First Draft Pick Must be a QB - Paxton
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I've watched tape of every game he played last year and this year. I don't get where you assume that just because someone's clamoring for Lynch, they're just listening to Kiper or McShay I doubt you have watched all of the tapes, or even one of them. You can do it in an hour or so. Your willingness to bash someone just because they think Lynch shoiuld be our #1 pick is both baffling and revealing of your nature,
I'm not bashing anyone directly, sweetheart... I've watched him. Didn't take me too long to realize it's going to take a couple years alone just to fix his throwing motion. His delivery is slow. Very slow. DB's will absolutely break on the ball if he's your starter as a rookie.
Fact is, #1 overall QB's come in and start right away. It's not a position you're benched for a few years when being drafted that high by an organization with these needs. Also, you can ask damn near anyone on this board - I watch tape. If you're asking for Lynch to be taken that high, you're either a Memphis fan or you haven't watched him at all. I see no attributes that jump off the screen. In fact I liked Garrett Grayson more last year than I like Paxton this year.
I see a QB whom get's favorable looks off of his first read, comes off of it slow coupled with a slow delivery. Since I've yet to be wrong about any QB the Browns have drafted (save for McCoy, I thought he'd be decent to a slightly above average starter) I like my track record in this matter.
I'm not bashing anyone directly, sweetheart... I've watched him. Didn't take me too long to realize it's going to take a couple years alone just to fix his throwing motion. His delivery is slow. Very slow. DB's will absolutely break on the ball if he's your starter as a rookie.
Fact is, #1 overall QB's come in and start right away. It's not a position you're benched for a few years when being drafted that high by an organization with these needs. Also, you can ask damn near anyone on this board - I watch tape. If you're asking for Lynch to be taken that high, you're either a Memphis fan or you haven't watched him at all. I see no attributes that jump off the screen. In fact I liked Garrett Grayson more last year than I like Paxton this year.
I see a QB whom get's favorable looks off of his first read, comes off of it slow coupled with a slow delivery. Since I've yet to be wrong about any QB the Browns have drafted (save for McCoy, I thought he'd be decent to a slightly above average starter) I like my track record in this matter.
I, too, have been fairly spot on with QB's overall, all bullshit aside...and I don't hate Lynch as a prospect at all. This is through three full games of tape, though, so I still have some more to work through...but so far here's what I see:
His throwing motion is molasses; that damn double clutch takes days. But his release is actually fine - fairly consistent release point and the ball has action coming from his hand. I haven't seen anything that would indicate he's any slower coming off his read than any other QB in the past few years.
These discussions remind me plenty of the ones that occurred last year on this board about Mariota. They remind me plenty of the ones that occurred when Philip Rivers entered the draft. They remind me plenty of the ones that occurred when Joe Flacco entered the draft. They remind me plenty of the discussions that occurred when Blake Bortles entered the draft.
IMO, Lynch is no worse of a prospect than any of those aforementioned guys, save maybe Philip Rivers.
With the way college football is progressing, you're going to be hard pressed to find a prospect who's adept at running a four read offense so, IMO, while a guy may be a "risky" pick coming from a ready-fire system, it doesn't make him a bad pick. At this point, I'd put him well above any of the other QB's. The only discussion is where to pick him, for me.
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PFF on the Browns pick:
www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2015/12/09/prospect-fits-for-3-teams-that-could-draft-no-1/
PFF on the Browns pick:
www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2015/12/09/prospect-fits-for-3-teams-that-could-draft-no-1/
Not being a Bosa-or-bust guy, that PFF take does set up an interesting trade competition prospects with TN at 2 and SD at 3 over Bosa.
"The most polarizing guy in the draft is going to be Connor Cook," he said.
Sounds like our kind of guy...
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Well, I retract my previous analysis. Lynch is terrible.
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I think anyone clamoring for Paxton #1 overall is taking the word of Kiper or McShay too much.
Best to watch some tape for yourself.
I've watched tape of every game he played last year and this year. I don't get where you assume that just because someone's clamoring for Lynch, they're just listening to Kiper or McShay I doubt you have watched all of the tapes, or even one of them. You can do it in an hour or so. Your willingness to bash someone just because they think Lynch shoiuld be our #1 pick is both baffling and revealing of your nature,
I've watched tape of every game he played last year and this year.
