Jonathan Paul Manziel
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The manliest thing I've ever seen a man do is type LOL and follow it up with "gurl".
Well.. you're not even a Man...Go drink some more ya fat alcohlic.
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The manliest thing I've ever seen a man do is type LOL and follow it up with "gurl".
Well.. you're not even a Man...Go drink some more ya fat alcohlic.
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One of the things that I heard most from many former clients who were also substance abusers is that the entire thing was just totally baffling to them They could never understand that promises they made were absolutely sincere when they made them, but were broken by them at almost the first opportunity no matter what the personal cost or the loss of trust in them by persons they so wanted to have trust in them. It's a baffling, self destructive disease which the abuser himself cannot understand other than that it continues to destroy what they want the most despite all desire to the contrary. JM is in this trap. It has nothing to do whatsoever with whether he wants to be a Brown or a good NFL QB. It has to do with something that right now he has no control of nor understanding of why it is happening. It would be easy to just call him stupid. But that isn't it at all. He is in fine company with many highly intelligent and highly talented people who have traveled this exact same path.
And yes, he is still totally responsible for the outcome. This one is on him, not Pettine or anyone else. Pettine is doing exactly what he should. It's called tough love. You reluctantly and sadly follow through with exactly what you said you would do if he could not control his off the field behavior. Have a seat JM and get professional help again. It didn't take.
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One of the things that I heard most from many former clients who were also substance abusers is that the entire thing was just totally baffling to them They could never understand that promises they made were absolutely sincere when they made them, but were broken by them at almost the first opportunity no matter what the personal cost or the loss of trust in them by persons they so wanted to have trust in them. It's a baffling, self destructive disease which the abuser himself cannot understand other than that it continues to destroy what they want the most despite all desire to the contrary. JM is in this trap. It has nothing to do whatsoever with whether he wants to be a Brown or a good NFL QB. It has to do with something that right now he has no control of nor understanding of why it is happening. It would be easy to just call him stupid. But that isn't it at all. He is in fine company with many highly intelligent and highly talented people who have traveled this exact same path.
And yes, he is still totally responsible for the outcome. This one is on him, not Pettine or anyone else. Pettine is doing exactly what he should. It's called tough love. You reluctantly and sadly follow through with exactly what you said you would do if he could not control his off the field behavior. Have a seat JM and get professional help again. It didn't take.
One of the things that I heard most from many former clients who were also substance abusers is that the entire thing was just totally baffling to them They could never understand that promises they made were absolutely sincere when they made them, but were broken by them at almost the first opportunity no matter what the personal cost or the loss of trust in them by persons they so wanted to have trust in them. It's a baffling, self destructive disease which the abuser himself cannot understand other than that it continues to destroy what they want the most despite all desire to the contrary. JM is in this trap. It has nothing to do whatsoever with whether he wants to be a Brown or a good NFL QB. It has to do with something that right now he has no control of nor understanding of why it is happening. It would be easy to just call him stupid. But that isn't it at all. He is in fine company with many highly intelligent and highly talented people who have traveled this exact same path.
And yes, he is still totally responsible for the outcome. This one is on him, not Pettine or anyone else. Pettine is doing exactly what he should. It's called tough love. You reluctantly and sadly follow through with exactly what you said you would do if he could not control his off the field behavior. Have a seat JM and get professional help again. It didn't take.
Thanks AG for telling it like it is.
Red flag was when he called it "possibly an old video" when it wasn't.
Fucking man up.
This weeks' depth chart: Got a feeling that third QB will be a healthy scratch.
http://www.brownsmedia.com/images/9003/11_30_15_depth_chart.pdf
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One of the things that I heard most from many former clients who were also substance abusers is that the entire thing was just totally baffling to them They could never understand that promises they made were absolutely sincere when they made them, but were broken by them at almost the first opportunity no matter what the personal cost or the loss of trust in them by persons they so wanted to have trust in them. It's a baffling, self destructive disease which the abuser himself cannot understand other than that it continues to destroy what they want the most despite all desire to the contrary. JM is in this trap. It has nothing to do whatsoever with whether he wants to be a Brown or a good NFL QB. It has to do with something that right now he has no control of nor understanding of why it is happening. It would be easy to just call him stupid. But that isn't it at all. He is in fine company with many highly intelligent and highly talented people who have traveled this exact same path.
