Browns might have a huge problem brewing...
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I have seven brothers and sisters. Everyone, including all our children root for the Browns. We are spread out across the country, some still in Cleveland, I'm in Florida, with sisters and brothers in Texas, California, New Jersey and Illinois. But we still root for the Browns. Probably because we are older and grew up in the 60's before the AFL-NFL MERGER. Or maybe we're too lazy too invest in another team.
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The Browns carry all of their picks into the 2016 draft and could receive a handful of others when compensatory and conditional picks are announced in the coming months. So maybe 10 0-linemen is possible.
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One Post From the Truth said:
I have 5 boys grown and gone. They grew up with me preaching the gospel of Cardinal football and only one of them even watch football and he is a Cards fan. The other boys ask me about certain games but that's about it. My advise is old but true...
You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.
I'm turning into a Browns fan though to be honest. Kind of weird how the Cards have gotten a lot better and I miss the down days of bad teams. I just don't root for the uni's but the players as well.
i had just gotten out of the army and drove my brand new car i bought in germany and had shipped to philly, to AZ where my dad had moved because of the dry air (had part of a lung removed due to cancer). he lived in mesa and i moved to tempe and worked in a couple of shops who needed pre-press production work done.
anyhoo the one 'sweat' shop was on mill ave. a couple of blocks from ASU stadium so the owner got a lot of college work to be printed on shirts, posters etc. this is when bill bidwell was running the team into the ground and the community of fans were looking for a way to get rid of him, like they were gov. meechum (man i remember the 'pickaninny remarks' within his rant about not honoring MLK day like they were yesterday...........dude was an ass). it seemed every other day we were getting orders for spoof shirts of the cards from fraternities and some of the stuff was hilarious and some of it was down right mean.......all the while i'm a browns fan thinking "hell, at least our team isn't that fucked up!" i moved to boston a year or two later, but remember those days in AZ vividly because they would be the last i'd spend with my father alive. but sand-pit volleyball, the beautiful girls running around in shorts and bikini tops, tubing down some river with a bunch of people like a huge raft full of beer, the $5 ticket U2 concert at ASU stadium.........
but the friggin heat. i don't give a shit if it's dry or not, by the time i left for work in the morning at 8, i was sweating half way to my car which was parked 25' from my front door.
dry heat? go fuck yourself.
cool to see how the cards have turned it around although it seems like it has taken 20+ years to do so. but if they can do it.........
Sorry to hear about your dad.i had just gotten out of the army and drove my brand new car i bought in germany and had shipped to philly, to AZ where my dad had moved because of the dry air (had part of a lung removed due to cancer). he lived in mesa and i moved to tempe and worked in a couple of shops who needed pre-press production work done.
anyhoo the one 'sweat' shop was on mill ave. a couple of blocks from ASU stadium so the owner got a lot of college work to be printed on shirts, posters etc. this is when bill bidwell was running the team into the ground and the community of fans were looking for a way to get rid of him, like they were gov. meechum (man i remember the 'pickaninny remarks' within his rant about not honoring MLK day like they were yesterday...........dude was an ass). it seemed every other day we were getting orders for spoof shirts of the cards from fraternities and some of the stuff was hilarious and some of it was down right mean.......all the while i'm a browns fan thinking "hell, at least our team isn't that fucked up!" i moved to boston a year or two later, but remember those days in AZ vividly because they would be the last i'd spend with my father alive. but sand-pit volleyball, the beautiful girls running around in shorts and bikini tops, tubing down some river with a bunch of people like a huge raft full of beer, the $5 ticket U2 concert at ASU stadium.........
but the friggin heat. i don't give a shit if it's dry or not, by the time i left for work in the morning at 8, i was sweating half way to my car which was parked 25' from my front door.
dry heat? go fuck yourself.
cool to see how the cards have turned it around although it seems like it has taken 20+ years to do so. but if they can do it.........
I started watching the Cards in '77. When I was in the 5th grade and my teacher was dating Pat Tilley a wr for the Cards. He would bring cool things for us signed by him and others from the team. I was a Jim Hart fan and he took the time to answer my questions. I was hooked.
In '87 the Cards moved and I was fresh out of high school so it wasn't like I had the dough to be a season ticket holder anyway. They moved and that's we're you come in lol.
