Mayock's New Top 20
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Mayock loves Ayers and if you watch the tape he was/is a damn monster. The problem is it was a 1 year spike in performance so teams are trying to evaluate how legit he is and whether or not the risk a high selection. You can bet your ass if he did what he did last season a additional time he'd be a top 15 selection. Watch the tape the dude is a beast. He also had a solid senior bowl and I can't recall his combine numbers at the moment.
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Ayers? Are you kidding me?
I was looking at Walter Football today. Walter is leaning heavily to the Browns taking Sanchez. He thinks Mangini wants his own guy.
Walter also moved Barwin up to the Pats at pick #33....Damn! I really could see that happening.
Ayers? Are you kidding me?
I was looking at Walter Football today. Walter is leaning heavily to the Browns taking Sanchez. He thinks Mangini wants his own guy.
Walter also moved Barwin up to the Pats at pick #33....Damn! I really could see that happening.
I wouldn't rule out QB with the pick.
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Mayock loves Ayers and if you watch the tape he was/is a damn monster. The problem is it was a 1 year spike in performance so teams are trying to evaluate how legit he is and whether or not the risk a high selection. You can bet your ass if he did what he did last season a additional time he'd be a top 15 selection. Watch the tape the dude is a beast. He also had a solid senior bowl and I can't recall his combine numbers at the moment.
Mayock loves Ayers and if you watch the tape he was/is a damn monster.
He was good, not great. Ayers only notched three sacks last year, though he had an additional four as a situational rusher in '07.
The problem is it was a 1 year spike in performance so teams are trying to evaluate how legit he is and whether or not the risk a high selection. You can bet your ass if he did what he did last season a additional time he'd be a top 15 selection. Watch the tape the dude is a beast. He also had a solid senior bowl and I can't recall his combine numbers at the moment.
He had an incredible Senior Bowl, but his Combine numbers weren't all too impressive - 4.77 40, 4.51 shuttle, 7.58 3-cone, 29.5" vert, 18 reps of 225. Not the kind of numbers that would boost his draft stock.
Ayers also was charged with assault back in '05 after he & Jerod Mayo beat up a college student. So character might be an issue.
I really like what he does on the field. He could be a Justin Tuck-type 4-3 DE, and he may be athletic enough to play 3-4 OLB. But I don't think he's the 5th best player in this year's draft; I'm surprised Mayock has him that high.
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I agree.
That is why I don't like the current process. A few months ago after all the games were played, Ayers was maybe a later to lower mid first rounder. Now we have this goof placing him at #5??
I wouldn't give all this combine stuff a grade weight of more than 5% as compared to watching games and live game scouting.
I think more teams blow picks at this point of the process than at any other point.
Unless you have done a really bad job of scouting through out the season....guys shouldn't jump or drop drastic amounts......the exceptions being small school guys who may not have gotten the looks....but Tennessee isn't a small school, so there was no shortage of him being viewed more than a few times somewhere along the way.
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I kinda disagree, especially with calling Mayock a "goof".
During the Senior Bowl coverage, Mayock kept on referring to Ayers as "a stack & shed 4-3 end," which I take to be code for "great against the run (15.5 TFL's), but nothing special coming off the edge." But after Ayers shamed Oher at practice and matched his senior season sack total during the actual game, Mayock went back to the tape to see what he'd missed.
Apparently, he really liked what he saw of Ayers' rush skills. Mayock talks a lot about how Ayers gave Andre Smith fits in the Alabama game - a little unfair to Smith, given that Ayers did most of his damage against Bama's LG, but Ayers did beat him once or twice.
This isn't a case of a workout warrior wowing people at the Combine & surging up draft boards. Perhaps he's overrating Ayers a little bit, but it's not because of how he looks in shorts. During the Combine coverage, Mayock was actually warning people that Michael Johnson would look great in drills but isn't nearly as impressive when you watch him on film. He factors in workout numbers, but he's more of a film guy.
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Ayers? Are you kidding me?
I was looking at Walter Football today. Walter is leaning heavily to the Browns taking Sanchez. He thinks Mangini wants his own guy.
Walter also moved Barwin up to the Pats at pick #33....Damn! I really could see that happening.
Sanchez?? SANCHEZ??? Are you kidding me?????? I can see the Browns drafting a lot of
different guys but a QB??? With all the holes on this team you draft a QB??? Are you
kidding me????? If Mangini/Kokinis blows a #5 on a QB Randy Lerner should sell the team.
Sanchez?? SANCHEZ??? Are you kidding me?????? I can see the Browns drafting a lot of
different guys but a QB??? With all the holes on this team you draft a QB??? Are you
kidding me????? If Mangini/Kokinis blows a #5 on a QB Randy Lerner should sell the team.
