RG3 Signs with the Browns
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First, I move that page 10 be named the Frisky Singo page...
What do you hate and why do you hate it?
Oh,this must be the part where we ignore Griffin's actual stats and replace them with empty rhstoric and pretend like he hasn't shown his talent. Am I right?
Pretty close... Even though you know what I meant, I'll play this once...
I hate the "if we give him pieces" argument and it's past tense version, "had we only...". Good QBs elevate their surrounding talent. When we land one who does this then I'm all in on building talent around him. As for "why"? Two years of hearing it for JM did the trick...
As for RG3... Yes, he showed his talent... over 800 yds of it his rookie season. Since then injuries have stolen the foundational element of his game... his running. His passing simply has yet to stand on it's own.
It's where we get the "he's bad at going through his progressions" argument jammed down our throat, despite the fact that it's nearly impossible to tell from film for a number of reasons.
No offense to Tour, it's just the same argument over and over again.
None taken... especially since in RG's case it's not my analysis, but that of nearly every writer I've read that has looked at his decline. That said it doesn't hurt that their opinion also jives with RG's stats and my take on him at Baylor.
"When you have a shared vision it is a lot easier to make unpopular decisions." - Paul DePodesta "When you win, say nothing. When you lose, say less." - Paul Brown Complete 2017 Browns Board Mock: http://thebrownsboard.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=46196 -
First, I move that page 10 be named the Frisky Singo page...
What do you hate and why do you hate it?
Oh,this must be the part where we ignore Griffin's actual stats and replace them with empty rhstoric and pretend like he hasn't shown his talent. Am I right?
Pretty close... Even though you know what I meant, I'll play this once...
I hate the "if we give him pieces" argument and it's past tense version, "had we only...". Good QBs elevate their surrounding talent. When we land one who does this then I'm all in on building talent around him. As for "why"? Two years of hearing it for JM did the trick...
As for RG3... Yes, he showed his talent... over 800 yds of it his rookie season. Since then injuries have stolen the foundational element of his game... his running. His passing simply has yet to stand on it's own.
It's where we get the "he's bad at going through his progressions" argument jammed down our throat, despite the fact that it's nearly impossible to tell from film for a number of reasons.
No offense to Tour, it's just the same argument over and over again.
None taken... especially since in RG's case it's not my analysis, but that of nearly every writer I've read that has looked at his decline. That said it doesn't hurt that their opinion also jives with RG's stats and my take on him at Baylor.
First, I move that page 10 be named the Frisky Singo page...
Pretty close... Even though you know what I meant, I'll play this once...
I hate the "if we give him pieces" argument and it's past tense version, "had we only...". Good QBs elevate their surrounding talent. When we land one who does this then I'm all in on building talent around him. As for "why"? Two years of hearing it for JM did the trick...
As for RG3... Yes, he showed his talent... over 800 yds of it his rookie season. Since then injuries have stolen the foundational element of his game... his running. His passing simply has yet to stand on it's own.
None taken... especially since in RG's case it's not my analysis, but that of nearly every writer I've read that has looked at his decline. That said it doesn't hurt that their opinion also jives with RG's stats and my take on him at Baylor.
It very well may be the case but, to me, that argument is VERY hard to make from an outsiders perspective for a number of reasons - we don't know the structure of the play, we don't know the pre-snap reads, we don't know where exactly the QBs eyes are, we don't know if or when a receiver runs the right or wrong route, etc.
It's easy to look at a screenshot and say "oh look, so and so missed Y on a delayed post, his second read, and instead dumped off to his back in the flats when he could have had a nice 20 yard gain".
However, what we don't know is Y was NEVER his read and the play was structured to vacate the flat and pull the safety toward the middle of the field, leaving the RB with room to run, and setting up a deep post later in the game.
There's so many moving parts of an offense that vary from a play-to-play basis that I take a lot of those articles with a grain of salt. Now, clearly in RG3's case there is SOMETHING that caused him to get benched, but I think it was more to do with his injuries, causing him not only to lose confidence in his abilities but also shoehorning him into trying to grind it out from the pocket and, thus, make bad decisions.
RG3 isn't a pocket QB. He CAN throw from the pocket, but we see what his ceiling is there - roughly a 90 rating, low 60% completion percentage guy.
He's a boot action, RPO sideline to sideline QB who plays his best football by turning each play into a three pronged attack. PA keeps the run option alive and freezes the safeties, rolling keeps the run alive and flows the linebackers and causes them to vacate their zones, freeing up mid-tree routes that eat up chunks of real estate, and if they don't flow then RG3 is able to gain yards off of the rollout.