Yep been there seen all that. But now the fan base doesn't recognize the older fans in the St Louis area. I've read their message boards and I don't really have a place over there. So I'm here hoping the Browns get bandwagon fans too I guess.
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VesnaKociper said:
Hey, lets draft 10 more offensive linemen.
I wouldn't care if they drafted 10 players of ANY position as long as they were good.
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Sorry to hear about your dad.i had just gotten out of the army and drove my brand new car i bought in germany and had shipped to philly, to AZ where my dad had moved because of the dry air (had part of a lung removed due to cancer). he lived in mesa and i moved to tempe and worked in a couple of shops who needed pre-press production work done.
anyhoo the one 'sweat' shop was on mill ave. a couple of blocks from ASU stadium so the owner got a lot of college work to be printed on shirts, posters etc. this is when bill bidwell was running the team into the ground and the community of fans were looking for a way to get rid of him, like they were gov. meechum (man i remember the 'pickaninny remarks' within his rant about not honoring MLK day like they were yesterday...........dude was an ass). it seemed every other day we were getting orders for spoof shirts of the cards from fraternities and some of the stuff was hilarious and some of it was down right mean.......all the while i'm a browns fan thinking "hell, at least our team isn't that fucked up!" i moved to boston a year or two later, but remember those days in AZ vividly because they would be the last i'd spend with my father alive. but sand-pit volleyball, the beautiful girls running around in shorts and bikini tops, tubing down some river with a bunch of people like a huge raft full of beer, the $5 ticket U2 concert at ASU stadium.........
but the friggin heat. i don't give a shit if it's dry or not, by the time i left for work in the morning at 8, i was sweating half way to my car which was parked 25' from my front door.
dry heat? go fuck yourself.
cool to see how the cards have turned it around although it seems like it has taken 20+ years to do so. but if they can do it.........
I started watching the Cards in '77. When I was in the 5th grade and my teacher was dating Pat Tilley a wr for the Cards. He would bring cool things for us signed by him and others from the team. I was a Jim Hart fan and he took the time to answer my questions. I was hooked.
In '87 the Cards moved and I was fresh out of high school so it wasn't like I had the dough to be a season ticket holder anyway. They moved and that's we're you come in lol.
Yep been there seen all that. But now the fan base doesn't recognize the older fans in the St Louis area. I've read their message boards and I don't really have a place over there. So I'm here hoping the Browns get bandwagon fans too I guess.
"One said:
Sorry to hear about your dad.
I started watching the Cards in '77. When I was in the 5th grade and my teacher was dating Pat Tilley a wr for the Cards. He would bring cool things for us signed by him and others from the team. I was a Jim Hart fan and he took the time to answer my questions. I was hooked.
In '87 the Cards moved and I was fresh out of high school so it wasn't like I had the dough to be a season ticket holder anyway. They moved and that's we're you come in lol.
Yep been there seen all that. But now the fan base doesn't recognize the older fans in the St Louis area. I've read their message boards and I don't really have a place over there. So I'm here hoping the Browns get bandwagon fans too I guess.
I just love a Pat Tilley reference.
Possession receiver, but only because he was white.
And probably still is.
Enjoyed the old NFC East St. Louis Cardinals.
Lots of rainy games on artificial turf in that division back then though, only the Redskins trampled in the mud.
Z
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"One said:
Sorry to hear about your dad.
I started watching the Cards in '77. When I was in the 5th grade and my teacher was dating Pat Tilley a wr for the Cards. He would bring cool things for us signed by him and others from the team. I was a Jim Hart fan and he took the time to answer my questions. I was hooked.
In '87 the Cards moved and I was fresh out of high school so it wasn't like I had the dough to be a season ticket holder anyway. They moved and that's we're you come in lol.
Yep been there seen all that. But now the fan base doesn't recognize the older fans in the St Louis area. I've read their message boards and I don't really have a place over there. So I'm here hoping the Browns get bandwagon fans too I guess.
I just love a Pat Tilley reference.
Possession receiver, but only because he was white.
And probably still is.
Enjoyed the old NFC East St. Louis Cardinals.
Lots of rainy games on artificial turf in that division back then though, only the Redskins trampled in the mud.