Great... please recommend three, can't-miss 2015 games here other than Ole Miss.
http://draftbreakdown.com/players/paxton-lynch/
VesnaKociper said:
You will get a chance to see him play against Auburn, a school that by all means, should be considered too much for a school like Memphis.
His ability to get rid of the football will impress you. The fucker just doesn't hand on to the ball and he hits recievers in stride, quickly, just as they are breaking open. QBs are a big gamble, but the great ones pay off. I was pimping DeAngelo Williams back in the day. This kid is worth the gamble. He is a gentleman, a leader, and a just the kind of guy Browns fans could adopt and depend on.
For all my horseshit, I love the Browns. I want to see this kid in Cleveland.
Looking forward to his bowl appearance... or at least the cutdown of it.
Same as the above, please. Also (and I am serious about this) any references you have on his personality, leadership, etc.
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Also been reading some good things about Goff. He might be the "more ready" prospect.
However, I'm still hopeful for a Manziel to Gordon combo. I know, I know...stop laughing. Manziel just seems like he could be so much fun to watch. You guys remember "fun", right? What does Manziel look like with a running game and a legit #1 WR? Hopefully we find out.
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Also been reading some good things about Goff. He might be the "more ready" prospect.
However, I'm still hopeful for a Manziel to Gordon combo. I know, I know...stop laughing. Manziel just seems like he could be so much fun to watch. You guys remember "fun", right? What does Manziel look like with a running game and a legit #1 WR? Hopefully we find out.
Also been reading some good things about Goff. He might be the "more ready" prospect.
However, I'm still hopeful for a Manziel to Gordon combo. I know, I know...stop laughing. Manziel just seems like he could be so much fun to watch. You guys remember "fun", right? What does Manziel look like with a running game and a legit #1 WR? Hopefully we find out.
If we're gonna lose, we might as well be entertaining. Under Pettine we're many things, but aggressive and entertaining is not one of them.
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I like Goff over Lynch from limited I have seen of both.
If they decide to give up on Manziel, QB should be the pick. The question then is which one.
And I get that there plenty of problems with the roster -- but removing their coaching stuff (Especially every person involved with their defense), could help.
Defensive coordinator candidates shouldn't be hard to find. Perry Fewell did a nice job with NYG as DC for a period. Hes the DB coach for Redskins. Their personnel (from my understanding) has been injured, and subpar talent-wise, but they're not playing so poorly.
Goff, IMHO, has regressed this year. He is far too light, especially for our division. CAL's been trying to bulk him up for years and they just couldn't add much weight to his frame. At 6'4" 210lbs., I don't think he can take the hits he will absorb in the NFL. He certainly is no "cold-weather QB" either.
Goff, IMHO, has regressed this year. He is far too light, especially for our division. CAL's been trying to bulk him up for years and they just couldn't add much weight to his frame. At 6'4" 210lbs., I don't think he can take the hits he will absorb in the NFL. He certainly is no "cold-weather QB" either.
I saw Goff play against Utah.....and was not that impressed.
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VesnaKociper said:
Ahem,
far be it from me to actually talk about football, versus the more philosophical shit, BUT........... Paxton is NFL ready. He is much more than an arm. An arm, as I have always said, is way don't the list on what makes a great QB.
Memphis is a small Div 1 school in the grand scheme of things. Ole Miss, a top 20 caliber team, threw the kitchen sink at this kid and he absolutely shredded their defense. He is Brian Sipe with a cannon; he is Dan Marino except bigger, faster and with moves. He is also a motivator and a leader. This kid is sound physically, emotionally, spiritually and intellectually.
If he is not job #1 for this Browns draft, then the Browns are bigger idiots than any of us know.
You will get a chance to see him play against Auburn, a school that by all means, should be considered too much for a school like Memphis. Now, mind you, the head coach moven on to greener pastures, but this kid can flat out play. And he plays TRADITIONAL QB....none of that horse cock RG3 fake ass Kordell Stewar bullshit. This guy is ALL QB.
