Haslam calls mtg with upper management tonight
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The reality is someone has to be held accountable for the total regression of this team, culminating in the compete pile of shit it has turned into.
I'm sure it was a bitter pill for Jimma to swallow, to have to admit he fucked up hiring Pettine, Farmer, or both.The reality is someone has to be held accountable for the total regression of this team, culminating in the compete pile of shit it has turned into.
Combine too little experience, with an impatient fan base and the writing is on the wall.
We'll be doing this same process again in 2 years or less.
Two things that will define you: Your determination when you have nothing. Your attitude when you have everything. - Mike McCartney -
I'm sure it was a bitter pill for Jimma to swallow, to have to admit he fucked up hiring Pettine, Farmer, or both.The reality is someone has to be held accountable for the total regression of this team, culminating in the compete pile of shit it has turned into.
Combine too little experience, with an impatient fan base and the writing is on the wall.
We'll be doing this same process again in 2 years or less.
We'll be doing this same process again in 2 years or less.
Unfortunately for all of us, you're probably right.
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After blowouts like this after a very poor season, someone is losing their job. My guess is O'Neil. The schedule hasn't been kind, but our defense, running game and WRs haven't been good enough all season. That suggests to me it's a coaching issue, as my logic says they should have had a good game at some point or shown some positive consistency. I'm not for a major overhaul unless we know we have someone good coming in (Gruden?), but it's time for O'Neil to depart.
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I'm sure it was a bitter pill for Jimma to swallow, to have to admit he fucked up hiring Pettine, Farmer, or both.The reality is someone has to be held accountable for the total regression of this team, culminating in the compete pile of shit it has turned into.
Combine too little experience, with an impatient fan base and the writing is on the wall.
We'll be doing this same process again in 2 years or less.
I'm sure it was a bitter pill for Jimma to swallow, to have to admit he fucked up hiring Pettine, Farmer, or both.
Combine too little experience, with an impatient fan base and the writing is on the wall.
We'll be doing this same process again in 2 years or less.
Eventually we have to hire the right guy. Can't keep making the wrong decision forever.
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I would go so far as to say to Mr Haslam please sell the team. The head
man is ultimately responsible for this mess. He has the final say on who
is hired. He is the one who hired Farmer and Pettine. Pettine is clearly over
his head as a head coach.He makes me yearn for Pat Shurmur the way
he (Pettine ) manages the clock. Farmer has been an unmitigated disaster as
a GM from Bowe to first round busts. I've been a fan of this team all my life from
the 50s on and this is as low as I can remember.You can have fans pissed off
and bitching but when apathy sets in you are in trouble and apathy is here with
our fan base.I know Haslam won't feel his cash cow but I yearn for someone
who cares.
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I don't think cleaning house is necessary. But a new Oline coach in sync with Flip and the offensive philosophy, coupled with passionate D cord who wouldn't be a 'yes man' to Pettine ( not that I'm saying O'Neil is, I just have a feeling) might do this team a world of good. Preferably a coordinator not married to pigeon holing his players into specific roles/assignments.
Edit. An apology for drafting Johnny would be nice as well. From Haslam, of course.
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I'm sure it was a bitter pill for Jimma to swallow, to have to admit he fucked up hiring Pettine, Farmer, or both.
Combine too little experience, with an impatient fan base and the writing is on the wall.
We'll be doing this same process again in 2 years or less.
Eventually we have to hire the right guy. Can't keep making the wrong decision forever.
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Elaborate, please.
You can't discredit an opinion about the quality of Browns' players by claiming "the best players aren't playing."
You're welcome...
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So your contention is that a bunch of guys riding the pine would justify the continued employment of Ray Farmer? I just want to make sure that's really what you're saying.
The short version of my response, to save me time and the rest of us brain cells, is that I vehemently disagree.
That's wonderful, but I couldn't give a fuck less about your disagreement, because it's wrong.
My contention is that Farmer was hired to do one thing - pull the best talent he could at the positions we picked, without mortgaging the future.
Pettine is on record claiming he wanted the Browns identity to be a run first team with a strong defense that bullied opponents. Farmer spent money on a former Pro Bowl LB, former Pro Bowl CB, and former Pro Bowl FS - all from proven winning franchises in order to help bring both talent and a winning mentality. Now we hear that the proven LB has been asked by our coaching staff to play 25 lbs lighter than he had in his entire career? That's not a Farmer problem, that's a Pettine problem.
Pettine asked for versatility among his front seven. Farmer brought in Starks, who is known as possibly the most versatile defensive lineman of the past 5-10 years. He has excelled at both interior line and defensive end, making a Pro Bowl at each position. Yet he's invisible here. Once again - a Pettine problem, not a Farmer problem.
Pettine wanted a lock down CB to help run his defense. Farmer took possibly the top cover corner in the draft. And, despite the concern that he had confidence issues in college, Pettine piled on him and relegated him to backup KR duties almost immediately. Once again, a Pettine problem, not a Farmer problem.