Z
Oh yes the memories and I still can't stand the Giants 'Skins Cowgirls or the Eagles to this day.Zombo said:
I just love a Pat Tilley reference.
Possession receiver, but only because he was white.
And probably still is.
Enjoyed the old NFC East St. Louis Cardinals.
Lots of rainy games on artificial turf in that division back then though, only the Redskins trampled in the mud.
Z
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I want to know if any of you have also had problems with your own kids or know people that are having issues converting their kids into fans? Maybe it's just happenstance that everyone I know has to varying degrees the same problem.
Daughter is 40 and I raised her right...
Still working on the grandkids, but their Dad is a Cowboys fan.
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VesnaKociper said:
I think your question, while sincere, and I don't mean this to be insulting, but points to the crux of the real problem; fans like you.
Let me explain. by definition, fan comes from fanatic, so a lot of the dynamic is polluted with emotion. However, Browns fans and media don't live in a world that most other people live in. I get people pissed off all the time by asking them to answer simple questions to back up their idiotic threads.
For instance. Joe Thomas according to most, is a future HOF'er. I simply ask, what stats make im equal to a Forrest Greg or Jerry Kramer? WInning teams? Playoffs? 1000 yard rushers? 3000 yard passers? wins against rivals? improved record?
The answer I get? You're fucked up man, why do you hate JT. But you see, THIS is what has killed the Cleveland Browns. Anything in life will die if you allow the bar to be lowered.
Let me ask you something, man; in other football towns, What Browns players could kids under 25 name? What Browns players would kids 25 or under line up to see? What Browns players do the NFL shows ache to have come on?
The most boring uniforms in the league, no hallmark players, no wins, no championships, no playoff appearances. No cheerleaders, no cool logo.........
It's not the kids man, it's YOU, and fans like you. Lerner gives the fans shit, and they support it. Haslam gives more shit, and the fans support it. NOW,,, we have a fortune teller and a guy named Sushi leading things. What The Fuck pray tell is their to be attracted to?
Hey, lets draft 10 more offensive linemen. That will REALLY reel in the fans.
So the answer is to stop watching the Browns. We should all stop. That will really encourage Haslem to keep the team here won't it?
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cause if we ain't watchin....nobody else is.
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VesnaKociper said:
Dude, what world do you live in? NOBODY cares about this fucking team outside of Cleveland.
At least stick to your own question. You asked why kids don't give a fuck about the Browns. I answered your question with direct reasons, and all you can retort with is "if we don't do it, who will"?
Do I want Haslam to find financial failure with the Browns? Yes, Forrest. THAT IS EXACTLY THE FUCKING POINT.
Supporting shit doesn't cause an owner to get better. It's like gubmint cheese, give a man a handout living and he will sit on his fucking ass his entire life. What part of Haslam will never have a winner can't penetrate your thick skull?
Look man, read your OWN POST and try to get past your ADD and have an original thought. If you know that young kids are not following this shit pile, ahhhhh.....do you think Haslam doesn't know that as well? So be honest, what would you do if you saw that the demographic of your team was aging and dying off?
Me? I would improve the experience. New uniforms that kicks ass, cheer leaders, top offensive and defensive players with reputation for exitement, wide-open balls to the wall football.
Haslam? Uniforms that are as ugly as the team is bad......... seriously, who they fuck would spend money on that ugly shit?
A restaurant gets a reputation for a shit product....do people stand in line to eat there?
The Browns show no effort to improve in 16 years ....people stand in line.
It's fans like YOU man. It's fans like you who don't have a fucking clue what really being a Browns fan is all about. Support shit, and you get served shit. There is no rocket science here. The Browns will be relocated by the 2012 season. If you don't think that's the purpose Haslam serves, then you are crazy. Move the fuckers for all I care. Send them to London and call them the Brittain Bangers. The Browns are doomed.
Ok lemme preface by saying much of what you say I do in some respects agree with. But....
Telling someone who's been loyal to a team his whole life and probably wouldn't watch much football if the Browns left again, that they don't know what being a Browns fan is all about? And I think that can be said of a lot of guys here. We're certainly not uncritical of the team and ticket sales will fall and jersey sales will not do much either. That's our way of telling the owner what he's doing ain't workin.