His ability to get rid of the football will impress you. The fucker just doesn't hand on to the ball and he hits recievers in stride, quickly, just as they are breaking open. QBs are a big gamble, but the great ones pay off. I was pimping DeAngelo Williams back in the day. This kid is worth the gamble. He is a gentleman, a leader, and a just the kind of guy Browns fans could adopt and depend on.
For all my horseshit, I love the Browns. I want to see this kid in Cleveland.
OK....considering where the Browns may be drafting, they may have a difficult choice: Bosa is universally considered the best talent available, and likely the #1.
.....but a franchise QB means everything.....and if this guy will be what you think, then it could be a possible answer.
Trade Johnny to Dallas for a 3rd/4th rounder....get this guy...and hopefully he is what we would need here.
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VesnaKociper said:
Ahem,
far be it from me to actually talk about football, versus the more philosophical shit, BUT........... Paxton is NFL ready. He is much more than an arm. An arm, as I have always said, is way don't the list on what makes a great QB.
Memphis is a small Div 1 school in the grand scheme of things. Ole Miss, a top 20 caliber team, threw the kitchen sink at this kid and he absolutely shredded their defense. He is Brian Sipe with a cannon; he is Dan Marino except bigger, faster and with moves. He is also a motivator and a leader. This kid is sound physically, emotionally, spiritually and intellectually.
If he is not job #1 for this Browns draft, then the Browns are bigger idiots than any of us know.
You will get a chance to see him play against Auburn, a school that by all means, should be considered too much for a school like Memphis. Now, mind you, the head coach moven on to greener pastures, but this kid can flat out play. And he plays TRADITIONAL QB....none of that horse cock RG3 fake ass Kordell Stewar bullshit. This guy is ALL QB.
His ability to get rid of the football will impress you. The fucker just doesn't hand on to the ball and he hits recievers in stride, quickly, just as they are breaking open. QBs are a big gamble, but the great ones pay off. I was pimping DeAngelo Williams back in the day. This kid is worth the gamble. He is a gentleman, a leader, and a just the kind of guy Browns fans could adopt and depend on.
For all my horseshit, I love the Browns. I want to see this kid in Cleveland.
OK....considering where the Browns may be drafting, they may have a difficult choice: Bosa is universally considered the best talent available, and likely the #1.
.....but a franchise QB means everything.....and if this guy will be what you think, then it could be a possible answer.
Trade Johnny to Dallas for a 3rd/4th rounder....get this guy...and hopefully he is what we would need here.
OK....considering where the Browns may be drafting, they may have a difficult choice: Bosa is universally considered the best talent available, and likely the #1.
.....but a franchise QB means everything.....and if this guy will be what you think, then it could be a possible answer.
Trade Johnny to Dallas for a 3rd/4th rounder....get this guy...and hopefully he is what we would need here.
Get the guy? Who is the guy? And again just because you draft somebody first or second overall doesn't mean he's a first or second talent.
And picking him there doesn't make it so. It just makes you more pissed off when that truth becomes apparent.
Paying $80,000 for a Dodge Neon doesn't make it a Maserati.
WSS
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OK....considering where the Browns may be drafting, they may have a difficult choice: Bosa is universally considered the best talent available, and likely the #1.
.....but a franchise QB means everything.....and if this guy will be what you think, then it could be a possible answer.
Trade Johnny to Dallas for a 3rd/4th rounder....get this guy...and hopefully he is what we would need here.
Get the guy? Who is the guy? And again just because you draft somebody first or second overall doesn't mean he's a first or second talent.
And picking him there doesn't make it so. It just makes you more pissed off when that truth becomes apparent.
Paying $80,000 for a Dodge Neon doesn't make it a Maserati.
WSS
Get the guy? Who is the guy? And again just because you draft somebody first or second overall doesn't mean he's a first or second talent.
And picking him there doesn't make it so. It just makes you more pissed off when that truth becomes apparent.
Paying $80,000 for a Dodge Neon doesn't make it a Maserati.
WSS
Yes, we are all cognizant of the Jamarcus Russells, Ryan Leafs, Joey Harringtons...etc.