And yes, he is still totally responsible for the outcome. This one is on him, not Pettine or anyone else. Pettine is doing exactly what he should. It's called tough love. You reluctantly and sadly follow through with exactly what you said you would do if he could not control his off the field behavior. Have a seat JM and get professional help again. It didn't take.
Thanks AG for telling it like it is.
Red flag was when he called it "possibly an old video" when it wasn't.
Fucking man up.
This weeks' depth chart: Got a feeling that third QB will be a healthy scratch.
http://www.brownsmedia.com/images/9003/11_30_15_depth_chart.pdf
Zombo said:
Thanks AG for telling it like it is.
Red flag was when he called it "possibly an old video" when it wasn't.
Fucking man up.
This weeks' depth chart: Got a feeling that third QB will be a healthy scratch.
http://www.brownsmedia.com/images/9003/11_30_15_depth_chart.pdf
Yep-and it also explains why Farmer was watching some QB play this weekend. They cannot afford otherwise. I would not either because there is no guarantee he will ever "get it".
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Sit him this week. Maybe one more. Let him play the rest if he doesn't screw up in the interim.
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Justin Gilbert still buried behind the likes of Johnson Bademosi ... THAT I don't get.
Gilbert passes the eye test. No hint of off-the field problems since last year ... what am I missing?
Zombo
Zombo said:
Justin Gilbert still buried behind the likes of Johnson Bademosi ... THAT I don't get.
Gilbert passes the eye test. No hint of off-the field problems since last year ... what am I missing?
Zombo
Gasp.
You mean there's a questionable coaching decision?
Oh my!
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Sit him this week. Maybe one more. Let him play the rest if he doesn't screw up in the interim.
Sit him this week. Maybe one more. Let him play the rest if he doesn't screw up in the interim.
Depends on what they told him before this screwup. If they said they would never trust him again and be done with him, then so be it.
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started reading this 9 page thread and skipped to the end after 5 posts to put my own 2 cents in, selfishly. If this has already be mentioned, so be it:
Even if the head motherfuckers in charge of the Berea Diarrhea are absolutely positive that Manziel isn't the QB of the future, they should still play him in hopes that he can put together a resume that will make him a tradable asset.
Here's a flame-worthy what-if scenario: Manziel starts the last 6 games and throws for 1900 yds 15 tds and 4 int, but the coaching staff is still like "fuck this kid is a cunt".
They trade Manziel to the Cowboys for their 1st round pick (which ends up being pretty dang good) which allows the browns to select Joey Bosa and Jared Goff.
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The thing is, though, that Johnny is who he always was. The Browns and Pettine would not have known or cared what he did as long as he showed up for work. Then the damn video came out.
Hell, if Johnny had started Monday and won, then the video had come out Tuesday, would the punishment be the same?
Everyone knew what Ray Rice did, but until everyone saw the video, he was going to still be an NFL running back.
It's just a damn shame that something so silly and seemingly harmless (having fun drinking in a bar) could cost so much. But if Johnny promised to stay away from bars, I don't see what else Pettine could have done.
UUUUUUUUUGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!
The thing is, though, that Johnny is who he always was. The Browns and Pettine would not have known or cared what he did as long as he showed up for work. Then the damn video came out.
Hell, if Johnny had started Monday and won, then the video had come out Tuesday, would the punishment be the same?
Good question, but do you really think one more win would have made a difference? Since the issue was trust based upon a perceived commitment, I believe the result would have been the same.
Zombo said:
Let's not forget this. McCown played well. And is under contract for next year.
Surprised me, but Josh is ours for 2017 as well.
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I'll make this brief as the issue is so black and white its not even funny. Johnny is named the starter but with certain conditions.
-Bury yourself completely in the playbook and practice. Even on days off, go work on your drop backs and release, get in a good workout.
Johnny has had ONE good game in his career. He has a chance to build upon that. Go look up the twitters for Bortles, Winston, Mariota. Young QB's.
You won't find that they've flown half way across the country to go clubbing.
-Stay away from booze because you're a recovering addict plus you can't tell me alcohol in the season is good for ANY athlete. For all the partying Gronk does you don't hear much about it during the season or post season.
-Don't draw media attention to yourself in a negative light and stay focused.
Johnny did NOT adhere to the ground rules established by Pettine and I presume Farmer as well. Therefore if he cannot hold to his word off the field, he simply won't play on the field. QB is held to a higher standard in this league. You're the most important piece on the field, you have the most responsibility and weight to carry. Dedication to your craft for 16 weeks straight is a MUST. Especially when you're a young QB and you've experienced the setbacks and limitations Manziel has and has brought upon himself.
