Camp Goff
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Im just interested if it was randomly observed velocity, or if it was designed for them to throw their fastballs at a certain distance.
I did not see Goff's arm having that kind of pop on tape, and not many people did. Could have been wrong, but it didn't look nearly as strong on deep throws. That could be a result of his entire body not being able to drive the ball as far with that velocity, which is what I suspect. He has a thin frame and doesn't generate the same torque Wentz or Lynch have.
But he does have enough zip to light up the radar gun, which is a check in the box.
Im just interested if it was randomly observed velocity, or if it was designed for them to throw their fastballs at a certain distance.
I did not see Goff's arm having that kind of pop on tape, and not many people did. Could have been wrong, but it didn't look nearly as strong on deep throws. That could be a result of his entire body not being able to drive the ball as far with that velocity, which is what I suspect. He has a thin frame and doesn't generate the same torque Wentz or Lynch have.
But he does have enough zip to light up the radar gun, which is a check in the box.
Yup- and another thing to consider. At what range did they clock that velocity? As in shooting a gun, you have "muzzle velocity". Or did they- as at your carnival baseball toss- just average the quickest time at (pick a distance)? 60 mph = 88 feet per second. Probably, the timing for different quarterbacks would be way different @10 yards, as opposed to 50. If I had to guess, they may have used a Jugs gun, that even Class A baseball teams use.
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Thinking about it the hardest throws I can remember were to the WRs running hooks to the right side... maybe 20 yds total out and downfield from 5-step drops IIRC...
The bigger throwers were throwing fairly flat arcs... Lynch, Goff, Wentz...
The Hogans had a little hump in their ball...
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I'm guessing they just measured all of the throws, particularly the deep balls as they will come out fastest/least touch.
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Thinking about it the hardest throws I can remember were to the WRs running hooks to the right side... maybe 20 yds total out and downfield from 5-step drops IIRC...
The bigger throwers were throwing fairly flat arcs... Lynch, Goff, Wentz...
The Hogans had a little hump in their ball...
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22h22 hours ago
Mike, The QBs throw out cuts to their right and then to the left. The radar gun records their peak speed in both directions. The ball is thrown to a standing receiver
43mThere you have it.
Sounds like it's a fastball contest. Good to see how high these guys "top out" at, but it's not the end-all-be-all of arm strength measurement.
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22h22 hours ago
Mike, The QBs throw out cuts to their right and then to the left. The radar gun records their peak speed in both directions. The ball is thrown to a standing receiver
43mThere you have it.
Sounds like it's a fastball contest. Good to see how high these guys "top out" at, but it's not the end-all-be-all of arm strength measurement.
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Goff Pro Day 3-18.. Wentz Pro Day 3-24.. Browns at both..
Well after 3/18 maybe they'll decide to skip 3/24 (or send the janitor there)
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So if I remember correctly you have to wear a pink to to or something if the Browns don't pick Goff?Well after 3/18 maybe they'll decide to skip 3/24 (or send the janitor there)
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"One said:
So if I remember correctly you have to wear a pink to to or something if the Browns don't pick Goff?
If they pick Goff and he flops. If we don't pick him then all bets are off.
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"One said:
So if I remember correctly you have to wear a pink to to or something if the Browns don't pick Goff?
If they pick Goff and he flops. If we don't pick him then all bets are off.
I hope it's Wentz. I don't want to see you in a to to.If they pick Goff and he flops. If we don't pick him then all bets are off.
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"One said:
I hope it's Wentz. I don't want to see you in a to to.
Goff is gonna wreck this league
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"One said:
I hope it's Wentz. I don't want to see you in a to to.
Goff is gonna wreck this league
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Wentz may be bigger and may throw harder and he may be more of a threat with his running game.
But I can't seem to find the minuses in Goff's game.
Wentz may be a threat to run, but Goff has great footwork in the pocket. Wentz may have a more powerful arm, but Goff is a great technical thrower and his arm is anything but a liability. Wentz is bigger, but Goff is still big and has had two years less to grow into his body. Goff has small hands, but throws a tighter spiral.
The way Goff sets his feet and goes through his reads, and gets the ball out quick - he's just precisely what this team needs. And I don't buy that Wentz has a higher ceiling either.
I was iffy at first about taking that QB with the first pick. But the more I've watched, read and listened to, the more sold I am that he's the guy we go for. And that we'll have finally made the right decision at that position.
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Yes, it's a tough choice. For me, I'd go Wentz because he's built to play
in the tough division, and isn't a stranger to tough weather.
It's going to be wild when they pick their guy. I'm thinkin it's qb ..."for sure".
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Wentz may be bigger and may throw harder and he may be more of a threat with his running game.
But I can't seem to find the minuses in Goff's game.
Wentz may be a threat to run, but Goff has great footwork in the pocket. Wentz may have a more powerful arm, but Goff is a great technical thrower and his arm is anything but a liability. Wentz is bigger, but Goff is still big and has had two years less to grow into his body. Goff has small hands, but throws a tighter spiral.
The way Goff sets his feet and goes through his reads, and gets the ball out quick - he's just precisely what this team needs. And I don't buy that Wentz has a higher ceiling either.
I was iffy at first about taking that QB with the first pick. But the more I've watched, read and listened to, the more sold I am that he's the guy we go for. And that we'll have finally made the right decision at that position.
Wentz may be bigger and may throw harder and he may be more of a threat with his running game.
But I can't seem to find the minuses in Goff's game.
Wentz may be a threat to run, but Goff has great footwork in the pocket. Wentz may have a more powerful arm, but Goff is a great technical thrower and his arm is anything but a liability. Wentz is bigger, but Goff is still big and has had two years less to grow into his body. Goff has small hands, but throws a tighter spiral.