That's how he succeeded in 2012 and that's how he'll succeed again. Not as a "running QB" but utilizing his mobility behind the line as a tool to cause the defense to move out of position.
The issue, in my eyes, was never his ability to read defenses, it was in his confidence. You can't hem this guy in and play small ball - they tried it in 2013 and again in 2014. It's not maximizing his skillset.
I'm awesome, and I fuck dolphins. Ghoolie 12/2/2012: I have absolutely no skills, training or pride -
I just don't understand the issue with signing RG3. He cost us nothing in terms of our future - no draft picks. Money? Shit, we are so far under the cap and we have to spend a certain amount of money per league rules, and hell, it's not our money anyway so what do we care? If they guys that are supposedly so smart with money-ball type stuff think he's worth the gamble of what they're paying him, that should be good enough for all of us simpletons.
If the dude comes in and struggles beyond belief, we are no worse off than where we are now......... a shitty 3-20 team. However, if he comes in and tears it up then we are instantly competitive again...... It's all upside, all ceiling, with no floor.
We still may take a QB in the 1st round, and we may not. If we don't, it's not because the FO thinks that RG3 is the guaranteed future franchise QB of the Browns, but it's because those in charge don't think the top QBs in the draft are worth that high of a pick, no matter what the draft gurus say.
In regards to RG3, R E L A X ......... Let's see how the man looks in our new "high tech" butt ass ugly unis for oh, I don't know, maybe a quarter or two before we all cry.
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Then you try to get the QB you take in round 2-3-4 to be as good or better than any expect. It happens.
can good QBs be found in late rounds consistently enough for it to be a viable strategy for finding the person known as the single most important player on the entire team?
remember we are talking about a billion dollar franchise here, one that should be expected to make sound, prudent, educated decisions and not gambling at that level correct? but it does seem as if they do, and may have to.
is it that franchise QBs can realistically be found later, or should those [couple few present-day actual legit franchise QBs] that were passed on and taken late just have been taken much, much sooner?
i dare anyone to try and name a single team in the NFL that--if given the advantage of hindsight--would NOT be willing to spend a 1st rd pick on Tom Brady or Russell Wilson. good luck w that.
in my opinion finding one late is definitely more exception than rule. "flukes" if you will.
here's reality: as noted, it's a billion dollar company predominantly hinging upon one position, yet so many of our fans, GMs, FO, Owners etc seem completely willing to be absolutely cheap and not truly invest in the position. then there's the issue w investing too much. both are detrimentally irresponsible.
for we suffering fans, after 25 plus QBs in the span of Peyton Manning's career (i think it might be 27 now?) you'd think you could rule out naivety or lack of realization by now as reasons why some aren't on board w drafting JG or CW and want D. maybe they aren't sold on them as franchise QBs. maybe their ideal and ultimate Browns team is seen through Ohio State glasses. who knows why but offseason disagreement is decent fun either way.
can good QBs be found in late rounds consistently enough for it to be a viable strategy for finding the person known as the single most important player on the entire team?
remember we are talking about a billion dollar franchise here, one that should be expected to make sound, prudent, educated decisions and not gambling at that level correct? but it does seem as if they do, and may have to.
is it that franchise QBs can realistically be found later, or should those [couple few present-day actual legit franchise QBs] that were passed on and taken late just have been taken much, much sooner?
i dare anyone to try and name a single team in the NFL that--if given the advantage of hindsight--would NOT be willing to spend a 1st rd pick on Tom Brady or Russell Wilson. good luck w that.
in my opinion finding one late is definitely more exception than rule. "flukes" if you will.
here's reality: as noted, it's a billion dollar company predominantly hinging upon one position, yet so many of our fans, GMs, FO, Owners etc seem completely willing to be absolutely cheap and not truly invest in the position. then there's the issue w investing too much. both are detrimentally irresponsible.
for we suffering fans, after 25 plus QBs in the span of Peyton Manning's career (i think it might be 27 now?) you'd think you could rule out naivety or lack of realization by now as reasons why some aren't on board w drafting JG or CW and want D. maybe they aren't sold on them as franchise QBs. maybe their ideal and ultimate Browns team is seen through Ohio State glasses. who knows why but offseason disagreement is decent fun either way.