It's that fucking simple. In our world, the world of the every day working man, there is nothing wrong with what Johnny did. I agree. But Johnny isn't the every day working man. He's an NFL QB. It's not like a normal 'job' because it isn't a 'job'. Sure you'll hear the phrase " We all have a job to do" thrown around often, but these players and we as fans know damn well that being a professional athlete is the furthest thing from a typical career.
Anyone defending Johnny 'he did nothing wrong'... "but, but but OTHER guys etc etc' ' Look what xx player did' - get bent. That's a typical deflection and has NOTHING to do with Manziel. But have a happy Thanksgiving while you're at it.
I'll make this brief as the issue is so black and white its not even funny. Johnny is named the starter but with certain conditions.
The difference between what you are prepared to tolerate from a 2nd string apprentice and the QB you hand the keys to the franchise to are great.
It's not a fucking personal agenda for some people. Some of us actually just want to see us win and understand that there are bigger things than "oh this guy lied to me this week, boo the fuck hoo."
Manziel's trade value has never been lower, we still have no idea what he could become, he showed just enough against Pittsburgh for us to still have faith in him...
... and he just showed us over the weekend that that faith is not well placed.
There's is nothing, abso-fucking-lutely nothing more foundationally imperative to a relationship than trust.
And yes, he is still totally responsible for the outcome. This one is on him, not Pettine or anyone else. Pettine is doing exactly what he should. It's called tough love. You reluctantly and sadly follow through with exactly what you said you would do if he could not control his off the field behavior. Have a seat JM and get professional help again. It didn't take.
Good stuff, Ag. I know this is killing you...
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I think the real heart of the issue with this football team, is that they do not operate by one of the primary principles of success. I don't know about any of you, but where I grew up, if somebody was your fuckin' guy, you backed him right or wrong. Did Bill Bellicheater hang Brady out o dry during deflate gate? Did Brady turn on Bill and say "he told me to do it!" HELL F'in NO! Because Brady if Bill's fuckin' guy, and he may kick his ass in private, but never in public. We need a lot less pansy ass finger pointing around here and a lot more loyalty. Pettine's problem is he has no fuckin' guy; how do I know you ask? Because if Manziel was his guy he would of told reporters to stick those photos, videos, tweets and any other inflammatory media bullshit, where the sun don't shine and leave his boy alone! So clearly Manziel ain't it, and if McCown was his guy then he would have had the balls to say "Look, I don't give a rats ass what you fans want, as soon as this old fart is healthy again I am gonna play him, because he is my FUCKIN' GUY!" Pettine better hope he is someone's guy, and if he is maybe he can learn some loyalty from that fuckin' guy. Oh, and by the way if your on a team, your fuckin' guy is the person standing next to you. That's my take... I am sick of these Browns impostors ruining the legacy of a once proud team that made our hearts swell with pride. I have not forgotten, and impostors or not these are our fuckin' guys and while they are here lets defend them.
Pettine, your an ass, but your our coach and if you say your benching Johnny, right or wrong I am with you.
These are our guys, and I know I just called them impostors, but that was said in our house, this is our team and if don't respect them no one will.
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That's actually a pretty interesting, possibly good, and if nothing else original, take, Carlsbad. (One of you grammar nazis let me know how I did with the commas.)
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That's actually a pretty interesting, possibly good, and if nothing else original, take, Carlsbad. (One of you grammar nazis let me know how I did with the commas.)
That's actually a pretty interesting, possibly good, and if nothing else original, take, Carlsbad. (One of you grammar nazis let me know how I did with the commas.)
She's still asleep. But when she awakes I'll put her right on it with explanations that, after 45+ years, I still don't understand. Or is it, "...with explanations, that after 45+ years, I still don't understand." Got me.
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That's actually a pretty interesting, possibly good, and if nothing else original, take, Carlsbad. (One of you grammar nazis let me know how I did with the commas.)
That's actually a pretty interesting, possibly good, and, if nothing else, original take, Carlsbad. (One of you grammar nazis let me know how I did with the commas.)
FIFY...