The way Goff sets his feet and goes through his reads, and gets the ball out quick - he's just precisely what this team needs. And I don't buy that Wentz has a higher ceiling either.
I was iffy at first about taking that QB with the first pick. But the more I've watched, read and listened to, the more sold I am that he's the guy we go for. And that we'll have finally made the right decision at that position.
Very similar to my thoughts so obviously I agree...
Distilled my case down to:
People who want to talk about Wentz's higher ceiling really need to worry about him first reaching Goff's floor. Doing so is far from a given...
Of course for some reason folks never are satisfied by my distillation...
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about Goff:
http://lastwordonsports.com/2016/02/19/jared-goff-2016-nfl-draft-profile/
http://lastwordonsports.com/2016/02/15/carson-wentz-2016-nfl-draft-profile/
Truth is, on the field, Goff is compared to Phillip Rivers, and Wentz is compared to
rothlicksbooger on the field.
By the same guy. "ABOUT THE AUTHOR: JOHN BAVA, NFL DEPT HEAD
John is currently NFL Department Head at LastWordonSports.com. "
I prefer Wentz, but it is close.
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from NFL.COM:
about Goff:
ANALYSIS STRENGTHS Quality arm. Makes all the throws and can sling the deep out with velocity and accuracy. Clean release and snaps throws off with flick of the wrist. Drives hips through his release for extra heat. Pocket mobility and poise showed improvement from 2014 to 2015. Maintains proper footwork and readiness to throw as he slides inside the pocket. Speeds up internal clock when he feels pressure or recognizes blitz. Pocket climber. Able to run out of trouble rather than into it. Looks the part of a confident, first round quarterback when working from a clean pocket. Sells his play fakes with purpose and draws linebackers forward. Has learned to expedite his throws from off-balance angles due to pocket pressure. Will throw receivers open in tight quarters. Has excellent trajectory and pillowy soft touch on touch throws down the field that give receivers a chance to make plays. Showed substantial growth with his willingness to attack intermediate areas of the field and did so with accuracy and relative success. Completed an impressive 43.8 percent of his deep throws. Competes on third and long seeking out first downs over check downs. WEAKNESSES Hits a rough patch with accuracy from time to time. Sails throws over intended targets especially early in games. Has spots where he makes receivers work too hard on easy throws. Spent 99.8 percent of his pass snaps from pistol or shotgun this season. Will likely need to orient himself with NFL footwork from under center. Rhythm passer who benefited from the uptempo and "quick game" of Cal's Bear Raid offense. Has to learn fine line between getting ball out and rushing throws. Able to escape pocket, but isn't a proven finisher when on the move. Fumbled the ball 24 times over the last three years losing 11. Sacked 81 times over three years. Internal clock and poise will need to be monitored closely. Several of his interceptions came when he failed to read zone defenders underneath drifting up to challenge the throw. NFL COMPARISON Matt Ryan BOTTOM LINEWhile Goff is a little leaner in the lower body than teams might like, he has good size, an NFL arm, advanced pocket mobility and the field demeanor of a franchise quarterback. His accuracy and decision making will suffer from occasional lapses, but he displays the tools to become a good starting quarterback with time.
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about Wentz, same place:
ANALYSIS STRENGTHS Tall with an athletic, proportional build that is made for the NFL position. Played in a pro-style attack with plenty of snaps under center. Asked to make NFL throws and showed he could do it. Stands tall in the pocket and delivers with a relatively high release point. Keeps ball high and tight in the pocket and can uncork it quickly with tight, sharp release and little wasted motion. Throws catchable ball with tight spiral. Naturally accurate passer. Sees lurking linebackers underneath and throws receivers open to safest spot in the passing window. Able to change arm slots and still throw a strike. Has plus deep ball accuracy and touch. Calm in pocket and has no problems sitting in and taking a hit to complete a pass. Excelled in structured passing attack that required him to read the entire field. Has athleticism to escape pressure and hurt defenses with his legs. Already able to feel pressure on the edges and slide around in pocket without dropping his eyes. Adept in play-action game at selling fakes and quickly finding safeties to help determine where to go with the ball. Intelligent with long list of academic achievements. Should be able to process and handle an NFL playbook quickly. Can play pitch and catch all day long against zone coverage. WEAKNESSES When rolling out, will float it a little too much when taking shots down the field. Allows passing windows to close quickly when he short arms his release. Needs a little more consistency on anticipatory throws outside the hash. Will get caught locking in on target bringing secondary charging in to make a play on the ball. Inconsistent footwork from the pocket. Arm gets ahead of his feet even with time to come to balance. Needs to pick up pace of his post-snap setup. Has to put a little extra air on his field-side throws. Can be a little flat with his downfield, touch throws. Has to eliminate the occasional nonchalant throw into tight quarters. Doesn't look comfortable yet with bootleg rollouts to the left. Broke a bone in his throwing wrist in October sidelining him for eight weeks. Dealt with arm and shoulder injuries as a baseball player in high school. Lower level of competition could cause issues for him adapting to NFL speed. NFL COMPARISON Blake Bortles BOTTOM LINEWith a body type that is as prototypical as they come and a background in reading the entire field and working through progressions, Wentz will immediately check a couple of boxes that many college quarterbacks won't be able to check. While his arm strength is OK, he can still make all the throws and he can make them with accuracy. His ability to escape pressure and pick up first downs with his feet will be yet another check mark in his favor. Wentz is still in a developmental phase after just two years at an FBS program, but has the mental and physical building blocks of a future, franchise quarterback.
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they both got the same grade - 6.5. I will surely fall out of my chair laughing, at Canton Mike's man cave..
if the Brown don't pick one of these two guys at #2.... but I won't be surprised if they pick Goff, .... or Wentz.
I'll love whichever pick they go with. I'd pick Wentz.
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