Taking a quick look at teams in the NFL, there are 10 starting quarterbacks not drafted in the first round- (Brees was the first pick in the second). I may be off by one or two. So sure, once in a Blue Moon a Brady or Romo falls into you lap. OTOH, of starting NFL quarterbacks 11 of them were drafted in the top 10 picks. The analytics say If you're drafting in the top 10, you don't have a franchise quarterback, there's a couple there worth of the possibility- you'd be nuts to not take one of them when you have the shot.
Sure first round QB bust, Russell, Harrington, and our litany of losers. But the washout rate (really can't call a 7th round prospect a "bust") of quarterbacks taken in lower rounds is even higher.
MHO is we've spent plenty of time shopping in the bargain bin for quarterbacks- we haven't drafted one in the top 10 since Couch. It's time to roll the dice again.
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I am excited to see what a healthy Griffin can do with a HC and coaching staff that believes in him. Griffin's greatest downfall in Washington was the fact that the front office hired a HC that wasn't committed to him.
From what I've seen watching literally every snap of Griffin's career, he remains one of the most talented QB I've every seen.
He has exceptional arm talent that can throw to all levels of the field with a flick of the wrist, he has a quick release, he's accurate. He's a good ball handler, excellent throwing on the run and can adlib to throw downfield.
However he's still learning how to execute a rhythm drop back west coast passing offense. He came from a spread-zone read offense at Baylor and as a rookie played in a Pistol read-option offense. It wasn't until his 3rd season with Jay Gruden did he play in an exclusively west coast passing offense and he was only given 5 games before being benched, only 2 which were actually bad.
When Griffin understands the play concept and where to go with the ball he's not just good he's incredible.
Some of his flaws. When he's unsure/doesn't trust what he sees he holds the ball and looks uncomfortable in the pocket and takes sacks. Surprisingly despite all Griffin's athleticism he has little to no "juke" to his running style you rarely seem him even attempt to make a defender miss. He's a straight line runner that needs to improve at avoiding contact.
I think right now, if Griffin were to be plugged into an offense like the Bills he could put up equal to if not better numbers then Tyrod Taylor. Or if inserted into an offense like the Chiefs he could put up similar numbers to Alex Smith and quickly surpass his level production.
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I am excited to see what a healthy Griffin can do with a HC and coaching staff that believes in him. Griffin's greatest downfall in Washington was the fact that the front office hired a HC that wasn't committed to him.
From what I've seen watching literally every snap of Griffin's career, he remains one of the most talented QB I've every seen.
He has exceptional arm talent that can throw to all levels of the field with a flick of the wrist, he has a quick release, he's accurate. He's a good ball handler, excellent throwing on the run and can adlib to throw downfield.
However he's still learning how to execute a rhythm drop back west coast passing offense. He came from a spread-zone read offense at Baylor and as a rookie played in a Pistol read-option offense. It wasn't until his 3rd season with Jay Gruden did he play in an exclusively west coast passing offense and he was only given 5 games before being benched, only 2 which were actually bad.
When Griffin understands the play concept and where to go with the ball he's not just good he's incredible.
Some of his flaws. When he's unsure/doesn't trust what he sees he holds the ball and looks uncomfortable in the pocket and takes sacks. Surprisingly despite all Griffin's athleticism he has little to no "juke" to his running style you rarely seem him even attempt to make a defender miss. He's a straight line runner that needs to improve at avoiding contact.
I think right now, if Griffin were to be plugged into an offense like the Bills he could put up equal to if not better numbers then Tyrod Taylor. Or if inserted into an offense like the Chiefs he could put up similar numbers to Alex Smith and quickly surpass his level production.
I am excited to see what a healthy Griffin can do with a HC and coaching staff that believes in him. Griffin's greatest downfall in Washington was the fact that the front office hired a HC that wasn't committed to him.
From what I've seen watching literally every snap of Griffin's career, he remains one of the most talented QB I've every seen.
He has exceptional arm talent that can throw to all levels of the field with a flick of the wrist, he has a quick release, he's accurate. He's a good ball handler, excellent throwing on the run and can adlib to throw downfield.
However he's still learning how to execute a rhythm drop back west coast passing offense. He came from a spread-zone read offense at Baylor and as a rookie played in a Pistol read-option offense. It wasn't until his 3rd season with Jay Gruden did he play in an exclusively west coast passing offense and he was only given 5 games before being benched, only 2 which were actually bad.
When Griffin understands the play concept and where to go with the ball he's not just good he's incredible.
Some of his flaws. When he's unsure/doesn't trust what he sees he holds the ball and looks uncomfortable in the pocket and takes sacks. Surprisingly despite all Griffin's athleticism he has little to no "juke" to his running style you rarely seem him even attempt to make a defender miss. He's a straight line runner that needs to improve at avoiding contact.