Our offensive line fell off of a cliff after Mack's injury, so Farmer drafted an offensive lineman who could play both center and tackle at a high level. Erving finally sees the field 10 games into the season...at guard. Once again, not a Farmer problem.
Our defense was ill suited to stop the run, getting gashed between the tackles for an inordinate YPC last year, so Farmer invested in the top interior defensive lineman in the league. Shelton's rookie season is almost identical to Haloti Ngata's...yet fans are calling for his head because they fundamentally don't understand how a 3-4 defense is run.
Flip wanted to continue the ZBS that Shanahan implemented, so Farmer got THE best zone scheme runningback in the entire draft. And he's been underutilized by the coaching staff. Once again, not a Farmer problem.
If you want to knock Bowe, go ahead. That was a bad acquisition. But don't try to come here with weak shit reasoning that "our first rounders are bad boo hoo".
Shelton's rookie season is almost identical to Haloti Ngata's
This gave me an actual belly laugh.......... Maybe by '"identical" you meant "they both played on the defensive side of the ball"?
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So your contention is that a bunch of guys riding the pine would justify the continued employment of Ray Farmer? I just want to make sure that's really what you're saying.
The short version of my response, to save me time and the rest of us brain cells, is that I vehemently disagree.
That's wonderful, but I couldn't give a fuck less about your disagreement, because it's wrong.
My contention is that Farmer was hired to do one thing - pull the best talent he could at the positions we picked, without mortgaging the future.
Pettine is on record claiming he wanted the Browns identity to be a run first team with a strong defense that bullied opponents. Farmer spent money on a former Pro Bowl LB, former Pro Bowl CB, and former Pro Bowl FS - all from proven winning franchises in order to help bring both talent and a winning mentality. Now we hear that the proven LB has been asked by our coaching staff to play 25 lbs lighter than he had in his entire career? That's not a Farmer problem, that's a Pettine problem.
Pettine asked for versatility among his front seven. Farmer brought in Starks, who is known as possibly the most versatile defensive lineman of the past 5-10 years. He has excelled at both interior line and defensive end, making a Pro Bowl at each position. Yet he's invisible here. Once again - a Pettine problem, not a Farmer problem.
Pettine wanted a lock down CB to help run his defense. Farmer took possibly the top cover corner in the draft. And, despite the concern that he had confidence issues in college, Pettine piled on him and relegated him to backup KR duties almost immediately. Once again, a Pettine problem, not a Farmer problem.
Our offensive line fell off of a cliff after Mack's injury, so Farmer drafted an offensive lineman who could play both center and tackle at a high level. Erving finally sees the field 10 games into the season...at guard. Once again, not a Farmer problem.
Our defense was ill suited to stop the run, getting gashed between the tackles for an inordinate YPC last year, so Farmer invested in the top interior defensive lineman in the league. Shelton's rookie season is almost identical to Haloti Ngata's...yet fans are calling for his head because they fundamentally don't understand how a 3-4 defense is run.
Flip wanted to continue the ZBS that Shanahan implemented, so Farmer got THE best zone scheme runningback in the entire draft. And he's been underutilized by the coaching staff. Once again, not a Farmer problem.
If you want to knock Bowe, go ahead. That was a bad acquisition. But don't try to come here with weak shit reasoning that "our first rounders are bad boo hoo".
That's wonderful, but I couldn't give a fuck less about your disagreement, because it's wrong.
My contention is that Farmer was hired to do one thing - pull the best talent he could at the positions we picked, without mortgaging the future.
Pettine is on record claiming he wanted the Browns identity to be a run first team with a strong defense that bullied opponents. Farmer spent money on a former Pro Bowl LB, former Pro Bowl CB, and former Pro Bowl FS - all from proven winning franchises in order to help bring both talent and a winning mentality. Now we hear that the proven LB has been asked by our coaching staff to play 25 lbs lighter than he had in his entire career? That's not a Farmer problem, that's a Pettine problem.
OK, grant you that. But the operative word is "former". Traded quality for experience. Personally, I'd like to have Ward and Skrine back
Pettine asked for versatility among his front seven. Farmer brought in Starks, who is known as possibly the most versatile defensive lineman of the past 5-10 years. He has excelled at both interior line and defensive end, making a Pro Bowl at each position. Yet he's invisible here. Once again - a Pettine problem, not a Farmer problem.
all his experience cost us a game.
Pettine wanted a lock down CB to help run his defense. Farmer took possibly the top cover corner in the draft. And, despite the concern that he had confidence issues in college, Pettine piled on him and relegated him to backup KR duties almost immediately. Once again, a Pettine problem, not a Farmer problem.
I want to see what he can do when he's de-concussed.
Our offensive line fell off of a cliff after Mack's injury, so Farmer drafted an offensive lineman who could play both center and tackle at a high level. Erving finally sees the field 10 games into the season...at guard. Once again, not a Farmer problem.
Erving played so poorly, Pettine benched him today.
Our defense was ill suited to stop the run, getting gashed between the tackles for an inordinate YPC last year, so Farmer invested in the top interior defensive lineman in the league. Shelton's rookie season is almost identical to Haloti Ngata's...yet fans are calling for his head because they fundamentally don't understand how a 3-4 defense is run.