Obviously this would all depend the Browns moving Quinn and possibly even Anderson. If they would move these guys and depending on what they received in return, Picking Sanchez is not as crazy as you seem to think it is.
Those holes you metnion could then be filled with the pickes receieved for Quinn and /or Anderson.
I seriously doubt Walter football was talking about drafting Sanchez with Quinn and Anderson on the roster. You certainly realize this, correct?
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Sanchez?? SANCHEZ??? Are you kidding me?????? I can see the Browns drafting a lot of
different guys but a QB??? With all the holes on this team you draft a QB??? Are you
kidding me????? If Mangini/Kokinis blows a #5 on a QB Randy Lerner should sell the team.
Obviously this would all depend the Browns moving Quinn and possibly even Anderson. If they would move these guys and depending on what they received in return, Picking Sanchez is not as crazy as you seem to think it is.
Those holes you metnion could then be filled with the pickes receieved for Quinn and /or Anderson.
I seriously doubt Walter football was talking about drafting Sanchez with Quinn and Anderson on the roster. You certainly realize this, correct?
Obviously this would all depend the Browns moving Quinn and possibly even Anderson. If they would move these guys and depending on what they received in return, Picking Sanchez is not as crazy as you seem to think it is.
Those holes you metnion could then be filled with the pickes receieved for Quinn and /or Anderson.
I seriously doubt Walter football was talking about drafting Sanchez with Quinn and Anderson on the roster. You certainly realize this, correct?
I think what he's concerned about (as am I) is that the focus of an NFL season should remain the playoffs/SB. Lets just say we make this move and it takes at least a season or two before Sanchez "gets" it.
BE's contract has come & gone, JT is about up for renewal (hopefully), Steinbach, Heiden & Tucker have probably retired, Cribbs will be a free agent & possibly gone, E.WRight is a FA, hell even Dawson could be gone at that point. Now what? We have Timmy Sofa version 2.0 with no one to one to throw to, or protect him.
I know the core of the idea is to build longevity for teams, but why not try and win a game or two in the process? How do we expect to be successful if we keep shifting the need of new core players through the roster every season or two?
Unless there is a trophy for most draft picks on day one...
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Obviously this would all depend the Browns moving Quinn and possibly even Anderson. If they would move these guys and depending on what they received in return, Picking Sanchez is not as crazy as you seem to think it is.
Those holes you metnion could then be filled with the pickes receieved for Quinn and /or Anderson.
I seriously doubt Walter football was talking about drafting Sanchez with Quinn and Anderson on the roster. You certainly realize this, correct?
I think what he's concerned about (as am I) is that the focus of an NFL season should remain the playoffs/SB. Lets just say we make this move and it takes at least a season or two before Sanchez "gets" it.
BE's contract has come & gone, JT is about up for renewal (hopefully), Steinbach, Heiden & Tucker have probably retired, Cribbs will be a free agent & possibly gone, E.WRight is a FA, hell even Dawson could be gone at that point. Now what? We have Timmy Sofa version 2.0 with no one to one to throw to, or protect him.
I know the core of the idea is to build longevity for teams, but why not try and win a game or two in the process? How do we expect to be successful if we keep shifting the need of new core players through the roster every season or two?
Unless there is a trophy for most draft picks on day one...
I think what he's concerned about (as am I) is that the focus of an NFL season should remain the playoffs/SB. Lets just say we make this move and it takes at least a season or two before Sanchez "gets" it.
BE's contract has come & gone, JT is about up for renewal (hopefully), Steinbach, Heiden & Tucker have probably retired, Cribbs will be a free agent & possibly gone, E.WRight is a FA, hell even Dawson could be gone at that point. Now what? We have Timmy Sofa version 2.0 with no one to one to throw to, or protect him.
I know the core of the idea is to build longevity for teams, but why not try and win a game or two in the process? How do we expect to be successful if we keep shifting the need of new core players through the roster every season or two?
Unless there is a trophy for most draft picks on day one...
Don't get me wrong. I don't want to draft Sanchez with this pick. Regardless of what the Browns could get for Quinn and/or Anderson. I'm just saying that it isn't beyond the realm of possiblity. Especially since new coaches and GM's often like to build around their own Own QB.
I want this team to use the higher picks to improve their ability to get the QB and help stop the rush as well, if possible.
I worry less and less about the O line. Stienbach is still only 29. I could see him being around another three years.
They will franchise Thomas. I think it's possible they'll draft a Center this year. Like a Shipley in the 4th or even a Cooper later. Next year they can address the OT or guard postion. Actually, the idea of drafting Joe thomas out of Pitt this year intrigues me for the obvious reason...lol!
