 1.5%
Where according to Census reports, the US is 17% Hispanic.
And the US is 4.2% Asian.....yet I see not a single Asian QB among the Top 200.
Though, Marcus Mariota is Samoan. Would that be considered Asian, or should we include Samoan/Polynesian as a separate ethnic subset?
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