I fundamentally don't understand how Farmer traded away all our d-line depth and talent either.
Flip wanted to continue the ZBS that Shanahan implemented, so Farmer got THE best zone scheme runningback in the entire draft. And he's been underutilized by the coaching staff. Once again, not a Farmer problem.
Is Duke an every down back though?
If you want to knock Bowe, go ahead. That was a bad acquisition. But don't try to come here with weak shit reasoning that "our first rounders are bad boo hoo".
I- and a lot of other guys who have been watching Browns football for 50+ years are saying Farmer can't be held totally blameless for this mess we're currently in.
Yeah- and I AM going to hold Farm Boy responsible for making a $9 million mistake bringing in a washed up Bowe.
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the TCPO rally cry of fire everyone. heard that before. probably more than once. grab the torches and pitchforks cuz god dammit things aren't going his way. donald trump rep nominee candidate blowhard<TCPO fire the coaches cuz i know what's right and everyone else doesn't troll.
yet i guarantee he bought into the holmgren regime (everyone raise your hands on that side of the table that did), drooled over peyton hillis then loved the TR pick, thought weeden would be great..................
do us all a favor couch and stick to what you know best, throwing drunk 120 lb. frat boys out of the bars at night.
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The only thing I don't like about the Bowe pickup is the pricetag. We had a need for a player like him.
I think/hope Farmer is smart enough to go House of Cards on this thing and earn Haslam's trust, positioning himself to be kept while Pettine fired. He seems sharp like that.
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Your most perplexing post ever, war...
At any price Bowe has been a waste of a roster spot... so would have been any player "like him".
And while I have never watched House of Cards, I'm guessing you are encouraging no-holds-barred self-preservation? Just what is needed in a GM...
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Hawkins, Gabriel, Bowe and Pryor were inactive. That left them a little thin today. Here is my lineup for next week: Manziel, Darius Jennings, Pryor, Crowell, Barnidge,
Cam Erving playing out of position is a waste of time. Shelton is still adjusting but I have hopes for him. Play Gilbert, Gaines, Orchard, Gipson, Is Winston still on the team?
Thank the front office for waiting until week 14 to play Manziel with a depleted receiving Corp. Johnny will improvise which is what made Russell Wilson so damn good. Difference is Wilson has a running game. Thomas Rawl is lighting up and great on my fantasy team
My estimate is the Meeting with Haslam will discuss who plays and who they should,place on IR for the remainder of the miserable season. It's stupid to keep these guys active when they're clearly not fit to play.
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It's a show about two Machiavellian a-holes positioning themselves for power. At least one of our guys is about to get fired. I would like to know that the one I like will be able to keep his job, and I think knowing how to get Jimmy's trust to a higher degree than the other guy is going to get important. I'm not saying it's a great quality for a GM per se, but it is a great quality for a guy in this position.
And please don't downgrade the perplexingness of my posts
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Personal take - Farmer, Pettine and O'Neil are gone at the bear minimum, along with the defensive staff. Not just because of the record, but because of the self-evident staring contest between them over some of the players Farmer insists on keeping around and Pettine insists aren't good enough - Bowe, Winston & Gilbert at least. That is high school shit, and Haslam will want no part of it.
As to who replaces them, no idea, but it's unlikely we'll get any big name coaches - why would we? People like Gruden or Dungy or the other names being floated about can have their pick of franchises - the dolphins are searching and at least have a semblance of a franchise QB; the eagles seem destined to part ways with kelly and have some legitimate top-class talent in Murray, Alonso etc; Chargers - you've got rivers; Rams - a D and running game; Giants - Eli and OBJ. Only the 49ers are as talentless as we appear to be.
Where that leaves Flip, I don't know. He seems a seriously good QB coach who's trying his best to be an OC but his inability to get anything going in the run game is probably going to cost him his job in a house-cleaning. He's not soooo good that we *must* keep him at all costs, and a new coach will want his own staff.
The good news is that the 49ers are likely the only other team looking at taking a QB high, so we can probably wait and still get one of the top two or three prospects later on. Yay.
Leading nicely on to the front office - Farmer is pretty much gone, I expect. No idea who will be coming in, but in both cases, somewhere like Carolina might be a good place to start.
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It would be an act of mercy to fire Pettine now. His body language says it all. He's a beaten man, with nowhere to turn....he probably wants out....the sooner the better. While firing him today will help him, I'm not sure what good it will do for the Browns. You really have to wonder with Pettine....no receivers over 4'-11" (exaggerating a little )...and most injured, but he deactivates Bowe and Pryor for the game???...WTF??!! Maybe he's been ordered to lose for the draft pick??...who knows. If Pettine were a real HC, he would be yelling and screaming at these players...trying to get more out of them. He is soft spoken, walks with his head down...he should be really pissed off at his ass. coaches and the players. He needs to go find a nice high school team to coach. We need a young Marty, or Bellichick, or someone that will light a fire under the asses of these freeloading pricks.....imho.
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