The alternative is to not watch football. I refuse to a chump two bit ngr and go pull for the ole Cowboys or some dumb shit like that. So what are we supposed to do? I "completely" agree with you about the lack of marketable players here. Completely agree. And as you can see from other threads, a lot of the fanbase wants the team to go get another chump little golden boy that they say will sit for a year but we all know he's gonna get tossed in toward the end of the season when McCown gets his nog cracked again......and he'll run for his life too and never be the same. We'll be right back here in a year or two saying oh no we can't take this budding superstar cause we need a QB blah blah blah.
I part ways with you though about OL like JT. I don't give a fuck about whether he's HOF or not...he at least kept our QB"s from taking blind side killshots. Yes it didn't amount to much cause they got hit from other parts of the line. But not using high picks on OL that can be the cornerstones of a great line for years and years is horribly short sighted. The skill positions play off what happens in the trenches. Get beasted on the lines and your skill guys production get's nerfed. That is basic football.
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VesnaKociper said:
A restaurant gets a reputation for a shit product....do people stand in line to eat there?
The Browns show no effort to improve in 16 years ....people stand in line.
You keep using this analogy......so, clearly, you don't understand the difference between a fan and a patron....
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VesnaKociper said:
A restaurant gets a reputation for a shit product....do people stand in line to eat there?
The Browns show no effort to improve in 16 years ....people stand in line.
You keep using this analogy......so, clearly, you don't understand the difference between a fan and a patron....
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Bottom line: this younger generation may be the FRAK generation.
My son has no interest in sports at all.....so its not like we are losing him to another team. He just doesn't like sports (except fishing)
My daughter is a Cowboys or Texans fans....she can't make up her mind. But she lives in Texas.
But, overall, this generation is full of FRAKs. They root for whomever is good.
Like LeBron.....became Cowboys and Yankees fans, because they were winning when he was young and he is a FRAK
Take Ben Roethlisberger. From Findlay OH......which is about equidistant from Cleveland/Cinci/Detroit. He didn't like any of them because they were not winning. He was a 49er fan because they were.
It is basically an entire generation of fickle pussies out there.
So? What else is new?
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I miss Air Coryell ... St. Louis and San Diego versions.
Saunders comes directly from that tree, while Hue Jack City started with Marty ... good mix, lets kick this shit off.
Z
Very cool. Right now Hue is headed in the right direction because he got the job. With all the front office movements there must have been a lot of politics before he came in and I bet Jimmy wasn't going to tolerate another shitshow.Zombo said:
I miss Air Coryell ... St. Louis and San Diego versions.
Saunders comes directly from that tree, while Hue Jack City started with Marty ... good mix, lets kick this shit off.
Z
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Bottom line: this younger generation may be the FRAK generation.
My son has no interest in sports at all.....so its not like we are losing him to another team. He just doesn't like sports (except fishing)
My daughter is a Cowboys or Texans fans....she can't make up her mind. But she lives in Texas.
But, overall, this generation is full of FRAKs. They root for whomever is good.
Like LeBron.....became Cowboys and Yankees fans, because they were winning when he was young and he is a FRAK
Take Ben Roethlisberger. From Findlay OH......which is about equidistant from Cleveland/Cinci/Detroit. He didn't like any of them because they were not winning. He was a 49er fan because they were.
It is basically an entire generation of fickle pussies out there.
So? What else is new?
Bottom line: this younger generation may be the FRAK generation.
My son has no interest in sports at all.....so its not like we are losing him to another team. He just doesn't like sports (except fishing)
My daughter is a Cowboys or Texans fans....she can't make up her mind. But she lives in Texas.
But, overall, this generation is full of FRAKs. They root for whomever is good.
Like LeBron.....became Cowboys and Yankees fans, because they were winning when he was young and he is a FRAK
Take Ben Roethlisberger. From Findlay OH......which is about equidistant from Cleveland/Cinci/Detroit. He didn't like any of them because they were not winning. He was a 49er fan because they were.
It is basically an entire generation of fickle pussies out there.
So? What else is new?
Gip,
IMHO this lack of lifetime loyalty was created, in large part, by free agency. These young people don't see the "Player to Team" & "Team to Player" loyalty that us older folks saw. When I was a kid, most players seemed to play their entire careers with one Team. They were your heroes for years & those players were linked to the Browns (or whatever Team you followed). Many of todays' players play for 2, 3 or more Teams throughout their careers. The days of kids growing up with a player or players spending entire careers on the hometown Team are virtually gone with very few exceptions.