I think right now, if Griffin were to be plugged into an offense like the Bills he could put up equal to if not better numbers then Tyrod Taylor. Or if inserted into an offense like the Chiefs he could put up similar numbers to Alex Smith and quickly surpass his level production.
Another Griffin fag.
"You planning on having a long relationship with that glass or are you going to drink it? Drink up, man. Maybe we can get another.β - Janis Joplin, 1970. -
those 2 are also rated far above the QBs that entered the draft in the past 2 years. so if you were screaming for mariota or bortles or winston or twatwater or the garrop, then why shy away from picking one now when the timing is right and the browns haven't picked a QB this high since couch in '99?
hell if we could get 4 all pro players for the #2 then i say trade away but those deals just don't happen anymore so you have to use it when you got it.
those 2 are also rated far above the QBs that entered the draft in the past 2 years. so if you were screaming for mariota or bortles or winston or twatwater or the garrop, then why shy away from picking one now when the timing is right and the browns haven't picked a QB this high since couch in '99?
hell if we could get 4 all pro players for the #2 then i say trade away but those deals just don't happen anymore so you have to use it when you got it.
The last QB I was thinking, only if, was Luck.
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It's not about being scared it's about the talent that's there, or not there. Wentz was the QB at North Dakota State and Goff was an underwhelming 14-23 at Cal.
That's not looking deep enough. Flacco (who Wentz is being compared to) went to Delaware State, remember? Goff had near zero supporting cast at Cal. Sure they're a risk-
In the last 30 years there have probably have only been 3-5 QBs who weren't considered a risk, Andrew Luck being the last. FWIW, I was totally against Holmgren's sell the ranch to get RG III- I was right. If we take Goff or Wentz and they flop, we're only out 1 first round pick, not three. I'll go on record I like what I see out of the Goff Wentz duo. BTW, Hue went to both pro days, and liked what he saw.
That's not looking deep enough. Flacco (who Wentz is being compared to) went to Delaware State, remember? Goff had near zero supporting cast at Cal. Sure they're a risk-
In the last 30 years there have probably have only been 3-5 QBs who weren't considered a risk, Andrew Luck being the last. FWIW, I was totally against Holmgren's sell the ranch to get RG III- I was right. If we take Goff or Wentz and they flop, we're only out 1 first round pick, not three. I'll go on record I like what I see out of the Goff Wentz duo. BTW, Hue went to both pro days, and liked what he saw.
Flacco was lucky to step into a quality organization with talent already established. Again we are talking about the Browns. Who is the #1 WR on this team? The guy who sat out the year or the other guy.
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"3 seconds on the clock. Griffin under center. The snap this is it folks. He drops back no one open...he scrambles to the left he's got Gordon deep. The throw!
Touchdown !!! The browns advance to the playoffs"!
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I am excited to see what a healthy Griffin can do with a HC and coaching staff that believes in him. Griffin's greatest downfall in Washington was the fact that the front office hired a HC that wasn't committed to him.
From what I've seen watching literally every snap of Griffin's career, he remains one of the most talented QB I've every seen.
He has exceptional arm talent that can throw to all levels of the field with a flick of the wrist, he has a quick release, he's accurate. He's a good ball handler, excellent throwing on the run and can adlib to throw downfield.
However he's still learning how to execute a rhythm drop back west coast passing offense. He came from a spread-zone read offense at Baylor and as a rookie played in a Pistol read-option offense. It wasn't until his 3rd season with Jay Gruden did he play in an exclusively west coast passing offense and he was only given 5 games before being benched, only 2 which were actually bad.
When Griffin understands the play concept and where to go with the ball he's not just good he's incredible.
Some of his flaws. When he's unsure/doesn't trust what he sees he holds the ball and looks uncomfortable in the pocket and takes sacks. Surprisingly despite all Griffin's athleticism he has little to no "juke" to his running style you rarely seem him even attempt to make a defender miss. He's a straight line runner that needs to improve at avoiding contact.
I think right now, if Griffin were to be plugged into an offense like the Bills he could put up equal to if not better numbers then Tyrod Taylor. Or if inserted into an offense like the Chiefs he could put up similar numbers to Alex Smith and quickly surpass his level production.
Another Griffin fag.
Another Griffin fag.
Better than the pussy Manziel knobslobbers.
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Another Griffin fag.
Better than the pussy Manziel knobslobbers.