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QB at #5 will never happen...........................sombody is smokin some good shit.
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I kinda disagree, especially with calling Mayock a "goof".
During the Senior Bowl coverage, Mayock kept on referring to Ayers as "a stack & shed 4-3 end," which I take to be code for "great against the run (15.5 TFL's), but nothing special coming off the edge." But after Ayers shamed Oher at practice and matched his senior season sack total during the actual game, Mayock went back to the tape to see what he'd missed.
Apparently, he really liked what he saw of Ayers' rush skills. Mayock talks a lot about how Ayers gave Andre Smith fits in the Alabama game - a little unfair to Smith, given that Ayers did most of his damage against Bama's LG, but Ayers did beat him once or twice.
This isn't a case of a workout warrior wowing people at the Combine & surging up draft boards. Perhaps he's overrating Ayers a little bit, but it's not because of how he looks in shorts. During the Combine coverage, Mayock was actually warning people that Michael Johnson would look great in drills but isn't nearly as impressive when you watch him on film. He factors in workout numbers, but he's more of a film guy.
Aloysius said:
I kinda disagree, especially with calling Mayock a "goof".I knew you would.
Don't get hung up on the goof comment.....just a figure of speech.
In the future, if you want me to call him a dork, I can do that.
Don't get me wrong...Ayers is a nice player.....but he isn't the 5th best....if anything, he is the flavor of the week. A week ago Everette Brown was supposed to be the guy.
I think after a while these goo....er....dor.....errrr guys feel like they have to make some noise somehow, so they anoint someone new as the next sure shot pick.
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Ballpeen, unless in the last year where I haven't been able to watch him Mayock turned into one of those guys that just want to make noise, he isn't one of those guys. He has always been a film break down guy and is usually pretty dead on when he starts making talking up a player for round 1. I can think of 3 guys he has done that with in recent years:
1. In 2006 he was talking up Cutler as the best QB in the draft when no one else really was. Pretty dead on so far for that one.
2. In 2005 he was talking up Merriman and Ware as the best OLB in a 3-4 prospects in the draft. He really talked up Merriman, who wasn't as known going in initially.
3. Last year he was talking up Flacco before others.
Like I said, unless Mayock has changed, if he is talking up this guy, I'd bet on Mayock being correct about him.
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Ballpeen, unless in the last year where I haven't been able to watch him Mayock turned into one of those guys that just want to make noise, he isn't one of those guys. He has always been a film break down guy and is usually pretty dead on when he starts making talking up a player for round 1. I can think of 3 guys he has done that with in recent years:
1. In 2006 he was talking up Cutler as the best QB in the draft when no one else really was. Pretty dead on so far for that one.
2. In 2005 he was talking up Merriman and Ware as the best OLB in a 3-4 prospects in the draft. He really talked up Merriman, who wasn't as known going in initially.
3. Last year he was talking up Flacco before others.
Like I said, unless Mayock has changed, if he is talking up this guy, I'd bet on Mayock being correct about him.
Masters said:
Ballpeen, unless in the last year where I haven't been able to watch him Mayock turned into one of those guys that just want to make noise, he isn't one of those guys. He has always been a film break down guy and is usually pretty dead on when he starts making talking up a player for round 1. I can think of 3 guys he has done that with in recent years:1. In 2006 he was talking up Cutler as the best QB in the draft when no one else really was. Pretty dead on so far for that one.
2. In 2005 he was talking up Merriman and Ware as the best OLB in a 3-4 prospects in the draft. He really talked up Merriman, who wasn't as known going in initially.
3. Last year he was talking up Flacco before others.
Like I said, unless Mayock has changed, if he is talking up this guy, I'd bet on Mayock being correct about him.
I wasn't on this board at the time, but i talked up Cutler in a Big, big way
Can't say i was all that high on Meriman, but i pimped Ware big as well...
Can't say I talked up Flacco....I did see him play when he lead his team to the championship game here in Chattanooga.
My point is all these guys....not just Mayock....turn it into something harder than it is.
If some old fat ass in Chattanooga could identify Cutler at Vandy and Ware at Troy as darn good players. it can't be that darn hard.
I do give them credit...they know more of the players......but heck, if that is what you are paid to do, you might as well give it a couple of hours a day.
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Mayock loves Ayers and if you watch the tape he was/is a damn monster.
He was good, not great. Ayers only notched three sacks last year, though he had an additional four as a situational rusher in '07.
The problem is it was a 1 year spike in performance so teams are trying to evaluate how legit he is and whether or not the risk a high selection. You can bet your ass if he did what he did last season a additional time he'd be a top 15 selection. Watch the tape the dude is a beast. He also had a solid senior bowl and I can't recall his combine numbers at the moment.