Dylan..."The times, they are a changin"
Mike
IN DORSEY I TRUST -
Bottom line: this younger generation may be the FRAK generation.
My son has no interest in sports at all.....so its not like we are losing him to another team. He just doesn't like sports (except fishing)
My daughter is a Cowboys or Texans fans....she can't make up her mind. But she lives in Texas.
But, overall, this generation is full of FRAKs. They root for whomever is good.
Like LeBron.....became Cowboys and Yankees fans, because they were winning when he was young and he is a FRAK
Take Ben Roethlisberger. From Findlay OH......which is about equidistant from Cleveland/Cinci/Detroit. He didn't like any of them because they were not winning. He was a 49er fan because they were.
It is basically an entire generation of fickle pussies out there.
So? What else is new?
Gip,
IMHO this lack of lifetime loyalty was created, in large part, by free agency. These young people don't see the "Player to Team" & "Team to Player" loyalty that us older folks saw. When I was a kid, most players seemed to play their entire careers with one Team. They were your heroes for years & those players were linked to the Browns (or whatever Team you followed). Many of todays' players play for 2, 3 or more Teams throughout their careers. The days of kids growing up with a player or players spending entire careers on the hometown Team are virtually gone with very few exceptions.
Dylan..."The times, they are a changin"
Mike
Very good point. It's like this way in baseball too.Gip,
IMHO this lack of lifetime loyalty was created, in large part, by free agency. These young people don't see the "Player to Team" & "Team to Player" loyalty that us older folks saw. When I was a kid, most players seemed to play their entire careers with one Team. They were your heroes for years & those players were linked to the Browns (or whatever Team you followed). Many of todays' players play for 2, 3 or more Teams throughout their careers. The days of kids growing up with a player or players spending entire careers on the hometown Team are virtually gone with very few exceptions.
Dylan..."The times, they are a changin"
Mike
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Bottom line: this younger generation may be the FRAK generation.
My son has no interest in sports at all.....so its not like we are losing him to another team. He just doesn't like sports (except fishing)
My daughter is a Cowboys or Texans fans....she can't make up her mind. But she lives in Texas.
But, overall, this generation is full of FRAKs. They root for whomever is good.
Like LeBron.....became Cowboys and Yankees fans, because they were winning when he was young and he is a FRAK
Take Ben Roethlisberger. From Findlay OH......which is about equidistant from Cleveland/Cinci/Detroit. He didn't like any of them because they were not winning. He was a 49er fan because they were.
It is basically an entire generation of fickle pussies out there.
So? What else is new?
Bottom line: this younger generation may be the FRAK generation.
My son has no interest in sports at all.....so its not like we are losing him to another team. He just doesn't like sports (except fishing)
My daughter is a Cowboys or Texans fans....she can't make up her mind. But she lives in Texas.
But, overall, this generation is full of FRAKs. They root for whomever is good.
Like LeBron.....became Cowboys and Yankees fans, because they were winning when he was young and he is a FRAK
Take Ben Roethlisberger. From Findlay OH......which is about equidistant from Cleveland/Cinci/Detroit. He didn't like any of them because they were not winning. He was a 49er fan because they were.
It is basically an entire generation of fickle pussies out there.
So? What else is new?
This generation is no different than any other generation in that respect. There would have been no "older generation" of Browns fans had they not torn apart the AAFC and then the NFL in its infancy.
Sure, there would have been some just solely based on proximity, as it was near impossible to be a fan of another team when you couldn't readily see or hear them. But the city of Cleveland would have likely just forgotten about the Browns if they didn't start fast and strong with PB.
Just like they've forgotten about them now.
I find it hilarious when other generations try to pile on millenials despite the fact that there have been infinitely more societal, technological, ethical, and educational dvancements during this time than during that of both baby boomers and Gen Xers.
I remember when frankfurters cost a nickel and you had to walk 10 miles uphill in the snow both ways to go to the corner store for some good taffy.
I'm awesome, and I fuck dolphins. Ghoolie 12/2/2012: I have absolutely no skills, training or pride
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