Can't say this guy won't be among that group....
so....we have to rely on Ghoolie's word about him...no?
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VesnaKociper said:
Gipper, a couple things come to my mind it isn't just the Browns who have floundered and gone through QBs looking for the right one. People can talk about youth, speed, OL, defense and all the other minutiae, but I don't know of too many SB winners that did not have a stellar QB.
Not too many.....a few....Rypien, Dilfer, maybe Brad Johnson....but overall you are right.
We can debate until we are blue in the face what it takes to win, but there is a reason the QB is the highest paid position, the guy that is the featured character in movies and pretty much all football culture in America.
Cowher had all the speed, defense, youth and other shit people are talking about, but until he got Ben, Pittsburgh couldn't win. Now they win even when they play like shit. Same with Cincy. On and on it goes.
Well, honestly....that 2005 Steeler team won in spite of BR. At that time he was NOT a stellar QB. He has since become one. That 2005 team was more like the 2000 Ravens than say the 2008 Steelers.
A QB is more than just the guy who throws the football. Life is an emotional sport. People need to believe in the guy they are following. Defenses play better when the QB holds on to the ball for longer drives, OL play better when they have the edge of not knowing where the hell the ball is going next.... in football, the heart of the team is the QB.
Only a mental child holds on to the belief that Johnny M is that guy. Maybe I am missing something, and if I am by all means educate me, but can yuo tell me the last time that some player the fans really, really counted on, changed his life around from being an asshole, to a solid, exemplary team leader and champion?
I am not the one to try to change your mind about that. I essentially agree.
If we are being honest, who the hell would want to be drafted knowing that they were going to be led by Manziel?
It isn't his off field behavior that is the problem. It is his heart, his understanding the importance of his role to the team, to the legacy and to the fans. Not taking Lynch at #1 amounts to nothing less than staying in the basement of the NFL. It is that cut and dry.
Lynch, as every player in the draft is a gamble. The Browns can't afford to gamble small, like they did with the wasted Joe Thomas pick. You have a big pick, you make a big wager. Anything else is the act of a coward.
I may still perhaps be very much on board with a pick of Bosa.....but you certainly have a valid point.
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VesnaKociper said:
Steve, I don't disagree with you at all. Joe Thomas was a Dodge Neon pick. There was absolutely no upside to that pick.
Again....I am not sure why you are obsessed with the one pick the Browns have made that turned out well.
And yet, you are not apparently upset with the very bad choices the Browns have made. Including 2007 the Browns have made 13 draft picks in the first round.....
What about carping about the other 12
Love him, send him to the fucking Hall of Fame, or have Tim Couch Pulls Out blow him, he remains the most over paid, under performing draft pick since Mike Phipps. Nobody (Save me, I have been the most accurate) can determine whether a pick was worth his money until the guy actually plays.
Except that the other 12 first round picks I refer to above.....were ALL more overpaid and underperforming than he was.
That said, if you are going to gamble, roll the die on the guy who, IF he shines, is a game changer. If the Browns pass on Lynch they will have made another, AP, Ben, Julio Jones leel mistake.
For those then....you must rail on the picks of Phil Taylor, Kellen Winslow and others...not on the JT pick.
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VesnaKociper said:
Browns can't afford to gamble small, like they did with the wasted Joe Thomas pick.
You mean such as gambling away a future 1st rounder and other picks for Brady Quinn shortly after Joe?
Also, 'wasted'... Yeah, that's about the dumbest thing I've seen on this board. Keep in mind, there is a TON of dumb shit on here.
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VesnaKociper said:
Browns can't afford to gamble small, like they did with the wasted Joe Thomas pick.
You mean such as gambling away a future 1st rounder and other picks for Brady Quinn shortly after Joe?
Also, 'wasted'... Yeah, that's about the dumbest thing I've seen on this board. Keep in mind, there is a TON of dumb shit on here.
You mean such as gambling away a future 1st rounder and other picks for Brady Quinn shortly after Joe?
Also, 'wasted'... Yeah, that's about the dumbest thing I've seen on this board. Keep in mind, there is a TON of dumb shit on here.
