How likely, now, do you'all think it is, that the Browns trade down from #2?
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far to many reconstruction fires still burning. 1. Tunsil & Ramsey still best talent available. We know what JT said on new FO about trading him but now it's going to be on Joe with respect to either choice. Talks say we get a late rd. 1 still on JT. With loss of Gipson, I could see Ramsey playing any where he damn pleases in secondary as a upgrade. 2. Starks gone, Cooper in & Armonty Bryant on the brink of out. Plenty of DE & PR at top of draft to equal Cooper? 3. Got to throw a WR in there somewhere with no Benji & a Gordon 4. We get Kap, am more leaning Hue see'e something in 4th or 5th with loss of 3rd. FA's of Bailey's & Tuttles, I got nothing but confusion so far
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Problem with your stance, Ag, is we did not just "let them walk"... Closest we came was probably with Gipson, and even in his case we negotiated on and off through 2015 with his people.
Right....I think we negotiated a long time with all of them.....and, in the end, it is the player who chooses, not the team....
Ive gone back a re-read a lot of what the team and Sashi(in particular) have said and dont see anywhere that they said they would resign these guys or even feel that it was a top priority....but found LOTS of quotes suggesting they would not be aggressive and would be very careful in signing FA's.....
Here's the most recent quote, when Sashi was asked about signing our guys....and clearly, he tip toed through this question and definitely didnt say they were gonna sign em, or pursue them heavily, etc etc....
(Is it fair to say that none of the prospective free agents will be re-signed?): "Working through the process with all of them.Alex Mack came in last week, met with Hue, myself, Hal Hunter. We were able to have some conversations with all of our rising free agents towards the end of the year in our meetings to discuss that back in Berea at the transition -- lay out kind of our plan and vision and where we saw them fitting in and we are currently in discussions with a number of our free agents. Not going to be able to talk much in detail about that, but there's a possibility that we'll have a few back. We won't be panicked on any one player but there's some guys we feel like can contribute for us in the fall and we absolutely want to do everything we can, see if we can reach a deal that works for them and us and keep them as Cleveland Browns."
Right....I think we negotiated a long time with all of them.....and, in the end, it is the player who chooses, not the team....
(Is it fair to say that none of the prospective free agents will be re-signed?): "... there's a possibility that we'll have a few back. We won't be panicked on any one player but there's some guys we feel like can contribute for us in the fall and we absolutely want to do everything we can, see if we can reach a deal that works for them and us and keep them as Cleveland Browns."
True.... and with Gip in particular I think it was clear that we were far apart in the assessment of his value. When that happens any team let's their player test the FA market. In Gip's case he found an employer who simply valued him much higher than we did. It happens... and not just to us.
Also will point out that per the quote we do in fact have a few of our FAs back... just not the biggest names.
The confusion may come from Hue's statements about liking to have all our FAs back. Pretty much the pat answer of every HC in the league not named Belichick.
Now we know whose words to lend weight...
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Well bottom line for me is that I now have a far better idea of how they are trying too go about this restructuring than I did before the FA period started. But for most fans I suspect there has been a lot of confusion. That article cleared it up better than anything else I have read on the subject.
But doesn't an attempt to get Kap fly in the face of that plan to do it through the draft and not FA?
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Well bottom line for me is that I now have a far better idea of how they are trying too go about this restructuring than I did before the FA period started. But for most fans I suspect there has been a lot of confusion. That article cleared it up better than anything else I have read on the subject.
But doesn't an attempt to get Kap fly in the face of that plan to do it through the draft and not FA?
Well bottom line for me is that I now have a far better idea of how they are trying too go about this restructuring than I did before the FA period started. But for most fans I suspect there has been a lot of confusion. That article cleared it up better than anything else I have read on the subject.
But doesn't an attempt to get Kap fly in the face of that plan to do it through the draft and not FA?
It does but if Hue thinks highly of Kaep and can get him on cheap, I guess they will go with it. Leaves the door open to grab up one of the premier defenders or move back.
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Well bottom line for me is that I now have a far better idea of how they are trying too go about this restructuring than I did before the FA period started. But for most fans I suspect there has been a lot of confusion. That article cleared it up better than anything else I have read on the subject.
But doesn't an attempt to get Kap fly in the face of that plan to do it through the draft and not FA?
But doesn't an attempt to get Kap fly in the face of that plan to do it through the draft and not FA?
One pseudo-splash acquisition? Not hardly...