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The media and fans in Cleveland are so comfortable with failure, that we not only expect it, we demand it. Example: We bitch about Pettine, being too easy on players ( easy training camp, millions of stupid penalties, laughing / joking on the side lines while we are losing big, etc. ). Then...when Pettine makes a decision, and disciplines Manziel, we want to fire his ass, he's an idiot, get him out of here. This is a scenario that has been played out here repeatedly, since 1999. I'm not saying Pettine is some great coach, but simple laws of averages would dictate success, just randomly picking players, coaches, and all other variables, at some point. The only common denominator, that hasn't been replaced is the fans. Well...that's not entirely true. It's been proven, that moving the team to a new location was effective. The team that moved to Baltimore turned things around, and won a Superbowl in a fairly short time. The only questionable point is...was it the different location, or different fans that changed the team into a winner? My solution: if you want this team to win, move it to another city. It's simply not possible to have a winning, successful NFL team in Cleveland. Blame it on us, the fans, or the location...either one...but it has to be one of them. Yes..... maybe I am drinking a little too early.
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The media and fans in Cleveland are so comfortable with failure, that we not only expect it, we demand it. Example: We bitch about Pettine, being too easy on players ( easy training camp, millions of stupid penalties, laughing / joking on the side lines while we are losing big, etc. ). Then...when Pettine makes a decision, and disciplines Manziel, we want to fire his ass, he's an idiot, get him out of here. This is a scenario that has been played out here repeatedly, since 1999. I'm not saying Pettine is some great coach, but simple laws of averages would dictate success, just randomly picking players, coaches, and all other variables, at some point. The only common denominator, that hasn't been replaced is the fans. Well...that's not entirely true. It's been proven, that moving the team to a new location was effective. The team that moved to Baltimore turned things around, and won a Superbowl in a fairly short time. The only questionable point is...was it the different location, or different fans that changed the team into a winner? My solution: if you want this team to win, move it to another city. It's simply not possible to have a winning, successful NFL team in Cleveland. Blame it on us, the fans, or the location...either one...but it has to be one of them. Yes..... maybe I am drinking a little too early.
The media and fans in Cleveland are so comfortable with failure, that we not only expect it, we demand it. Example: We bitch about Pettine, being too easy on players ( easy training camp, millions of stupid penalties, laughing / joking on the side lines while we are losing big, etc. ). Then...when Pettine makes a decision, and disciplines Manziel, we want to fire his ass, he's an idiot, get him out of here. This is a scenario that has been played out here repeatedly, since 1999. I'm not saying Pettine is some great coach, but simple laws of averages would dictate success, just randomly picking players, coaches, and all other variables, at some point. The only common denominator, that hasn't been replaced is the fans. Well...that's not entirely true. It's been proven, that moving the team to a new location was effective. The team that moved to Baltimore turned things around, and won a Superbowl in a fairly short time. The only questionable point is...was it the different location, or different fans that changed the team into a winner? My solution: if you want this team to win, move it to another city. It's simply not possible to have a winning, successful NFL team in Cleveland. Blame it on us, the fans, or the location...either one...but it has to be one of them. Yes..... maybe I am drinking a little too early.
It's mostly not the same people complaining about lack of discipline/too much discipline. People disagree on the best way to treat these players - big shock.
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I'll make this brief as the issue is so black and white its not even funny. Johnny is named the starter but with certain conditions.
The difference between what you are prepared to tolerate from a 2nd string apprentice and the QB you hand the keys to the franchise to are great.
It's not a fucking personal agenda for some people. Some of us actually just want to see us win and understand that there are bigger things than "oh this guy lied to me this week, boo the fuck hoo."
Manziel's trade value has never been lower, we still have no idea what he could become, he showed just enough against Pittsburgh for us to still have faith in him...
... and he just showed us over the weekend that that faith is not well placed.
There's is nothing, abso-fucking-lutely nothing more foundationally imperative to a relationship than trust.
And yes, he is still totally responsible for the outcome. This one is on him, not Pettine or anyone else. Pettine is doing exactly what he should. It's called tough love. You reluctantly and sadly follow through with exactly what you said you would do if he could not control his off the field behavior. Have a seat JM and get professional help again. It didn't take.
Good stuff, Ag. I know this is killing you...
Good stuff, Ag. I know this is killing you...
I had two choices on how to handle this Tour
1. Pull out my bottle of Deaver Vineyard Syrah Port or
2. Just enjoy the good news of the day-- http://www.12thman.com/news/2015/11/25/MBB_1125150338.aspx
I made the wiser choice of #2 because I have friends, not enablers. LOL
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