Yeah, I post here
I'm awesome, and I fuck dolphins. Ghoolie 12/2/2012: I have absolutely no skills, training or pride -
VesnaKociper said:
Browns can't afford to gamble small, like they did with the wasted Joe Thomas pick.
You mean such as gambling away a future 1st rounder and other picks for Brady Quinn shortly after Joe?
Also, 'wasted'... Yeah, that's about the dumbest thing I've seen on this board. Keep in mind, there is a TON of dumb shit on here.
You mean such as gambling away a future 1st rounder and other picks for Brady Quinn shortly after Joe?
Also, 'wasted'... Yeah, that's about the dumbest thing I've seen on this board. Keep in mind, there is a TON of dumb shit on here.
Right....as I said, Ghoolie is always griping about picking JT high instead of taking an offensive skill player high.
But we have taken a ton of offensive skill players very high....and they never want to work out;
Braylon #3
K2 #11
Richardson #3
Quinn #22
Weeden #22
Manziel #22
I mean shit Maude....these all are suckage supreme....yet he doesn't complain about them so much (except maybe JMZ)
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Yeah, I post here
See? I've even got YOUR support. So I know I'm in the right corner here.
Errr.....wait, what?
I love the 'we should have taken AP instead' crowd. Let us imagine our 2007 Oline without Joe. Feel free to move forward until present day with that as well. Would Adrian have found the success here that he has enjoyed with Minnesota? I'm not entirely sure about that.
Seriously though, guys - anybody check out Carson Wentz yet?
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Yeah, I post here
See? I've even got YOUR support. So I know I'm in the right corner here.
Errr.....wait, what?
I love the 'we should have taken AP instead' crowd. Let us imagine our 2007 Oline without Joe. Feel free to move forward until present day with that as well. Would Adrian have found the success here that he has enjoyed with Minnesota? I'm not entirely sure about that.
Seriously though, guys - anybody check out Carson Wentz yet?
See? I've even got YOUR support. So I know I'm in the right corner here.
Errr.....wait, what?
I love the 'we should have taken AP instead' crowd. Let us imagine our 2007 Oline without Joe. Feel free to move forward until present day with that as well. Would Adrian have found the success here that he has enjoyed with Minnesota? I'm not entirely sure about that.
Seriously though, guys - anybody check out Carson Wentz yet?
You'll find that Ghoolie is in a "we should have taken anyone else" crowd.
He should have taken any other instrument beside accordion.
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See? I've even got YOUR support. So I know I'm in the right corner here.
Errr.....wait, what?
I love the 'we should have taken AP instead' crowd. Let us imagine our 2007 Oline without Joe. Feel free to move forward until present day with that as well. Would Adrian have found the success here that he has enjoyed with Minnesota? I'm not entirely sure about that.
Seriously though, guys - anybody check out Carson Wentz yet?
You'll find that Ghoolie is in a "we should have taken anyone else" crowd.
He should have taken any other instrument beside accordion.
You'll find that Ghoolie is in a "we should have taken anyone else" crowd.
He should have taken any other instrument beside accordion.
Just for the record he's a great guitar player too. Just saying.
WSS
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You'll find that Ghoolie is in a "we should have taken anyone else" crowd.
He should have taken any other instrument beside accordion.
Just for the record he's a great guitar player too. Just saying.
WSS
Just for the record he's a great guitar player too. Just saying.
WSS
I don't doubt it. Anyone who can play accordion is probably insanely musically inclined.
I once farted my way through Piano Man on keyboard.
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I watch tons of college football. I live in SEC country and pay for the Big ten channel. I don't like any of the quarterbacks enough to take with the first pick. Not one is a blue chip. Not one is Jameis Winston. I would take a QB but there's not one that deserves first pick in this draft. Although Imstill think Cardale Jones could be developed. I would take him in 2nd or 3rd. We need a ton of help. Bosa, Adolphus Washington, Ezekiel Elliot would help. Elliot is as good as they come. We have the 2nd worst run game next to the Chargers. The Browns are second in the league in pass attempts with no Quarterback.
I take a pass on Paxton.
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