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We could be showing interest in Kaep just to throw everyone off.
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So maybe this undying love for Cleveland is based on finances? If Hugh Jackson is in love with this kid for whatever reason he might be the guy to persuade the guys that hold the purse strings to crack open the piggy bank. We know that Denver was having cap problems but the Brownies? They are flush.
WSS
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Ive mentioned this before....Makes me think about a Belichick interview I heard years ago, where he explained his theory on winning with middling players....which he has found a way to do....
Basically, he said you have A players and F players, and B, C & D players......and, due to salary structures, for every A player, you'll end up with more Ds & F's to balance the scale......and, often, when your A goes down, you're stuck with a D or F playing...
So, his objective is to load the roster with all B's and C's, who collectively are better than mixing A's and F's.....because there might not be superstars, but there are no big holes(which is more important).....and, quite often, some of those lesser players will surprise you and play like A's.......which we've seen over and over again with the Pats.....
So.....reading about Depodesta's history and trying to understand some of what the FO is doing....perhaps they are going to try to get a little better balance on the roster, instead of hoping for one or two big splash players to carry the load.....
Personally....I like the theory.....
Ive mentioned this before....Makes me think about a Belichick interview I heard years ago, where he explained his theory on winning with middling players....which he has found a way to do....
Basically, he said you have A players and F players, and B, C & D players......and, due to salary structures, for every A player, you'll end up with more Ds & F's to balance the scale......and, often, when your A goes down, you're stuck with a D or F playing...
So, his objective is to load the roster with all B's and C's, who collectively are better than mixing A's and F's.....because there might not be superstars, but there are no big holes(which is more important).....and, quite often, some of those lesser players will surprise you and play like A's.......which we've seen over and over again with the Pats.....
So.....reading about Depodesta's history and trying to understand some of what the FO is doing....perhaps they are going to try to get a little better balance on the roster, instead of hoping for one or two big splash players to carry the load.....
Personally....I like the theory.....
And Belichick is the luckiest man on earth when he drafted Tom Brady...because he thought he was getting basically a C- player when he got one of the greatest A+ players of all time.
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Ive mentioned this before....Makes me think about a Belichick interview I heard years ago, where he explained his theory on winning with middling players....which he has found a way to do....
Basically, he said you have A players and F players, and B, C & D players......and, due to salary structures, for every A player, you'll end up with more Ds & F's to balance the scale......and, often, when your A goes down, you're stuck with a D or F playing...
So, his objective is to load the roster with all B's and C's, who collectively are better than mixing A's and F's.....because there might not be superstars, but there are no big holes(which is more important).....and, quite often, some of those lesser players will surprise you and play like A's.......which we've seen over and over again with the Pats.....
So.....reading about Depodesta's history and trying to understand some of what the FO is doing....perhaps they are going to try to get a little better balance on the roster, instead of hoping for one or two big splash players to carry the load.....
Personally....I like the theory.....
And Belichick is the luckiest man on earth when he drafted Tom Brady...because he thought he was getting basically a C- player when he got one of the greatest A+ players of all time.
And Belichick is the luckiest man on earth when he drafted Tom Brady...because he thought he was getting basically a C- player when he got one of the greatest A+ players of all time.
That would be true........
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pick wentz or goff at #2 and quit fucking around.
although i'm a D first guy, the fact that the browns haven't had a franchise QB in the last 20+ years has obviously cost them. i thought building everything before adding the hood ornament was the way to go (and it prob is still) BUT how can any plan work (building D and OL) when the person trying to install that plan is gone before the plan can be fostered?
at least let hue get us the QB we need before he gets canned.
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pick wentz or goff at #2 and quit fucking around.
although i'm a D first guy, the fact that the browns haven't had a franchise QB in the last 20+ years has obviously cost them. i thought building everything before adding the hood ornament was the way to go (and it prob is still) BUT how can any plan work (building D and OL) when the person trying to install that plan is gone before the plan can be fostered?
at least let hue get us the QB we need before he gets canned.
pick wentz or goff at #2 and quit fucking around.
although i'm a D first guy, the fact that the browns haven't had a franchise QB in the last 20+ years has obviously cost them.
But, many are of the thought that neither of those guys give us the quality of QB that we are looking for...that you are looking.
(but...sure....we won't know for sure until you sign them up and let them play. I get that)
i thought building everything before adding the hood ornament was the way to go (and it prob is still) BUT how can any plan work (building D and OL) when the person trying to install that plan is gone before the plan can be fostered?