He had an incredible Senior Bowl, but his Combine numbers weren't all too impressive - 4.77 40, 4.51 shuttle, 7.58 3-cone, 29.5" vert, 18 reps of 225. Not the kind of numbers that would boost his draft stock.
Ayers also was charged with assault back in '05 after he & Jerod Mayo beat up a college student. So character might be an issue.
I really like what he does on the field. He could be a Justin Tuck-type 4-3 DE, and he may be athletic enough to play 3-4 OLB. But I don't think he's the 5th best player in this year's draft; I'm surprised Mayock has him that high.
Aloysius said:
He was good, not great. Ayers only notched three sacks last year, though he had an additional four as a situational rusher in '07.He had an incredible Senior Bowl, but his Combine numbers weren't all too impressive - 4.77 40, 4.51 shuttle, 7.58 3-cone, 29.5" vert, 18 reps of 225. Not the kind of numbers that would boost his draft stock.
Ayers also was charged with assault back in '05 after he & Jerod Mayo beat up a college student. So character might be an issue.
I really like what he does on the field. He could be a Justin Tuck-type 4-3 DE, and he may be athletic enough to play 3-4 OLB. But I don't think he's the 5th best player in this year's draft; I'm surprised Mayock has him that high.
Mayock almost always grabs on to one dude he loves and builds up throughout the entire process. Last season that guy was Rashard Mendenhall.
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Masters said:
Ballpeen, unless in the last year where I haven't been able to watch him Mayock turned into one of those guys that just want to make noise, he isn't one of those guys. He has always been a film break down guy and is usually pretty dead on when he starts making talking up a player for round 1. I can think of 3 guys he has done that with in recent years:1. In 2006 he was talking up Cutler as the best QB in the draft when no one else really was. Pretty dead on so far for that one.
2. In 2005 he was talking up Merriman and Ware as the best OLB in a 3-4 prospects in the draft. He really talked up Merriman, who wasn't as known going in initially.
3. Last year he was talking up Flacco before others.
Like I said, unless Mayock has changed, if he is talking up this guy, I'd bet on Mayock being correct about him.
I wasn't on this board at the time, but i talked up Cutler in a Big, big way
Can't say i was all that high on Meriman, but i pimped Ware big as well...
Can't say I talked up Flacco....I did see him play when he lead his team to the championship game here in Chattanooga.
My point is all these guys....not just Mayock....turn it into something harder than it is.
If some old fat ass in Chattanooga could identify Cutler at Vandy and Ware at Troy as darn good players. it can't be that darn hard.
I do give them credit...they know more of the players......but heck, if that is what you are paid to do, you might as well give it a couple of hours a day.
I wasn't on this board at the time, but i talked up Cutler in a Big, big way
Can't say i was all that high on Meriman, but i pimped Ware big as well...
Can't say I talked up Flacco....I did see him play when he lead his team to the championship game here in Chattanooga.
My point is all these guys....not just Mayock....turn it into something harder than it is.
If some old fat ass in Chattanooga could identify Cutler at Vandy and Ware at Troy as darn good players. it can't be that darn hard.
I do give them credit...they know more of the players......but heck, if that is what you are paid to do, you might as well give it a couple of hours a day.
I am just saying, Mayock ain't one of those guys. He doesn't turn it into anything harder. He always goes by game tape, not combine, or pro day work outs. Usually the guy that just jumped because of the last two is the first guy Mayock will rip on tape, if the tape doesn't match the combine/pro day work.
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I understand.....he seems like a good egg.
No beef here on that point.
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Masters said:
I would certainly agree with you on most of the others
I'll take Alo over anybody. He had Curry pegged as a stud before a lot of us even knew of him all that well. Now he's looking at being the best player in the draft.
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Masters said:
I would certainly agree with you on most of the othersI'll take Alo over anybody. He had Curry pegged as a stud before a lot of us even knew of him all that well. Now he's looking at being the best player in the draft.
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Not to diminish Alo.....he is in to it more than i, and knows more than i in this regard but i have noted Curry since last year....for some reason several Wake games have been on I decided to watch for one reason or another.
I follow college football, and due to my location, i get a high dose of SEC and ACC games. This is SEC country, but Ga Tech is 100 miles down the road, and Clemson is 100 miles away as the crow fly's, so ACC is aired on a regular basis......mostly Wake, Clemson and Ga Tech.....a good many local prep players end up at those schools.
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Heck sent me a PM way back in September about how much he liked Curry and teammate Alphonso Smith. All I had to do was watch the Ole Miss game...and fall in love.
I'm just playing McShay to Heck's Kiper.
I guess that makes ballpeen "the goof"
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