Better than the pussy Manziel knobslobbers.
Pot meet kettle.
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Better than the pussy Manziel knobslobbers.
Pot meet kettle.
Pot meet kettle.
The difference is one experienced NFL success...the other had a hard time finding the stadium on game days.
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Pot meet kettle.
The difference is one experienced NFL success...the other had a hard time finding the stadium on game days.
The difference is one experienced NFL success...the other had a hard time finding the stadium on game days.
Bullshit. His teammates let him down.......
"You planning on having a long relationship with that glass or are you going to drink it? Drink up, man. Maybe we can get another.β - Janis Joplin, 1970. -
The difference is one experienced NFL success...the other had a hard time finding the stadium on game days.
Bullshit. His teammates let him down.......
Bullshit. His teammates let him down.......
I can't even
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The difference is one experienced NFL success...the other had a hard time finding the stadium on game days.
Bullshit. His teammates let him down.......
Bullshit. His teammates let him down.......
Because they weren't with him in Vegas, doing lines of some dude's dick?
What a let down.
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That's not looking deep enough. Flacco (who Wentz is being compared to) went to Delaware State, remember? Goff had near zero supporting cast at Cal. Sure they're a risk-
In the last 30 years there have probably have only been 3-5 QBs who weren't considered a risk, Andrew Luck being the last. FWIW, I was totally against Holmgren's sell the ranch to get RG III- I was right. If we take Goff or Wentz and they flop, we're only out 1 first round pick, not three. I'll go on record I like what I see out of the Goff Wentz duo. BTW, Hue went to both pro days, and liked what he saw.
Flacco was lucky to step into a quality organization with talent already established. Again we are talking about the Browns. Who is the #1 WR on this team? The guy who sat out the year or the other guy.
Flacco was lucky to step into a quality organization with talent already established. Again we are talking about the Browns. Who is the #1 WR on this team? The guy who sat out the year or the other guy.
I mean seriously- the best quarterbacks in the draft almost always go to talent depleted teams. Like the Tampa, the Jags and Titans were loaded when they took their franchise qbs? Only luck out was Rodgers who fell far enough to sit behind Farve. Andrew Luck was a fluke too, as you could almost say the Colts tanked.
It could be why we picked up Griffin, so whoever we draft @ #2- and I'm damn near certain it's going to be Wentz or Goff- gets to sit for at least 1\2 the season.
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Flacco was lucky to step into a quality organization with talent already established. Again we are talking about the Browns. Who is the #1 WR on this team? The guy who sat out the year or the other guy.
I mean seriously- the best quarterbacks in the draft almost always go to talent depleted teams. Like the Tampa, the Jags and Titans were loaded when they took their franchise qbs? Only luck out was Rodgers who fell far enough to sit behind Farve. Andrew Luck was a fluke too, as you could almost say the Colts tanked.
It could be why we picked up Griffin, so whoever we draft @ #2- and I'm damn near certain it's going to be Wentz or Goff- gets to sit for at least 1\2 the season.
Great point. If I may inflect...I mean seriously- the best quarterbacks in the draft almost always go to talent depleted teams. Like the Tampa, the Jags and Titans were loaded when they took their franchise qbs? Only luck out was Rodgers who fell far enough to sit behind Farve. Andrew Luck was a fluke too, as you could almost say the Colts tanked.
It could be why we picked up Griffin, so whoever we draft @ #2- and I'm damn near certain it's going to be Wentz or Goff- gets to sit for at least 1\2 the season.
Many Super Bowl QB's weren't with the team that drafted them. I haven't looked it up but I'd bet more QB's that have played for more than one team outnumber the QB's that have been with the team that drafted them.
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1) I would take RG3 over Kap
βMe too.β
2) We didn't pay him much. We are swimming in cap
βAgreed.β
3) unless we're sure Wentz/Goff is a franchise QB, I'm fine taking the best available, elite player. Build the team then plug in the QB. Going the other way is what we've done for years. We'll just break the QB. No one us is expecting great things. Let RG3 and maybe a later QB run the show. If one does well, you got your guy. If not, at least you have a young superstar.
βNo way to tell if Goff or Wentz are the answer. And who is the young Superstar?
Sure as hell isn't RG3.β
WSS
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The difference is one experienced NFL success...the other had a hard time finding the stadium on game days.
Bullshit. His teammates let him down.......
Bullshit. His teammates let him down.......
He's just trolling
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Signing RG3 is their way of getting out of drafting a QB at 2. This really opens the door for Cardale or Cook.
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