OK< the Tim Couch/David Carr school of thought.
at least let hue get us the QB we need before he gets canned.
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Baloney. I like Lynch, but not anywhere near as much as Wentz.
Lynch...will....not...be....there....at......32. It's a silly pipe dream.
That's what I think. So, you want to not draft at 2, and get Lynch at 32, after he probably already went earlier.
You take that chance, you will get burned, like sitting on a molten hot rock.
That's old Browns fo methodology.
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Browns won't trade down. Kaep won't take a pay cut, he won't come to Browns, and the pick will be Tunsil.
..Because the Titans will take Ramsey.
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lynch is prob the worse QB in the draft behind connor cock.
this regime WILL draft either wentz or goff. book it now suckers.
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Lynch could be good in a few years.... if he's there at 32, I'll be shocked.
and I think Kaep is just playing the Browns to get a good deal from Denver.
We already have a veteran qb that wants to be here, is a great teammate and mentor,
and threw for 451 yds in a game vs the ratbirds, I think it was.
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The 2016 Gruden’s QB Camp class features:
- Jared Goff (California),
- Carson Wentz (North Dakota State),
- Connor Cook (Michigan State),
- Christian Hackenberg (Penn State),
- Cardale Jones (Ohio State),
- Paxton Lynch (Memphis), and
- Dak Prescott (Mississippi State).
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
Who is taking 3 Qbs? If we pass on one of them - I don't think both Goff and Wentz and Lynch goes before the second round... who is taking all these QBs if we pass. Id wager that if the Browns pass on a QB it sets off a chain reaction and only ONE, if that, goes in the first round. What teams NEED at QB that bad that they would burn a first round pick on one of these guys over the abundance of talent available in the first round?
The secret of getting ahead is getting started. The secret of getting started is breaking your complex overwhelming tasks into small manageable tasks, and then starting on the first one. -Mark Twain- "It's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog." -Mark Twain- -
Most teams have their QB from years past... or have acquired talented QBs to fit their system, this is the year to build outside the QB. There are players. Elliot, Treadwell, Bosa, Tunsil, At least a handful of D-line and a couple players in the secondary that will make the first round. There's some good WRs. There is a beast TE that will be gone by the second. There is Jack and then you have ostrich looking Goff with his skinny jeans and arms. Then you have Wentz... don't draft the young version of Brandon Weeden. Wentz in Cleveland is just too much orange. Then when the Bengals and Browns play it can be the match of the NFL's red-headed stepchildren... I'm gonna vomit.
Bosa makes the Browns Defense Elite. Shelton and Bosa with Desmond Bryants' big ass, on the line. You put Kruger or Mingo on the other side and that QB isn't going anywhere but down.
For the QB hungry guys, We get Lynch at the top of the bottom of the first. Who is spending a first rounder on Lynch- besides the Browns? Once you get to the 20's no team up there need a QB.
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Most teams have their QB from years past... or have acquired talented QBs to fit their system, this is the year to build outside the QB. There are players. Elliot, Treadwell, Bosa, Tunsil, At least a handful of D-line and a couple players in the secondary that will make the first round. There's some good WRs. There is a beast TE that will be gone by the second. There is Jack and then you have ostrich looking Goff with his skinny jeans and arms. Then you have Wentz... don't draft the young version of Brandon Weeden. Wentz in Cleveland is just too much orange. Then when the Bengals and Browns play it can be the match of the NFL's red-headed stepchildren... I'm gonna vomit.
Bosa makes the Browns Defense Elite. Shelton and Bosa with Desmond Bryants' big ass, on the line. You put Kruger or Mingo on the other side and that QB isn't going anywhere but down.
For the QB hungry guys, We get Lynch at the top of the bottom of the first. Who is spending a first rounder on Lynch- besides the Browns? Once you get to the 20's no team up there need a QB.
Bosa makes the Browns Defense Elite. Shelton and Bosa with Desmond Bryants' big ass, on the line. You put Kruger or Mingo on the other side and that QB isn't going anywhere down.
For the QB hungry guys, We get Lynch at the top of the bottom of the first. Who is spending a first rounder on Lynch- besides the Browns? Once you get to the 20's no team up there need a QB.
So...cross off Bosa and Lynch as being good NFL players. They've received the PoG seal of suckage like Richardson and Manziel.
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